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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Deckless! » » Macdonald's Aces... (7 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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RVM7
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Hey guys I'm just wandering which one do you like to perform/prefer...
The Macdonald's Aces marketed today (gaffed) or Grandpa Aces (David Copperfield) which is pure sleight of hand. But both cannot be examined or checked by spectators.
Vlad_77
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The MacDonald Aces plot goes back quite a few years. There are gaffed and non-gaffed versions. Grandpa's Aces is a member of this plot family. Your assertion of Copperfield's approach is only partly correct. Just because something is "gaffed" does not mean there is no sleight of hand involved.

I perform two versions of this effect at present:

Frier by Cameron Francis which is gaffed and uses sleights, and Under Her Spell by Simon Aronson which is NOT gaffed and uses sleights.

GENERALLY speaking, gaffs do not eliminate sleight of hand but they DO enhance an effect and allow for effects either not possible or unnecessarily difficult in methodology. Remember Theo. Annemann's maxim that EFFECT is everything. Don't get hung up on the strange notion that pure sleight of hand is the "better" magic. Maximum impact achieved by the most EFFICIENT method is what marks a great effect. So, Darwin Ortiz's "The Sting" is pure unadulterated sleight of hand and employs efficient means to achieve maximum effect. Lorayne's HaLo Aces is the same. Conversely, Harry Anderson's "Shadow Card" uses a very old gaff that achieves a very strong impact as well. Another class (in magic) is "self-working" effects that use neither sleights nor gaffs. Untouched by Daryl Easton (based upon a Tony Faro effect), Impossible by Simon Aronson, and Out of This World by Paul Curry are just three examples out of hundreds of strong effects that rely purely on subtlety for method.

Memdecks are yet ANOTHER method. These effects run the gamut of knucklebusting sleights to no sleights at all.

But, in ALL cases, ALL magic depends ultimately on ONE principle: the psychological reality that the magic actually happens in the spectator's MIND.

Ahimsa,
Vlad
RVM7
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I perform both too. But I didn't say anything about Macdonlad's Aces not having any sleight of hand. I actually copied CA's routine and for the ungaffed DC.
Thanks for your reply Vlad. My ears are open for other's opinion.
Vlad_77
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I should clarify then: An effect like Under Her Spell is completely examinable.

I am curious when you say you "copied" routines. Perhaps a language barrier?

Ahimsa,
Vlad
RVM7
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I meant copied as in copied. I just do every single move they do.
pepka
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The version David performed on TV DOES use gaffs. Just not the typical ones that we're used to.
RVM7
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It did ?? I think it's just DL's and double stick tape...
pepka
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Double Stick tape would be a gaff. Gaffed cards does not mean specially printed cards. For the record though, I don't think David used double stick tape. Something very similar though that used to be be available to the magic community which I don't think is being made anymore.
Dougini
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Although, I'm not allowed to discuss ANY of Copperfield's effects, one routine I prefer over his Grandpa's Aces, is "Dream Of Aces". I had both the gaffed cards And the accompanying DVD. With the music, it was one of the best card tricks I had. The ladies were floored! It's very emotional. If you want to do a similar effect to Copperfield's (I hope I don't get into trouble here), go here, and order "Dream Of Aces":

http://www.camirandmagic.com/mv_001d.html

That's all I can say. Good luck and good conjuring!

Doug
pepka
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All that is is a handling of MacDonald Aces. As I said Doug, it's not similar, it's a different trick. In Dream of Aces and other versions, the aces change to other cards. In David's trick, they vanish.
RVM7
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Hey pepka can you pm me about the "thing" DC used. And what was the background music?
Will DC sue me (lol) if I do it with the music, his routine,the camera and projector?
Just thinking of it cause I want to perform it on my stage act...
Uli Weigel
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Why not going all the way? You must also wear black jeans, a white shirt and everything. In short, spare neither cost nor effort, so that nobody will ever know, it's you who are performing.
Dougini
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I CAN tell you, the same music DC used, is mentioned in the Dream of Aces DVD. And you are correct, Pepka. I should have just said "...it has the same effect on people." My Bad. Thanks! Smile

Doug
pepka
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It's pretty common knowledge that the music used is the love theme from the movie Cousins. A few months after it aired on TV, I competed in a competition at a convention and was doing a completely different ace assembly. I joked that my Grandpa taught me and Elsmsley count and as I produced the 4 aces whistled the song. I then got a room of about 150 magicians to all whistle along.
RVM7
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Lol... So did you win the competition? I think I'll perform it with DC's style with a little touch. I really love his presentation. Please pepka pm me the "thing".
pepka
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From the sounds of your posts, you just want to copy his routine, so no I won't.
RVM7
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I already do Macdonald's and Grandpa's Aces I just want to improve Grandpa's aces...
Vlad_77
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Quote:
On 2010-08-11 05:19, RVM7 wrote:
I already do Macdonald's and Grandpa's Aces I just want to improve Grandpa's aces...


If you feel that Copperfield's routine is in need of improvements, why not work out you own method? And why not work out your own presentation? There are MANY emotional hooks out there; it's a BIG universe. (I am tempted to quote Dr. Carl Sagan, may his memory be eternal, but, I will abstain).

Just a KIND word of advice: asking such a question of Pepka or anyone is not very good form. When you reach 50 posts, you will have access to the Secret Sessions area of the Café. But, you might want to consider the larger picture when asking questions as to methodology in general - even in the Secret Sessions area.

The methodology is not Pepka's to give away my friend. Your enthusiasm for magic serves you well, but, while we are here to help one another, we are not here to expose methods.

Please, PLEASE do NOT take this as a flame or an insult or a value judgement on your character as a person. It is just a friendly suggestion. Smile

Ahimsa,
Vlad
pepka
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Thanks Vlad. I was trying to find a way to say basically the same thing. David's routine is not, has never been, and will never be for sale. So just copying it from the video performance is stealing.
Vlad_77
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Quote:
On 2010-08-11 08:55, pepka wrote:
Thanks Vlad. I was trying to find a way to say basically the same thing. David's routine is not, has never been, and will never be for sale. So just copying it from the video performance is stealing.


You are MOST welcome, Pepka Smile

Sadly my friend, originality is a rare commodity these days methinks and respect for the intellectual property of others has waned dramatically.

By the way, I am a HUGE fan of your posts. I used to live in PA and worked in three different shops. I wonder if perhaps we may have met.

Ahimsa,
Vlad
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