Topic: All the bill switches...

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Posted by: bugjack (May 29, 2006 7:13pm)

As I posted when I joined this board a couple of weeks ago, I used to do a lot of magic as a kid and teenager, even semi-professionally. I stopped for a long time and recently started checking out the scene again. It's been interesting -- in some ways, it is "the more things change, the more they stay the same" -- especially as there are "new" versions of effects out with fancy packaging that are pretty much the same as I bought thirty years ago. On the other hand, there a lot of changes, especially with the Internet marketers and young name magicians like Blaine, Garcia, etc., putting their name on effects which require some skill and which are marketed to a young demographic.

All of that is a long preamble to my question -- what is up with all the bill switches? Why are there so many on the market? Are people really shelling out $30 a pop for DVDs that teach variations on the same basic effect? I might go ahead and buy the "Switch" book because I like the concept and the idea of how obsessive it is, but I was really surprised that to see how many different products there are out right now dealing with this one effect, which was one that I never even really did back when I started.

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Posted by: BooRadley (May 29, 2006 7:37pm)

I'm in a similar situation: a once-active magician getting back into the "act" after a long absence. I am a bit mystified by all the hype over different variations on a theme. A lot of it is the creation of a new marketing approach to a new audience...a new demographic of performers. And a lot of it seems to be those who are into the minutia of details.

And there are those who like to cast stones at others and say they have an all new way of doing something that is much better than someone else. This is true of bill switches and many other "steps" in the performance of illusions.

The difference, however, is more likely in the overall performance of an illusion than the technique. Who is the audience likely to remember: a technically superior manipulation artist or a great performer? I'm leaning towards the performer.

Obviously technique is important...but to a layman...all he knows is the bill switches. Whether you are effective at physical switches, use a thumbtip, have a finely made gaff or employ effective misdirection--the net effect is likely the same.

BooRadley

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Posted by: bugjack (May 29, 2006 8:02pm)

I'm with you, although I also get the "geek factor" of wanting to know every variation, etc. I'm just surprised that these variations are coming out at $30+ a pop and being marketed as effects when they are really just moves. I am going to pick up Garcia's "Greed" because a) I don't do anything with bills; b) like his "Torn" and c) like the way he's sequenced the changes into a short effect. But something like the "Juan Hundred Dollar Bill," as cool as it seems, is to me something that should appear in a book and not as its own product. But that's just me -- there are a lot of people out there who feel differently, and more power to them.

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Posted by: Chevrie (May 30, 2006 11:30am)

I guess I am one of the people that feel differently. I think the single effect DVDs often give the best value. $30+ for a single effect DVD like Doug McKenzie's Juan Hundred Dollar Bill is quite reasonable in my opinion. Doug deserves to be rewarded for the creative work that he has done with this effect. I have never been disapointed in any single effect DVDs that I have come across. The Andrew Mayne single effect DVDs for example are a great value and quite entertaining. I have found that some people that complain of the cost of DVDs, lecture notes and ect. are usually the ones that share copies and other unauthorized versions of these products. I would urge everyone to support these creative artists, it will pay off in the long run and I believe it is good for magic.
Lonnie Chevrie

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Posted by: BooRadley (May 30, 2006 3:01pm)

I certainly support the free enterprise system of individuals marketing their products in the marketplace and having them succeed or fail on their own merits. Or marketing effectiveness. Some products are better than others and will stand the test of time while others will fall to the wayside. It's the same in any industry.

The best products and the artists who produce them tend to do better. That's as it should be. From a consumer standpoint, I have certain parameters that appeal to me and what I perceive to be the overall value of an effect. I rarely use the word "trick" for a variety of reasons--it's an effect. And to me, it has to be part of an overall presentation. Making a coin appear to vanish ain't all that hard...the key is putting it a context that appears logical on one level while seeking to amuse, entertain and confound on another.

So for me, a single "effect" is less valuable than something that is a complete routine or at least sets the stage for it. I think that's one of the reasons some of Daniel Garcia's effects are so popular.

Now...I started a big "stink" in another forum about coin retention vanish effects. It's not that I wanted to learn that single move as an isolated presentation all by itself. I have several vanishes that I do reasonably well. Not nearly so efficiently or effectively as most of the folks here, but I've been away from the craft for a while and I'm getting my fingers limber again. The retention vanish appeals to me because it is different from my other effects and I think when done properly, it is a wonderful effect. I hate repeating moves in basic routine, so I wanted to add a new move.

The same can be true with dollar bill switches. If you're doing it one way in a routine, I think it's great to do it another way in a different routine. To simply switch bills one after the other would not make a whole lot of sense, but applying the techniques to a sequence of moves to create a personal routine is a whole different story. At least to me.

So if you see an effect you like and you want to add it, by all means pay the freight and make it yours. I've bought DVD's of effects even though I know the "basics" of the move or the gaff just because I want to know the full story and foundation of the move and can then adapt it to my own style. Most of the time, I'm glad I did. There are a few times I've been disappointed with the purchase. Some folks take great care in their presentation of the effect, how to do it, how to make a gaff if required etc. I'm not overly concerned about fancy production values, but I DO appreciate clarity of thought and an accurate presentation of information. Some DVD's appear to have been quickly shot in a rented office space without a script. 3-D Cash, for me is an example. Love the effect, but was disappointed in the DVD.

But that's me. The marketplace is an interesting barometer of success--not quality.

I'll now return to limbering up my fingers and attempting to confound someone other than myself.

BooRadley

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Posted by: Chevrie (May 30, 2006 4:31pm)

I've always wondered about magicians that are afraid to use the word "trick". Magicians perform magic tricks, just ask anyone. Also, making a coin appear to vanish is pretty difficult. For me anyway. When a magician tells me that it isn't the trick itself, but the entertainment value that is important, I know that they haven't been in as many church basements or banquet halls as I have. If you are going to call yourself a magician, you'd better be able to fool your audience. (Dai Vernon) I guess the difference is someone that is trying to educate their audience instead of learning from them...
Lonnie Chevrie

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Posted by: CasualSoul (May 30, 2006 4:53pm)

I agree that there are a lot, almost to the point of excessive, bill switch variations out there. However, an advantage to knowing multiple ways of achieving the same effect is that you can feel more comfortable in breaking the "never repeat a trick" rule. As I perform a lot for friends and family, having a few variations keeps them off balance whenever they see what appears to be the same effect.

I also shy away from the word "trick" and either don't call it anything or refer to it as an effect. I don't like the words "magic trick" as it has so many geeky connotations attached to it. I prefer to blow their minds with a cool effect rather than entertain them with a magic trick.

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Posted by: BooRadley (May 30, 2006 4:55pm)

Different strokes for different folks. Lonnie certainly has more "magic" in his little finger than I have in my entire body, so I'm tempted to defer to his wisdom on the subject. No matter what you call it, "fooling" the audience is pretty much the definitive goal of magic. Most people understand the coins didn't vanish and the bill didn't REALLY transform in your hand--but are entertained by presentation of the effect and the disconnect in logic. Okay, call it a trick. What the heck...if a pro like Lonnie says it's a trick, I certainly can't call him on it. Lonnie is one of the Lonestar state's premier performers and practioner of the art of magic.

There are all sorts of ways to approach the business of magic. I just enjoy watching someone do it well.

BooRadley

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Posted by: Chevrie (May 30, 2006 10:23pm)

Thanks for the nice comments, BooRadley. I'm speechless. You win.
Lonnie

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Posted by: CasualSoul (May 31, 2006 3:45am)

I didn't intend to sound like I was beating up on anybody, it's just that I find that asking someone who doesn't know what you can do if they want to see a magic trick can open a huge range of possible associations in their mind and some may be negative. After they've seen what I can do, then I have no problem with them running around telling people about my fantastic magic tricks.

But yeah Boo, different strokes.... If we all approached magic the same way, then what a sad, boring bunch we'd be.

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Posted by: aiki (May 31, 2006 11:18am)

BooRadley & Bugjack,

I am in the same boat as you guys. I have been out of magic for about 15 years and have just started back up. I was very surprised at all of the marketing for one sleight when I got back into magic. I have often thought that it is just the younger type kids that are trying to show off something new which it really may not be.

I like Lonnie's performance of his grandfather bill. Not because of his switch but because of his total performance and that is what would make me purchase the sleight. I would not even consider perchasing the sleight just because it is new sleight.

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Posted by: Jim Mullen (Jun 1, 2006 1:54am)

I bought Michael Ammar's Bill Switch DVD, which shows in precise detail how to perfect and perform the $100 Bill Switch and gives two examples of professional performances of this trick--Michael's own appearance on Johnny Carson and John Cornelius' presentation at the Magic Castle. I bought this even though I had used the very similar Roger Klause menthod given in his book In Concert. I am glad that I did because the Ammar method is slightly better than the Klause version and overwhelmingly better than many other versions. Also, the teaching approach of this DVD is among the best I have ever used.

A number of respondents mention that they are getting back into magic. To them I would add that the greatest revolution that has taken place in the art of magic is the publishing of hundreds of video tapes and (better) DVDs giving clear instructions on how to do the finest magic being done by full-time professionals in their own shows. It is astounding how much better the training is than what could be gotten from books alone. Also, the video and DVD formats allow one to watch a number of tricks and pick out the one or two that are the most interesting. Reading effects in books alone, it is quite a bit harder to visualize the performance of each effect and appreciate its value. This does not mean that books are obsolete. To the contrary, certain things, especially complex sights and discussions of magic theory, still can be better presented in writing. The best of all worlds though is the increasing number of book-DVD combinations that cover every aspect of a trick or tricks. It is a great time to be returning to magic, as your re-learning will be remarkably fast.

Good luck.

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Posted by: BooRadley (Jun 1, 2006 9:25am)

Well put. Intelligent, insightful and, in my mind, quite accurate. For good or ill, many of us learn quicker from a visual prompt.

BooRadley

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Posted by: Merenkov (Jun 3, 2006 2:52am)

This is a funny thread. It's a combination "which bill switch is best" and "I've just returned to magic after a ____ year absence". And I fall into both categories of interest too. When I first saw Roger Klause do the $100 bill trick at a magic convention back in the early eighties, I was floored. But when I see where it is today, the amazingly visual change, with no folding, as with Doug McKenzie's version of the Juan Pablo bill switch, it is truly astonishing. It looks like real magic. Magic continues to do what it has always done, make incremental improvements over what has come before. The great advantage of magic today is that you can witness effects on the internet before you buy them, as opposed to reading some ad copy in a magic catalog and then being disappointed when the trick doesn't measure up to the one in your imagination.

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Posted by: Kevin King (Jun 3, 2006 6:22pm)

I personaly like my "Money Morph" but I am baised. :)

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Posted by: Brian Proctor (Jun 3, 2006 7:05pm)

Kevin, your Money Morph has been a life saver many times!

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Posted by: Alan Munro (Jun 4, 2006 9:56am)

There are many great bill switches out there. I'll stick with the one that I developed, because of the attention to detail and its simplicity - perfect for the Mismade effect.

Brad Lancaster was the one who urged me to develop my own tipless method. I had to research a lot of switches, as well as perform the Roger Klause version for years, before I came up with the concept for my switch. I had to analyze the Leirpoll and Klause switches, boil them down to their essence and then build a handling almost from scratch.

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Posted by: Mike Lowry (Jun 5, 2006 4:00am)

Personally, I think that all the DVDs out there about the same effect are essentially geared and mostly marketed to the demographic out there that are looking for "the quick and easy way out". Almost all those "variation" DVDs cater to an audience who is looking for those effects that they can "perform in one night". I'm not saying that that's what they are necessarily intended for but that tends to the market who's hands these DVDs usually end up in. Now I think it is smart business on the magician's part to release such a DVD but it may not be the best move for those just starting to learn the effect and it's principles. For one, some of those DVDs, thankfully not the majority, teach the mechanics and principles of the effect poorly. Also, if the proper mechanics and principles are not learned, bad habits begin to develop, and unfortunately, more often than not those habits are passed on to those who are taught by the individual possessing them. Before we know it there are countless people running around performing "variations" of an effect that has collected bad habit after bad habit and has been mutilated beyond recognition. What I'm really getting at is that almost all variations with the exception of one or two minor tweaks can be found in the "SWITCH" (the $100 bill change book). This is probably the most in depth and thorough publication I have ever seen on one effect. If you really want to know every variation, you may want to start with that one purchase which is probably the cost of one and a half times the price of each of the countless DVDs out there. Learn the fundamentals of the actual effect itself and you may even figure out the majority of the others out there yourself. For all the "over-nighters" out there, don't forget that all the magicians teaching you their variations on a particular effect had to learn the mechanics of the original first. I guess I do have to give credit to magicians putting out those DVDs, it is a good way to filter out those who are not truly interested and serious about magic. Those who are serious will seek out the valuable fundamentals such as "Switch" and the "over-nighters" will be left to keep performing their "tricks".

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Posted by: CasualSoul (Jun 5, 2006 4:32pm)

I think your recommendation of picking up the Switch is a good one, but there is a lot of great, unique stuff (and some crap) that can be found on DVD. Greg Wilson's Hundy 500 being one example that does a great job teaching and expanding on some fundamentals.

Of course there is also the whole book versus dvd issue that also needs to be taken into account, but I think that's already been debated to death enough here on the Caf�.

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Posted by: tlfdoc (Jun 5, 2006 11:50pm)

I just bought the book Switch and can highly recommend it. I remember the first time I saw the $100 bill switch, performed by David Copperfield on one of his TV specials. It completely blew me away as one of the most purely magical effects I'd seen. I learned the Kozlowski bill switch, then Michael Ammar's tapes, and still perform it regularly. The book goes into some detail regarding the switch, but also includes nice chapters on torn and restored bills, bill productions and vanishes, and some impossible location routines.

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Posted by: DanielTyler (Jun 6, 2006 12:04am)

With bill switches, I would follow the martial arts philosophy of "Have five moves that you've done a thousand times each rather than a thousand moves that you've done five times each." Limit yourself to a few that look good and master them.

For me, my sequence goes from Jay Sankey's Indentifying Features, to U.F. Grant's 1-to-5 Bill Switch, to Jay Noblezada's $2 Window, to Gregory Wilson's Hundy 500 ( I think I've posted about this routine before, sorry if it's redundant )

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Posted by: Jim Mullen (Jun 6, 2006 8:06pm)

A couple of people have mentioned the Hundy 500--a great trick. I had not thought of it as a bill switch, but it certainly is. Like the Ammar Bill Switch
DVD, Greg Wilson's Hundy 500 DVD shows in complete detail how to perform the sleight; then it gives demonstrations of the effect as it is presented to multiple audiences. The L&L tapes do a good job in showing presentations in front of studio audiences, but it is much better to see multiple audience situations. For the best $100 bill switch using a thumb tip (e.g. $1 bill to $100 bill), my recommendation is the Ammar DVD. For the best multiple-bill switch (e.g. five $1 bills to five $100 bills), I like the Hundy 500. Incidentally, the Hundy 500 is one of the best opening tricks for a seemingly impromptu show.

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Posted by: Mike Lowry (Jun 8, 2006 7:47pm)

Yeah I agree about Hundy 500... This is definitely an awesome effect and a diamond in the rough among bill switch effects. Greg Wilson always has great material (for anyone that doesn't already know). And the Hundy 500 is not included in "Switch" so I would recommend picking it up for that extra knowledge. For anyone looking to learn the famed "100 dollar bill switch" Take everyone's advice on here and get "Switch" before anything else. You might save yourself some research and money.

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Posted by: daffydoug (Jun 10, 2006 11:00am)

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On 2006-06-03 02:52, Merenkov wrote:
This is a funny thread. It's a combination "which bill switch is best" and "I've just returned to magic after a ____ year absence". And I fall into both categories of interest too. When I first saw Roger Klause do the $100 bill trick at a magic convention back in the early eighties, I was floored. But when I see where it is today, the amazingly visual change, with no folding, as with Doug McKenzie's version of the Juan Pablo bill switch, it is truly astonishing. It looks like real magic. Magic continues to do what it has always done, make incremental improvements over what has come before. The great advantage of magic today is that you can witness effects on the internet before you buy them, as opposed to reading some ad copy in a magic catalog and then being disappointed when the trick doesn't measure up to the one in your imagination.

Could you please tell me a little more about that Juan pablo switch? I have never heard of it.

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Posted by: Doug McKenzie (Jun 10, 2006 2:36pm)

The Juan Pablo bill switch is in my opinion the most visual bill switch out there. There were a few things that I didn't like about it though. You didn't start very clean and you didn't end very clean. Lonnie Chevrie spent a lot of time with this routine and developed a new handling with some brilliant additions to bill prep etc. I still wasnt comfortable with the entire routine, so I developed a new handling called "the juan hundred dollar bill switch." No folds during the switch, starts clean, and ends clean. The original Juan Pablo switch can be found on Juan Pablos video vol 1, and in John Lovick's "switch book". Lonnie's handling is entitled "Grandpas dollar" and is on his video. The Juan Hundred Dollar Bill Switch is a DVD of its own with demo clips on most magic websites. Hope that helps

D

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Posted by: daffydoug (Jun 11, 2006 7:21am)

So you've basicly taken the JPBS and streamlined it and ironed out the kinks?

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Posted by: Doug McKenzie (Jun 11, 2006 2:38pm)

Basically. I fixed all the things I didn't like about it. I start clean, end clean, and don't have to fold the bill at any point during the trick. The moment of change is the same as the JP change, but everything before and after is completely different. Folds and all.

D

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Posted by: P.T. Murphy (Jul 26, 2006 11:46am)

See the Jon Lovick book. A GREAT book!