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plainman007
Special user
519 Posts
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Posted: May 5, 2012 12:20am
Whats the thinnest monofilament fishing line I can get for stage work. The load gauge can be even just 1 lbs as I don't need it to support more than half a pound ?
Regards
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john wills
Loyal user
267 Posts
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Posted: May 5, 2012 2:47pm
Fishing line is not the best way, because it shines.
Then the next question is: what has the line to do ?
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plainman007
Special user
519 Posts
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Posted: May 7, 2012 12:59am
That's why the OP says for stage work. If its for stage work you'd assume its a thread running accross the stage either vertically or horizontally. The thread will be running across the stage.
Im just asking if any of you have worked with vectra line or fishing line, kevlar is too cumbersome as the strands have to be seperated manually and that's ok for short lengths not for 100 feet etc. Weight load doesn't matter as its only going to hold about 100gms.
The reason I'm asking here is because people who've actually used it can vouch for the visibility factor. Since you say fishing line shines I guess that takes a back seat, though ive heard rubbing marker pens and other materials onto fishing line to dull the thread.
Ive worked with some excellent threads and even have the samples but cant locate who sells them ro even what the actual material is. Unfortunately I have them in shorter lengths than 100ft.
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Pete Biro
V.I.P.
17740 Posts
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Posted: May 7, 2012 1:54am
More important is the lighting. Only front light. Top, back and side will kill you. A marking pen, black or purple used in short strips, say six inches with hp;en, then six inches without, etc. etc. Like camouflage.. break up the pattern.
STAY TOONED... @ www.petebiro.com
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Michael Baker
Inner circle
Near a river in the Midwest
8454 Posts
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Posted: May 7, 2012 11:07am
As Pete said, lighting is very important, but the background can be, as well. Extremely strong for its thickness is Coats Outdoor Thread. I find it at Wal Mart. I sent a spool to John Calvert, and I believe that's what he uses now. This stuff is so strong that it will cut you before you'll break it.
Also, a friend turned me onto fly-tying thread. It comes in a variety of thicknesses. I found this at Bass Pro Shop. The spools are only a few bucks each, so it would be worth buying several different sizes and colors to experiment with.
Regarding the load strength... just because something might be rated for 1 pound, doesn't mean that it would necessarily work for even 1/2 pound load. The tensile strength can be affected by the action required to move the object. Obviously go with the thinnest you can get away with, but lighting and background are the two biggest factors that will make the difference you need.
~michael baker
The Magic Company
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plainman007
Special user
519 Posts
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Posted: May 7, 2012 12:09pm
Thanks Pete.
Micheal, Coats outdoor thread which you mentioned is how many mm thick or roughly like hair thin ??
Thanks
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Michael Baker
Inner circle
Near a river in the Midwest
8454 Posts
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Posted: May 7, 2012 2:32pm
Quote:
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On 2012-05-07 12:09, plainman007 wrote:
Micheal, Coats outdoor thread which you mentioned is how many mm thick or roughly like hair thin ??
Thanks
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Hair thin? Nope. But it works under the proper conditions. There is no thickness spec on the spool.
The fly-tying thread I have is 8/0 and 6/0. The six is considerably stronger but I haven't tested it for specific weights. I think they make it even heavier. You should just experiment. The investment is comparatively small compared to most stage props.
~michael baker
The Magic Company
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Dougini
Inner circle
I have killed more topics with my
4522 Posts
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Posted: May 22, 2012 2:47pm
I've heard pretty good things about Vectra X2 Stage Thread, by Steve Fearson. I'm picking up a spool the first of next month, so I'll give a review then. Meantime, anyone else have comments on X2? Back in the day, we used plain brown carpet thread and used red gels on the lights.
Doug
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magicboy7
New user
Chicago, IL
42 Posts
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Posted: May 23, 2012 3:04am
Best resource is Mike Ching in Hololulu, he is the guy when it comes to supporting items on stage. His book on the floating hank is the best.
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magicboy7
New user
Chicago, IL
42 Posts
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Posted: May 23, 2012 3:13am
What's really critical here is the backdrop. We like to use eyelash from Rosebrand.
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Bill Hegbli
Eternal Order
Bill and Bill in Fort Wayne Indiana
12874 Posts
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Posted: May 23, 2012 10:56am
What plainman007 doesn't seem to grasp, is that it is not the thread, but the lighting and backdrop combined. From his comments, I think he believes that if he gets a super thin thread it will be inviaible.
I keep coming back to the example of the spider web, you cannot see it, until the lighting is changed. Spider webs are thinner then any man made thead on the market, and yet, you can still see them when the light falls on them in a particular way, otherwise they are invisible to the eye.
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Falconer
Special user
PORTUGAL
551 Posts
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Posted: May 23, 2012 11:57am
Pete have reason: the most important aspect is the light.
In my opinion, the best source of information comes Vctor Voitko: he sell one DVD that teach all about the invisble and light!
Falconer
FALCONER
IMAGICIANS.DE facebook falcobook
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hugmagic
Inner circle
6548 Posts
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Posted: May 23, 2012 12:06pm
I will second Mike Ching's book. It has a lot on different backdrops, lighting, and materials. Every situation is different depending what you are floating and where. That is where the experience will come in so you are used to different situation. You may need to use different set ups for different situations or figure out how to better control the situation.
Richard
Richard E. Hughes, Hughes Magic Inc., 352 N. Prospect St., Ravenna, OH 44266 (330)296-4023
www.hughesmagic.com
email-hugmagic@raex.com
Write direct as I will be turning off my PM's.
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Falconer
Special user
PORTUGAL
551 Posts
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Posted: May 23, 2012 1:03pm
I also agree with Richard!
Falconer
FALCONER
IMAGICIANS.DE facebook falcobook
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illusiontech
Regular user
Las Vegas
190 Posts
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Posted: May 23, 2012 3:23pm
Yes, Mike Chings Book is wonderful.
I buy thread from "The Thread Exchange" Online shop.
They even have a Invisible Magician Thread section because many magi must buy the close up invisible thread from them, I found that funny.
http://www.thethreadexchange.com/
Vinny
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hugmagic
Inner circle
6548 Posts
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Posted: May 23, 2012 3:43pm
The brief answer is braided nylon or dacron thread.
Richard
Richard E. Hughes, Hughes Magic Inc., 352 N. Prospect St., Ravenna, OH 44266 (330)296-4023
www.hughesmagic.com
email-hugmagic@raex.com
Write direct as I will be turning off my PM's.
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Ekuth
Inner circle
1104 Posts
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Posted: May 23, 2012 4:51pm
X2 is an excellent thread; I use it for my larger floating effects. I also use it in a close-up/parlor environment. Yes, you read that correctly- I use a stage thread in close-up work.
As others have stated here, it's really all about the lighting and how you use/don't use it.
As to X2's strength- it's NOT- I repeat- NOT as strong as the ad copy would have you believe. I love Fearson's site and his stuff, but his ad copy is always... slightly... misleading. Look past the hyperbole and see the product(s) for what it/they are.
For example (all of these comparisons are SINGLE STRAND):
X2 will NOT work for a dancing cane.
At least not without multiple threads, and there goes your visibility.
I know, I make my own canes and they all are constructed of balsa and weigh less than commercially available canes. If it won't work for my canes, I can bet money they won't for the others. So there's an ad copy claim busted.
Will it 'slam a door'? NO. Unless the door is made of cardboard or foamcore, not a chance.
X2 is FANTASTIC for floating orb/stick/wand/ect, though. The interesting thing with X2 is that it's very tension sensitive. I've found if you work (horizontally) with some 'give' or slack in the line it works far better than 'tight' thread technique.
Basically, look on X2 as a step up from the regular Vectra line (which is one of, if not the best IT on the market) but a step down from monofilament/fishline. You don't have the glare/flash issues as with mono, but you also don't have the strength.
I also make extensive use of Coats and Clarke's Smoke colored transparent thread (in the Wal-Mart fabrics section). I'll second the use of the Outdoor/Upholstery thread. TOUGH stuff.
There are definately times and certain effects that work better with regular old sewing thread.
Really, the best way to find the best thread is just to experiment with different threads for the different effects you need them for. One line may work for one effect, but not another.
Remember, it's not just the weight of the object you're working with but the tension and TORQUE you're putting on the line while you're performing that plays a key role.
Good luck!
"Magic is found neither in the mind, nor the eye; but in the heart."
http://www.christophe-magic.webs.com
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