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tommy
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One can only hope magicians keep their cleverness to themselves.
If there is a single truth about Magic, it is that nothing on earth so efficiently evades it.

Tommy
MagicalEducator
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Quote:
On Jun 28, 2016, Dannydoyle wrote:
Then why bother?

You seem to think all opinions are equal. They are not.

You cane here to stalk Bob because you have a beef with him. High school indeed.

Go and get 35 years of experience and then perhaps you will be treated differently. Having another tested and validated opinion is one thing. Having an opinion based on not doing in a performance art is useless.


I came here to stalk Bob? I don't agree with something that's happening with Bob on another thread...is this now the standard? Who says I don't have 35 years of experience...I actually started performing in 1978 and so I'll leave you to do the math. That one has experience doesn't mean that I agree with everything that Bob says or writes. I do this little thing called thinking for myself. It's served me well and so I shall stand by my comments which are hardly stalking. I still buy his work, study it and use what I find works for my work.

jeff
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So you have been actively performing full time since 1978?
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
George Ledo
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Sorry, not to derail the mud-flinging, but if I can speak for the guy with the red coveralls, pitchfork, and Brunhilda helmet for a moment...

Could it be possible (not probable, just possible) that using the term "magic" in advertising is really a weird sort of compliment? As in, have advertisers thought all this time (or thought they thought) that "the masses" think magic is so wonderful that they want to jump on the bandwagon by calling something "magical?"

***

Disclaimer: The statements above are not meant to promote the writer's personal opinion, but to ponder as to whether there might be a possible explanation for the issue in question.

... or something to that effect. Smile
That's Burt, aka The Great Burtini, doing his famous Cups and Mice routine
www.georgefledo.net

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tommy
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Prescriptive advising is based on authority, with the primary notion of dispensing information and the prescribing of remedies for problems and so on. I don’t think there is much magic/art about prescriptive advising but there can be when it some advanced technology I guess. New is a word they use a lot to sell. New can stretched to the future, giving rise to magical ideas.
If there is a single truth about Magic, it is that nothing on earth so efficiently evades it.

Tommy
tommy
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Hype meaning excessive or misleading publicity or advertising is a way of creating magic which is essentially that which does not exit n realm of the physical world we call reality. Bosh is used to create the illusion and advertisers and magicians use it. Take some truth such as, Guinness gives you strength, then you stretch the truth beyond what exists in reality and then manifest it. For the advertisers with his techno it is of course quite easy for them to manifest the magical illusion; i.e.
If there is a single truth about Magic, it is that nothing on earth so efficiently evades it.

Tommy
funsway
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old things in new ways - new things in old ways
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Quote:
On Jul 4, 2016, George Ledo wrote:

Could it be possible (not probable, just possible) that using the term "magic" in advertising is really a weird sort of compliment? As in, have advertisers thought all this time (or thought they thought) that "the masses" think magic is so wonderful that they want to jump on the bandwagon by calling something "magical?"


More than possible, methinks - they recognize that "magic" is closer to how humans think that rational discourse as mentioned by neuroscientists.

The only issue is whether the perceptions of the average lay person has changed such that a perceptive performer should reappraise their magic presentations in light of these factors.

The interesting part is why some posters here ignore "magicians helping magicians" and make personal attacks or diversions into other subjects rather than discuss the issue at hand.

I happen to think that the shift from "magical' to a direct claim of "here is where the magic happens" should prompt a "wake up call" or "food for thought."

"Change" is not necessarily either progress or advancement for society or magic as an art -- but it is an opportunity for a performer to consider changes in how they present magic to an audience.

There is an ancient saying (Turkic) - "If things change they may not be better, but for life to get better things must change."

I pine for a better tomorrow and think performance magic can play a vital role in the game - perhaps taking marketing's lead as to the importance of magic in people's lives.
"there is real merit in the magician who tries to be creative – from such endeavors magic sustains its life energy." Harold Rice



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ctom
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Quote:
On Jul 5, 2016, funsway wrote:

I happen to think that the shift from "magical' to a direct claim of "here is where the magic happens" should prompt a "wake up call" or "food for thought."



I can't say I've noticed advertisers using "magical" less and "here is where the magic happens" more, although I am not one to particularly pay much attention to the commercials. I'd be interested in reading more about this though can you post the links to those studies?
Ba Ba Booey
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I always thought that You-Tube is where the magic happens: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uPo411ysueM
ed rhodes
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Quote:
On Jun 14, 2016, funsway wrote:
Quote:
On Jun 14, 2016, Dannydoyle wrote:

Rather than fight progress a wise man embraces it.


That is the difference then. I don't see this as progress. Change, yes, To me, "progress" implies improvement. I don't see any.

I posted this to acknowledge the change -- suggesting that the wise magician take the changes of perceptions about magic into account when designing a routine.

I don't think these dilutions of language are for the best, and certainly not for magic as an art form. Just an opinion.

Please explain how the change of the term magic from some reference to "inexplicable phenomena" to a ubiquitous marketing term is progress.

How does it help a magician today prepare a routine? What can they assume about a general audience with regards to how they perceive magic?

The next time a magician says, "Here is where the magic happens," what will the audience be thinking?


That this is where something magical will happen.

Whether you approve of it or not, for some people, using mayonaise to make a really nice grilled cheese IS kind of magic. But then, some people don't know how they get the little people into their televisions! Smile (no, not really.)

I remember "Wayne's World," where the sponsor shows up for the first "big budget" taping of "Wayne's World" and he bring his (girlfriend? trophy wife? I don't remember.). The "producer" offers to bring them down to the sound stage and the girl says; "Ooh, that's where the magic happens!" So it's not like the mayonaise people were making a unique statement.
"He was born with the gift of laughter and a sense that the world was mad." - Rafael Sabatini, Scaramouche
ed rhodes
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Quote:
On Jun 20, 2016, funsway wrote:
Quote:
On Jun 19, 2016, ZachDavenport wrote:
Have you never heard the phrase "This is where the magic happens"? Its fairly common.



Exactly -- when suggesting that something impossible or unexpected is about to apparently occur.
For mayonnaise to turn brown when heated is simple science - no mystery, no illusion -- certainly no magic.


It can also mean something "wondrous" is about to happen. That certainly matches both the browning of mayonnaise AND the amazing conclusion of a magic show. Let's be honest, if you break everything down to its physical reality, no actual "magic" happens in a magic show either.
"He was born with the gift of laughter and a sense that the world was mad." - Rafael Sabatini, Scaramouche
funsway
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Quote:
On Mar 18, 2017, ed rhodes wrote:

It can also mean something "wondrous" is about to happen. That certainly matches both the browning of mayonnaise AND the amazing conclusion of a magic show. Let's be honest, if you break everything down to its physical reality, no actual "magic" happens in a magic show either.


It would seem you prove my original point -- people today equate "wondrous" and even "magical" with "magic" as a demonstration of the impossible that has not rational explanation.

The term has been so conflated and watered down that a typical spectator doesn't know what to expect when you offer to perform a magic effect.

And I totally disagree with the last part. Definitional, of course, but magic happens all the time as a result of our defying the impossible in a theatrical way.
I have helped hundreds of business owner overcome problem in their business (considered impossible) by including magic tricks in my presentations.

Others have provided similar stories -- lives changed in positive ways because of performance magic.

Check with the Vanishing Wheel Chair Project. Persons with disabilities developing entirely new skills and life attitude because of magic.

The results are "physical" and the parents readily say "magic happened." They don't say that about burned bread.

I can live with people calling a cleaning product 'amazing" and even "magical." My objection is their saying "here the magic happens" - big difference for me.

If I accepted your statement then the ad is a lie -- since magic never happens, why do they claim it? But, people do think magic can happen - so it is real. Just not in this ad.
"there is real merit in the magician who tries to be creative – from such endeavors magic sustains its life energy." Harold Rice



ShareBooks at www.eversway.com * questions at funsway@eversway.com
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