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Mallusionist New user 7 Posts |
I am a great fan of memorized deck magic. As such, I take great care not to mention memorizing deck as a concept -- to the point that any books with the phrase "memorized deck" in the title are not easily seen in my home. My concern is that, once a non-magician thinks of the memorized deck as a concept, he will start guessing that every trick he sees involves a memorized deck and this will get annoying.
I admit that this comes in part from an experience when I was a youth and thought my focus would be on card magic instead of mentalism. I used to try tricks out on my dad, and at one point he discovered that I was using a stripped deck. From that point on, he'd check for a stripped deck every time I did a card trick (and was gloriously baffeled the first time I showed him a MD trick). Any way, the question here is: do you think I'm being too protective of the concept, or is this a real concern?
|/ Presto!
www.mallusionist.com |
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ROBERT BLAKE Inner circle 1472 Posts |
Yes!
see what Tamariz does. he mixes normal tricks with memo deck tricks. |
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Hushai Elite user St. Louis, Missouri, USA 459 Posts |
This concern is kind of like one I posted about in another thread. It has occurred to me that non-magicians sometimes think that card tricks are ALWAYS done with gimmicked cards. Marked cards are often suspected. And, in fact, some very good tricks COULD be done with marked cards, maybe more easily than with the methods that are actually used. The only ways I can see to eliminate the suspicion of marked or otherwise gaffed cards are (1) to use a borrowed or new deck when possible and (2) do many tricks in which a gimmicked deck could not possibly be the explanation, e.g. tricks in which the spectator, not the performer, does the work, such as Out of This World.
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frog52 New user Iowa 62 Posts |
I agree: it is very important to camouflage the fact you have a MD. In most cases, I use a few false shuffles & cuts followed by 2 faros. If that does not dispel the possibility of a stack, then I do not know what could.
The problem is for ACAN. I uses Barrie Richardson's version, and really do not want to have to do any sleights before putting the cards in the box, before starting the effect. This trick does point to the use of a MD, but it is still very strong. Any ideas? |
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landmark Inner circle within a triangle 5194 Posts |
If you want to do ACAN without sleights beforehand, one approach is this:
"I had a premonition I want to share with you. I'm going to be very open and frank with you. I've arranged this deck in a very specific way based on my premonition. I'd like to see if my premonition is correct. Please name a card . . . now a number." etc. It's kind of a jiu-jitsu approach. You admit up front that the cards are arranged and that's why (by implication or explicitly) you are not going to shuffle them. Even if the spectator had any notion of what a memorized deck was, there is no way to reconstruct the effect. If the spec is a puzzle hound, all he can really ask himself is "what possible order could the cards have been in at the beginning for my card to land at my number?" Not the only approach of course, but I sometimes do it this way, and it plays very well. Jack Shalom
Click here to get Gerald Deutsch's Perverse Magic: The First Sixteen Years
All proceeds to Open Heart Magic charity. |
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phil in KC Regular user 199 Posts |
Quote:
On 2006-07-25 15:54, landmark wrote: Very clean, Jack! The only change I'd suggest is not to reference the deck -- as far as the spectator knows, you've placed a single card at a specific number, so that's all you should admit to. -Phil in KC |
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landmark Inner circle within a triangle 5194 Posts |
Yes, thanks, that's better!
As to the original question, I could be wrong on this but I think the concept of a memorized deck is completely out of the realm of possibility for a layperson. I don't think it needs disguising unless you are playing to magicians. The power of the memorized deck is simply this: who in their right mind would take the time to memorize the order of 52 cards? I just don't think it's even on the radar for most lay people. Sure, throw in a false shuffle or two before an effect if you like, but only because that's what people expect before any card handling. I wouldn't over worry it. Jack Shalom
Click here to get Gerald Deutsch's Perverse Magic: The First Sixteen Years
All proceeds to Open Heart Magic charity. |
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Mesquita Special user 917 Posts |
...last week the World champion of memory presents here, in Brazil, on Television; he memorizes a completely shuffled deck, in ONE MINUTE!!!!! That's right! One minute!!!!!
Unbelievable!!!!!!!
"Siempre somos tres me acompaña la luna y me sigue mi sombra" René Lavand
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frog52 New user Iowa 62 Posts |
One second per card, in front of a TV camera, that screams "trick", IMHO. Did he shuffle his own deck?
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Jay Elf Elite user 466 Posts |
Hello.
The world record is about 40 or 50 seconds for one deck if my memory serves. |
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Mesquita Special user 917 Posts |
Quote:
On 2006-07-26 17:04, frog52 wrote: No, it is not a trick... he didn't even touch the deck... and "remember" he is the current champion of the World Memory Championship... I think his name is "BEN PRIDMORE". All the best, :bikes: Mesquita
"Siempre somos tres me acompaña la luna y me sigue mi sombra" René Lavand
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frog52 New user Iowa 62 Posts |
Mesquita: Wow. That is amazing then. When I was a teenager, I learned a memory system and managed to memorize a deck in about 10 minutes. Had no idea there was a world championship. Obrigato.
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randywebb New user 9 Posts |
Quote:
The problem is for ACAN. I uses Barrie Richardson's version, and really do not want to have to do any sleights before putting the cards in the box, before starting the effect. This trick does point to the use of a MD, but it is still very strong. Any ideas? My first post was deleted, and I am guessing it was because I got too specific. It was actually my frist post in the forums so I guess I got over eager and didn't read all the FAQ's, so first let me say I am sorry. I would use something simple and subtle like Lew Brook's, "False False Shuffle". |
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spycrapper Loyal user Indonesia 295 Posts |
I keep it as secret that I use MD
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Kjellstrom Inner circle Sweden, Scandinavia, Europe 5203 Posts |
Do some effects with real shuffling and then bring in a hot deck with some kind of switch: that is my approach for sceptical people.
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Memo New user Germany (northrhine-westfalia) 77 Posts |
The world record for one deck with 52 cards is 31.16 seconds by Andi Bell. I got 40s in the last World Memory Championships. In training I did it in less than 30s already.
Ben Pridmore is not the actual World Memory Champion. He finished fourth last time (he won in 2003 & 2004). Clemens Mayer is the actual champion.
"There have been many claims by magicans and mentalists to the invention of mnemonics; some of the claimants have been world-famous performers - and none of them have a right to their claims!" - Corinda
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K_B_G Regular user 136 Posts |
A full deck false riffle shuffle should relieve any suspicious spectators of all doubt.
Also I really doubt this creeps into the minds of the average audience member. Unless you spend about 5 minutes thinking about the position of the card and what to do next, while holding the dormant deck in your hand. I think memorized desks are light years away from being the next plastic thumb. |
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Patrick Differ Inner circle 1540 Posts |
KBG wrote:
Quote:
I think memorized decks (sic) are light years away from being the next plastic thumb. This is the truth. Unless one bumbles around with the calculations, the layman discounts the idea of a MD as absurd. Who in their right mind would do it? Certainly not us...
Will you walk into my parlour? said the Spider to the Fly,
Tis the prettiest little parlour that ever you did spy; The way into my parlour is up a winding stair, And I've a many curious things to show when you are there. Oh no, no, said the little Fly, to ask me is in vain, For who goes up your winding stair -can ne'er come down again. |
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MichelAsselin Veteran user 20th century, 3rd dimension 326 Posts |
As Memo alluded, there are a handful of people who can memorise a deck cold less than 40 seconds; but the nameéplace in the deck relationship is usually not instantanous. (But I could be wrong in the case of Pridmore).
Memo, am I wrongÉ
" , ? ; !!! "
- Marcel Marceau, Feb 30, 1945. |
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fallingblood New user North Dakota 98 Posts |
I don't use a memorized deck many times, but when I do, I do it the way Andrew Mayne explains in his The Zero Memorization Memorized Deck ebook. I tell my audience that I'm going to memorize an entire deck, and then I prove it.
A couple of false shuffles and false cuts will usually make it less suspicious. If you let the spectator cut the cards, that's eliminates a lot of suspicion also. |
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