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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Tricky business » » Using County Fair To Promote Business. Appreciate Tips & Wisdom (10 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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daffydoug
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Then I will be sure NOT to do that!!
The difficult must become easy, the easy beautiful and the beautiful magical.
charliecheckers
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Quote:
On Jun 23, 2018, TomBoleware wrote:
Charliecheckers,
Sorry I am just now getting back on this, but the reason I said that is there are some that believe that if you ever do a free show or give any type discount then your business is ruined forever.
I don’t believe that, never have believed that simply because when you are viewed as a ‘business’ rather than a ‘person’ most people understand that you have rules that you have to follow.
Businesses have sales everyday and customers don’t come back expecting the sale price after it is over. With that said, some businesses never have sales and that is ok too.
But yes for the most part I do agree a good image is important and it’s important to be viewed as someone that treats everybody fairly.
Tom

I agree with everything you mentioned. That was the point I was trying to make - that what is offered is in line with the image one is trying to create. $1 coffee and “buy one get one” works for McDonalds but could work against 5 Guys because they have different images they are trying to maintain. Moving into advice on professional entertainment services, it is important to consider how your offers affect the way one perceives the business. Again, no right or wrong image to create, just have awareness and consistency.
TomBoleware
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I couldn’t help but laugh out loud when I signed on and the first thing I saw was : "Murphy's Magic is giving you the opportunity to win $1000 in FREE Magic!” LOL

I guess I’m not the only one that likes to give stuff away. But anyway it made me forget what I was going to post now. LOL

Tom
A habit is a habit until you realize you doing it, then it is a choice.

The NEW Daycare Magician Book
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Mindpro
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That is funny because that's exactly who they'll get - a bunch of people that want nothing but free magic. It is funny, lol.
Dannydoyle
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How happy will you be when they keep pestering you when you lose?
Danny Doyle
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<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
charliecheckers
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On Jun 24, 2018, Mindpro wrote:
That is funny because that's exactly who they'll get - a bunch of people that want nothing but free magic. It is funny, lol.


They may also get some disappointed dealers wondering why the $1000 couldn’t have been better spent towards thier challanging business needs.

Anyway, no need to try to understand why they are doing this or even thier business model in a retail oriented market. Just read that they are doing it, laugh out loud, and jump in and do the same thing they are.
charliecheckers
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Quote:
On Jun 24, 2018, Dannydoyle wrote:
How happy will you be when they keep pestering you when you lose?


Three weeks ago I was at the check out at Big Lots and they asked if I wanted to join thier “rewards club” - “it costs nothing”. The next day I get an email from them. No biggie, I deleted it without reading it. The next day, same thing. Day after that, same thing. After day 5, I unsubscribed, but in those five days of tireless pestering I got a bad taste in my mouth for Big Lots because they over shot on thier intrusion into my life.
TomBoleware
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To be clear, in my first drawing suggestion above I said make EVERYONE a winner.

But anyway, Does Las Vegas, Branson, and places like that ever use discount coupons to sell tickets? Yes they do.
Do they sometimes give away FREE tickets to help fill seats? Of course they do. Do people stop going when they can’t find
a discounted or free ticket? No they don’t.

Tom
A habit is a habit until you realize you doing it, then it is a choice.

The NEW Daycare Magician Book
https://www.amazekids.com/magic-downloads/childrens-magic-ebooks/the-daycare-magician/

www.tomboleware.com
55Hudson
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Doug,

I didn't see it specifically mentioned, but seems you would be focusing on getting kids shows from this type of event. There are a couple of things you could do to get your name out there and collect contact details for potential clients.

I buy pencils with my website on them (Oriental Trading) at a cost, including shipping, of about $0.20 each, and teach the kids a quick penny vanish. (Pencil behind the ear method). I tell the parents that if the email me I will send written instructions for the trick. The parent know they are giving up their contact details in exchange for the instructions. You've also left the kids with your "business card" on something they will hang onto to for at least a little while.

Another idea might be to have a sign up with a show discount. "Provide me with your contact details and I will contact you about your event. You will en entitled to a 10% , 20%, whatever discount ". That way you get their contact details and in exchange they get the discount.

I agree with Danny, you must be clear that you will be contacting them if they provide their contact details. They must see a value in giving up those details - instructions for the penny vanish, discount for a show, or something else of value. I also believe the frequency of contact makes a difference. There are certain retail companies that send me an email every day - I just delete them without even reading them, send them to my spam folder, or unsubscribe. While others, ones that send an email once a month or so, I read them to see what's new.

Hudson
Dannydoyle
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Quote:
On Jun 24, 2018, TomBoleware wrote:
To be clear, in my first drawing suggestion above I said make EVERYONE a winner.

But anyway, Does Las Vegas, Branson, and places like that ever use discount coupons to sell tickets? Yes they do.
Do they sometimes give away FREE tickets to help fill seats? Of course they do. Do people stop going when they can’t find
a discounted or free ticket? No they don’t.

Tom


You are comparing apples and hand grenades as uaual. Doug is not Branson or Las Vegas. He is trying to establish an identity in the market. Most of us get this.

Also the issue with your idea is that you collect identification details under a false premise for the sole purpose of contacting them. This is a bad way to start a relationship.

First off there is the integrity thing, which you have made clear bothers you not. Most it does. But then once people feel scammed they never use you. Also you end up with a dead list of people who want something for free.

Hey if this is your method and it works for you go for it. It just is dishonest and perilous. It is not s methodI would start with.

As Hudson explained it can be done honestly. An exchange, not a con.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
TomBoleware
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Absolutely no false premise at all. Those registering are doing so to win a prize, they ALL win a prize and if they don’t want it then that’s ok, no harm done.

Not really apples and oranges because those attending the shows in Vegas, Etc, are the SAME moms and family members that will be buying the kid/family show.
They understand how discount coupons and sales work. They don’t expect something for free all the time, but they are constantly looking for deals and appreciate
one when they do find it.

Like I said, it’s not for everybody but don’t discount the idea of marketing your business in a different way than others. Just because it may not be for some
doesn’t mean it won’t work. It’s works everyday.

Tom
A habit is a habit until you realize you doing it, then it is a choice.

The NEW Daycare Magician Book
https://www.amazekids.com/magic-downloads/childrens-magic-ebooks/the-daycare-magician/

www.tomboleware.com
TomBoleware
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Quote:
On Jun 24, 2018, 55Hudson wrote:
Doug,

I didn't see it specifically mentioned, but seems you would be focusing on getting kids shows from this type of event. There are a couple of things you could do to get your name out there and collect contact details for potential clients.

I buy pencils with my website on them (Oriental Trading) at a cost, including shipping, of about $0.20 each, and teach the kids a quick penny vanish. (Pencil behind the ear method). I tell the parents that if the email me I will send written instructions for the trick. The parent know they are giving up their contact details in exchange for the instructions. You've also left the kids with your "business card" on something they will hang onto to for at least a little while.

Another idea might be to have a sign up with a show discount. "Provide me with your contact details and I will contact you about your event. You will en entitled to a 10% , 20%, whatever discount ". That way you get their contact details and in exchange they get the discount.

I agree with Danny, you must be clear that you will be contacting them if they provide their contact details. They must see a value in giving up those details - instructions for the penny vanish, discount for a show, or something else of value. I also believe the frequency of contact makes a difference. There are certain retail companies that send me an email every day - I just delete them without even reading them, send them to my spam folder, or unsubscribe. While others, ones that send an email once a month or so, I read them to see what's new.

Hudson


I completely agree the rules of of the drawing should be clear.
Never said they shouldn't be. Danny is the only one saying they would not.

Tom
A habit is a habit until you realize you doing it, then it is a choice.

The NEW Daycare Magician Book
https://www.amazekids.com/magic-downloads/childrens-magic-ebooks/the-daycare-magician/

www.tomboleware.com
Mindpro
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Several great points offered here by Danny, charliecheckers, and Hudson. I couldn't agree more with the email signup scenario charliecheckers presented. This is something I strongly believe and cover in great detail in my own materials, as I could care less what they gurus tell you about how effective this is and the "fantastic" numbers they get when communicating with opt-ins on a regular basis. There isn't a person I can think of (other than perhaps our kids) that I would want to hear from every day. Period! This is abuse and overkill. Regardless of what these gurus tell you, my own research and experience has shown much differently. I know they are saying this because they are in the business of constant selling and because it is automated with autoresponders so they actually have no clue just how overbearing and unwelcome this is or can be. As Hudson said, they simply are just overlooked, deleted or never read. To me, this is far worse than spam. I have never received spam from anyone on a daily basis, (some of these gurus up to 4 times in a single day!)

This is right up these with what Danny speaks of in trying to gain sign-ups or opt-ins under false or shady pretenses. This is almost a type of bait and switch.

As Hudson has said, and I eluded to earlier in my first post, this type of campaign can be done once value is already established and it is a welcome, invited and completely understood exchange between you and the prospect. This is the type of ethical business I believe in, teach and strongly suggest to everyone. This type of business often works against what all of the online gurus will tell you, but it is a time-tested, proven type of business that supersedes trends, technology and continues to produce well and prevail even today, with or without the online world. Several of the methods I share with kids/family performers that have been successful for decades are built on this exact premise.

As Danny put it, although I never thought of it this way, is it really is sort of a con if not executed correctly. I think ethics in business execution is something rarely discussed much around here.
TomBoleware
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Mindpro, what shady pretenses are you talking about. My suggestion to have a drawing?

Who here suggested doing somthing shady?

Let's stop the BS with trying to paint anything I say wrong.

Tom
A habit is a habit until you realize you doing it, then it is a choice.

The NEW Daycare Magician Book
https://www.amazekids.com/magic-downloads/childrens-magic-ebooks/the-daycare-magician/

www.tomboleware.com
Dannydoyle
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YOU suggested doing something shady and you are the only one who doesn't see it. Go figure.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
TomBoleware
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Danny please show me where I posted that about doing something shady.

I am sure I have done more kidshows than you have. I don’t believe you have done any, have you? I have dealt with parents of small children for years;
I understand the thinking when it comes to shopping for their kids. So please let’s stop the BS that I must be some conman or I don’t treat all people
fairly. That I haven’t earned the trust of thousands of kids and parents over the years. Ok?

Tom
A habit is a habit until you realize you doing it, then it is a choice.

The NEW Daycare Magician Book
https://www.amazekids.com/magic-downloads/childrens-magic-ebooks/the-daycare-magician/

www.tomboleware.com
Dannydoyle
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So now suddenly experience matters? You're the guy with almost NONE and always claim having an opinion is all that matters. Now suddenly experience is all that matters. Well you haven't done a professional show in decades ago there is that.

You collect information with a false premise. To win. Winners will be contacted. Then suddenly they won a discount show not a free one. This is SHADY. It is an intentional misrepresentation to get contact details.

Everyone but you sees it.

I have not said it won't work. I have said it is dishonest and a poor way to start a relationship.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
Mindpro
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Quote:
On Jun 24, 2018, TomBoleware wrote:
Mindpro, what shady pretenses are you talking about. My suggestion to have a drawing?

Who here suggested doing somthing shady?

Let's stop the BS with trying to paint anything I say wrong.

Tom



What? Ah, a touch of the old Tricky Business creeping back in. After the recent cleanup and banning of a couple of the main troublemakers and trolls, and the warning to several others, it seems some prefer to bounce back to their old ways. Well, we can exactly by whom and where this started.

I don't know where these accusations have come from, as I clearly addressed exactly the information I was referring to (overbearing and unwelcome communication and email blasting (charliecheckers), and how most view and react to these (Hudson), and shady bait and switch-type business, and the proper exchange of information (Hudson, Danny) vs. false pretences or a shady con as mentioned by Danny) and to whom my post was addressing (and you Tom were not mentioned once). Let's settle down. If anything, in my first post on this thread, I actually said: "My suggestion is to do what Tom mentioned or something similar as a promotion where you are offering reason or incentive for them to provide their information to you."

There is no BS coming from me, but rather straight advice and commentary based on direct experience as being sought. The BS, and even the term seems to be coming specifically from you and once again defending your often counter-point of view and understanding to most others here in this thread (and the always tying it to unrelated businesses and supposed past experience in worlds having nothing to do with entertainment or entertainment business). Then, of course, the go-to, default nonsense of "I am sure I have done more kid shows than you have. I don’t believe you have done any, have you?" That had absolutely nothing to do with the topic, this post or anything stated by anyone. It is a deflective tactic that most used when being called out on their inadequacies or falsities that many seem to resort to in defense, but again, means nothing.

This was a very positive and productive thread until you at this point. Part of helping others is preventing things that could happen, backfire or create opposite results than intended. Many times things appear as one way or as something on the surface, yet when going deeper it is quickly realized that it is actually much different than originally thought or seen. Also, things may not be as they appear which can lead to the participation or acceptance under false pretenses. Couple these with one size never fits all and we have had a very productive discussion. That is what is being discussed here.

Seems you are just continuing old positions and agendas.
TomBoleware
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Mindpro, I said almost the same thing Hudson said about gathering names for a discount show, yet you and Danny attack me for my idea and praise him for his. LOL

But hey boss men, I understand your agenda here, so carry on.

Tom
A habit is a habit until you realize you doing it, then it is a choice.

The NEW Daycare Magician Book
https://www.amazekids.com/magic-downloads/childrens-magic-ebooks/the-daycare-magician/

www.tomboleware.com
Dannydoyle
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You said almost the same thing, with a touch of dishonesty. Which is what Hudson himself objected to as well as Charlie. So it is not just us Tom. Apparently many disapprove of it.

But don't ruin another thread PLEASE.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
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