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Dynamike
Eternal Order
20609 Posts
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Posted: May 8, 2012 8:56am
Quote:
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On 2012-05-07 02:49, TheGreatNancini wrote:
She asked us if there was any way we could do the assembly without doing magic tricks of any kind.
I thought she had to be joking, but she proceeded to tell us it was because she had one student out of a 600 student school that was Jehovahs Witness and was not allowed to watch magic shows.
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She must have been the only Jehovah Witness there.
I have bumped into a few people over my years and showed them a quick trick. Next thing I notice they are showing me a bad attitude telling me they are a Jehovah Witness. I would not want to share any blood with them. 
Dynamike
Oakland County Magician Macomb County Magician Wayne County Magician Detroit Magician Detroit Clown
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Damian
Loyal user
284 Posts
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Posted: May 8, 2012 8:42pm
That's very interesting, Nancy. I didn't know that about Jehovah's Witnesses. In fact, we have 6 JWs in our (extended) family. None of them have ever objected to my magic performances at family gatherings over the years. In fact, some of them have been particularly big fans of it, so I guess this strict attitude doesn't apply to all.
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sleightly
Elite user
New Hampshire
463 Posts
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Posted: May 8, 2012 8:56pm
Quote:
| On 2012-05-07 21:57, Steven True wrote:
In a day when most of the school children don't even know the Pledge of Allegiance even is I don't doubt that other requests like this one will start to show up more and more, I hope not but time will tell. |
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Are you kidding me? In NH almost every schoolchild starts every school day with the Pledge. In my years of performing in schools I have never experienced a school that did not.
As a School Board member, we say the Pledge of Allegiance at the start of every meeting.
Not sure where you got your information, but in my experience the assertion is not supported by the facts...
ajp
www.troublewit.net
www.threeshellgame.com
www.absomagic.com
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Dynamike
Eternal Order
20609 Posts
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Posted: May 8, 2012 9:49pm
When I was in third grade my teacher taught us the Pledge of Allegiance. We had to say it at the start of the class everyday. A student was a JW. His mother came to the class room and confronted the teacher about having her son say it. The next day the teacher told the student he must still say it. The mother came again the next day and complained to the principal about having her son say the Pledge of Allegiance. The principal told the teacher to no longer have the student say the Pledge of Allegiance.
Dynamike
Oakland County Magician Macomb County Magician Wayne County Magician Detroit Magician Detroit Clown
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TheGreatNancini
Veteran user
Ohio
358 Posts
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Posted: May 9, 2012 2:22am
Quote:
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On 2012-05-08 20:42, Damian wrote:
That's very interesting, Nancy. I didn't know that about Jehovah's Witnesses. In fact, we have 6 JWs in our (extended) family. None of them have ever objected to my magic performances at family gatherings over the years. In fact, some of them have been particularly big fans of it, so I guess this strict attitude doesn't apply to all.
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Lol! Perhaps your 6 JW's extended family members are bit more "contemporary" than others. Sounds like folks in a lot of other faiths as well. Perhaps you do your magic so well and they are so entertained, that they forget that they should be offended
At least they give you a chance!
~Nanci
-- Nancilee N. Jones --
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Billy Bo
Special user
624 Posts
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Posted: May 9, 2012 2:46am
Why would a JW not say the pledge? I'm in London so don't quite get it.
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RJE2
Veteran user
383 Posts
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Posted: May 9, 2012 6:35am
The teacher was the one that created the difficulty with Nanci.
Not the kid. The kid did not confront her.
Not the religion. No representative of the religion came to her.
Not the system. No one acting on behalf of either the school or the school board came to her.
Just the teacher. And, if I read Nanci's post correct, the principal even apologized to her about that one teacher's behaviour.
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TheGreatNancini
Veteran user
Ohio
358 Posts
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Posted: May 9, 2012 11:58am
RJE2,
You actually have all of the facts correct! Thank you for summing it all up in a nutshell!
Being fair to JW's, since I am not one of them and do not intend to be, I really do not know what their doctrine consists of. I like most people here can only speak for what we have observed from some of their members we have encountered along the way.
Since I consider myself a Christ follower, I certainly would not want people judging all of Christianity by the actions of many Christians I have encountered. (Hence the reason I have issues with many churches).
I really did not mean to turn this into a religious discussion. The main point I was making upon starting the thread was the fact that knowing we were magicians we were asked to do a "no magic "magic show. It was something we had never encountered before, but as several has said here, it is not a first for many in the business.
Someone mentioned that they could do a no magic magic show with puppets and storytelling and that is great! But then it is entertainment and not a magic show. We can entertain without magic as well, but the fact is the person that was behind our paycheck specifically hired a magic show.
Thanks to everyone that has contributed so far. I really appreciate all of your thoughts on the subject! I am impressed that we have been able to keep the thread intelligent and civilized!
~Nanci
-- Nancilee N. Jones --
Website | Facebook | Twitter
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Cheshire Cat
Special user
Wilmslow, UK
941 Posts
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Posted: May 9, 2012 12:53pm
Reminds me of the number of calls we get around here for October 31st parties on church premises with the theme of "light". I mean, what harm can it do to let kids dress up and do the Halloween 'thing' each year? Has Christianity reached a point where it feels threatened by a few kids wearing pointy hats and tricking and treating? I'll not book them in. Give me a good old Halloween Party any day!
We do puppets - big puppets. Pig is now unacceptable for Muslim children (Jewish don't mind as long as not at a Synagogue Party). The Chimpanzee is now 'suspect' too. Dare not use my brilliant Cowboy puppet because he carries a gun. Oh, and don't forget that dogs are considered unclean according to some religious beliefs. So no magic tricks with dog stories! Oh yes, and don't blow up modelling balloons by mouth or insert the mouse tail into your mouth to suck a bubble - naughty, naughty now!!
That's all my posts here used up till about 2015 now. I usually only do about one a year!
 T.
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Dennis Michael
Inner circle
Atco, NJ
5972 Posts
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Posted: May 9, 2012 1:58pm
I was told by a priest not to use the word magic in my show. That is next to impossible. After he was transferred, I did the show.
Dennis Michael, Atco, NJ (856)768-2281
KIDabra Chapter #1
Facebook
Email: DennisMichael@KIDabra1.org
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Al Angello
Eternal Order
Collegeville, Pa. USA
10475 Posts
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Posted: May 9, 2012 2:14pm
Billy Bo
I PMed you.
Al Angello The Comic Juggler/Magician
http://www.juggleral.com
http://home.comcast.net/~juggleral/
"Footprints on your ceiling are almost gone"
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arthur stead
Elite user
When I played soccer, I hit
425 Posts
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Posted: May 9, 2012 3:26pm
After graduating high school, I was drafted into the South African Army (where I grew up). While recuperating from an injury, I was assigned to work odd jobs in the Detention Barracks (army jail). This was a hard labor jail, with inmates forced to work chain-gang style until exhaustion. Prison officers did their best to break people's spirits.
One of my duties was to bring meals to Jehovah's Witnesses in their cells. These kids were not forced to work. Instead, they were kept, one to cell, in complete isolation, because they refused to wear the uniform.
Watched over my a sergeant, I had to hand each meal tray to a single cell occupant without saying a word. Inside, it was dark. They wore only gym shorts - no shirts, shoes or socks. In their cells, the only "furniture" was a foam mattress on the floor, and one blanket. No other bedding, and no pillows. None of these cells had a window. Each inmate was as pale as a sheet (not having seen the sun for many months). Like I said, I was not allowed to speak to them. But at least we briefly made eye contact, and I could give them a smile.
As far as I know, these young 18-year old boys stayed locked up like this for the duration of their conscription. I felt tremendous sympathy for them. At the same time, I can't help thinking that their time could have been better served, had they - and their parents - compromised on the uniform issue. There are plenty of other useful things to do in the army besides fight. The medical corps, for one.
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TonyB2009
Inner circle
3231 Posts
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Posted: May 9, 2012 4:41pm
Arthur, I agree with you. I am an extreme pacifist, and would not accept conscription. But I would be quite happy to serve a similar time in an ambulance, on a fire truck, or some other useful role. A pity countries don't consider that as an option.
Check out Tony's new thriller The Gilli Gilli Man at Amazon.com http://www.amazon.com/Gilli-Tony-Black-Mysteries-ebook/dp/B007GFD0NQ/ref=sr_1_16?ie=UTF8&qid=1363055541&sr=8-16&keywords=The+Gilli+Gilli+Man
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TomBoleware
Inner circle
Hattiesburg, Ms
1692 Posts
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Posted: May 9, 2012 4:43pm
I feel for the younger school children not being able to do things with their friends. I also feel for the teachers because they are often caught in the middle. Taking a child to another room while the rest of the class has a party is not an easy thing to do. Explaining to a child why they didn't receive a gift when everyone else did, is not easy to do. I can kind of understand a new teacher looking for an out at times for the child.
Still I do agree, you can't do a magic show without magic. You can sing or dance or something, but without magic, it's not a magic show.
Tom
Tom Boleware
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Starrpower
Inner circle
3149 Posts
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Posted: May 9, 2012 4:49pm
Quote:
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On 2012-05-09 12:53, Cheshire Cat wrote:
or insert the mouse tail into your mouth to suck a bubble !!
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Well, that IS a bit disgusting.
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TheGreatNancini
Veteran user
Ohio
358 Posts
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Posted: May 9, 2012 6:21pm
Quote:
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On 2012-05-09 16:43, TomBoleware wrote:
I feel for the younger school children not being able to do things with their friends. I also feel for the teachers because they are often caught in the middle. Taking a child to another room while the rest of the class has a party is not an easy thing to do. Explaining to a child why they didn't receive a gift when everyone else did, is not easy to do. I can kind of understand a new teacher looking for an out at times for the child.
Still I do agree, you can't do a magic show without magic. You can sing or dance or something, but without magic, it's not a magic show.
Tom
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I do agree with you there Tom. It is a catch 22. There is really no good way of not hurting someone in these situations.
Still, as unfortunate as it is for the student and the teacher having to deal with it, it seems unfair to punish the 599 students whose families have no problem with magic.
~Nanci
-- Nancilee N. Jones --
Website | Facebook | Twitter
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arthur stead
Elite user
When I played soccer, I hit
425 Posts
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Posted: May 9, 2012 8:04pm
I totally agree that it's unfair to punish hundreds of students just because one of them complains. What ever happened to democracy?
In one of our educational school programs, I perform a version of David Ginn's Spiked Arm Illusion. Because I was born in Africa, my patter is related to my birthplace, and the story-line involves King Shaka. After each show we distributed evaluation forms to the teachers who were present. Everyone loved the routine ... except for one teacher, who thought it was "racist." Just goes to show you ... there's one in every crowd!
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TonyB2009
Inner circle
3231 Posts
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Posted: May 9, 2012 8:21pm
Quote:
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On 2012-05-09 16:43, TomBoleware wrote:
Still I do agree, you can't do a magic show without magic. You can sing or dance or something, but without magic, it's not a magic show.
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That is one of the reasons (not the main one) that I bill myself as an entertainer rather than a magician. I wouldn't change a show at the last minute to suit a teacher (and I certainly wouldn't drop magic because of one crackpot), but I can and often do change a show as I go along, depending on what goes down with a particular audience. By calling myself an entertainer I can give myself more freedom.
This evening I had a family show for a communion, with more adults than kids. I told them in advance they might get hypnosis, mind-reading, magic or stand-up comedy, depending on how I felt the crowd were. It is very liberating to have no plan.
Check out Tony's new thriller The Gilli Gilli Man at Amazon.com http://www.amazon.com/Gilli-Tony-Black-Mysteries-ebook/dp/B007GFD0NQ/ref=sr_1_16?ie=UTF8&qid=1363055541&sr=8-16&keywords=The+Gilli+Gilli+Man
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TomBoleware
Inner circle
Hattiesburg, Ms
1692 Posts
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Posted: May 9, 2012 9:04pm
Very true Tony, calling yourself an entertainer gives you a lot of wiggle room.
Some JW will keep their kids at home on party days in order not to cause trouble. So they're not all bad.
I'm just glad my preschool business is private, where I can make the rules. But even there it gets touchy at times.
Tom
Tom Boleware
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marknem7
Elite user
477 Posts
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Posted: May 10, 2012 2:03am
The sad part to Nanci's story was that the school would only pay her in denariuses and shekels.
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