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Harry Lorayne 1926 - 2023 New York City 8558 Posts |
Always interesting to me - why in the world don't people learn an effect of mine AS TAUGHT?! Then make it fit what I call the three P's - your patter, your personality, your presentation (without changing the basic concept)?! (Oh well, then we wouldn't have this interesting discussion. would we?)
[email]harrylorayne@earthlink.net[/email]
http://www.harrylorayne.com http://www.harryloraynemagic.com |
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Steven Keyl Inner circle Washington, D.C. 2630 Posts |
Quote:
On Jul 12, 2017, PaulIngram wrote: Paul, whatever your motive, posting methods in a thread like this is entirely inappropriate, and only serves to stroke your own ego. Objecting to the fact that a performer lied about methods in play in order to deceive is preposterous, as that is what we do every day. When a stage performer shows that the linking rings contain no gaps, do you storm the stage, rip the rings out of his hand and show to the world the depth of your genius by exposing his deceit? Classless.
Steven Keyl - The Human Whisperer!
B2B Magazine Test! Best impromptu progressive Ace Assembly ever! "If you ever find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause, and reflect." --Mark Twain |
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SmilingMule New user 20 Posts |
Quote:
On Jul 12, 2017, Steven Keyl wrote: The two scenarios aren't remotely the same, making your virtue signalling laughable. Had this been a demo for an instant download and you bought it believing it could be done FASDIU to only learn it wasn't, would you say "oh well, that is what we do every day"? It was introduced as being done FASDIU and was defended as such on this and another forum. There's a difference between presentation to entertain an audience and an outright lie to intentionally deceive your peers. |
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Steven Keyl Inner circle Washington, D.C. 2630 Posts |
The only hole in your logic, Mule, is that this is NEITHER A DEMO NOR A DOWNLOAD FOR PURCHASE!!
The point remains: Exposure isn't fair game anytime someone feels they want to show off how smart they are, or just because they want to take the wind out of someone else's performance. It's classless. He could have made the exact same point without the exposure. EDIT: I hate when I allow myself to get involved in these stupid Café kerfuffles. I regret my participation and so this is my last post in the thread. Kent, both videos are excellent and I thoroughly enjoyed them. I'm out!
Steven Keyl - The Human Whisperer!
B2B Magazine Test! Best impromptu progressive Ace Assembly ever! "If you ever find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause, and reflect." --Mark Twain |
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SmilingMule New user 20 Posts |
Quote:
On Jul 12, 2017, Steven Keyl wrote: I could have been pedantic and picked "holes" in your Linking Ring analogy too - not being performed for a group of magicians, not prefaced by being told the rings where borrowed and ungimmicked etc etc etc |
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kentfgunn Inner circle Merritt Island FL 1639 Posts |
Smiling Mule,
I apologize for any deceit on my part. I shall endeavor to behave better in the future. The lines, to me, are often blurred. Version 2, posted in this thread is done with a borrowed deck. That's how I perform it these days. Talking with Brent Braun at a convention, I'd bought one of his great decks. Figured out it was a great way to do Stabbed in the Pack. In my little mind, after shooting the version and thinking, "that looks pretty clean". I posted it. Somehow, being the dipwad, I am, I still considered this trick to be the version I've done for years. Shown in video 2. From a spectator's point of view the two methods are indistiguishable. Even to some pretty knowledgable folks the two methods are indistinguishable. I lied about the method used. I should not have. Chastised, I remain. Again sir, To you and anyone who feels slighted, I'm sorry. Harry, I've read your books, unlike most card magicians. I read your words about performing the tricks as you write them up. Your way is often a great starting point. I figure, since I've done Stabbed in the Pack for over forty years, I have the right to mess with it. You put something out there, in print, you lose control of how the trick is done. KG |
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SmilingMule New user 20 Posts |
Kent - easy mistake to make and certainly no need to justify yourself (to me or anyone). Poor Steven's hurt magic feelings were all I took issue with.
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Harry Lorayne 1926 - 2023 New York City 8558 Posts |
No problem, Kent. I'm pleased to see a)that you read my books, b)that you feel that my way is usually a great starting point, c)that you've been performing one of my routines for over forty years and d) of course you have the right "to mess with it."
Of course, I obviously don't have to agree with your "messing" - but I will fight to the death for your right to "mess" however you like - so long as everyone knows and is aware that you're "messing" and that that's not my original concept.
[email]harrylorayne@earthlink.net[/email]
http://www.harrylorayne.com http://www.harryloraynemagic.com |
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kentfgunn Inner circle Merritt Island FL 1639 Posts |
SM,
Steve and I are pals. He's a great cardman. He was coming to a pal's defense. Some guys are like that. If you ever get the chance to see him work, it's worth your time. I could've been selling drugs, dressed as a nun, Steve would've still backed me up. Steve, Love you man! Harry, Whenever I post one of the tricks I do, from your books. I ALWAYS list my source. I ALWAYS mention if I've changed things up. This is my personal favorite of yours/mine. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=818flW02CME |
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PaulIngram New user 63 Posts |
Steven Keyl - I thought I was being quite complimentary towards Kent after congratulating him on a direct method and stating that I enjoyed his performance. Kent's post was specifically directed to magicians, making reference to the original effect and book. If he had begun his post by saying that this was 'HIS GAFFED DECK METHOD' for the effect then he would have gained far more credit.
As far as exposure, I have no idea how Kent achieved the effect - my comments were based upon pure speculation and reasoning on how I thought he might have achieved the effect. I only described how I thought the deck might be gaffed, I did not describe or expose any method. If you are saying that I was correct in guessing how the deck was gaffed, then I would once again say well done to Kent for his ingenuity and originality. |
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Harry Lorayne 1926 - 2023 New York City 8558 Posts |
Just so you know - since I use only borrowed decks when working for laymen - I have a few ways of ending my Stabbed In The Pack. Most often - the way I originally taught it - and many times, and I've never put this idea in print - I'll use my The Lorayne Force to reach a pretty strong ending. Obviously, if you don't know The Lorayne Force you won't know what I'm talking about. Anyway, point is, I'll stick to "impromptu with borrowed decks."
[email]harrylorayne@earthlink.net[/email]
http://www.harrylorayne.com http://www.harryloraynemagic.com |
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dj Inner circle 1178 Posts |
This is my absolute "Stabbed in the Pack" favorite.
Very simple and amazing: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mL31hc7ZywA Darko |
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gillesA4 Special user Brussels, Belgium 593 Posts |
Kent did it once again, I've been had, and I love that!
Talking about MKFCT, I follow the control- or at Least I *think* I follow it, but how on earth does the choosen card find her way to the right place??? I may have an idea but it cannot be that bold! Nice shot, cow boy!
We can't solve problems by using the same kind of thinking we used when we created them. (A. Einstein)
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Claudio Inner circle Europe 1927 Posts |
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On Jul 16, 2017, dj wrote: Funny, when I was myself looking for a solution, Simon Aronson's sleight is one I thought of as you can use it to stab between two selections. It's not as clean as Harry's original though, that requires only one hand and is very clean in handling. |
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