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Jaxon
Inner circle
Kalamazoo, Mi.
2459 Posts
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Posted: Feb 3, 2005 7:51pm
This is just something I've learned from my years of practicing magic sleights. Maybe it'll help some of you when you get stuck on a move. It will happen a lot. Especially in the beginning.
Let me share a recent example that happened to me. There's a move in Paul Harris's Art of Astonishment books with two aces. Forgive me for not remembering the name of the move. I'm sure many of you know it so please fill us in if you read this.
Anyway, in the move you're holding the deck in one hand with a face up ace on top. And the other hand is holding a single ace face up. The move is that the two aces flip up and change places with each other. Like I said I'm sure many of you know this move and know it's not the easiest thing to master.
I tried for months and months to get it down when I first learned it from a Paul Harris video (Before the books came out). I just couldn't get it down. Every once in a while it would work but the move was far from mastered. The strange thing is this move isn't very useful. It's just a kind of neat looking flourish. That's not really my style but I still liked the move. Over the years since then I attempted it from time to time but never really pushed at it.
Then one day. Out of the blue. I tried it and I could do it! Not just once or twice. I can really do the move now. It's a shock when that happens too. "How in the heck can I do it so easily now?" That's what I felt like saying. Actually, I think I did say that out loud even though I was alone at the time and that really sucked.. 
So if you're ever stuck on a move. Don't get discouraged. Push yourself but don't get discouraged. When you are getting mad you'll only make more mistakes and you'll never master it that way. Take a 5 minute break then try again. Take a day, week or even years away from it then come back from time to time. Most hard moves like this aren't very useful anyway so it won't change your life, but I understand the desire to master things.
Well, Maybe that little thought will be helpful to someone. It's sure helped me over the years. It doesn't just apply to magic of course.
Ron Jaxon
"The map is not the Territory"
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TommyTheTremendous
Regular user
Azusa, California
151 Posts
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Posted: Feb 3, 2005 8:50pm
I have had situations like that with mostly cards, coins, and ropes and it DOES help to take a break from it for a few days and then try it again. I bet all of you have had days where you can't get just the slightest success in a trick. I agree with Ron on that breaks with discouraging tricks are a good thing.
- Tommy
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calexa
Inner circle
Germany
1634 Posts
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Posted: Feb 3, 2005 9:02pm
Not only in magic, but in most "life situations" a break is a good solutions when you get stuck. You step back, relax, think about your problem, let your brain get into new actions..... and you produce solutions. I had this experience very often in my life.
Magixx
Optimists have more fun.....
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BlackShadow
Special user
London UK
666 Posts
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Posted: Feb 3, 2005 9:12pm
You'll also find that the biggest jumps in improvement don't come during a sesion but at the beginning of the next one. You don't think you are learning but don't get disheartened. Wait a day or so and give it another half hour. You may be suprised. This is especially true of awkward manipulative work which needs a precise touch such as the coin rollout.
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Brent McLeod
Inner circle
New Zealand
1230 Posts
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Posted: Feb 3, 2005 9:43pm
JAXON-
Good post-
I had the same experience with Palms& switches on" Silk to Egg"
Took a break for a couple of months -retried a few moves & now its 1 of my strongest effects in between my music acts etc-Great audience reaction at each show this is done!!
http://www.thicmi.co.nz/Entertainer/After_Dinner_Entertainment/Brent_McLeod/Biography
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bigchuck
Veteran user
Nothing clever has ever been said in my
398 Posts
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Posted: Feb 3, 2005 10:37pm
PAY ATTENTION to Mr. Jaxon's post -- don't kill yourself trying to get a move down to performance level in one weekend (it generally isn't going to work that way) time away lets your brain catch up and it actually is working on the move in a subconscious way and when you go back to it, it will be easier.
"The computer can't tell you the emotional story. It can give you the exact
mathematical design, but what's missing is the eyebrows. - Frank Zappa"
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Chris Miller
Loyal user
Rochester, NY
229 Posts
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Posted: Feb 3, 2005 10:45pm
This happened to me with my strike double lift. I was getting frustrated by the inconsistency: sometimes getting doubles, sometimes getting triples.... Gave it up for a while. Tried it on a whim and now I am so much better. I think part of it is the break, but another important part is not thinking too hard about what you are doing. Like playing sports, thinking about every little thing can hurt your play. Letting go and having fun and trusting your body to perform just seems to work. A good observation, Jaxon, and one I don't seem to take advantage of on purpose with magic. Perhaps I should.
Chris Miller
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jaxonlee
New user
Butte, MT
66 Posts
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Posted: Feb 3, 2005 10:58pm
Taking a break from attempting to learn something new is very helpful. Another thing that I learned when I was fencing competitively was to spend a bit of time each day quietly visualising yourself (in detail) performing the action perfectly. Two to three 5 minute sessions a day will greatly enhance the learning curve. My two cents worth...hope it helps.
Jason L. Parish
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TommyTheTremendous
Regular user
Azusa, California
151 Posts
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Posted: Feb 4, 2005 12:22am
Some examples for me that are frustrating is the Coin Rollout and the One Hand Card Shuffle. I have been working on these both in the past few months. The breaks from them feel relaxing, hehe.
- Tommy
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Jaxon
Inner circle
Kalamazoo, Mi.
2459 Posts
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Posted: Feb 4, 2005 12:29am
I saw a thing on TV once where they took two groups and tested their accuracy in playing basketball. Then they had one of the groups practice for an hour each day for a week. The other group was asked to not touch a basketball for a week but to spend an hour a day visualizing themselves making baskets. I'm sure you guessed it. The group that just visualized an hour a day improved more then the group that actually practiced an hour a day. Very interesting how the mind works.
Magical_Mystifier made a good point about sports. I'm a pretty good bowler (average about 190 now). If I'm ever having a bad game I try to forget everything about bowling. Sometimes I even sing while I'm bowling. Not out loud of course.. I just kind of hum a tune. It really works. our mind has so much effect on our body. It's impossible to think more then one thoughts at a time on a conscious level. If we're frustrated we're probably jumping from thought to thought. So that break really helps.
Ron Jaxon
"The map is not the Territory"
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gene plampin
Regular user
172 Posts
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Posted: Feb 4, 2005 7:14am
I have also had this experience, in magic most recently with the palm to palm change. I just couldn't get it, so stopped for a few days. Then one day while I was waiting for a friend I gave ti a try and good do it over and over again with about a third the effort it took previously.
This also helped me in college doing term papers. I woould get stuck, take a break for have an hour, come back to it and be able to write again. And it was always the part that I had written after the break that got the best comments from my professors.
Gene
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Zac Vee
Veteran user
Assyrian/Iraq, Greece, UK
367 Posts
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Posted: Feb 4, 2005 7:25am
This is common with me, but some time from the opposite dirction. I mean when I am almost to master a slight, then suddenly I start to lose the plot, I become worse than when I first start that slight, so I leave it and start again in a day or two. That seems to work good, I beleive is the same as Jaxon mentioned giving it a break is very good and natural idea.
peace, love and kindness
1001 Magic Nights Blog
www.kasrani1.wordpress.com
http://www.samuelkasrani.com/
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Corey Harris
Inner circle
Kansas City, MO
1223 Posts
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Posted: Feb 4, 2005 9:34am
I have been doing this with the pass. It seems like every time I take a break from it and come back, it gets a little more easier almost. The understanding on how to accomplish it is becomming greater. Im far from being Ken Krenzell though. lol
Peter Egginks "Jurassic Deck" Available now only through US Toy Magic. Contact me for ordering Details.
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zur
Special user
California
671 Posts
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Posted: Feb 5, 2005 2:14am
That's very true. Sometimes when you keep on practicing a sleight you might have some kind of finger sprain. If you take a rest and then try again in a couple days you'll be amazed that you will pull it off.
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ClouDsss
Inner circle
1799 Posts
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Posted: Feb 6, 2005 8:41pm
Sometimes its jus your fingers getting exhuasted from doing the same thing over and over again. Other times, its jus your mind being too exhuasted and frustrated with having to do the same thing many times.
hence, a break will relax your mind and fingers and you might find it easier to perform the feat
cheerios
Think outside the box, cos people are all thinking inside now!! - ClouDsss
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rannie
Inner circle
4099 Posts
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Posted: Feb 7, 2005 1:09am
Be careful with the breaks too. Sometimes it goes on and on. Like the pass for example, it took me 10 years to get it down . Same thing with the one handed shuffle and the coin roll. I thought about it and realized that I had more breaks than tries. I would go at it like a madman then drop it , totally disgusted for months, then the same cycle again.
I think consistency is key. don't force it . take a break once in a while . Cross train, play a guitar or something.
peace,
Rannie
"If you can't teach an old dog new tricks, trick the old dog to learn."
-Rannie Raymundo-
aka The Boss
aka The Manila Enforcer
www.rannieraymundo.com
www.tapm.proboards80.net
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swiftshifter
New user
Philippines
94 Posts
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Posted: Feb 7, 2005 7:14am
Quote:
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On 2005-02-07 01:09, rannie wrote:
Be careful with the breaks too. Sometimes it goes on and on. Like the pass for example, it took me 10 years to get it down . Same thing with the one handed shuffle and the coin roll.
I think consistency is key. don't force it . take a break once in a while . Cross train, play a guitar or something.
peace,
Rannie
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Which pass is that, the coughing pass, or that kamot pass? Just kidding  Seriously though, I've had only an hour and a half of sleep since nine o'clock yesterday. Since I left your place this morning, I have been stressing over that handling of your pass...
...Or, instead of playing the guitar, do what I did: brood over some petty issue between you and your girl--it worked wonders for my one hand shuffle..
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itexus
New user
55 Posts
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Posted: Feb 7, 2005 4:32pm
Thanks for that topic.. it was just like you read my mind Jaxon 
I'm stuck on a trick and gets even more frustrated because I am frustrated about it.. that's a neat evil circle time for a break.. icecream! *yey  *
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rannie
Inner circle
4099 Posts
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Posted: Feb 7, 2005 10:21pm
Thanks Mike! It was the classic pass I was talking about. Hope your recharched now!
"If you can't teach an old dog new tricks, trick the old dog to learn."
-Rannie Raymundo-
aka The Boss
aka The Manila Enforcer
www.rannieraymundo.com
www.tapm.proboards80.net
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amerigo
Loyal user
with ONLY
242 Posts
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Posted: Feb 7, 2005 10:31pm
I find when you work at something too long it becomes more difficult. Jaxon you are right a little break can work wonders
Magic is Everywhere
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swiftshifter
New user
Philippines
94 Posts
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Posted: Feb 8, 2005 2:33am
Definitely back on track, and ready for more...
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Mystician
Inner circle
Wallachia
3403 Posts
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Posted: Feb 8, 2005 2:32pm
As BlackShadow mentioned, most improvements seem to occur at the beginning of the subsequent session, not during the current one.
I think there's an actual, bonafide, physical reason for this, regardless of will-power and the condition of your finger muscles.
Studies of the brain have shown that neurons and synapses, the things that comprise the myriad little neural pathways in our brain, grow, expand, and form new connections when a person is undergoing a learning process. This is especially the case in infants and toddlers, whose brains grow at relatively phenomonal rates.
So part of the explanation is that in-between sessions, your brain is actually growing the neural pathways it now needs to be able to do what you're demanding of it - because, really, it's not the fingers so much as the brain that's doing the hard work of prestidigitation.
One can overpractice too, which only brings exhaustion, despair, and I suppose can even reinforce a bad technique due to repetition (muscle memory?)while tired or burnt out.
This of course brings up a couple more points: get a good night's sleep every night !! This is when your brain is probably doing the most growth; it's when your body rebuilds itself from the stresses of the day. Very important, frequently overlooked.
Lastly, not to sound like anyone's mom, (yeah right) but don't just eat junk food. Get those vitamins, minerals, and everything else you need in your system so that your brain has the essential amino acids and junk that it needs to build up those important neural pathways ASAP.
Aside from good advice that can steer you into good habits and away from bad ones, there are no "shortcuts".
Can I just say, Feed your head ?
Mortals' minds are toys to be played with, and prey to be toyed with.
http:// www . phrets . com
Visit http://www.bizarremagic.net
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LordM
Loyal user
Portugal
232 Posts
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Posted: Feb 9, 2005 12:47pm
It's almost like using a TT. Use it for a long long time , and one day you'll be surprised by how easy it will be to handle it. It becomes part of you.
Kind Regards,
JP
http://www.joaopedroso.com
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JohnnyNykkon
New user
Crystal Lake,IL
57 Posts
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Posted: Feb 11, 2005 11:00am
Jaxon in your pic you look like a white version of snoop dogg.
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Mystician
Inner circle
Wallachia
3403 Posts
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Posted: Feb 11, 2005 3:35pm
Quote:
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On 2005-02-11 11:00, JohnnyNykkon wrote:
Jaxon in your pic you look like a white version of snoop dogg.
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LOL !!!
Mortals' minds are toys to be played with, and prey to be toyed with.
http:// www . phrets . com
Visit http://www.bizarremagic.net
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Jaxon
Inner circle
Kalamazoo, Mi.
2459 Posts
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Posted: Feb 11, 2005 10:55pm
LOL.. I never heard that one before but one time I went to a bar and some girls ran up to me excitedly. I was wearing a black leather trench coat. My hat and I still had my sun glasses on from being outside.
The girls suddenly lost their excitement. When I asked why they said, "We thought you where Kid Rock"..
Ron Jaxon
"The map is not the Territory"
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Dark
Elite user
406 Posts
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Posted: Feb 16, 2005 12:48pm
Jaxon hit the nail on the the head. I've found that when I'm "just not getting it", if I stop and analyze what I'm doing wrong. Then I visualize myself doing the move correctly. The next time I try again, it gets much better. I think its the shifting of the conscious to the unconscious.
I've also found that sometimes a metronome helps me a lot. I start with a very slow count and then work my way up to the speed I want.
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what
Special user
Lehi, UT, USA
643 Posts
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Posted: Feb 16, 2005 1:47pm
If you really want to improve something, do it a few times, take a break for at least an hour (doing something else), Then do it again (just a few times). You will learn to do it right the first time.
Mike
Magic is fun!!!
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