| Go to page (Previous) 1 ~ 2 ~ 3 (Next) |
|
|
mindpunisher
Inner circle
5249 Posts
|
Posted: May 8, 2012 5:49pm
I find it hard to believe Tony that they reacted the same as with hypnosis. Especially rapid reaction to cues from music etc. I don't think that could be faked.
Maybe our shows are different?
For The Serious Mentalist..
"Turn your Thumper Into A Secret Weapon"
"hypnotic presentations"
|
Tommy Vee
New user
Boston
14 Posts
|
Posted: May 8, 2012 6:41pm
Getting back to the original question.....adding mentalism can be effective in 'wowing' your audience a bit. Sure there will be some who think it is fake or rigged. Some think that about the hyp show too.
You see, impressionability is a key factor in hypnosis. When you impress the audience, your show is easier. It's a factor for sure. It is also a matter of preference. Use it if you like it. Don't be afraid to open with mentalism or even a few jokes, or both.
-Tommy Vee
Tommy Vee
www.StageHypnosisSeminar.com
ww.TommyVee.com
|
Anthony Jacquin
Inner circle
2084 Posts
|
Posted: May 9, 2012 12:32pm
Especially rapid reaction to cues from music - like musical chairs then?
Anthony Jacquin
http://www.headhacking.com/training/
Get free hypnosis lessons here
http://www.youtube.com/how2hypnotise
|
TonyB2009
Inner circle
3229 Posts
|
Posted: May 9, 2012 4:36pm
To get the rapid reactions I make it a game. I tell them that we will eliminate one after each test, until we are left with the best. I do eliminate one after the first two tests. After that there is no need.
MP, over the past year I have seen a few things that made me doubt my lack of belief. But I still am of the view that there is no absolute need to hypnotise anyone. We are putting on shows, and the people who best simulate hypnosis - whether they are hypnotised or not - are the ones I want to work with.
By the way, the non-hypnosis show is one I do rarely, and only when a 'true' hypnosis show might not be as successful.
Check out Tony's new thriller The Gilli Gilli Man at Amazon.com http://www.amazon.com/Gilli-Tony-Black-Mysteries-ebook/dp/B007GFD0NQ/ref=sr_1_16?ie=UTF8&qid=1363055541&sr=8-16&keywords=The+Gilli+Gilli+Man
|
mindpunisher
Inner circle
5249 Posts
|
Posted: May 9, 2012 7:40pm
So you do tests etc then that IS an induction of sorts. Also do they have amnesia after etc. If so then they have been hypnotised. People do not have amnesia after being told to do something. Unless something out of the ordinary waking state or whatever you want to call it has taken place.
There's no point arguing this Tony we are flogging a dead horse. But in everyday situations that just doesn't happen. I have seen this over 25 years of doing it professionally. I can tell you now without a doubt. I can tell when hypnosis is being simulated and so can the audience.
There is just a unique quality to the response of someone who is highly hypnotized or hypnotizable without getting into what hypnosis is or isn't.
I need not only hypnotized subjects I need talented trance personalities when I do shows. I am no doubting that you can carry off a show with what you say. It just wouldn't the same as a "true" show. Although I suspect its not far away from one.
I actually see the whole show as an induction from beginning to end. Where at the end they are at a place so far out there because of the way I compound suggestions throughout the entire show.
For The Serious Mentalist..
"Turn your Thumper Into A Secret Weapon"
"hypnotic presentations"
|
mindpunisher
Inner circle
5249 Posts
|
Posted: May 9, 2012 7:53pm
Quote:
|
On 2012-05-09 12:32, Anthony Jacquin wrote:
Especially rapid reaction to cues from music - like musical chairs then?
|
|
Yes but MUCH exaggerated. Perhaps you haven't experienced it?
For The Serious Mentalist..
"Turn your Thumper Into A Secret Weapon"
"hypnotic presentations"
|
TonyB2009
Inner circle
3229 Posts
|
Posted: May 9, 2012 7:54pm
MP, at the end of every show I ask the subjects how long they have been on the stage, and they normally say a few minutes or less. It is a final convincer for the audience. But some - who have appeared completely out - say they have been with me over an hour, which always surprises me.
It is quite possible that by the end of a fake show the subjects have talked themselves into 'hypnosis'. Perhaps the whole show acts as an induction. But the bottom line is that it works because removing the question of hypnosis removes their fears and inhibitions, so they can let themselves go.
Check out Tony's new thriller The Gilli Gilli Man at Amazon.com http://www.amazon.com/Gilli-Tony-Black-Mysteries-ebook/dp/B007GFD0NQ/ref=sr_1_16?ie=UTF8&qid=1363055541&sr=8-16&keywords=The+Gilli+Gilli+Man
|
Dannydoyle
Eternal Order
14036 Posts
|
Posted: May 9, 2012 7:57pm
I have no idea why you are saying,but it also should be pointed out that the "excuse" of hypnosis also brings people out.
Danny Doyle
Semper Occultus
In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
|
mindpunisher
Inner circle
5249 Posts
|
Posted: May 9, 2012 8:05pm
Tony
I can see how what you say would work by doing it "overtly" and removing the fear of hypnosis which would be rife in this part of the world. I also agree with Danny that for some the "excuse" of hypnosis will bring some people out. I get the feeling that in Danny's part of the world they are less inhibited about hypnosis? It depends upon the context. Over here corporates are very inhibited and worried about how they come across in front of colleagues.
As for the amnesia I guess it has no set pattern just in my experience the majority do experience it. Just about everybody experiences time distortion.
For The Serious Mentalist..
"Turn your Thumper Into A Secret Weapon"
"hypnotic presentations"
|
mindpunisher
Inner circle
5249 Posts
|
Posted: May 9, 2012 8:08pm
Quote:
|
On 2012-05-09 19:53, mindpunisher wrote:
Quote:
|
On 2012-05-09 12:32, Anthony Jacquin wrote:
Especially rapid reaction to cues from music - like musical chairs then?
|
|
Yes but MUCH exaggerated. Perhaps you haven't experienced it?
|
|
Another example is rapid relaxation in response to key word re induction. Most people I know probably everyone I know can't fake that level of rapid relaxation. In fact most of them haven't experienced that level of relaxation in their lives unless they were very ****ed.
For The Serious Mentalist..
"Turn your Thumper Into A Secret Weapon"
"hypnotic presentations"
|
Dannydoyle
Eternal Order
14036 Posts
|
Posted: May 9, 2012 9:38pm
I have no idea why you are saying,but it also should be pointed out that the "excuse" of hypnosis also brings people out.
Danny Doyle
Semper Occultus
In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
|
Anthony Jacquin
Inner circle
2084 Posts
|
Posted: May 10, 2012 1:41am
Quote:
|
On 2012-05-09 19:53, mindpunisher wrote:
Quote:
|
On 2012-05-09 12:32, Anthony Jacquin wrote:
Especially rapid reaction to cues from music - like musical chairs then?
|
|
Yes but MUCH exaggerated. Perhaps you haven't experienced it?
|
|
How much faster in their response than people playing musical chairs?
Anthony Jacquin
http://www.headhacking.com/training/
Get free hypnosis lessons here
http://www.youtube.com/how2hypnotise
|
Decomposed
Eternal Order
Cannot See
10612 Posts
|
Posted: May 10, 2012 3:35am
I like to do it the other way around. Add hypnosis to my mentalism show. I think with a mixture, they have no clue which is what.
Decomp
90 seconds of pure laughs without a standing ovation!
|
mindpunisher
Inner circle
5249 Posts
|
Posted: May 10, 2012 6:20am
Quote:
|
On 2012-05-10 01:41, Anthony Jacquin wrote:
Quote:
|
On 2012-05-09 19:53, mindpunisher wrote:
Quote:
|
On 2012-05-09 12:32, Anthony Jacquin wrote:
Especially rapid reaction to cues from music - like musical chairs then?
|
|
Yes but MUCH exaggerated. Perhaps you haven't experienced it?
|
|
How much faster in their response than people playing musical chairs?
|
|
Much faster Ant NOTICEBLY faster. Its a hyper response and they usually go into some extreme bahaviour not just jumping on a seat. In fact its totally different and if you haven't experienced that then maybe you need help? Just like when your hypnotees on RIP dvd were lethargic and you got help on here to sort that out?
You don't get these responses immediately they have to be conditioned in. But people can be conditioned too with musical chairs I agree but not to the same degree. If you like its an amplified version of that.
I once did a show in a rough hotel. I had a 6 foot two soldier volunteer. He was agressive from the start but very suggestible and funny. Whenever he realised what he was doing he would try and punch me. But would always respond to the key re induction or piece of music and immediately go back into trance or the behaviour associated with the music.
I sent him back to his table happy until his friends told him what he was doing. He came flying across the room to attack me. He actually grabbed me my sound guy at that point put one of the music tracks on. It was rave music and he immediately went into his silly little rave routine. This went on for a while before we managed to get sound system packed away. WE then removed all the suggestions and left.
That is not the same as the conditioning involved with musical chairs.
For The Serious Mentalist..
"Turn your Thumper Into A Secret Weapon"
"hypnotic presentations"
|
TonyB2009
Inner circle
3229 Posts
|
Posted: May 10, 2012 7:13am
Great story, MP.
I had a buddy who was a DJ. There was a riot in the hotel one evening and two big men grabbed his sound desk and were about to dash it into the ground. Seeing the loss of some very valuable sound equipment, he immediately played the national anthem. Everyone stood like statues, including the two guys holding the sound desk.
But as soon as the music died, the two guys flung his sound desk onto the ground and smashed it anyway.
Check out Tony's new thriller The Gilli Gilli Man at Amazon.com http://www.amazon.com/Gilli-Tony-Black-Mysteries-ebook/dp/B007GFD0NQ/ref=sr_1_16?ie=UTF8&qid=1363055541&sr=8-16&keywords=The+Gilli+Gilli+Man
|
mindpunisher
Inner circle
5249 Posts
|
Posted: May 10, 2012 7:59am
Poor guy he needed an extended edition!
I am using the same principle with golfers to reach the correct level of arousal to access their best shots. One of many techniques is they stand as if totallt unstoppable and walk around the room. Saying "this is a piece of ****". They do it until they can feel arrogant. They then visualize themselves on a wall as they walk about feeling arrogant. The see them play exceptionally well from the warm up to the completion of the game. I also install a "connection" ritual that allows them to get to their best shots.
Once they have done this a few times I play music. I recently used "the great escape". They do this a number of times. Then they "flash up in their mind a favourate colour a few times during the process.
After all they have to do is play the music in their minds and the feelings will come flooding back giving them the correct level of arousal to play their best shots. It then over time becomes linked to everything to do with golf, holding the club, picking up the balls, walking on the grass etc. They also mark their balls with the colour and wear a wrist band. This is similar to how the scottish sprint champion shaved four seconds off his personal best after only one session of 90 mins.
Which is probably nearer to musical chairs. The ultimate aim is to get them to play on autopilot so they remember very little between each stroke,
Its all the same process though and we are constantly exposed to it ourselves whether we realize it or not.
For The Serious Mentalist..
"Turn your Thumper Into A Secret Weapon"
"hypnotic presentations"
|
seeragain
New user
17 Posts
|
Posted: May 21, 2012 10:54pm
Oddly enough I think Magic goes better with hypnosis than mentalism does. I know it sounds counter intuitive but I believe it to be the case. I am not even sure why I believe it is the case. Just let us simply say that it is pure instinct. Providing it is the right kind of magic of course.
I didn't always believe this. There was a famous hypnotist who I think may still be around. His name was Barry Sinclair. He used to do one hour of magic before having an intermission and then going into about 90 minutes of hypnosis. He did this in his theatre shows which I saw many times. I wasn't doing hypnosis at the time and I remember sniffing in great superiority over the matter thinking the magic dented the credibility of the hypnosis despite Ormond Mc'Gill saying in one of his books that it was quite a good idea which he actually did himself. Anyway I told Barry this and he was very tactful about it and didn't say I was talking out of the back of my neck (which I was). He replied, "Oh I want to do the magic even if they don't want to see it. I inflict it on them whether they like it or not. I just want to do it for the love of it". Or words to that effect anyway. It was a long time ago but he said something like this.
I thought he was completely wrong even though the magic and indeed his whole show went over very well. But one day I met his roadie and I mentioned my uninformed opinion to him. This fellow was not an entertainer but he had quite a bit of realistic common sense. He smiled and retorted, "Ah Jaysus no! We could do the magic show alone without the hypnosis and they would love it! As long as they are entertained it doesn't matter one way or the other"
And from that moment I realised I was wrong. Now I am not saying you HAVE to put magic or mentalism into your hypnosis show. However, I certainly do when it fits the occasion and it is one of the best things I have ever done. It actually makes it easier to hypnotise the people for reasons which would take me too much space to explain. And there are other advantages too.
You do not need to do this and in fact Barry did'nt always do it but it isn't a bad thing, believe it or not.
|
kcalB
Special user
It's EVP not EVP's
881 Posts
|
Posted: Aug 22, 2012 8:50pm
I've opened with ESP and without.
From experience I find that my guests go into trance considerably sooner when I do an ESP opener.
I refer to the Mentalism as ESP which is a term that laypeople can relate to more so than Mentalism.
SB
Listen to Cult of the Psychic Fetus.
BooandBreakfast.com
|
suspectacts
Elite user
Boston
465 Posts
|
Posted: Aug 23, 2012 10:55am
I have a technical question: How long are the shows you guys are presenting? My biggest problem with my hypnosis show, is the length of the show. Pretalk, induction, skits, post-hyp suggestions, release, final lines; with a good committee my shows run 70 minutes. I would never consider ADDING length to my hypnosis show.
Just 2 more cents.
http://www.funnymagic.com
http://www.bostonhystericalsociety.com
http://www.funnyhypnotism.com
|
Mindpro
Inner circle
3569 Posts
|
Posted: Aug 23, 2012 11:39am
I think it has to do with the venues you perform. My preferred length is 75 to 90 minutes, but on some occasions I have done a nearly two hour show. These are usually large shows that are going extremely well where no one wants it to end. In these shows I will usually have 65-85 volunteers on stage, and just working with that amount of subs takes time and organization. They are great shows, but I prefer my 75-90 minutes ones.
To me doing a 45 or 60 minute show is much more difficult, but when doing resort shows, corporate, fests, cruises, etc. it is necessary. Then again, if it is small show, 60 minutes is welcome.
|
mindpunisher
Inner circle
5249 Posts
|
Posted: Aug 23, 2012 1:14pm
The length of your show depends up on the structure. A shorter show needs a different structure to a longer one. Its also dependant upon the venue and fees involved too I would say.
For The Serious Mentalist..
"Turn your Thumper Into A Secret Weapon"
"hypnotic presentations"
|
Dannydoyle
Eternal Order
14036 Posts
|
Posted: Aug 23, 2012 7:16pm
Quote:
|
On 2012-08-23 10:55, suspectacts wrote:
I have a technical question: How long are the shows you guys are presenting? My biggest problem with my hypnosis show, is the length of the show. Pretalk, induction, skits, post-hyp suggestions, release, final lines; with a good committee my shows run 70 minutes. I would never consider ADDING length to my hypnosis show.
Just 2 more cents.
|
|
Exactly.
Danny Doyle
Semper Occultus
In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
|
mindpunisher
Inner circle
5249 Posts
|
Posted: Aug 26, 2012 4:19pm
Length isn't a technical question its a question of what time slot do you need for the venue or client. If 70 mins works for you and that's all you need then its not a problem. You don't have to extend it.
However that's not to say it can't be extended or made bigger. Again its the venue and the situation. A longer show to be successful may need a different structure and a few additional spectacular components to pull it off. But that's not a problem its just a different requirement.
So which is best? Depends on your situation and what works best for you in your situation.
I have been in situations where a longer show is required and in these venues they work brilliantly.
So how long is a piece of string?
For The Serious Mentalist..
"Turn your Thumper Into A Secret Weapon"
"hypnotic presentations"
|
TonyB2009
Inner circle
3229 Posts
|
Posted: Aug 26, 2012 6:23pm
I am generally asked for a ninety minute show or a two hour show (though I try to push for a 75 minute show, as I think it is a better length).
When I do two hours I always include mentalism as an opener. Two hours of hypnosis is too much.
Check out Tony's new thriller The Gilli Gilli Man at Amazon.com http://www.amazon.com/Gilli-Tony-Black-Mysteries-ebook/dp/B007GFD0NQ/ref=sr_1_16?ie=UTF8&qid=1363055541&sr=8-16&keywords=The+Gilli+Gilli+Man
|
mindpunisher
Inner circle
5249 Posts
|
Posted: Aug 26, 2012 7:19pm
Two hours of your structured show may be too much. that doesn't mean 2 hours is two much. I can tell you now I ran Two plus hour shows for years --- for theatre type shows is the best format I have ever seen and only one I ever used. Not because of the length of time but because the structure . Time is irrelevant in the right context. Its all about how good the show is to fill that time. I wouldn't do a two hour show in a club or smaller venue with pure hypnosis but used to do it regularly with mentalism in first half.
For The Serious Mentalist..
"Turn your Thumper Into A Secret Weapon"
"hypnotic presentations"
|
Slim King
Eternal Order
Orlando
13008 Posts
|
Posted: Aug 27, 2012 12:56pm
Quote:
|
On 2012-08-22 20:50, kcalB wrote:
I've opened with ESP and without.
From experience I find that my guests go into trance considerably sooner when I do an ESP opener.
I refer to the Mentalism as ESP which is a term that laypeople can relate to more so than Mentalism.
SB
|
|
That makes a lot of sense !!!!
THE MAN THE SKEPTICS REFUSE TO TEST FOR ONE MILLION DOLLARS
|
Cris Johnson
Regular user
Niagara Falls, NY
191 Posts
|
Posted: Aug 29, 2012 9:14am
I typically do a 60-min hypnosis show. Occasionally a client will REALLY want a 90 minute show so I'll have mentalism effects such as PK touches or even a blindfold routine in reserve if I get there and I read that the group feels reluctant to be hypnotized, often in corporate shows. You know the type - you get there and people come up to you saying, "Get him!". Starting off with some mentalism lets the audience see I'm not going to embarrass them. They get to see how I am as a performer and my personality. I find this approach useful in corporate gigs. For a high school or college show, I just do 90 minutes of hypnosis (pretalk, induction, skits) as there is usually little to no resistance for these types of gigs.
Every once in a while a client will want a 2 hour show. In these cases I usually start off with mentalism, then an intermission, then hypnosis. Seems to work for me.
Cris Johnson, CH, CT.NLP
www.ElementarySchoolAssemblies.com
www.FunHighSchoolAssemblies.com
www.MotivatingEntertainment.com
|
mindpunisher
Inner circle
5249 Posts
|
Posted: Aug 30, 2012 5:49am
Quote:
|
On 2012-08-22 20:50, kcalB wrote:
I've opened with ESP and without.
From experience I find that my guests go into trance considerably sooner when I do an ESP opener.
I refer to the Mentalism as ESP which is a term that laypeople can relate to more so than Mentalism.
SB
|
|
The reason this works I believe is that when you do a piece of mentalism the conscious mind goes on a search for meaning trying to make sense of what they just seen. It creates an open loop. This means they are less likely to analyze the hypnosis procedures and suggestions go in easier. Their conscious minds are basically overloaded and the emotions heightened. And expectation has of you succeeding has also been established.
For The Serious Mentalist..
"Turn your Thumper Into A Secret Weapon"
"hypnotic presentations"
|
garett
Regular user
118 Posts
|
Posted: Nov 2, 2012 10:28am
If I were doing a straight up stage hypnosis show I'm not sure I'd be comfortable doing any sort of mentalism or conjuring unless the audience understood that I was also a magician and would be using a bit of that expertise. The public already has so many misconceptions about hypnosis, and I think people are starting to wisen up a bit too. I've had a lot of difficulty discussing the topic with people when I was learning hypnosis, and they were trying to tell me that hypnosis is fake etc. I had to explain to them that while there are a lot of misconceptions and myths, that doesn't mean it's all one big trick.
In other words, I don't want to be responsible for perpetuating myths about what hypnosis is. I think you can pull off a great show that's highly entertaining and demonstrates genuine principles of suggestion without having to claim that hypnosis and suggestion is something that it's not.
On the other hand, I do employ hypnosis and suggestion all the time in my mentalism, for theatric effect. But in that case people know I'm a "psychological illusionist" employing hidden methods to create a world of fiction and fantasy. In that setting I can present hypnosis as anything that I want because I'm telling my audience up front to engage in a bit of make believe.
|
kellaroneil
New user
60 Posts
|
Posted: Nov 2, 2012 11:01am
I think that no more than 10-12 minutes of mentalism to open a hypnosis show is quite enough. Sometimes the hypnosis part of the show can go much longer than anticipated. I think any show over 2 hours (and that's a stretch) is way too long for any audience.
|
| The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » You are getting sleepy...very sleepy... » » Mentalism in a Hypnosis Show |
|
|
| Go to page (Previous) 1 ~ 2 ~ 3 (Next) |
![[8]](/forums/images/digits/8.gif)
![[1]](/forums/images/digits/1.gif)
![[5]](/forums/images/digits/5.gif)
![[7]](/forums/images/digits/7.gif)
![[2]](/forums/images/digits/2.gif)