I had a restaurant and provided a 4 piece jazz band at night. When he was playing to 10 customers, I let him go and he could not understand why I didn't keep him. One big reason was that he had no following. I might have had canned music and gotten the same results.
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If a restaurant has a clientelle already, I see no reason to have a strolling magician. A restaurant looking to increase his kids trade or a bar looking to fill a dead night is the reason to have entertainment.
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The payment to that magician does not depend on an existing gross business, the increase in business is the reason for the entertainmet.
I have a friend who draws clients where he performs and he is worth having because he brings people with him.
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I never take tips when there is a waitstaff who depends on tips. It takes money out of their pocket and I am compensated more than they are.

Magicinas servers are tipped on a percentage of the bill. I have never heard anyone but a restaurant manager say that an entertainers tips take away from the waitstaff's tips.

An entertainer getting tipped does NOT take away tips from the staff. I worked with musicians and their getting tipped may have helped me make more, I don't know, but it did NOT take away.

BAD, insecure servers think it takes away and people that have no knowledge and are just guessing that it does, think that way ( Magicians think if people tip them, they may give less to a server....WRONG ).

What has happened is a Magician got tipped and a BAD server got a poor tip and blamed the Magician.

It rained and my car wouldn't start. Rain causes cars to not start.

Such long posts. Try making one point and letting people toss it around a bit.
[/quote]

Also, try to double space more often...I have a hard time reading big blocks of text.

With all due respect, you got that one backwards: stranded cars cause rain.

S2000, I checked my almanac and you're right, so no offense taken.

I wonder why it affects the weather? Science is so...mysterious.

Zombie and Countage, Thank you for not letting the statement that magician's tips take away from waiters tips stand unchallenged. Very well statedm both of you.

Thank you also to every one who keeps their posts short and to the point and who uses paragraphs.

Question:)

If ventriloquism makes a good Cable TV Special why don't all HBO specials have ventriloquists?

Ventriloquest should take heart in the fact that JEff Dunham has had several successful specials. That shows that it is possible. At the same time ventriloquists can observe that it isn't common. HBO executives can note that a Ventriloquist show CAN work but that it is far from a sure thing. It's not like "Hey we're in trouble, lets get some vents in here". But it would be equally foolish to never considerer a ventriloquist

(I know magician's are not vents and restaurants are not HBO Specials. This is an analogy. Anologies are never proof. They are illustrations of a concept)

Thanks for the tips on double spacing and keeping posts short and to the point.

(Notice the double space here?). I'll stick to one point with this post in regards to profesionals working for free. Many pros have attended a convention on the West

Coast hosted by a Gentleman named Stan Kramien. They have ranged from David Williamson to Mark Wilson and Nani Darnell. Total amount Mr. Kramien has paid these pros..zilch. (oops...forgot to double space...DANG IT!)

Sure they are entitled to sell lecture notes and related magical items to make up the cost of travel and lodging...but these folks are pros and by their own admissions

are charging 1,500 dollars and more for a gig. Why they give up a weekend of 1,500 dollar gigs to attend a small convention in the Pacific Northwest is none of my

business...perhaps one of you fellows has an idea.

Alright dude...I was just trying to help.

[quote]On 2013-02-18 00:10, Rocky wrote:

If restaurant magicians were as beneficial to the success of a restaurant and the reason families return to dine there, why do so few restaurants take advantage of this promotional tool? I just did a google search on the number of restaurants in my area and to my knowledge only 3 out of the 1,200 eateries are taking advantage of the benefits a house magician would add to their business.( end of quote)

From my experience, there is not a whole heck of allot of qualified magical entertainers to service the demographic you site and the restaurants that I've talked to have never heard of close-up table-side magic, let alone seen close-up magic themselves. Most people, a huge percentage, have never seen a close-up magician in person.



Really? You are comparing one of the most popular TV shows and it's cast to table side magicians? From my experience and no I don't draw "crowds" when I perform, nor are people waiting in huge lines to see me.

But... when I perform something meaningful for someone celebrating a special occasion, or when something magical happens in the hands of mentally challenged little boy or girl, or when a child sees magic for the very first time...That IS SPECIAL...When a couple leans over to kiss each other after a card effect designed for their anniversary or a grandparent laughs out loud on his/her birthday....ad infinitum....you bet they REMEMBER.

Those of us who do perform in this type of venue, know how many times repeat customers come in and say " We still have the card we signed , or " We have the card on our refrigerator" or whatever.......We may not be rock stars or The Brady Bunch Kids but we provide something a little extra to make the patrons dining experience memorable. PROVIDED we gear our magical presentations in a personal way. ( NOT showing off our magical skill)

I'm also glad you brought up the subject Rocky. I really feel it depends on the personality of the performer as well as the business acumen of the restaurant owner. Fortunately the restaurants I perform in are very family oriented and love to see the patrons laughing or with shocked looks on their faces. Because of that they feel I'm worth having around even if I don't pack-them-in. Other restaurant's mileage may vary...

Great topic.

If there is good value of having a magician, there should be no problem paying for it.
Else, there should be no reason to continue with it - even if it's given at no cost.
If a magician wants to offer a good value at no cost, go ahead and take it, but don't expect that to be the norm.

That's my view from over here on the outside (not a performer nor restaurant owner). I wouldn't mind working for experience only but that's because experience would be the thing I need most. At some point I should have enough experience to be paid for my performances (private gigs). If my private gigs don't get enough traffic to test new things, I might consider working for experience again. This is how many comedians use comedy clubs, open mic nights, etc. I believe and it seems to make sense.

I'd be shocked if an established pro who made their living doing magic, accepted your invitation to work for free to work on material.

Is this restaurant one that we would know?

It's almost as if we were punked into a don't pay magicians discussion. If so, well done!

I guess in my opinion if a person (magician or restaurant owner or managment) doesn't think that it is worth while to pay a magician to perform there - then it isn't.

However I feel that a magician "should" get something for his time. Working on new material is one thing, however I find that I have had "less" working on new material than working when it comes to restaurants.

The only times I have ever worked for free were on a night where I showcased myself for the restaurant owner or management. That is I gave them a free night so they could see what I do, how I work in their place and see the advantage of having happy "entertained" customers that enjoyed my little show as well as their food.

Speaking of their food - yes people go to the restaurants for food. But customers can get food "anywhere" and having a magician perform for them at their table - can be that added "free to the customer" advantage that can bring a customer back four times a month instead of once a month.

When I was working in a Pizza place in Chicago. In one of my letters the manager Joyce said I increased their family night 7% the first season alone. So in my opinion if the magician is good they the customer will come to see the magician along with the good food - that they can get in other restaurants.

In my opinion a good magician is worth whatever they get in pay - for performing in restaurants. And once in a blue moon they may try out a new trick. And that is part of it to and it is called keeping the act fresh for the customers.

I hope this helps.

Pardon me for jumping in...this is my first post and can relate quite well to the topic. I have been a working entertainer for 30 years.
Promoting myself for the first 10 was quite a harrrowing experience...I lived hand to mouth for most of that time. Restaurants were never at the top of my list as far as pursuing work simply because so many said no to my carefully prepared sales pitch.

However,the work I was able to scrape up from restaurant gigs saved me from apartment evictions and a growling tummy. Resturants are places I only eat at these days,performing magic is strictly for private parties and comedy clubs. I salute any person who perfroms walk around in restaurants/lounges. It is demanding work (yes...even compared to what the waitstaff is expected to do) but at the same time very rewarding and quite fun. At the end of my shifts I would take a seat at the bar and unwind with a few of the other staff.They all knew not to ask to see a trick in the same context I knew not to ask them to take another order.We were TIRED!

Bottom line...restaurants will dictate what they feel creates a successful business. If a clown twisting balloons on kids night or a classy looking gent with fancy props is part of their equation for success, then some lucky chap will have a job...but you have to go out and find these places because they typically don't put a sign in the window reading "Wanted:Close-Up Strolling Magician. Apply Inside".
Good luck and have fun!

Wimpy, may I say that was a wonderful and insightful first post! Welcome to the Café! I look forward to many more posts from you!

As for the debate, I believe our new friend hit the nail on the head! Just because you're turned down doesn't mean that your act or

pitch is poor, persay. Nor does it mean that magicians shouldn't be asking for pay for restaurant gigs...It simply means that's just not

the vision that manager/owner has for his business. Those managers who ARE interested ARE out there, just gotta keep trying! If they're one in a

thousand, then hey, you know you'll happen upon them eventually! I think one SHOULD be compensated for their time, indeed! Granted, perhaps not as

much as some of us would like, but remember, the staff are usually making less than minimum wage! Why should we get $100+? Just a thought. I

know of several employees who work hard, and have GREAT customer service, at a local Denny's...they get paid only $2.45/hr...! So if the people who

work so hard on a daily basis to keep the restaurant running get paid so little...why think it in the budget $100 for an evening entertainer. Once

every few weeks I suppose. I get work as well, though restaurants are not my primary magical income. I'm just saying I can totally understand the

OP's point of view. I don't totally agree, but I do understand.

The price an entertainer is able to get is based on the market value. Also if servers do make make any tips on their shift their wages are readjusted to minimum wage.

Welcome Wimpy...Glad you posted for the first time. Hope you post some more.

You posted the following; quote:
"At the end of my shifts I would take a seat at the bar and unwind with a few of the other staff.They all knew not to ask to see a trick in the same context I knew not to ask them to take another order.We were TIRED!"

Just speaking for myself, I would gladly and enthusiastically show someone another effect (trick) In fact when my time is up at the restaurant I look for just another table who looks like they would enjoy some magic. The waitstaff laughs at me and says "You really enjoy what you do, don't you?"...I really do. That is reflected to the patrons and the management. Maybe just maybe, and I'm not saying I'm right, but you could see this as a job and not a true love and passion...........I hate when my time is up. .....Just a observation is all. I know the written word is hard to convey true feelings and intent.
Thanks again for your post...

That part of Whimpy’s quote struck a cord with me too, but for different reasons.

Note: This really does not add to the discussion, I just thought I’d share some memories and a story for those who are interested.

My first year of table hopping I got lucky with a 4 night per week restaurant gig in a resort town during the summer. I didn’t receive my pay (all in cash) until the end of the week which was a busy Saturday night. The restaurant manager always made me wait to be paid. It really frustrated me but I was a newbie and very happy to get the work and the cash.

Anyway, I would make the wait more tolerable by sitting at the bar and having a drink and listening the outstanding singer they had. As the summer went on the wait got longer and longer, so naturally I’d have to have more drinks!

What I didn’t realize is that restaurant was struggling financially and closed after that summer. I’m thinking the reason for the long wait sometimes was they were actually waiting for the cash to come in so they could pay me!

They were great memories of sitting at the bar with some tips in my pocket listening to Phantom of the Opera being sung, content in the fact that for the first time I reached my goal of being a full time magician.

Seth Godin just posted a very relevant article about working for free on his blog: http://sethgodin.typepad.com/seths_blog/......ree.html

Magicians provide entertainment value. People know that entertainment has value, which is why someone would go out of their way to get entertainers, even if they don't feel like paying them (yes, I said "feel like"). For some restaurants, hiring entertainment isn't cost effective, but they know that having entertainment will bring people through the door (when executed well).

Right now I have 2 restaurants, and I have 2 more interested in me. The work is out there. In fact, one of the restaurants that is interested is a part of a national chain. They are a bit more upscale and the kind of place I know I would do well in. But, I honestly didn't approach them because they are a chain. Chains are notorious for having no entertainment policies, and for having management afraid to speak up and stand out. That is why they are called managers and not leaders.

However, I randomly met the event coordinator last week and told her what I do for restaurants. She was very enthusiastically interested. As she put it, "We are trying to do different things (they just booked a mystery dinner theater) to get people coming back in more often." And I know that what I offer will help her do that, both with entertainment and social media.

One of the other restaurants I have has unbelievably slow business during winter months because they rely heavily on foot traffic. But, the owner hired me on anyway because he knows that right now we are laying the ground work to kill it in the summer months, and do what we can to prevent his next winter from being as slow as this one. As their head bartender said yesterday, "We need you." They know that it isn't just magic that will set them a part, but also the social gathering we are working to create around the magic. The same thing could be done with a band, comedy night, etc. But luckily magic can do well because it amazes people, and has interactive qualities.

You bring up an important point, Close.Up.Dave, "Social Gathering" I always watch one of my favorite shows 'Restaurant Impossible" with Chef Robert Irvine as the host. Anyone who works restaurants should watch the show. Chef Roberts' goal is to turn failing restaurants around and scrutinizes every aspect of the restaurant business...........He made a statement that stuck with me.....

"A sign of a healthy restaurant is a noisy restaurant". Lots of conversational chatter, laughter and happy noise. An experienced magician with people skills can do just that......Another example of social interaction I think is extremely important. When entertaining at a table, surrounding tables are also watching. Just last week an adjacent table of about 6 people were reacting as if I was performing for them. They apologized to the people where I WAS performing, for interrupting. My table said no problem and the two tables started to talk with each other, introduced themselves and talked for a few minutes.

This often happens where people will turn to surrounding tables and say: "Did you see that?" It just makes for a very pleasant experience for everyone and leaves a good taste in their mouths (no pun intended) that associates the good time with that particular restaurant.

A fun and happy atmosphere as Chef Roberts' states, is a great sign of a healthy restaurant......Now there are those that like a quiet, intimate atmosphere or when people are there to gather for a not so happy occasion. There are those restaurants out there and if, like Eugene Burger likes to perform, a magician is requested he will be invited to a particular table in a much more formal situation.

Yes, a restaurant magical entertainer, with the proper people skills, can be a valuable asset.