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rtgreen Inner circle Portland, Oregon 1322 Posts |
Hey Danny,
How did you work things out with your "reps"? To be honest, I have a real phone phobia that I have to fight everytime I pick up the phone to make a call. I have toyed with the idea of working something out with some sales people, but haven't done much to pursue it. I would love to hear how you handle this. Thanks, Richard |
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Donald Dunphy Inner circle Victoria, BC, Canada 7563 Posts |
Quote:
On 2006-06-01 11:35, Dannydoyle wrote: Hi Danny - Just a question for clarification. Did you make this comment because I said my mailings included some to past customers (aka customers, clients)? Or did you make it because I said my mailings included some to the same list year after year, even if they haven't bought yet (aka suspects, prospects)? Or did you say that because I mail to both types? Occassionally, I do mail to some people I have never mailed to before, or to different contact people at the same business I have mailed to before, when there is a turnover. I guess it is true, that mailing to a totally cold list, is much harder than mailing to a list you have mailed to before, even if they haven't bought yet. - Donald
Donald Dunphy is a Victoria Magician, British Columbia, Canada.
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Dannydoyle Eternal Order 21219 Posts |
Donald. First off it was a compliment. So lets make that clear.
Second I said it as your mailings include past clients. People who have shown a propencity to buy the product. It sounds like you "mine" if you will a 25 year past client list. GREAT MOVE!!!!!!! Even mailing to a "turnover" as you refer to is still not really "direct mailing" as it is being refered to. That was what Richard and I meant by "your way is better" or at least I meant it. You are maintaining a mailing list. If the direct mail business did what you do, it would simply be maintaining a mailing list of past customers. Which they DO. It is simply a different department, and different budget is all. The debate was about the 1% figure Richard and I threw out. THAT spacific figure is pretty much agreed upon throughout most of direct mail industry. Indeed a 100000 things effect it, but in "general terms" it is accepted. 20% only happens when you do what you are speaking of. Maintaining a mailing list. Different catagory. Also not possible by the way for Tim. He has NO contacts. No matter what you put in the mailing you can NOT expect a 20% return cold. Hope this clears it up for you. Posted: Jun 2, 2006 10:30am Richard. I posess the exact same phobia. Not so much a phobia, but selling yourself is tough. To me it seems to me as if I come off as an arrogant braggart when I tell how good I am. My first solution was to create another person. I had a whole different name when I was selling the show. This did 2 things. First I wasn't bragging, second, how busy and good can a performer be who is calling me every 2 days for a job? It is a "perception" thing. I did this for a while, but then realized how much better a peformer I am than salesman. As for the deal you work with someone that is up to you. With cell phone packages so cheap and email campaigns easy, it is cost effective. I am not sure what you make or how you book now but my theory was that since I did a lot through agents anyhow, I had about that much to play with on shows I booked myself. BUT it depends on what you want them to do. Do they do all the paperwork, do they do scheduling, do they do pricing, help with marketing? You have to figure what you want them to do, then that will help with what it should cost you. Figure what it costs you to do these things yourself. That is money spent either way. What I found out was when someone who was better than myself at doing them was doing them, I made more money in the long run. after the first year or so. A better salesman, with the "perception" of selling a busy performer the whole thing. So figure what they need to be doing and start there. Hope this helps. Semper Occultus
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus <BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell |
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HypnotizeAmerica Veteran user 399 Posts |
Couple of stupid questions from a sleep deprived hypnotist.
Someone a while back mentioned actually picking up the phone and calling someone to book the show. To me this sounds like it would take longer than a mailing and also more rejection because it is a cold call, sales type call. Also, when someone is calling in you have a set of questions to ask but what about when you are cold calling. Example - "Hi I am Hypnotist calling about your post prom party - tell me about it, etc. etc" I like the idea of having someone else selling the show for me but how do I go about finding someone who does that - who wants to do it and what percent do they take? I'm sure there are more questions by my brain is done. Tim |
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Donald Dunphy Inner circle Victoria, BC, Canada 7563 Posts |
Thanks for the clarification, Danny. I get your point. You and I are cool. I could see you meant no malice, but were complimenting me. Didn't mean to sound defensive. Just trying to understand.
- Donald
Donald Dunphy is a Victoria Magician, British Columbia, Canada.
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Paddy Inner circle Milford OH 1571 Posts |
For the first two years my wife kept her day job as a meat clerk in a grocery store. It was a good union job paying over US$11 per hour. Then when I was consistantly makeing more than she was, she joined me full time instead of only one day a week.
Yes, we lost her health insurance but we are both a heck of a lot happier now as self employed performers. Peter |
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icentertainment Inner circle 1429 Posts |
Actually some of my cold calls are to event managers- and I ask them for advice on where they look for their entertainment and what kind of info packs they want--- This is less about sales and more about learning- they inevitably ask me for my promo pack and at the same time I learn about the customer- I still don't enjoy picking up the phone
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Stuart Cumberland Loyal user 289 Posts |
Tim: Geoff's plan works. In fact, if you go through his couse, he gives examples of what doesn't work and what does. It's worked for him. It's certainly worked for me. And it's worked for others.
I know a guy in a city that has Geoff's courses. About a year ago I heard him complaining that there's no business where he lives. NOBODY books hypnotists, expecially schools. Yet, I have been through his area 6 times in the past year and made a sizeable amount of money. I'm *confident* that there's more there, as I've turned down stuff that wasn't viable because of travel considerations. Oh. And I've never heard them mention his name. Ever. Go figure. He lives there and is starving. I direct mail (and that's ALL I do in this case), and I'm eating his breakfast. From a LONG distance away. Another thing. Don't focus on percentages. Focus on dollars. Dollars count. Percentages mean nothing. Bucks you can take to the bank. You do a mailing to 1000 names. One person books a show. You calculate the stats and discover that you got a 0.001% return. You freak. Close up shop and get a job flipping burgers. No. Lets say you get $1000.00 for that gig. You spent $300.00. You got $1000.00. For every dollar you put out, you got $3.33 back. How many times would you give me a buck if you knew I'd give you $3.33 back? Yeah. As many times as possible. Heck, you'd *borrow* money to do it. But you need to realize that it doesn't always work out. You might do a mailing and get nothing. You might mail again and get nothing. But the third might get you ten. THAT, I agree, is not always predictible. No business has a guaranteed way to make money. None. If there was, everybody'd be doin' it! But direct marketing works. And you can do it on a miniscule budget. And remember that to the degree you believe something, you are right. Stuart Cumberland |
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Scotty Mac Regular user 113 Posts |
All,
I just used Geoff Ronning's Service Club program to put together a direct mailing for my hypnsosis show. I received 5 responses to the cards I sent out within 36 hours. I spent a grand total of around $50.00 to mail 120 cards. I'll admit I was somewhat skeptical about what kind of response I would get, but having had time to reflect on this type of program here is how I break down the success or failure of a such a campaign. It comes down to a mindset change and you have to ask yourself the following questions: 1)Are you providing a product that your target client is interested in? 2)Are you focusing on a specific market or are you trying to blanket the entire planet with mailings? 3) What's the content of the postcard? 4)Is the program (content and pricing) you are offering attractive to the potential client? 5) What is your follow up strategy with the leads that call back? 6) What services or support to do you provide prior, during, and after the show? I know when a lot of people think of a direct mailing they think of the discount for the cracked windshield repair, the oil change, or maybe the discount on the doggie wash. Those campaigns are much less focused (based on a generic demographic)and as a result the hit rates are going to be lower. It's one thing to debate whether or not direct mailing will work. It's another to actually put a campaign together yourself and see what kind of results you'll get. Scott |
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Dannydoyle Eternal Order 21219 Posts |
See Scott your talking of apples and oranges.
What you are doing and what Geoff recomends is a "targeted mailer". NOT a direct mail piece. HUGE difference. Direct mail is not to qualified customers. It is a shotgun approach. Your using a rifle. Again far more accurate and yes you get better returns. The only real factor of success is did you make more money than you spent. Direct mailing will work or there wouldn't be so much money spent on them. This approach works, Geoff has had fantastic success with it in the past. The debate is not if it works. Truthfully getting up off ones but and doing SOMETHING works. So just so its clear to everyone your approach is not direct mail. It indeed works.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus <BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell |
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