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Cliffg37 Inner circle Long Beach, CA 2491 Posts |
I am looking to build a small platform stage for the community center where my local magic club meets. I know I can take a sheet of plywood, brace it, put planks around it, and it would hold up a car if needed.... But I wonder if there is a way to make it strong enough to act as a stage while still being easily taken apart and put back together? Any thoughts?
Magic is like Science,
Both are fun if you do it right! |
the Sponge Inner circle Atlanta 2771 Posts |
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Cliffg37 Inner circle Long Beach, CA 2491 Posts |
Thank you Sponge... Much appreciation.
Magic is like Science,
Both are fun if you do it right! |
dashroom New user 9 Posts |
To put it simply, don't
I don't know about the regs where you are, but in general they are much more prescriptive in the US than here in the UK. Stages need more than just "strength" as you put it - the car is a static load, people are dynamic loads, thus shear and shock forces come into play. Small stages also need safety rails built to appropriate standards. You need to calculate maximum deflection, bending moments, area moments of inertia, changes in material conditions due to environmental factors. All of these are worked out by the manufacturers when you buy them in, giving you the safe max weight and number of people (the most weight you can put on it is not the max safe loading they give you) Also, just using wood means that it can only be used a few times before the screws give and you need to rebuild. You also have to worry about non-destructive testing. Assuming you have actually put a car on it (guessing you haven't), then you have past the "rated" point (even if not yet rated) and caused damage. Safety margins also have to be considered. By standard international safety margins a small 1000kg would be divided by 30 (10x human lifting safety margin, 3x dynamic load approximation) to allow you half of one skinny guy All of this is fairly simplified as going into all of this would require lots of structural engineering knowledge to understand, and I'm not one either. All these will be required by "due diligence" parts of your local law / fire regs, if not explicitly asked for. I would also say that it is ethically required - "stages" like this injure people (and occasionally kill) on a regular basis. Save yourself the risk and buy a cheap riser and guardrails - it'll last longer, be much safer, and much more convenient. George Sources: Custom build engineer for theatrical projects ( I do electronics not staging, but work with staging engineers and need to understand the process just as they need to understand mine to allow good teamwork ) |
MagicSA New user South Africa 67 Posts |
I know someone who used this resource. http://www.ehow.com/how_6393834_build-portable-stage.html Obviously one can make changes, but to me the final product looked good.
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George Ledo Magic Café Columnist SF Bay Area 3042 Posts |
What I said in the thread referenced above still stands: figure out what you're trying to make (dimensions, height, how many people on it at the same time, and so forth), and go from there. Anybody can do a "how-to" on building a stage, but keep in mind that his was probably built for a specific purpose too.
BTW, from the way you wrote the OP, I'm guessing that the comment about putting a car on it was facetious. If you're doing "a small platform for the magic club," and you're not planning on illusions, and the purpose of the thing is just visibility, I'm going to guess you're probably looking at something along the lines of 4x8 feet, and maybe ten inches or a foot high, which can be easily disassembled. Take it from there. As someone mentioned in the other thread, there are standard theatrical techniques for building a low platform, which is what yours would be. Now, if you'd said you wanted to tour with the thing, and it was larger and higher, and more weight would be on it, I'd say talk to a theatrical staging supplier.
That's our departed buddy Burt, aka The Great Burtini, doing his famous Cups and Mice routine
www.georgefledo.net Latest column: "Sorry about the photos in my posts here" |
bertolla New user Switzerland 84 Posts |
I use always this:
http://www.spider-evoflex.com/lng/en/spider-stage-risers/ I have many great reaction and I use them always. |
Cliffg37 Inner circle Long Beach, CA 2491 Posts |
Indeed George, The line about the car was from a platform I built years ago. (not portable) It was to hold a considerable amount of weight, and I was concerned. I asked a former construction worker I knew what he thought of it, and he said, "You could put a car on that."
In this case the stage will hold tops three people and some magic stage equipment. Since it is not so tall (probably 15 or 16 inches high or so) I am not too worried about strength.
Magic is like Science,
Both are fun if you do it right! |
George Ledo Magic Café Columnist SF Bay Area 3042 Posts |
It sounds like you could use a device called a "parallel." It's basically a folding openwork wood frame (like an open-sided box) that is then covered with a lid, which is generally 3/4" ply.
I looked it up online but didn't find any good resources. You can find instructions on how to make one in a good theatrical scenery textbook, especially an older one. "Scenery for the Theatre" by Burris-Mayer & Cole is a good one, as are "Scene Design & Stage Lighting" by Parker & Smith, and "Stage Scenery: Its Construction and Rigging" by A.S. Gillette. These can sometimes be found on amazon or eBay, but you can also usually request them from a library via inter-library loan. I'd love to suggest that you go to your local college theatre department or community theatre, but unfortunately I'm finding that not everyone in these places... ummm... how to say this... knows the basics. It's sad, but that's how it is.
That's our departed buddy Burt, aka The Great Burtini, doing his famous Cups and Mice routine
www.georgefledo.net Latest column: "Sorry about the photos in my posts here" |
IDOTRIX Elite user Darien,il 467 Posts |
Check Craig's list in your area
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Cliffg37 Inner circle Long Beach, CA 2491 Posts |
FYI - I am building the stage I spoke of.
2 - 6x3 foot sections, (6 legs on each one) with a height of 16 inches and 1 step on each side to help with ascension. 16 inches should be plenty high for our club purposes. Much higher would requre more bracing on the legs. I used double hinges to hold the legs on. Hinged on once side as expected for a folding leg. Hinged on the other with the pin removable to allow for strength while standing and foldability on demand. They both will store easily as they are each only 3 inches think or so. I can either bolt the two pieces together at the site, or use clamps to hold them. Both have their benefits and drawbacks. Clamps: easy to apply and remove, but can work loose as the stage is used. Bolts: Takes longer to apply and remove, but stronger in use Velcro glued to the front lip to allow a hanging cloth. Not a curtain per se, but it will look better than the bare view underneath the thing. One draw back, they are not light weight, but neither are the professionally made foldable platforms. They will however, fit easily in the back of my van. That was one of my goals; the ability to trasport them easily.
Magic is like Science,
Both are fun if you do it right! |
George Ledo Magic Café Columnist SF Bay Area 3042 Posts |
Sounds simple enough, and lots of times, that's the key.
That's our departed buddy Burt, aka The Great Burtini, doing his famous Cups and Mice routine
www.georgefledo.net Latest column: "Sorry about the photos in my posts here" |
Chris Stolz Inner circle Mississauga, Ontario 1958 Posts |
I'd also recommend what I do.
Whenever I design a set, I get it in front of the TD of the theatre MONTHS in advance. I'll be sending my set for a March show in the next 2 weeks to start our discussions. We discuss what it is, how it's used and what I need to comply with every regulation. We talk about everything from structure, to railing heights, to fire-proofing. In your case, make friends with someone who runs another theatre and download what you can. They'll know all the rules since safety is usually 95% of their role. For instance, you'll want to make sure you paint all surfaces with something like Rosco Flamex. There are cheap ways of making your own using certain soaps, but this stuff works really well and lasts.
Chris Stolz
BLACK ART BOOK: Hiding In The Shadows. |
George Ledo Magic Café Columnist SF Bay Area 3042 Posts |
Good points, Chris. However, based on my long experience down here, I do need to add a caveat.
Theatre is like magic in that the perception of a magician, by the general public, is similar to that of a TD (technical director): they're all the same, or do the same, or have the same background and experience. Unfortunately, not everyone working as a TD in non-professional theatre knows what he or she is doing. I have seen TDs in community theatre who not only have no training in tech theatre, but who have apparently never even seen a textbook, never mind read it. I have also met TDs in college theatre who have their degree in acting or directing, and are serving as TDs mostly by default. These are the dangerous ones in my opinion, as they make the kids think they're learning things properly, and then experience major culture shock when they try to get a job. I've had to re-train kids coming out of a two-year "tech theatre" program, who didn't even know the basics and thought it all happened by the seat of the pants at the last minute "because that's how theatre is." The moral of the story: make sure you know who you're talking with, especially when it comes to safety.
That's our departed buddy Burt, aka The Great Burtini, doing his famous Cups and Mice routine
www.georgefledo.net Latest column: "Sorry about the photos in my posts here" |
Cliffg37 Inner circle Long Beach, CA 2491 Posts |
Here is the stage I built. I recieved strong praise from all, except for those who felt it was too small for effects requiring lots of props. It was built to hold grand illusions, just a magician, an effect and maybe a volunteer or two. It came out nice and sturdy. It is just under 17 inches high, and was perfect ot let the audience see the action.
Click here to view attached image.
Magic is like Science,
Both are fun if you do it right! |
Bill Hegbli Eternal Order Fort Wayne, Indiana 22797 Posts |
I would consider putting those none slip strips on the step and at the front on the stage. That way, no one will slip and fall off. Check a good home improvement store for the adhesive strips.
On the news lately, there have been a lot of collapsing stages with to many people on them. Just insure you have it braced in the middle. |
Cliffg37 Inner circle Long Beach, CA 2491 Posts |
Thanks Bill, Yess, it is well braced in the middle. Also the steps have rubber strips on the bottom to make them skid resistant. This is good advice.
Magic is like Science,
Both are fun if you do it right! |
Bill Hegbli Eternal Order Fort Wayne, Indiana 22797 Posts |
From your picture, it does not look like you put skid resistant strips on the steps. That is what I was referring to. People with new shoe, that are dress leather shoes usually have leather soles. Women have high heels with smooth soles. Children many times are dressed nicely when going to events, thus they are not usually well worn in shoes.
http://www.lowes.com/pd_96654-1681-61202_0__ |
George Ledo Magic Café Columnist SF Bay Area 3042 Posts |
Cliff--
Looks good. Good and simple. It's what you needed. Reminds me of a cartoon from many years ago, showing how various people interpreted what the client wanted. Here's a more recent version of it: http://www.tamingdata.com/2010/07/08/the......present/
That's our departed buddy Burt, aka The Great Burtini, doing his famous Cups and Mice routine
www.georgefledo.net Latest column: "Sorry about the photos in my posts here" |
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