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silverking Inner circle 4574 Posts |
The Smiling Mules credentials are solidly established.
It helps to have some history with the subject as contemplated by the Mule, as for reasons known only to him he has withdrawn 99% of his previously public insight from view (although some likely remains here on the Café under a different name). The James set has been most definitely set adrift by the card handling community. I think it's probably safe to say that the Ackerman set is the very best audio/visual representation of Erdnase currently available......... just how far up the scale it ascends is something that only you personally can attest to after repeated viewings of the actual discs. The paper book of course remains the most viable source to actually learn this material. It's only by reading Erdnase that you can come to fully understand Erdnase. If you were contemplating buying some Erdnase DVD's, consider this instead: http://www.magicbookshop.com/product_inf......_id=7941 Dick Hatch has found a very limited number of copies of the now quite legendary 2002 facsimile of the first edition. Released in an edition of 750, he's found probably no more than a few dozen more. It feels good in the hands, will disappear (once again) for good very soon, and will inspire a lifetime of learning..............DVD's you can buy anytime. |
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Magiguy Inner circle Seattle, WA 5467 Posts |
Great advice, Silverking.
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John Neely Loyal user Iowa 280 Posts |
This post discourages me from studying Erdnase at all. Maybe some of the moves are as impossible as they seem when you first try them. Could this be why neither DVD set is outstanding (and I'm just saying this based on what I read here since I have not watch either DVD set)? If there is not any one person who can do all of Erdnase's stuff outstandingly, then maybe some one shoulds produce a DVD with various artist who specialize in different moves from the book rather than having one person try to demonstrate all the moves. Just a thought.
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splice Inner circle Canada 1246 Posts |
Am I understanding you right? Because no one has shown that they can perform EVERY SINGLE MOVE PERFECTLY from Erdnase, you don't feel like studying Erdnase at all?
There are books that I feel are worth it because of one little gem found amongst hundreds of pages. Erdnase has much more than that. Just because neither Wesley James or Allan Ackerman can't do everything perfectly to the very letter of what Erdnase wrote doesn't mean the book is worthless. |
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luvisi Special user 601 Posts |
I'm surprised that nobody has mentioned the Revelations video tapes yet. They don't cover everything in Erdnase, but they touch on quite a bit of Erdnase material.
Andru
Andru Luvisi
http://www.practicenotincluded.com/ |
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Zachary Loyal user 275 Posts |
One more for Ackerman, they have served me and a great majority of other workers in my area, as for James, I've only seen parts of it and from what I did see, it doesn't quite outdo the teaching approach that Alan brings to his version. Both incredible guys though
Twitter:@Zachary_Heath
Instagram: @zachheathmagic |
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silverking Inner circle 4574 Posts |
Quote:
If there is not any one person who can do all of Erdnase's stuff outstandingly............ Steve Freeman could do every move in the book, but he didn't make any videos other than the series Andru mentions above, nor does he currently maintain any sort of public profile. It doesn't matter though, reading and learning from the book is a personal journey, and has nothing to do with what somebody has accomplished before you. |
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Jonathan Smith Regular user 125 Posts |
The Mule is considering filming his own set.
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John Neely Loyal user Iowa 280 Posts |
Quote:
On 2009-04-02 10:05, splice wrote: Let me rephrase what I said. It has never been a goal of mine to try to learn all the material in Erdnase. The thought that some of the moves in the book might not actually be workable (and I'm not saying this is the case, just if it were) I would be even less inclined to try to learn all the material in Erdnase. I could see myself spending hours trying to get something to work which in the end isn't going to work right anyway. I do know there is important useful material in there and have worked on some of it myself (overhand shuffle techniques, palming techniques, diagonal palm shift, ect.) and have bought the Annotated Erdnase by Darwin Ortiz to assist me in doing so. I'm looking for those gems, too, and I have found plenty in Erdnase! |
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silverking Inner circle 4574 Posts |
Quote:
On 2009-04-02 12:10, Jonathan Smith wrote: You seem to be representing yourself as somebody who knows the Smiling Mule personally, and are sharing information here on the Café that obviously could only come from the Mule himself. Is this accurate? Are you posting on behalf of the Smiling Mule? |
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Jonathan Smith Regular user 125 Posts |
Not posting on behalf of anyone but myself. Sorry if it seemed I was trying to represent myself as anything other than an Erdnase fan and Smiling Mule blog reader. Yes, I was passing in info that came from the Mule himself.
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silverking Inner circle 4574 Posts |
Thought you might be referring to something other than his blog post of this past October.
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Ben Train Inner circle Erdnase never had 4639 Posts |
Quote:
On 2009-04-02 09:47, John Neely wrote: I've had the pleasure of seeing EVERYTHING from the book, including the tricks, performed outstandingly well- be it the SWE shift, the open shift, DPS, the palm work, the shuffle work, or the legerdemain/tricks stuff. Of course, this was done by a variety of people, in different situations. Can everything be done? Yup. Can it be done well? Yup. Can you do it? If you put the time into it, I see no reason why not. Ben
If you're reading this you're my favourite magician.
Check out www.TorontoMagicCompany.com for upcoming shows, and instagram.com/train.ben for god knows what! |
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Steve Burton Loyal user 258 Posts |
I can't imagine anyone would want to learn everything in Erdnase except as an exercise for completists. The culls, for example, were designed for the card table but as for their use in conjuring I can't see why you would need to cull cards from five different positions with so many overhand shuffles. I think that's the reason Erdnase divided the book into two different sections. The Legerdemain section should definitely be studied by every card magician. The gambling section should be cherry picked for techniques that may be used in your magic.
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markmiller Special user 731 Posts |
Well said.
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Ben Train Inner circle Erdnase never had 4639 Posts |
Hey Steve,
If you pm me I'll be happy to explain a very strong effect in which that cull sequence is made use of.
If you're reading this you're my favourite magician.
Check out www.TorontoMagicCompany.com for upcoming shows, and instagram.com/train.ben for god knows what! |
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skillzilla Regular user 106 Posts |
Have you seen the ordinary methods of stocking put to good use or done deceptively
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Ben Train Inner circle Erdnase never had 4639 Posts |
Quote:
On 2009-04-02 13:48, Ben Train wrote: In regards to that specific move: from a gambling perspective, no, I haven't. From a magicians standpoint, yes.
If you're reading this you're my favourite magician.
Check out www.TorontoMagicCompany.com for upcoming shows, and instagram.com/train.ben for god knows what! |
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Kjellstrom Inner circle Sweden, Scandinavia, Europe 5203 Posts |
I think this (new) 10-DVD set must be the best collection of powerhouse effects from D. Ortiz:
http://www.llpub.com/zenshop/index.php?m......_id=2600 |
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Jeff Corn Inner circle Las Vegas 1190 Posts |
I've never understood why Wesley James gets so much heat for his set of DVDs. Not all the moves were as polished as we'd hoped and he has a couple of tells, but the conversation between he and Lovell were entertaining and informative. As much as I like Allan Ackerman's work, his set put me to sleep. Not to mention messing up some of the material himself. The SWE Shift is performed with the most awkward cover I've seen used and he even slipped on the Charlier Cut.
Yes, that is my real name. Yes, I am a real person. No, you probably won't agree with me.
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