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Dannydoyle Eternal Order 21245 Posts 
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But he READILY thinks that souring around bloviating on the Internet regularly makes huh a conjuror. Hilarious. Not doing shows and pontificating about an audience somehow qualifies.
Well just because you have a above ground pool in the back yard doesn't make you Michal Phelps. Or Mark aspitz, or Johnny Weissmuller. Pick a swimmer from your generation for the analogy.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus <BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell |
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Dannydoyle Eternal Order 21245 Posts
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Quote:
On Jun 27, 2016, mastermindreader wrote: See that is always the underpinning of his posts. Things were so much better when,.. It is a ridiculous premise. Like I said perfectly happy to jab at Taylor Swift, having never met her and gets cranky when someone makes an "assumption" about him. But it is easy to have these theories when you never back them up. Why is it with so much knowledge there is no body of work? Just forcing tricks on peole at meetings and that bs. Show me the work!
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus <BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell |
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funsway Inner circle old things in new ways - new things in old ways 9988 Posts
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Sure would be helpful if you two used your experience to address the topic rather than wallow in personal attacks.
I clearly stated above, "The challenges for a magician today in "know your audience" is different from a century ago and even a decade. Not "worse than" or "better than, just different" That is an opinion, not an assumption; and certainly is not disparaging about younger age cohorts or anyone at all. Bob, you know that "criticism" does not imply a negative view. Critical analysis of how people make decisions and communicate is not bound by"generations." You and Danny have created an illusion that I feel a certain way about young people today. I have never said that I think any person is sallow or stupid. Why do you make these things up? You must really be afraid of something. I just can't figure out what.
"the more one pretends at magic, the more awe and wonder will be found in real life." Arnold Furst
eBooks at https://www.lybrary.com/ken-muller-m-579928.html questions at ken@eversway.com |
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Dannydoyle Eternal Order 21245 Posts
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Quote:
On Jun 27, 2016, funsway wrote: You just madeup the part about us being afraid.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus <BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell |
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Dannydoyle Eternal Order 21245 Posts
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With most of these threads it is more junk food for thought.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus <BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell |
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mastermindreader 1949 - 2017 Seattle, WA 12586 Posts
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What personal attack? You've regularly disparaged and attacked modern society and the current generation.
And why do you think I'm afraid of anything? That be more likely with someone who constantly pines for the good old days. |
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funsway Inner circle old things in new ways - new things in old ways 9988 Posts
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Bob, amongst other false claims by you, you stated that I seemed to consider that the current generation is stupid and shallow.
As I never said any of those things, you made it up; projecting those perception from within yourself. No one made you do that. You chose to do it. What other motivation can thee be but fear? If that is not so, please explain what your motivation is to make false statements, argue against your own projections and act so unprofessionally on these threads? From the first posts I made years ago suggesting a different view of magic and related performance approaches that differ from your own you have chosen to attack me rather than discuss the issues. My experiences are different so my conclusions and opinions should be different. I do not offer my views to convince you of anything, but to offer alternatives for those on the Café' looking for a more complete understanding of magic than offered by any single individual. I have found value and things not to like in every generation I have had the good fortune to pass though. I do not disparage modern society any more than the past ones. The good day is today, appreciated in comparison to those of every past generation - both the good and bad parts. If you view my offering of an opinion different from yours as an attack on modern society, then you will like even less what I post tomorrow and next year. It is your choice to threat alternative world views as disparaging and attacking. Just recognize that this comes from you and not me or the world. I can only hope you continue to share your personal opinion on subjects with which you have experience and knowledge. "What I think" is not one of those subjects. I am always interested in what you think and feel about the mystic arts. You don't you show the same respect?
"the more one pretends at magic, the more awe and wonder will be found in real life." Arnold Furst
eBooks at https://www.lybrary.com/ken-muller-m-579928.html questions at ken@eversway.com |
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MagicalEducator Veteran user 369 Posts
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I share many of your frustrations. So much knowledge and yet the sarcasm, belittling and more seems to be a fall back position when someone dares to have a position that's different. Some people don't come to online sites to participate in a discussion instead they come to validate what they already know to be right. Look for those who have a change of opinion or that show any movement in their positions. Unfortunately this is fairly uncommon particularly in Penny. There, much like here it seems, one can only have one opinion. It's the right one that's insisted upon by pure mentalists, the PEA and anyone who doesn't agree obviously just doesn't know better. It's all rather self serving and any new information is simply ignored, twisted or ridiculed. Fortunately I have thick skin and lots of self esteem otherwise this could be just a brutal place to visit. The question soon becomes why does one bother? There are so many better things to do with your time than to have a discussion with people who devalue others and just know better. It's like they didn't have anything more important to do with their time. Lot like high school really.
Jeff
Voted "Canada's Most Inspirational Magician"
www.MagicalEducator.com Check out my column "Magic is Education" in Vanish Magazine |
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funsway Inner circle old things in new ways - new things in old ways 9988 Posts
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Quote:
On Jun 28, 2016, Dannydoyle wrote: I pretty much agree with the sentiment here, but feel "useless" a bit strong and certainly subjective. Every person's opinion should be weighted against the experience related to the topic discussed. No opinion is worthless, just possibly "worth less" than that of another. A stage illusionists opinion on handling kids at a party may be "worth less" than that of a clown doing kid's parties. If the subject is thinking of a spectator, then anyone doing a "performance art" may offer a less valuable opinion that a guy on the street. If the subject is on using mixed media to describe a magic effect for classroom use, then the opinion of teacher who uses magic in a classroom would rate higher than that of a professional entertainer. "Tested and validated" may be a good measure. "Doing in a performance art" may not even be a factor for some aspects of magic. If I ever get to Las Vegas again I will try and catch your magic show and learn first-hand how to value your opinions (test and validate). Until then I must rely on congruency of opinions expressed and how professionally you act toward others -- accepting your expertise on stage performance as a given. I support getting as many opinions as possible out in view so that I can learn from each and select what best works for me.
"the more one pretends at magic, the more awe and wonder will be found in real life." Arnold Furst
eBooks at https://www.lybrary.com/ken-muller-m-579928.html questions at ken@eversway.com |
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mastermindreader 1949 - 2017 Seattle, WA 12586 Posts
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Quote:
On Jun 27, 2016, funsway wrote: Really? Here are a few examples out of dozens of things about the current generation that you now claim, with a straight face, you never said: Quote:
On Mar 16, 2013, funsway wrote: Quote:
On Aug 20, 2013, funsway wrote: Many references to "the devolution of our culture." Quote:
On Jul 15, 2015, funsway wrote: I've got two granddaughters, ages 16 and 18, both educated in public schools, who put the lie to everything you wrote. |
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Michael Baker Eternal Order Near a river in the Midwest 11172 Posts
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East is east and west is west, and never the twain shall meet... (not so fast folks...)
This magician just made a delightfully delicious... and dare I say, "MAGICAL" mayonnaise-grilled sandwich! Well, considering I have skills and experience in both cooking and magic, I declare myself the ultimate winner because this was yummy!!! Even with my svelte figure at risk and my belly headed for a new low, never once did I feel that my "magician's magic" was threatened. So, behold wanderers of the green pages... the monster under the bed is nothing more than a little ham with lots of cheesy goodness!! Hey! Just like a magic show!! 
~michael baker
The Magic Company |
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0pus Inner circle New Jersey 1739 Posts
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Do I detect a cinnamon swirl on that grilled bread?
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Michael Baker Eternal Order Near a river in the Midwest 11172 Posts
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Quote:
On Jun 28, 2016, 0pus wrote: Pepperidge Farm 3 cheese bread 
~michael baker
The Magic Company |
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funsway Inner circle old things in new ways - new things in old ways 9988 Posts
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Bob, "entitled" does not mean either "stupid" or "shallow."
Being less educated does not mean either of those words either. Do you have access to a dictionary? It is wonderful if your relatives are better educated than most younger people today. This does not mean they are better educated than kids of the same age 30 years ago. Young people today are preparing to exist in a different world from that we older folks were raised in. This is a fact. Does than mean their skill set is less appropriate -- or that an earlier skill set is bad or better? No. It is just a basis for comparison with each person drawing their own conclusions. Your example does not demonstrate any lie on my part, but do illustrate why a consideration of change might suggest a reappraisal of values, goals and plans. The real question is why you are so adversarial against any view other than your own? I will continue to look at life's changes though a variety of lenses. A few opinions I might share. The forum is "Food for Thought" - not "my beliefs are better than yours." Michael, for example, did consider his views of magic and cooking. Great! That was the purpose of my post. Others may consider their view of magic as a performer and spectator and arrive at a different conclusion. Never once did I ask that anyone agree with my point of view. And nothing posted so far will cause me to change my view/opinion that apparent changes in perception of what magic means over recent decades is reason to reappraise your own effect choice and presentations. Why do you feel called upon to try and change that opinion? Try some pepperjack cheese on there next time, Michael - truly astonishing.
"the more one pretends at magic, the more awe and wonder will be found in real life." Arnold Furst
eBooks at https://www.lybrary.com/ken-muller-m-579928.html questions at ken@eversway.com |
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Dannydoyle Eternal Order 21245 Posts
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Young people have ALWAYS been preparing to live in a far different from the one their patents existed in. It is called PROGRESS and most think it is a good thing.
I have to say the way you come off in your pays is hating progress and pining away fit a time that will never return. If that is not true done but it is how you come across. For someone SO interested in communication it is ironic that if this is not your intent you let it happen. Things were not better before. They were not worse before they just were. You seem shocked by progress and state things like young people living in a different world as if it is news. If that is not your intent go back to your communication skills as they seem to have deserted you. How much different was the world after the invention of the nuclear bomb? That is just ONE of millions of examples of the point you seem to miss.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus <BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell |
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Ray Pierce Inner circle Los Angeles, CA 2604 Posts
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Quote:
On Jun 28, 2016, funsway wrote: I must admit that I share this feeling on ideas. I worked a lot with Don Wayne and David Copperfield in the early years and Don had a very interesting take on these things. He always listened to every one no matter what their experience. He always said that even stupid people can luck into a good idea once in a while so you never know. It is true that you usually have to wade through a lot more stuff to get to those occasional good ideas so the fact that as a whole, each word is "worth less" then an expert is a reasonable thought. He also said that laymen and others who were less experienced were great at picking up on problems, just not necessarily solving them. He would say that people would usually find the right problem but for the wrong reason. If enough people comment on something, there is definitely a weakness there although their solutions might not be as useful. Just another approach that changed my way of thinking years ago!
Ray Pierce
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Dannydoyle Eternal Order 21245 Posts
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I wonder if he had to wade thorough every piece of drivel on the Internet if the opinion might have been modified some?
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus <BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell |
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Michael Baker Eternal Order Near a river in the Midwest 11172 Posts
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Not being one to shy away from levity...
I was telling friend (who is aware of this thread) about a particularly trying day that I've had today. This was his response: "Now, if you had coated yourself in mayonnaise before you left home, none of that would have happened!"
~michael baker
The Magic Company |
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Ray Pierce Inner circle Los Angeles, CA 2604 Posts
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Quote:
On Jun 28, 2016, Dannydoyle wrote: lol... of course, the art is in selecting the correct sample.
Ray Pierce
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Michael Baker Eternal Order Near a river in the Midwest 11172 Posts
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Quote:
On Jun 28, 2016, Ray Pierce wrote: As if there isn't enough cherry picking on these forums...
~michael baker
The Magic Company |
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Posted: Jun 27, 2016 03:23 pm 
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