Hey guys! If you have ever been interested in 2-walling and owning your own theater, David just added a 4-hour talk with me (split up into 2 sections) on how I did it, costly mistakes I've learned from, and general advice on the matter that I wish someone told me before I started...I'm hoping it will benefit someone out there! Here's an invitation video:

https://vimeo.com/240701230

(Video Password is "magicmasters")

Here's the link to sign up:

Don’t miss 30+ Free Presentations From More Than 26 Of The World's Experts Convening In One Place, With One Goal:
Elevate The Art Of Entertainment!
Registration is free, but you must register now!
http://magicmastersummit.com/2017?affiliate_id=848066
(Live event runs Nov 13-17)

Great suggestion. I don't have anything on it this year since it's such a personal choice... however, I'll certainly keep this in mind for next year!

Thanks!

Dave

FYI everyone- day one is live now! It includes part 1 of my talk with Dave.

Day 1 was great! Looking forward to my lecture next year: How I make 6 figures selling TTs to strangers in bars.

This has been incredible so far this year.... True GOLD being given away.

Congratulations to Dave on another successful summit. I loved the production, look and feel of it this year, very nice. Hopefully it was well-attended and many found much great information and some useful and applicable advice to help in their own businesses. Such value for free or only a minimal investment in yourself and your business.

I have to admit it was not so wonderful for me. Dave Womach's constant interruptions and taking the personality guest off topic and drifting away from what was the topic, was very annoying for me.

I took from it, Dave does not recognize that he is a success in his own right, and I really felt he was just trying to get information for himself, and not those that really need it.

His approach was totally different then last year's, and I felt, I was not getting the information the person was hoping to give.

I would have been interested in know how the promoter got to be a promoter, being he was a failure as a performer. With his attitude I don't see how he ever got anyone to work for him. I did catch, he is very difficult to get ahold of, and that may be his secret, as he is never available. The actual people that know how to talk to and treat people actually makes his business a success. Just did not like the guy, and his smirk he had throughout the interview.

This really missed the mark this year. Dave should have just done all the video topics himself.

Again, no props or examples to actually see. If Dave did not have those posters, we would have no examples of what they were talking about.

I once was invited to dinner by a famous magician. When I arrived, this guy I knew nothing about, or did not recognize him in any way, introduced himself and started talking. All through dinner, I was trying to converse with that actual person I was hoping to talk to. The other guy kept getting loud and interrupting with his nonsense. Long story short, I barely got to say hello to the actual person, and left with a lot opportunity.

This is how I felt with this years videos. So many lost opportunities to learn something I did not know previously.

Dave Womach, you are at the top of your career as a variety entertainer, I don't know what you consider as success, but I believe you have hit the top already.

Chance Wolf, why did you know turn off the camera and tell Chance, you would wait while he found the other working parts. Thinking about it, why didn't you do that with all of them. Again, they were totally not prepared for the interview.

If you want to know what the bottom looks like, get a job for a day at McDonald's.

I was so annoyed, I did not bother to watch, but 3 of them all the way through, most I gave up after half way.

I sympathize with some of those comments, but on the whole I must disagree.

I didn't like every presenter. I wouldn't work with some of them at all. That's a useful thing to know about a person in my industry, if I didn't already. If you thought all or most of the presenters were unlikable people, then that's a real criticism of the coordination of the event. One or two that rub you the wrong way seems expected.

I also discovered some people I didn't know about (Zach Zimmerman!), and learned more about some who I only had a 'branded' image of in my head. (Michael Trixx! I'd seen his promos but would have never known that I would like to hang with him, until I saw his seminars) That's the treasure-hunt of these kinds of events, in my mind. The surprise gem makes up for the hyped let-down.

I agree that some of the presentations were loosely directed. I still found most of it to be valuable information even when it went off-topic. Dave isn't going to be a professional late-night host (At least not until he gets better at "to-doot to-doo"). That's not what I was looking for though. I liked the conversational nature of the presentations, even if I didn't like all the conversations. I had to turn off one interview because I disagreed with the way Dave was handling the topic and the things he was saying. So we have slightly different politics; That's ok. It was only one, out of dozens of presentations, and on the whole I'm comfortable learning from and watching anyone, even if we might not make great beer-buddies. I think you're asking for a very high-bar to be met, but I'll grant that if you were expecting solid and structured interviews, this isn't the series for you.

The thing I disagree with completely though, is your seeming resentfulness of David for wanting to improve his magic and career, just because you would be satisfied where he is now. I myself will never stop seeking new knowledge, sit back and tell myself "I've made it. This is the top." One of the most inspiring bits of this conference to me was hearing that sentiment explicitly affirmed over and over by not just working magicians, but highly respected magicians too. If Jeff McBride and Tony Clark are still improving, the top is a lot further than you're saying it is. I can not think of a single magician, or any artist, who is "at the top" and isn't working every day to get one step higher. I don't know what it must feel like to you, to not have that ambition and drive as an artist; but it feels like a case of sour grapes to me, for you to discourage others from embracing it.

I thank Dave, and all the people who presented, and those who worked behind the scenes. I left my day-jobs behind earlier this year to focus full-time on my magic business and starting a new theater company; This was just what I needed, at just the right time. I came away with a full notebook to dissect this weekend, a renewed enthusiasm for my work, and a bunch of real steps I can take right away to grow both my businesses. I already know the lecture I want to give, and set a goal that by applying everything I learned this week I'll be "successful" enough in a year or two that Dave will invite me.

Who was this Bill? Which interview was this? I didn't notice anything from a promoter. Perhaps I missed this.

I thought the conversations were fascinating and insightful.

I was very excited to see Jeff McBride, Michael Finney, Fielding West and Tony Clark. Plus, Gladwell's talk had plenty of good advice.

Tobias Beckworth was filled with great advice - like when he said that McBride tends to follow the money... go to the markets that are thriving when the business gets slow in one sector. Reminded me of the book, "Who Moved My Cheese."

My only critique on the subjects, if I could offer one... is that I don't feel that the corporate market was spotlighted with a heavy hitter that could've provided some inside intel on that area. Certainly, some of the guys worked corporate - but has a subject in and of itself it wasn't highlighted with a talk specifically for that market.

Aside from that, it was a fantastic summit and I thank David Davinci/Womack for putting it together.

Oscar

That is because there is so many meaning guys use for the word corporate work. As for real corporate work, there is many ways to get into it, but most all is "who you know, or get to know" and expert salesmanship on the performers part. Magician's just do not want to be salesmen.

It was the promoter guy, don't remember his name, he had his shows and only looked to hire people to pretend to be magicians, or whatever he needed to present the show.

In my opinion, it had noting to do with magic or magicians. More like hiring an actor or dancer in a show he had all set, only needed someone to learn the lines and actions for the show.

Well the summit was not just for magic or magicians, but the business of entertainment. It's probably good for everyone (magicians included) to realize that some real-life producers feel this way about magicians and variety performers. I missed the lecture you are talking about but it sounds interesting to me... if/when (I eventually bought last years so I'm sure I'll buy this years at some point) I buy the summit I'll be interested in taking a look at it.

I just don't like this kind of work, they don't care if you are a magician or not, most likely if you would tell them you are a magician or have some knowledge in magic, they would not hire you.

The late Paul Osborne and others have done this, they have put together a show, and all they want is someone to do the work for $6 an a show.

I watched Eric Bedard's talk on the 2017 Magic Master Summit. Although his topic was about the shows he does for celebrities, he also touched on corporate magic, and even some of the tricks he tailors to his customers / audiences. And the research he does in preparing for shows.

(Eric is a friend who lives locally, who I've known for a number of years. He travels internationally to perform.)

- Donald

Magicians have done this to themselves. All doing the same tricks in the same way with the same old tired line. Coming here and asking for the top five tricks for this or that is the next step. Then all garnering together on Gigmasters to further the perception of interchangeability really helped.

So how long was it before producers just found GOOD actors to deliver old tired lines to audiences? It is a natural progression if you ask me and one that is unfortunately promoted within the magic community itself.

Don Alan warned against back in the 80's talking about how he hasn't seen many young guys an agent can sell by saying "I have a guy who can_____". Fill in the blank on your own. It had been on the way for a long time. Cruise lines now often but multiple illusions and have the entertainment staff do them.

Hopefully the lesson is learned.

I agree with much of this. Part of the problem is the way magicians see and feel towards themselves and also how talent in general sees themselves. It is much different from a producer or promoter or even an agent/agency in that fact.

From an agent/agency's perspective and also the perspective of a producer, the reality is talent is the easy part to find, it is the clients and bookings that take and require the effort. To many magicians and other performers, they find a problem with this but as I always say, we MUST deal in complete honesty and the reality of things, not our own perceptions. This is very hard for magicians. They do not deal in complete honesty. Very few magicians are special or unique to the point that they create their own positioning and demand within the industry. Producer's and agencies know and understand this. Performers typically don't.

They'll say things like "I do a (insert name of trick here) and it is completely my own version of it." Perhaps it may be, but it is likely still the same trick to a layperson or audience that fails to see the nuances of your own and to them it is still the same as others.

Danny's line from Don Alan is so true. Sure blame it on the internet or all the the releases of the magic companies, but it is what it is. Practically every magician that does a rope routine, cups and balls, and sponge bunnies runs the risk of falling victim to this.

So then is it really the fault of the producers or agents? They only work from what they have to work with. I don't think many magicians realize this. Again, if you could sit in the chair next to me when I open mail and emails and view the demos we're sent, it becomes clearer than day. Same for watching demos on youtube. Most magicians won't ever see this, as they only see, think and operate from their own views and perspectives and rarely ever think or operate from an industry perspective. This could make the world of difference to many but still, most will never do it or even realize it. I also think this is the difference between older magicians and younger ones, is those that came up in magic before the information age boom, HAD to do things on their own (think, create) and were sincerely concerned with being seen as "a hack".

People (audiences) think the same thing every single time they see some about to get cut in half or go into a box to disappear and to reappears or go into a box with swords placed all around only to come out unscathed. Originality today means someone's new take on someone else's original work. Magic is in the state it is in because of MAGICIANS, not audiences!

Having worked with literally every type of performer available, magicians are truly their own breed and worst enemy, often in self-sabotaging ways. I agree magician's have done this to themselves.

I will also say, I do think some of the topic titles of the interviews were a bit misleading. I tuned into to several that were titled to be about the running and operating an entertainment business or creating a successful entertainment business when it clearly was not. Yet some interviews had content not mentioned that one would have no way of knowing about know about.

That is what happened with the example of Bill's above about the Promoter. I don't remember seeing one about a Promoter. If I would I would have certainly wanted it to be on the top of my list as few know as much about the business side of entertainment as Promoters.

The one thing that seemed part of every interview is regardless who the guest was and what the topic was about, it always seems to turn to the tricks and the magic itself. Magicians cannot not talk about the tricks! Even when questions or topics were about something else, they always have to talk about their tricks. No other type of performer does this - talk about the songs, or the caricatures, or the jokes, or their instrumentation, etc. Can't a magician talk about their career without talking about their tricks? Can't a mentalist talk about mentalism without talking about their effects? I get interviewed hundreds of times about being a hypnotist and rarely will I ever talk about the routines my subjects do when hypnotized. Only if the interviewer brings it up and even then I would avoid it.

I am curious if any members here are willing to share, what is it that attracted you to the Magic Master Summit? Was it a discussion about tricks, business aspects, producing, performance/stagecraft topics, specific topics like comedy and humor in magic, working with and hiring assistants and crew, traveling and working the road, or something else? I would really like to know this if you would be willing to share. It is no secret the demographic of The Magic Cage had changed in recent years. Along with this so has such interests. Add this to how the entire community has changed and affected by the internet, youtube and technology and there are many reasons for the changes. I understand interests are been subjective to each person, but what was your main interest or interests?

MindPro, I totally agree some of the titles were mis-leading. Nabil's interviews (he has a 2-wall deal at a resort in Guam) was titled something like "Big Show Small Room" so I almost didn't watch it. I had forgotten that he, himself, had stopped by this section of the Café to let us know about his interview and it's subject.

What draws me to the summit? Hearing the business side of show business. To hear professionals in the business talk about the business in a pretty open and honest way is pretty unique. Hearing what works and doesn't work for real professionals is worth gold to me. My favorite interview that I heard was the Bill Gladwell interview. It literally felt, at times, that it was just 2 professionals sharing their past years experiences and discussing what did and didn't work and why. The entertainers who are talking about how they are producing their own shows and making it work (2-walling, fundraising shows, cruise ships, fairs and festivals, etc.) are the biggest draw for me.

@Mindpro - I tuned in to hear more about the business side of magic. Good question.

I'll also say, I thoroughly enjoyed the summit - but I agree with your assessment as well.

Oscar