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Chessmann Inner circle 4247 Posts 
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Assuming a magician who can entertain with a pack of cards, I don't agree with Silverking in regard to this. Of course, Harry is an example of someone who can do both successfully. If the lay-people are entertained, that is what counts.
My ex-cat was named "Muffin". "Vomit" would be a better name for her. AKA "The Evil Ball of Fur".
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silverking Inner circle 4574 Posts
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I wasn't speaking as a magician, or to magicians in general, I was only speaking to the OP, who asked a specific question in a Gambling Forum.
The world is full of balloon twisters and silk workers sticking gambling routines in the middle of their shows.......something that poisons gambling demos as executed by true students of gambling and hustling who aren't magicians, and who don't seek the opinions of magicians on topics related to gambling and hustling. My comments stand as I wrote them. |
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The Dowser Special user Canada 763 Posts
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I don't think the transition, or the difference is so stark if the magician is one who works primarily with cards. Then gambling routines are a natural, even if you do mostly magic (card magic). I think this is why some one like Harry has success with these routines ( not mentioning that fact that Harry is an exceptional showman ). As for someone sticking it in between illusions, silks, and balloons... I guess I do agree with Silverking.
But not for "card" magicians. If you already do mostly card magic, I think the persona is already there just waiting to be activated by your presentation. Anyone who has seen ten minutes of card magic will not think a gambling routine is a sudden change of gears and I don't think gambling routines are any less interesting than any of the other standard card fare that is out there, unless, of course, the performer is less interesting. |
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AMcD Inner circle stacking for food! 3078 Posts
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Gambling routines are fascinating. All serious card magic books have some. Everyone enjoy a gambling routine. It's part of a concealed dream "Ha, if I could...". Gambling is an area full of myths and stories. Just look how many movies in the cinema history show a simple card game. Gambling is part of the human nature. I've never seen someone not enjoying a gambling routine. Plus, I second Braue (I think) when he said that if you perform card tricks, be sure someone is gonna ask you for a gambling routine one day or another.
But! I've seen countless stupid routines or ones which have nothing to do with gambling! I'm not a magician looking at a colleague in a show, I'm not part of a paid audience of a DVD and I'm not someone who has hardly seen a true card in his life, then I need something I can believe. I perform card tricks once in a while. I remember 5 or 6 years ago when a 12 years old nephew asked me "what's that Poker version using 5 five dealt cards?". How many times I've seen people not cutting cards while demoing a gambling routine! What I mean is that people enjoy gambling but are not dumb nor fully ignorant. You need something more or less serious. If you are close to actual gambling, people will be much more convinced and much more pleased. You're talking about gambling, you are supposed to cheat or gain advantage in a true game! What's the point to use fancy cuts or stunts like I've seen so many times in pseudo-gambling expose? Get close to true gambling and it will be more convincing and entertaining. But don't make the mistake to do kinda expose. A true gambling expose is boring as hell for 90% of lay people. Very few are interested with TRUE gambling techniques detailed for hours... We're talking about a magic show, it has to be entertaining and... magic! Anyway, I think nevertheless that a gambling routine should be part of a gambling act. Stacking cards between doves and silk routines, well, I don't find it's appropriate. I second Silver about Harry. Mr Lorayne's personality is unique and very few could handle an audience like he's doing for decades. OK, OK, it's not a secret he's one of my favorite guys and I'm not fully objective  . |
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Harry Lorayne 1926 - 2023 New York City 8558 Posts
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Hi Guys: Thanks for the kind words; they are appreciated. But I don't want any negativism to creep in so far as my routines are concerned. Yes, presentation is always important, and yes, I sure make it my business to "present" my items, but believe me, I've seen people over the years do my gambling routines with little or no "presentation" and they still wowed their audiences. Yes, they'd have "wowed" them a h@ll of a lot more if presented properly, but the routines are strong enough (in my obviously biased opinion) to get by. Please don't take this to mean that you shouldn't work on presentation - of course you should. Just wanted to get this small point across. Best - HARRY L.
[email]harrylorayne@earthlink.net[/email]
http://www.harrylorayne.com http://www.harryloraynemagic.com |
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tommy Eternal Order Devil's Island 16543 Posts
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It seems to me that playing cards are not called playing cards for nothing. Playing cards are for playing card games with. And the games that are played with cards are so often played for money that a pack of cards is, more or less, seen as a gambling device. When a conjurer does magic with these gambling devices, no mater what sort of magic it is, the public see it as cardsharping. Even if one did something like Cardini, the public would still think one was a cardsharp. In any event there are so many gambling card tricks I don’t where to start. For something different one could look at some of Lennart Greens stuff.
If there is a single truth about Magic, it is that nothing on earth so efficiently evades it.
Tommy |
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oOMagiiCOo New user 74 Posts
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I can recomend learning different sleights such as the second and bottom deal and developing your own routine with ideas incorporated from others that you have seen.
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stoneunhinged Inner circle 3067 Posts
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Quote:
On 2010-06-07 11:40, oOMagiiCOo wrote: An excellent idea! |
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Alan M Elite user California 433 Posts
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Sb,
Hollingsworth's Drawing Room Deceptions does indeed have a gambling demo routine. It's multi-phased and requires only intermediate skills. If you already have the book it is certainly worth a peek. -Al |
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silverking Inner circle 4574 Posts
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Quote:
On 2010-06-07 11:40, oOMagiiCOo wrote: Precisely!....and if you can combine the above suggestion with a control of 3 or 4 cards, or do a straddle faro(or both), then you've got the making of a gambling routine superior to anything I've read in a book. If you combine the above with accurate knowledge of the game you're demo'ing, and offer accurate information on the betting process and odds combined with an interesting take on the history of the game.......you've got a great answer to the OP's original question. Quick example of where magicians can go wrong when designing "gambling routines" without sufficient knowledge of the subject matter. (this is by no means saying that all routines designed by magicians are not accurate, only that some are). The Becker and Earle routine called "Texas Fool'Em" was marketed for somewhere around $165.00 originally. It's now available for around $50.00, and still nobody is buying it.......they can't give it away. WHY? Because they designed the routine as an accurate representation of a Texas Hold'Em game, BUT....they failed to design in the ability to burn cards......any cards. In other words, they didn't anticipate that any amateur Hold'Em player (of which there are many these days) would stop the routine and say "hey wait, you didn't burn a card". When you (as the magician) had to state aloud that you couldn't burn a card, you essentially could give up the routine as being as good as over in the eyes of the spectator. Accuracy counts in gambling demo's.......or it should to those who wish to be taken seriously. I'm reading plenty of comments here and in this and other forums on the Café from magicians who do understand and undertake to be accurate and authentic when giving gambling demo's.......it's actually much more commonplace than I had originally thought it might be. |
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IanKendall Special user Edinburgh 571 Posts
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I like Darwin Ortiz's sentiment - if you want to give the impression of having great skill, it helps to actually posess great skill.
For example, if you are doing a gambling themed routine and presenting yourself as skilled but cannot do a serviceable second or bottom deal, you are setting yourself up for an awkward moment when one of your audience asks about such deals. Similarly, if you are going to use a false stacking routine, you might want to learn to stack properly - even if it's a basic stack. As has been mentioned above, the best route is to learn the moves and then noodle them together into a thread that fits your skill level and character. That way you will be unique (in that it is _your_ routine), and that alone will set you apart from the rest. It's a long road, though. Ian |
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AMcD Inner circle stacking for food! 3078 Posts
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Quote:
On 2010-06-09 04:44, IanKendall wrote: +1 And you can bet any audience will ask you for moves they want to believe as true! Millions of people play cards today, mainly Hold'dem. You're gonna face troubles using swivel cuts or not cutting procedures... I'm really glad to read your post. For years now I ask guys to understand that magic has evolved, that new medias are available and that many people know "something" about Magic or even true card games. Today's audiences are not the ones of the last century! Of course, not everyone is interested on Magic or card playing, of course many people just wanna be entertained and of course they are many people easy to fool. But, it's my own opinion, I strongly believe that since Internet, youtube, dailymotion, forums, P2P, explosion of Magic DVD, etc., millions (yes, millions) of people are much more educated about basic Magic than it was in the past. The performer has to be careful. |
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Harry Lorayne 1926 - 2023 New York City 8558 Posts
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The more "educated" the laymen are the better I fool them!! HL.
[email]harrylorayne@earthlink.net[/email]
http://www.harrylorayne.com http://www.harryloraynemagic.com |
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Howard Hamburg New user 94 Posts
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Quote: there is haskell's poker deal,thompson's million-dollar bridge and poker demonstration,and a hard to find (not poker)BJ demo from chuck smith's lecture notes.a cheat showed it to him in 1949.you win every hand.ez stack,plays heads up.easier for them to follow,to non-card players poker can be confusing.
On 2010-06-03 23:10, sb wrote: |
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bishthemagish Inner circle 6013 Posts
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If your performing an illusion show and want to do a close up segment and feature one card routine for an audience. Sort of like a formal close up show. And you want to feature a gambling routine with cards. I will suggest Harry Loraynes fantastic routine the Magician vs. the Gambler in personal secrets.
This routine is a cutting of the four kings - three are cut and an ace then the three kings change to aces - and four kings are removed from your pockets. It is a great routine with an interesting and entertaining storyline plus it has two fantastic climaxes. And it is a routine you do standing with a side table or get a helper out of the audience and hold their palm out to place the cards (kings) on face down as you cut to them one at a time - before they change to aces. I hope this helps.
Glenn Bishop Cardician
Producer of the DVD Punch Deal Pro Publisher of Glenn Bishop's Ace Cutting And Block Transfer Triumphs |
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bazza2302 New user 23 Posts
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I just watched the youtube of the texas Fool'em, I wonder if you could add in a burn by bottom dealing. I don't own the trick so I don't know if this works, but it looks to me like you could bottom deal the burn cards, and you wouldn't disturb the setup on the top.
Quote:
On Jun 7, 2010, silverking wrote: |
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KardSharp89 New user 17 Posts
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Quote:
On Jun 3, 2010, sb wrote: You should check out the ALL IN video from Jack Carpenter. Available on PenguinMagic.com. I like Jack because he does gambling based routines that aren't "expose" style. They actually use the gambling slights and magic slight of hand to create a gambling related trick. He has a bunch of them! And while you are there feel free to check out Holy Crap Aces by Houston Curtis. (That's me) Sincerely - Houston Curtis
He's leaving town tomorrow...so let's go ahead and skin him.
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KardSharp89 New user 17 Posts
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Here is a gambling style card trick along with the actual card hustle that inspired it. Enjoy!
https://youtu.be/wiQdKoaUn4k
He's leaving town tomorrow...so let's go ahead and skin him.
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| The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » The Gambling Spot » » Looking for a good gambling demo routine (0 Likes) | ||||||||||
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Posted: Jun 6, 2010 04:20 am 
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