(Close Window) Topic: Science Friction - the new roughing solution?!
Message: Posted by: Card-Shark (Aug 2, 2011 1:43am)
Hi everybody.

I would like to inform you about the hottest product we EVER came up with. It is called Science Friction and is a nano based fluid that was specially developed for playing cards. I cannot imagine anything similar to this tool, just be sure to see not only the teaser video but also the trailer demo in the video section!

Science Friction is actually manufactured here in Germany and we will get the first cans ready for Magic Live. Alexander Koelle will attend Magic Live also and will be happy to show you his creations he came up with.

All details about Science Friction can be found here: www.sciencefrictionspray.com . We are really interested in your opinion, as we want to give you as much info BEFORE you have to buy a magic product. I think this alone is a revolution.

Wow, I am so excited about all this. Hope to see you in Vegas!!!
Message: Posted by: ABK-Magic (Aug 2, 2011 12:54pm)
You are excited? ASK ME!!! :D

It will be a fun time in Vegas!!!
Message: Posted by: jugglestruck (Aug 3, 2011 9:49am)
There is a lot more info on this product here;
http://www.themagiccafe.com/forums/viewtopic.php?topic=427274&forum=218&start=0
Message: Posted by: Mind_Magic (Aug 3, 2011 10:09am)
Another big hit from Card-Shark!
Message: Posted by: TheGreatRaymondo (Aug 3, 2011 2:23pm)
Not sure I like the idea of having to submit personal details BEFORE you guys will tell me anything!
I know you say it won't get passed on and I will not be spammed - but I just don't see the need for you guys to have my home address etc (until I place an order). Yep I could have given a false address but why bother?
Message: Posted by: Vlad_77 (Aug 3, 2011 5:37pm)
+1

Vlad
Message: Posted by: Card-Shark (Aug 3, 2011 7:01pm)
All we ask is for your address and not your money.

You know the magic dealer's sentence? You buy the secret!
So they even recline to take back an item once received, even if you are totally disappointed. Burnt money, every magician can tell his own stories of magic crap he purchased.

All we ask for is your address. Not money, no blood, not your first born child. In exchange you will get enough info to judge for yourself if Science Friction suits you or not. You can safe a lot of money or purchase with confidence. Fair, isn't it? Do you know ANY other creator or vendor doing something similar? I hardly doubt.
Message: Posted by: perceptions (Aug 4, 2011 1:34am)
+2

perceptions
Message: Posted by: martyjacobs (Aug 5, 2011 6:22am)
Looks good, but the following add copy irritated me a little:

Quote:
Want them to see real magic? With Science Friction they will think you are the next Dai Vernon!


This spray looks very promising and I'm sure that this will be a quality product (just like the other items released by Christian), but please stop over-hyping this product. A can of spray will not make you the next Dai Vernon!

Marty
Message: Posted by: TheGreatRaymondo (Aug 7, 2011 8:47am)
Quote:

On 2011-08-05 06:22, martyjacobs wrote:
Looks good, but the following add copy irritated me a little:

Quote:
Want them to see real magic? With Science Friction they will think you are the next Dai Vernon!


This spray looks very promising and I'm sure that this will be a quality product (just like the other items released by Christian), but please stop over-hyping this product. A can of spray will not make you the next Dai Vernon!

Marty,
This stuff is going to cost around $100 bucks a can! They say it will make you the next Dai Vernon so it must be true!

Marty
Message: Posted by: J-Mac (Aug 11, 2011 1:45am)
Raymondo,

I think that's the package price. Looks like you get roughing spray templates, a wallet, a 3-hour DVD and the new Phoenix Gaff Deck also.

Jim
Message: Posted by: saysold1 (Aug 14, 2011 6:17pm)
This officially launches TONIGHT! Look forward to reading the reviews folks - bring 'em on.
Message: Posted by: bblumen (Aug 14, 2011 6:47pm)
Quote:

On 2011-08-02 01:43, Card-Shark wrote:

It is called Science Friction and is a nano based fluid that was specially developed for playing cards.



Seriously?!
Message: Posted by: TheGreatRaymondo (Aug 19, 2011 11:06am)
Seems to have gone very quiet on the latest revolutionary product that will change magic forever as we know it....
Message: Posted by: martyjacobs (Aug 19, 2011 11:27am)
Quote:
Seems to have gone very quiet on the latest revolutionary product that will change magic forever as we know it....


Maybe because most of the chatter about this product has been taking place in the 'Latest and Greatest?' forum:

http://www.themagiccafe.com/forums/viewtopic.php?topic=429662&forum=218&29

Marty
Message: Posted by: Chessmann (Aug 19, 2011 11:44am)
There are 2 topics in the "Latest..." section, so folks might wish to check for both. One of them can be read through at the reader's own risk! :)
Message: Posted by: saysold1 (Aug 19, 2011 3:27pm)
Quote:

On 2011-08-19 11:44, Chessmann wrote:
There are 2 topics in the "Latest..." section, so folks might wish to check for both. One of them can be read through at the reader's own risk! :)


Ha Ha!!!

Good one...!
Message: Posted by: martyjacobs (Aug 19, 2011 5:09pm)
Quote:
There are 2 topics in the "Latest..." section, so folks might wish to check for both. One of them can be read through at the reader's own risk!


Er, yeah. I wasn't going to mention that thread. Several people, whether they be Card-Shark fanboys or cynical cardmen need to take a chill pill. ;)

Here's the other thread for those interested (you have been warned!):

http://www.themagiccafe.com/forums/viewtopic.php?topic=427274&forum=218&228

Marty
Message: Posted by: Powermagic (Oct 23, 2011 10:13am)
I did not learn any secrets and nothing was revealed when I signed up. It is a dodge to get your email. Glad I used a fake one


Quote:

On 2011-08-03 19:01, Card-Shark wrote:
All we ask is for your address and not your money.

You know the magic dealer's sentence? You buy the secret!
So they even recline to take back an item once received, even if you are totally disappointed. Burnt money, every magician can tell his own stories of magic crap he purchased.

All we ask for is your address. Not money, no blood, not your first born child. In exchange you will get enough info to judge for yourself if Science Friction suits you or not. You can safe a lot of money or purchase with confidence. Fair, isn't it? Do you know ANY other creator or vendor doing something similar? I hardly doubt.
Message: Posted by: Card-Shark (Oct 23, 2011 10:49am)
Where did you go after logging in?
And what did you expect? The formula behind Science Friction?
Message: Posted by: Powermagic (Oct 23, 2011 10:33pm)
I clicked all the tabs so saw all that was available which was not muchmore than when you do not sign up. There was only one video plus the annoying test pattern video. So I already knew it was a special spray . You also imply this is something you developed. But in fact you are just repackaging Science Friction the floor spray.

I just think your site is misleading and only to collect emails and for marketing and nor really have much information that is helpful in my opinion. More has been said on the threads here than on your site.

The site states :"In an unprecedented move, unlike other creators of magic, we are giving away the secret of our product BEFORE you buy it. No secret left hidden..."

So yes I did expect more information. Read their words... can you blame me. You speak of this nano spray BEFORE anyone signs in. So I am not sur what secret is being revealed. Really all you are doing is allowing access to the DEMO video. People should know this.


But look, I could care less it is a can of spray. That is NOT the secret. I would rather have liked to not see the can and see the effects. You think you are being clever , giving the illusion of turning the table on how magic is sold but really you are just collecting names.

This is why on EVERY site I sign up for something to SEE something or to LEARN something I know better and use a spam tracking email account and never give an actual name or mailing address. This way if I run into a scheme to collect data I can either track via the speical email if my name is being sold (which happens allot even with compnanies who say they do not sell names) or if I get junk emails from the company.


I am just putting the word out what the reality of the site is and suggest others not fall prey to this and just look on the Café for info on this product. Then if you must have the $95 kit then sign up. Trust me folks, they are being fruity, so NO secrets are given, everything is hidden.
Message: Posted by: saysold1 (Oct 23, 2011 11:24pm)
Quote:

On 2011-10-23 22:33, Powermagic wrote:
I clicked all the tabs so saw all that was available which was not muchmore than when you do not sign up. There was only one video plus the annoying test pattern video. So I already knew it was a special spray . You also imply this is something you developed. But in fact you are just repackaging Science Friction the floor spray.

I just think your site is misleading and only to collect emails and for marketing and nor really have much information that is helpful in my opinion. More has been said on the threads here than on your site.

The site states :"In an unprecedented move, unlike other creators of magic, we are giving away the secret of our product BEFORE you buy it. No secret left hidden..."

So yes I did expect more information. Read their words... can you blame me. You speak of this nano spray BEFORE anyone signs in. So I am not sur what secret is being revealed. Really all you are doing is allowing access to the DEMO video. People should know this.


But look, I could care less it is a can of spray. That is NOT the secret. I would rather have liked to not see the can and see the effects. You think you are being clever , giving the illusion of turning the table on how magic is sold but really you are just collecting names.

This is why on EVERY site I sign up for something to SEE something or to LEARN something I know better and use a spam tracking email account and never give an actual name or mailing address. This way if I run into a scheme to collect data I can either track via the speical email if my name is being sold (which happens allot even with compnanies who say they do not sell names) or if I get junk emails from the company.


I am just putting the word out what the reality of the site is and suggest others not fall prey to this and just look on the Café for info on this product. Then if you must have the $95 kit then sign up. Trust me folks, they are being fruity, so NO secrets are given, everything is hidden.


Why do you keep leaving highly aggressive and accusatory posts about Science Friction?

Do you own it? Have you reviewed it? Have you seen it?

No????

All the gripes and whining you mention above have also been whined before some months ago - ad nauseum. One well known whiner even got kicked off of the Café although I have no idea why exactly...

You've made your points - enough already dude.

If you find the ads or web site not to your taste, so be it as someone else said on another thread (Brehaut) - then don't buy it.

This is an outstanding product - and it is not some repackaged floor spray lol - very funny though :)

Your posts have not been helpful - far from it. If you want buy it and then have at it.
Message: Posted by: Chessmann (Oct 23, 2011 11:36pm)
Powermagic, I left my email with them, and have yet to receive an email as a result of it.
Message: Posted by: bicycle66 (Oct 24, 2011 2:09am)
Actually I find powermagic's post very helpful I now know not to sign up to the site, no I don't expect to get the formula but as they state no secret left hidden then you would think you would get something for signing up....I will stick with the Café it is great you can find out a lot about products and ask people questions who are usually very helpful.
Message: Posted by: Card-Shark (Oct 24, 2011 5:53am)
The Magic Café is a great source to get informed about products, good or bad. After a while everything was said that would also be stated on our website http://www.sciencefrictionspray.com after you signed in, there is even somewhere the video link of the video that only opens up if you signed in.

The Magic Café, even if we think that EVERY magician informs himself here, is only covering a friction of the whole magician´s community. So if you want to inform yourself here (and have to live with a lot of misinformation like "relabeling an existing product" to get Science Friction) then please stay here and do not sign up. All the others who are not members in the Café find these informations very helpful.

I guess most of you are using an Iphone where you have to wade through 43 pages of terms of agreement and where Apple knows everything of you, or is for sure in Facebook, where you already completely gave up your privacy and where ALL your information is sold to advertisers. I gave you my word to keep these information for us, that this would only be used for (very rare) newsletters. Everybody can decide by himself. We add these information manually to our address book, so a "Mr. fajlafs afsdjkliwo" will never be added anyway.
Message: Posted by: Waterloophai (Oct 24, 2011 11:19am)
Quote:

On 2011-10-23 22:33, Powermagic wrote:
But in fact you are just repackaging Science Friction the floor spray.


All the people who have allready bought Science Friction KNOW you are telling a blatent lie.
I and many others have bought it and are VERY happy.

P.S.: I never met Cardshark and I don't know him. What I do know is that I was NEVER dissapointed with his products and that his service is 100%.
Message: Posted by: Powermagic (Oct 24, 2011 6:46pm)
Who ever said my posts are agressive I have to disagree, I am only stating the facts and only responding to the responses. This has NOTHING, ZERO ZILCH to do with the product itself. It only has to do the the claims they make about it lasting a lifetime, which by its nature would be impossible and how they are working their pre web site.
Sorry, don't shoot the messenger who points out the truth. Nothing is " Unprecidented" about the site. They are just not showing you the effects they have put together on the video.
I am sorry,
I was wrong about the repackaging I guess, But I would like more information how YOU developed the science behind it if that is true. Are you chemists? Seems so close to the claims of the Science friction floor product that is is an easy assumption.
But again, here is the point, it matters little if you are rebadging or had a company who developed the nano tech put it in spray cans for you.

All I am talking about are your claims, and web methods.
Message: Posted by: Powermagic (Oct 24, 2011 6:54pm)
Quote:

On 2011-10-23 23:36, Chessmann wrote:
Powermagic, I left my email with them, and have yet to receive an email as a result of it.


That is not the point. The point is I automatically do not give my acutal emails or addresses until I do business with a company. I do nto know this company and since they are in Europe, I have just choose to limit who sees what. And yes I am one of those who will not allow just anyone to read my facebook and I read most agreements.

When someone makes a claim of all secrets revealed it sounded fishy, and turne out NO secrets of any kind revealed , I just automatically posted my findings. What you learn on the site is the ad for the package they are selling.

I surely HOPE they never abuse their policy and hope they never get hacked which then releases your info to the public as well.

I wish them well with their product and as I said this is not about their product but about their claims and web practices.
Take it or leave it. And if feel you wnat to blast me I will keep responding. You want this to go away, let it go and accept the facts of how they are advertising and what actually happens when you sign up. There is no arguement.
Message: Posted by: Chessmann (Oct 24, 2011 7:04pm)
I prefer to go on track record over time, myself. Card-Shark has a good one over time. I am forgetting nothing about this whole episode, believe me. Have you dealt with him at all? On anything?

What on earth makes you think I want anything to go away, or that I'm blasting you? Not on this topic, anyway :)

You, on the other hand, made a completely uninformed accusation re: the floor spray, then backtracked, but called it an 'easy assumption'.
Message: Posted by: TheGreatRaymondo (Oct 25, 2011 6:05am)
Just placed my order... I just have to see this stuff for myself!
Message: Posted by: Roger Kelly (Oct 25, 2011 10:01am)
Quote:

Just placed my order... I just have to see this stuff for myself!


Aaah - the Market Man's dream....

Powermagic - I'm one of the few who found your post useful.

As soon as I see a 'register your interest' prompt - I stop reading and they can go whistle!

Utter marketting and sales BS...usually....
Message: Posted by: saysold1 (Oct 25, 2011 11:42am)
Quote:

On 2011-10-25 10:01, Roger Kelly wrote:
Quote:

Just placed my order... I just have to see this stuff for myself!


Aaah - the Market Man's dream....

Powermagic - I'm one of the few who found your post useful.

As soon as I see a 'register your interest' prompt - I stop reading and they can go whistle!

Utter marketting and sales BS...usually....


Roger-

There are loads of comments and reviews now on Science Friction in multiple thread areas.

The comments by Powermagic were a repeat of criticisms made way way back at the beginning of the threads back in July. No one has complained since.

Me, I could give a crap personally about the SF web site.

What I do care about is whether the product performs as advertised and is a good value. Card-shark has never disappointed me with his innovative products (Get Sharky, DD cards, etc) so I have a high level of trust that has built genuinely over time.

If you find Powermagic's snide comments helpful more power to you - I don't.
Message: Posted by: Roger Kelly (Oct 25, 2011 1:43pm)
It matters not to me when he wrote it - I'm responding as I just read it and I thought he made a good point and I was merely adding my two cents of a similar 'suspiciousness' whenever I see 'register.'

I'm equally happy that others don't agree.

As it turns out, I think Card Shark puts out some good stuff. I've dealt with him three times and suffered poor service on each occasion - that he was quick to correct. But's that's a by-the-by and surely a coincidence.
Message: Posted by: Roger Kelly (Oct 26, 2011 6:23am)
Quote:

On 2011-10-25 11:42, saysold1 wrote:
There are loads of comments and reviews now on Science Friction in multiple thread areas.


Aha - hadn't seen all that! Interesting reading - blimey!

Can't wait to see it 'in action.'
Message: Posted by: saysold1 (Oct 26, 2011 4:13pm)
Quote:

On 2011-10-26 06:23, Roger Kelly wrote:
Quote:

On 2011-10-25 11:42, saysold1 wrote:
There are loads of comments and reviews now on Science Friction in multiple thread areas.


Aha - hadn't seen all that! Interesting reading - blimey!

Can't wait to see it 'in action.'


All is good sir... Take care and Blimey blimey blimey! :) What a great saying lol
Message: Posted by: Roger Kelly (Oct 27, 2011 2:38pm)
Blimey from the Limey, Brett!
Message: Posted by: juggle (Dec 10, 2011 6:58pm)
When will the member section be available on the science friction website?
Message: Posted by: J-Mac (Dec 30, 2011 1:18pm)
Quote:

On 2011-12-10 18:58, juggle wrote:
When will the member section be available on the science friction website?


+1

We had some indications from Alex Kolle that some added videos were about ready to be posted there, but that they are still "researching for a good platform"... That was back on Dec 10. Doesn’t sound good, which is kinda disappointing. A lot was made of SF having a private Members area. Jeff Kaylor made similar promises for his UCCU device and then he got it going very shortly after saying that.

I'm beginning to wonder if there will ever be a Member area for SF. Seems like it has been forgotten.

Jim
Message: Posted by: BatsMagic (Jan 25, 2012 7:54pm)
I'd like to see a members section- we are owed the privilege since we spent so much on it. That was part of the deal. I haven't received an eMail from them since I bought it long ago.
Message: Posted by: Card-Shark (Mar 1, 2012 5:20pm)
Guys, I was not online for a long time, had some struggles with several printing jobs, my health etc. but finally I can announce that we were able to open up the member area on our website www.sciencefrictionspray.com, where several bonus videos are already waiting for you. Sorry for the delay.

Feel free to discuss all your ideas there, as this is a restricted area, there should be limitations in helping each other out.

Christian
Message: Posted by: Magiguy (Mar 1, 2012 7:05pm)
Excellent! It might be a nice gesture to send an email to those who purchased. I checked the site each day for quite a while and finally gave up. I would not have known that the section was open if I had not checked this thread.

Nonetheless, glad to see that things are back on track!
Message: Posted by: Card-Shark (Mar 1, 2012 7:12pm)
We kept track of all magicians who bought Science Friction using our online shop so that we would be able to inform them. (Nevertheless there were some purchases at conventions and now over some dealers, where we don´t have their contact details.)

I just opened up the Member area and you are the first one in. The others will get an email notification also, for sure.
Message: Posted by: Magiguy (Mar 4, 2012 12:02am)
Thanks, Christian. I enjoyed my first visit, and look forward to the successful future of the site. I am also glad to hear that your health has improved, at least enough to rejoin the forums.
Message: Posted by: Jonathan Townsend (Mar 4, 2012 12:55am)
Per discussion on the Genii forum - try using an SF card for Red Hot Moma/Chicago Opener.
Message: Posted by: andyhurst (Mar 17, 2012 4:27pm)
I picked up some SF at Blackpool and have been having great fun trying out things with it. Now I see the site is open I will go register and check out the new content :)

Andy
Message: Posted by: magicHart (Jul 10, 2012 9:08pm)
Would be nice if they would market a trial size.
If it's as good as advertised, they will sell tons more to satisfied customers!
Message: Posted by: MagicJuggler (Jul 11, 2012 8:48am)
Actually all they would need to do is to market at a low cost some sample cards treated with the stuff along with some suggested applications and instructions on how to handle the cards. That way people could see the results for themselves, and Card Shark wouldn't have to go to the expense of manufacturing new arisol sprays.

Plus, the size can they give you is enormous considering how little you have to use to treat a card and the fact that for an effect you're usually only treating one or two cards.

But let me tell you, I just bought the stuff on the chance that it would enhance a trick I've been working on, and it worked like a dream. So I was able to ditch the double stick tape and use the science friction spray instead and achieve the same result. Plus the cards separate easily with no sound at all and with no effort. The treated cards don't gather lint so I can keep them in my pocket until I need to ring them into the deck, and not have to worry about the cards losing their grip.

If you like to work with gaffs this stuff is fantastic.

In my opinion it is as good as advertised. (Though the use of the word 'nano' seems a bit off, since in the states it's usually associated with microscopic sized particles that have been engineered in a certain way. I think they meant it as implying that you only have to use a tiny amount to treat a card-literally one light pass of the spray is enough)
Message: Posted by: Card-Shark (Jul 11, 2012 9:21am)
Here at FISM we just release two spin-off effects called One Card Collector and Delicious Ambitious. The will be online available next week on my website. Come with treated cards as well as a streamlined DVD of Science Friction where only one trick is explained but all the other effects of Science Friction are shown. Each effect costs 15$, so this should really help to find out in an affordable way how good it is.

All the others who signed in for Science Friction will get an email soon so that they can get a treated sample card for just the postage. At least I am able to realize that soon.
Message: Posted by: MagicJuggler (Jul 11, 2012 9:47am)
That sounds like an excellent idea, I hope you sell a lot.

-Matt
Message: Posted by: TheGreatRaymondo (Jul 11, 2012 2:42pm)
Quote:

On 2012-07-10 21:08, magicHart wrote:
Would be nice if they would market a trial size.
If it's as good as advertised, they will sell tons more to satisfied customers!


I bought it when it was first released. It is as good as it is advertised. It does exactly what they say it will do.
Message: Posted by: magicHart (Jul 13, 2012 6:21pm)
Thanks for your comments Juggler......looking forward to seeing the effects on the website!
Message: Posted by: kellaroneil (Nov 2, 2012 10:54am)
Was introduced in person to Science Friction this week by another magical friend...what an amazing tool!
Message: Posted by: G3LO (Nov 19, 2012 10:39pm)
Is it dangerous to touch the stuff before it dries completely to the skin?
Message: Posted by: Card-Shark (Nov 20, 2012 4:29am)
Well, I am not a doctor, you definitrly should not inhale it, but I sprayed myself with it several times (accidentally) and still feel ok. Maybe I will collapse one day and this would have a thousand reasons.

Regarding being harmful to the skin and you would feel it directly: no. There is no itching, you can rub it off if you want.
Message: Posted by: saysold1 (Nov 20, 2012 6:50pm)
Quote:

On 2012-11-19 22:39, G3LO wrote:
Is it dangerous to touch the stuff before it dries completely to the skin?


Like any aersol it is best to use in an open space and not inhale directly.
Message: Posted by: patrickmg (Nov 21, 2012 2:13pm)
There should be a Material Safety Data Sheet (MSDS) data sheet provided or at least available for download with all the health information regarding the product.
Message: Posted by: Card-Shark (Nov 21, 2012 2:40pm)
Everything necessary to be declared, including safety and health issues have to be printed on the label. And that is.

What you will not find but maybe it should when sold in the USA: don't heat the can in your microwave, don't use it as hairspray for a solid new look, don't spray it under your shoes to get more grip during winter season. And also: don't spray it onto yourself.

But when I am asked: magicians have more (clever/stupid) ideas I could ever dream of.
Message: Posted by: saysold1 (Nov 23, 2012 1:06am)
LOL! :)

You go Christian!

But on a much more serious note...

1. Can I use SF as an effective deodorant? Especially before a big gig?

2. Can Science Friction be used to add a little "spice" in the bedroom? :)
Message: Posted by: Chessmann (Nov 23, 2012 9:15pm)
Quote:

On 2012-11-23 01:06, saysold1 wrote:

2. Can Science Friction be used to add a little "spice" in the bedroom? :)



Spray enough and it can be used as a virtual condom. Try it! :)
Message: Posted by: Merc Man (Nov 24, 2012 8:03am)
Quote:

On 2012-11-23 21:15, Chessmann wrote:
Spray enough and it can be used as a virtual condom. Try it! :)


I prefer to use cling film - so that I can 'roll my own'.
Message: Posted by: Magicmagician83 (Feb 18, 2013 10:54pm)
You guys are paying a hundred dollars for a can of clear plasti dip spray. LOL
Message: Posted by: saysold1 (Feb 19, 2013 9:02am)
Your wrong... ha ha ha.
Message: Posted by: Tfet (Feb 19, 2013 9:29am)
Yes, You're wrong Magicmagician83....

You get a DVD and templates with it as well for that $100.00.

Oh and a plastic wallet.
Message: Posted by: saysold1 (Feb 19, 2013 2:10pm)
The essence of this (and this was debated ad nauseum in the threads) is that the products may be similar in terms of what is I the can but they are not the same.

Since I tesetd both side by side myself out of curiosity - I found that the PD did not last more than a few uses on a card and quickly started to peel off. The SF was good for 100+ uses on a typical card.

In addition the DVD and routines are gold - very well produced.
Message: Posted by: DelMagic (Feb 19, 2013 2:17pm)
Let's try a Gedankenexperiment - a thought experiment. We don't have to actually do this, just reason it out in our heads.

Give to twenty people twenty cans of plastidip spray. Give to a different group of twently people twenty Science Friction kits. Talk to all 40 in a week or two and report on the findings. What do you think the difference will be?

For the second round, imagine rather than twenty + twenty random people, you select twenty + twenty random magicians. Give half of the magicians a can of plastidip spray and give the other half of the magicians Science Friction kits. Talk to all 40 magicians in a week or two. Will there be any significant difference?

Are the development of the idea and the instruction which is part of the kit worth little to nothing or do those things make all the difference in the world? We know a few who think the development and the instruction are close to worthless, but others know where the real value resides. It isn't in the can.

This is something many magicians have come to understand and they don't mind rewarding the thinkers and inventors by purchasing their effects even if they can suss out the method and make it themselves.
Message: Posted by: Card-Shark (Feb 19, 2013 3:01pm)
Thank you and well said, DelMagic.

I don't know how long PD is already on the market (and actually I don't really care), but if they are so similar, why did no magician ever thought about using it in the past? It was Alexander Koelle who found this German wonderspray that we then refined to make it working for us magicians.

Actually, sometimes when I see the prices of a single can of PD on Amazon USA and the price we have to pay to get our own stuff bottled here in Germany in huge quantities for a much higher price per bottle....I wish that both would be the same to safe a lot of money by just relabeling PD. You guys have no idea how much money is involved in such a production run.

The next tricky part that I did not know when I decided to start a partnership with Alexander to release this revolutionary spray was the shipping of SF. If you like you can try to ship a can of aerosole spray by airfreight. As these are declared as dangerous goods and have to be treated in a totally different way, only few freight companies offer that, but for a price that is several times higher than regular shipping. That is why we still cannot sell SF to Asia, Japan and Eastern Europe, even if there would be a huge market and demand. You have no idea what it cost us to ship a part of the German production over to our warehouse in the USA, it was half a fortune. (So even that reason was tempting to use PD to reduce all the hassle.)

Certainly, based on all the accusations and false statements, we bought and tested PD and compared it with our SF. Come on guys, be serious, there are a lot of differences in quality and the end product. SF is so far ahead of PD that we will definitely continue producing SF in Germany... and will go the hard way of shipping it overseas for an extremely high price.

Finally, do the maths and you will understand how reasonably priced SF is. For 95 US$ you get brilliant ideas, a closed forum to share ideas and get help, a deck of gaffed cards produced at USPC, a high-class leather wallet, spraying templates, a DVD of three hour material...oh yes, and not to forget a spray that will last for guaranteed 600 gimmicks (with three coatings; with two coatings you will get 900 gimmicks)! The gimmicks last as long as your deck of cards lasts, how long does it take you to go through 600 decks? Ten years?

Every owner of SF can also buy a cheap refill can, so far, after having SF released 18 months ago, we sold 3 refill cans. To guys who use SF for their own developed effects that they sell at their lectures. A regular user of SF will be able to use the single SF can for years.

So my advice is that:
Use whatever you want to use. Take beercoasters and try to do card magic with them. Use hairspray and try to make up your own ID. But don't try to "educate" people what they should do to "safe money".
Message: Posted by: Waterloophai (Feb 19, 2013 6:54pm)
Please Card-Shark, don't react to stupid remarks as from Magicmagician83. They are not worth it.
Those who have Science Friction know better.
Thanks again for creating this fantastic product.

If I may add: PD is also a useful industrial product. Helas, if you use it with playing cards, it is worthless.
Message: Posted by: Magicmagician83 (Feb 20, 2013 3:38am)
Well I am a MFing idiotic moron then.
Message: Posted by: Zombie Magic (Feb 20, 2013 5:11am)
Quote:

On 2013-02-19 15:01, Card-Shark wrote:

I don't know how long PD is already on the market (and actually I don't really care), but if they are so similar, why did no magician ever thought about using it in the past?


Kenton Knepper did years ago. In 2002 his booklet Sorcerer Series #2 introduced it. In 2006 he marketed a trick, the Khameleon Deck ( an incredible color changing deck ), that used PD.
Message: Posted by: Siekomagic (Feb 20, 2013 5:34am)
Very interesting thread !!! Gotta try this.
Message: Posted by: Zombie Magic (Feb 20, 2013 5:40am)
If you're in the U.S. and want to try out Science Friction, Delicious Ambitious by Alexander Kolle is fantastic! It comes with a DVD and 4 treated cards.

Here's a trailer:
http://www.penguinmagic.com/p/2953
Message: Posted by: Card-Shark (Feb 20, 2013 5:57am)
An alternative effect and I think even stronger than Delicious Ambitious is One Card Collector, the same price of only 15$ incl. treated cards.

You can find it on our website under new releases.

I read the Kenton Knepper lecture brochure where the named effect is in. Not sure if he really mentioned PD but I doubt it. It seemed that the effect had a lot less publicity, so I guess it stood under the radar the recent years.
Message: Posted by: TheGreatRaymondo (Feb 20, 2013 3:20pm)
Quote:

On 2013-02-20 03:38, Magicmagician83 wrote:
Well I am a MFing idiotic moron then.


Yes you are.
Message: Posted by: saysold1 (Feb 20, 2013 8:33pm)
Quote:

On 2013-02-20 15:20, TheGreatRaymondo wrote:
Quote:

On 2013-02-20 03:38, Magicmagician83 wrote:
Well I am a MFing idiotic moron then.


Yes you are.


Agree.
Message: Posted by: Magicmagician83 (Feb 22, 2013 1:42am)
Wow. You guys make me glad I am in such a welcoming profession.
Message: Posted by: Magicmagician83 (Feb 22, 2013 11:14pm)
I will admit that I do own Delicious Ambitious and I love it to death. However I can not find a reason to pay 100 bucks for science friction no matter what it is or what it comes with. In my experience it works no better than regular roughing fluid that is applied correctly. Also, the new stuff that is applied like nail polish would even be an easier way to apply it. I have had much luck with Elmer's flexible and 2-way glue pens (Chek out Changin' Glue by Anthony Owens.) that when allowed to dry gives you a rubber like softly sticky residue on the back of the card that is virtually invisible. Here are some other issues with science friction I discovered.

1. Because it can be removed and reapplied, it tends to bead up slightly and actually come off the card even if handled lightly.
2. It is not undectable. It can be easily felt and seen if the light hits it right.
3. It can, despite what the ad says, pick up minute dust and dirt. This is not as much as you would think but it is noticable after a short while.

The good news is the stuff works pretty well if you can handle the above problems. The cards stick together nicely and can be seperated easily. If applied like in delicious ambitious it can be a dream to work with. But I do not like that it flakes off. So again, I do not see the logic in paying 100 bucks for that stuff when I can get a tube of 2 way glue that works just as well for two dollars at Wal-Mart. That's all I have to say about that.
Message: Posted by: Ihop (Feb 23, 2013 11:50am)
Quote:

On 2013-02-22 01:42, Magicmagician83 wrote:
Wow. You guys make me glad I am in such a welcoming profession.


To Magicmagician83
Wait a minute.
You laugh & ridicule the people that bought SF and you expect to be welcomed????

You said:

"You guys are paying a hundred dollars for a can of clear plasti dip spray. LOL"

First of all, perhaps they can afford it and you can't. LOL
Second they have SF and you have Plasti Dip. LOL
If you want to be welcomed, you have to learn people skills and be civil.
Message: Posted by: daffydoug (Feb 25, 2013 10:22am)
I can't watch videos on my phone, but was hoping someone would give me a quick run-down on what this spray allows you to do with cards, or rather a quick comparison of it with regular roughing spray. (advantages?)
Message: Posted by: Magicmagician83 (Feb 26, 2013 2:14am)
Ihop, you mean the civil people skills that you just showed? I'll pass.
Message: Posted by: Ihop (Feb 26, 2013 9:19am)
I'm just trying to explain to you why you feel that you're not welcome.
Just be nice.
Message: Posted by: Card-Shark (Feb 26, 2013 11:25am)
To answer the question of daffydoug:

Science Friction (reduced onto the spray and not what comes with it) is a spray that works much stronger and more reliable than a Roughing Fluid. While cards prepared with Roughing Fluid get weak over the time, Science Friction cards will keep the friction much longer. The basic difference though is the following fact and that changes the whole approach of roughing on playing cards:

While cards prepared with Roughing Fluid always need a partner card to work properly, Science Friction does not need a partner card. That means that usually a single card is prepared, and if you bring this card into a borrowed deck you are able to do miracles that are unexplicable. Steal that card out at the end and you are clean.

If you use an ID, you will never want to use another one than an ID made with Science Friction. The handling is so much more reliable and flawless.
The preparation for it is different, so with the same amount of spray needed to prepare a normal ID, you can make four IDs with Science Friction.
Message: Posted by: Michael J (Feb 26, 2013 12:05pm)
I have to agree with Card shark.

I made up an ID with Science Friction and it works beautifully. No more struggling to separate the card.

I've also used SF to make up Richard Sanders 4 Card Crunch. A Dr Daley Last Card Trick, type of effect.

Additionally, I've also used it to make up 'Hands Off Silent but Deadly', a wonderful effect from Ben Harris' Run_Silent_Run Deep Manuscript. which is the sequel to Silent Running by Ben Harris

All the best

Michael.
Message: Posted by: CaMagic51 (Mar 1, 2013 7:04pm)
I know this is probably a dumb question, but if Science Friction works without a partner card, then how do you and/or a spectator easily separate it from an adjacent card when that needs to happen?
Message: Posted by: Waterloophai (Mar 2, 2013 12:32am)
Quote:

On 2013-03-01 19:04, CaMagic51 wrote:
I know this is probably a dumb question, but if Science Friction works without a partner card, then how do you and/or a spectator easily separate it from an adjacent card when that needs to happen?


VERY VERY easy. That's one of the things that is explained on the DVD.
Message: Posted by: saysold1 (Mar 4, 2013 12:19am)
Only a small amount of spray is used - a dab will do ya (as Jack Nicholson would say).

It isn't a dumb question, but think about it.

Only a small portion of card gets treated.
Message: Posted by: TheGreatRaymondo (Mar 4, 2013 2:56pm)
Quote:

On 2013-02-26 02:14, Magicmagician83 wrote:
Ihop, you mean the civil people skills that you just showed? I'll pass.


Guys,
Let's just completely ignore this troll from now on and maybe (but unlikely) he will go away.
Some people just don't know when they are disliked and not wanted...
Message: Posted by: b0sl0q7 (Mar 6, 2013 2:28pm)
Hi,

I always have problems with my ID and cards flashing when I don't want them to. I think I might try it just for that. Does anyone know how many cards worth of spray you get for the $95?
Message: Posted by: Card-Shark (Mar 6, 2013 2:36pm)
You can spray 600 cards if you coat them with three thin layers, 900 cards with two thin layers.

In the Science Friction Forum you will learn how to prepare the ID with SF, and the amount used will only be counted for 13 cards. So I bet I would easily get 45 to 50 IDs out of one can. (cards provided, they are not IN the can... ;) )
Message: Posted by: b0sl0q7 (Mar 6, 2013 10:11pm)
Thanks for all the info on Science Friction. I will definately give it a try!
Message: Posted by: Zack_Johnston (Mar 7, 2013 11:56pm)
Quote:

On 2013-03-06 22:11, b0sl0q7 wrote:
Thanks for all the info on Science Friction. I will definitely give it a try!


I will as well! I will buy Delicious Ambitious first, then (I am almost sure I will) if I like it, I will buy Science Friction. Thanks for all the information on this fluid!

:bluebikes:
Message: Posted by: ApprenticeWizard (Mar 31, 2013 10:38pm)
If you do serious card work then Science Friction is a must have. I've been doing card magic for over 50 years. With Science Friction I have taken many of my favorite effects and added that last 5 percent of improvement that turns them into real miracles -- at least that's what my audiences and brother magicians tell me. Thanks for developing this truly wonderful product.
Message: Posted by: Gaz_Japan (Apr 14, 2013 1:57am)
Just made up an ID deck with SF and I can't believe how well it works.
Thank you very much Cardshark.
Message: Posted by: saysold1 (Apr 14, 2013 2:14am)
SF is a h*ll of a great product - it is one of those rare items and there is nothing else like it.
Message: Posted by: Magic Alaskan (Apr 20, 2013 4:12am)
Magicmagician83 obviously, no one on this forum cares what you think, on any subject. Get Lost!

The Cardshark rules....

Both products and service beyond compare.
Message: Posted by: fyi2 (Apr 22, 2013 9:24pm)
Kind words please - "Magicians helping magicians" and Please apply Thumper's rule at all times.
Message: Posted by: psychod (Apr 23, 2013 6:17pm)
I'm fairly new here but I really don't understand some of the posts. If someone doesn't like a particular product, that's fine. However, I don't feel that it's appropriate for them to put down others who do like that product. I would also hope that before people put down a product, that they spend some time with the actual product to give an informed opinion. As far as the cost, maybe some people could feel better if it cost $100 to buy a DVD with routines and the company threw in a free can of spray. There are certainly products out there that could be made less expensively but even assuming that SF is nothing more than basic roughing spray (I realize it's more than that), then the company is doing the magic fraternity a service by releasing an existing product with some new ideas. Plenty of effect that have been sold are also available for free in books. That doesn't mean that the person buying the effect wasted their money. Perhaps, they knew about it from the book but didn't want to go to the trouble of making it up themselves.

One more rant...this is supposed to be a fraternity of magicians...let's all try to be civil to each other.

Just my 3 cents worth,

Dave
Message: Posted by: saysold1 (Apr 23, 2013 8:36pm)
Quote:

On 2013-04-23 18:17, psychod wrote:
I'm fairly new here but I really don't understand some of the posts. If someone doesn't like a particular product, that's fine. However, I don't feel that it's appropriate for them to put down others who do like that product. I would also hope that before people put down a product, that they spend some time with the actual product to give an informed opinion. As far as the cost, maybe some people could feel better if it cost $100 to buy a DVD with routines and the company threw in a free can of spray. There are certainly products out there that could be made less expensively but even assuming that SF is nothing more than basic roughing spray (I realize it's more than that), then the company is doing the magic fraternity a service by releasing an existing product with some new ideas. Plenty of effect that have been sold are also available for free in books. That doesn't mean that the person buying the effect wasted their money. Perhaps, they knew about it from the book but didn't want to go to the trouble of making it up themselves.

One more rant...this is supposed to be a fraternity of magicians...let's all try to be civil to each other.

Just my 3 cents worth,

Dave


Dave-

Some very good words and advice here.

Just to make it crystal clear however, that SF is far from roughing spray being re-release. I know you aren't saying that it is - but that's probably not the best analogy to use.

This is in fact a breakthrough productt - it is something quite new - and it will allow many things your Grandpa's roughing spray wishes it could do but can't in a million years.

Roughing spray requires 2 cards - and much of each of those cards needs to be sprayed.

SF needs only the smallest dusting on a very small portion of one single card - and dries in less than 3 min.

SF is as close to "bottled magic" as I have ever encountered.

TRouble with your DL? Need a little hep with a perfect Elmsley Count? Triple lifts? Need a control card?

All and more possible with SF - making non card guys like me look like a pro.
Message: Posted by: J-Mac (Apr 24, 2013 8:46am)
Why argue with these people?

I just keep quietly using my SF and enjoying every effect greatly! I often have to keep from laughing out loud while using it. It is so easy yet so darned amazing!

Jim
Message: Posted by: psychod (Apr 24, 2013 5:25pm)
For what it's worth, I plan on picking up Science Friction. I saw it at Magic Live in 2011 and it looked pretty cool but I had already spent my allotted budget on magic (okay, I actually spent more). I do realize it's much more than roughing spray but I don't personally own it yet so I didn't want to comment on that. I guess I was commenting more on one person in particular making derogatory comments about others and then others continuing on with some comments that weren't all that nice either.

Just my 3 cents worth,

Dave
Message: Posted by: Poindexta (Apr 29, 2013 9:45pm)
Magicmagician83 is just another obvious troll, speaking ill of others for their opinions, then feigning shock and dismay when people speak ill of him. This is nothing new, there are thousands of these sad individuals all over the 'net. Sadly, this is the only way the common troll can obtain the attention he so craves. Generally, trolls have nothing of real value in their lives, be it family, friends, interests, and especially love. Therefore, the only thing they know to do is insult others, in a sad attempt to make themselves feel better. The best thing to do is either just say "okay" to whatever verbal diarrhea oozes from their mouths, or ignore them entirely. They HATE that.
Message: Posted by: saysold1 (May 1, 2013 1:11am)
Quote:

On 2013-04-29 21:45, Poindexta wrote:
Magicmagician83 is just another obvious troll, speaking ill of others for their opinions, then feigning shock and dismay when people speak ill of him. This is nothing new, there are thousands of these sad individuals all over the 'net. Sadly, this is the only way the common troll can obtain the attention he so craves. Generally, trolls have nothing of real value in their lives, be it family, friends, interests, and especially love. Therefore, the only thing they know to do is insult others, in a sad attempt to make themselves feel better. The best thing to do is either just say "okay" to whatever verbal diarrhea oozes from their mouths, or ignore them entirely. They HATE that.


Wow that may be a teeny bit heavy - I have encountered many a troll here on the Café but they are exceptions rather than rules thank goodness.

Good triumphs - and even I have said a few nitwitted things here over the years. Its all good.
Message: Posted by: The Amazing Pog (May 2, 2013 9:21am)
Where is the best place (only place) to order this online for UK delivery?
Message: Posted by: Card-Shark (May 2, 2013 9:35am)
Directly from us is the easiest way you can get it. Paypal payment, 4.90 Euro flat shipping or even free of charge shipping if you are ordering using your smartphone (as your purchase reaches the free of charge-limit with Science Friction).
Message: Posted by: alondon (May 20, 2013 8:39am)
SF is great.
Is there a site that users of SF can share their ideas and uses- I am sure that some will be very cleaver and useful to the rest of the magic world that uses this product.
Message: Posted by: Card-Shark (May 20, 2013 11:07am)
Yes, in your package you find a member card that allows you to join th Science Friction Community at www.sciencefrictionspray.com