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Mr Salk Special user Tied to 568 Posts 
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On Oct 27, 2018, Dannydoyle wrote: Nobody would argue that a single minimum-wage should pay for housing in Manhattan or Seattle or LA. But two people making 60k together can lead lives of quiet-desperation within commuting distance of any city in America. Surely businesses must be held to SOME minimum to prevent exploitation. The free-market has never been the friend of the unskilled and indigent.
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Dannydoyle Eternal Order 21263 Posts
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But that standard simply can not be based on workers need alone.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus <BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell |
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Mr Salk Special user Tied to 568 Posts
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On Oct 30, 2018, Dannydoyle wrote: What standards should wages be based on? The business-ideal is bare minimum.
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Dannydoyle Eternal Order 21263 Posts
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It absolutely must be based on what value a particular task has to the company.
Oh and the idea that a minimum wage job is intended to support a family is simply wrong. They have never been intended as such. So it is a mute point and silly to argue. Individual businesses are not responsible for individual living situations. They do not exist to provide jobs and health insurance. To force this upon them is counter to our founding. That being said individual business should (notice the qualifier.) not exist to exploit workers. This is where government has a roll to step in and level the playing field for the individual. But the idea that somehow everyone "deserves" a living wage completely independent of qualifications is simply unsustainable. I would like to all talk about the same thing and not just platitudes and sound bites. Of course the business ideal is bare minimum. So what? Never happens. This is why people rise above minimum wage jobs. Should a minimum wage job provide flat screens and cell phones in the life style? Should it have to provide for children and cigarettes and drinking and drugs? What diet are people on in this fictitious lifestyle? See the problem with things based on need alone?
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus <BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell |
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S2000magician Inner circle Yorba Linda, CA 3465 Posts
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Out of curiosity, how many here have had a class in basic economics?
How many actually understand basic economics? How many could draw a supply curve? A demand curve? How many could identify the equilibrium wage? The equilibrium level of employment? How many could identify the dead weight loss given a minimum wage that exceeds the equilibrium wage? If you can't answer "Yes." to all of these, I humbly suggest that you shouldn't be contributing to this discussion, because you're out of your depth. |
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Dannydoyle Eternal Order 21263 Posts
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I can do all of that and a Laffer Curve and may STILL be out of my depth!
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus <BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell |
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Mr Salk Special user Tied to 568 Posts
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Quote:
On Oct 30, 2018, S2000magician wrote: Humanity doesn't not require depth of specialized knowledge. Tell the haggard harassed waitresses in southern diners that their $2.13 hr wage is reasonable because Economics. They don't understand because they are "out of their depth". I don't hear anyone arguing that a single minimum-wage job should afford luxuries, but there is clearly a base-survival rate. It may not be $15 but it surely isn't $2.13.
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Dannydoyle Eternal Order 21263 Posts
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What is a base survival rate to include then?
$2.13 is a disingenuous figure and you know it. That is with tips.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus <BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell |
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Senor Fabuloso Inner circle 1243 Posts
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On Oct 30, 2018, Dannydoyle wrote: I think your countries welfare system, would provide you with that information.
No matter how many times you say the wrong thing, it will NEVER be right.
If I'm not responding to you? It's because you're a TROLL! |
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Dannydoyle Eternal Order 21263 Posts
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Nope not at all. I am asking an individual question to a person. I am not asking about government programs.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus <BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell |
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Senor Fabuloso Inner circle 1243 Posts
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On Oct 30, 2018, Dannydoyle wrote: The above is what you asked. Your goverment sets a minimum standard of living with it's social programs. Poverty lines and such are figured through algorithms and standards unfamiliar to me but most certainty can be found on those goverment websites. That would be the survival rate you asked for.
No matter how many times you say the wrong thing, it will NEVER be right.
If I'm not responding to you? It's because you're a TROLL! |
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Dannydoyle Eternal Order 21263 Posts
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Again I asked for his opinion, but government statistics.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus <BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell |
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TomBoleware Inner circle Hattiesburg, Ms 3174 Posts
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It’s my understanding that nobody actually gets paid $2.13 per hour. That figure is a base pay rate plus tips. At the end of the week IF the tips don’t bring the $2.13 up
to normal minimum wage they must be paid the difference by the employer. Minimum wage is a federal law and nobody can be paid less regardless. I always found the problem with minimum wage raises weren’t in paying the new hire, but was in having to then raise the whole company pay scale for everybody else too. A wage increase doesn’t just cover the new people, and it can be very costly for a small business. Tom
The Daycare Magician Book
https://www.vanishingincmagic.com/amazekids/the-daycare-magician/ My Blog - https://boleware.blogspot.com/ |
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Senor Fabuloso Inner circle 1243 Posts
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On Oct 30, 2018, TomBoleware wrote: Actually your country does have exceptions to the minimum wage laws.
No matter how many times you say the wrong thing, it will NEVER be right.
If I'm not responding to you? It's because you're a TROLL! |
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TomBoleware Inner circle Hattiesburg, Ms 3174 Posts
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On Oct 30, 2018, Senor Fabuloso wrote: That's mainly for school students, not for waitresses and such. Tom
The Daycare Magician Book
https://www.vanishingincmagic.com/amazekids/the-daycare-magician/ My Blog - https://boleware.blogspot.com/ |
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Dannydoyle Eternal Order 21263 Posts
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Https://www.cga.ct.gov/2003/olrdata/lab/rpt/2003-R-0390.htm
There they agree. The exceptions to minimum wage. Changes nothing in the discussion.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus <BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell |
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Mr Salk Special user Tied to 568 Posts
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On Oct 30, 2018, Dannydoyle wrote: I'll get back to base-survival. Businesses push their wait-staff to earn as much in tips as possible, or at least enough to surpass federal-minimums so they don't have to pitch in. They don't have to match the state-minimum in most states. Restaurant ethics are probably better suited in a separate thread. I consider base-survival to be modest food, clothing and livable shared housing. The federal minimum doesn't meet this standard in several states.
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Senor Fabuloso Inner circle 1243 Posts
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Quote:
On Oct 30, 2018, TomBoleware wrote: Quote:
On Oct 30, 2018, Dannydoyle wrote: Actually it changes Tom's statement from true, to false.
No matter how many times you say the wrong thing, it will NEVER be right.
If I'm not responding to you? It's because you're a TROLL! |
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Jonathan Townsend Eternal Order Ossining, NY 27300 Posts
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Quote:
On Oct 30, 2018, Mr Salk wrote: From elsewhere: Quote: Justifying his long-secret subsidizing of Hogan's lawsuit against Gawker, Thiel yesterday made the multi-millionaire wrestler sound like Tom Joad in “The Grapes of Wrath”—a person impotent to take on powerful forces. He spoke at the National Press Club in Washington, coming off as an anti-media shiv in a velvet glove. He sounded alternately understated, civil, deeply ideological and vengeful. “One of the striking things is if you are middle class, upper middle class, a single-digit millionaire like Hulk Hogan, you have no effective access to our legal system. It costs too much.”
...to all the coins I've dropped here
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TomBoleware Inner circle Hattiesburg, Ms 3174 Posts
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On Oct 30, 2018, Senor Fabuloso wrote: I was responding to his comment about waitress pay, but he is right there are a few exceptions, a very few. Trust me, I know a little about min wage pay. A few years ago back when I owned my daycare center I got audited by the Federal Wage and Hour Department. I had 18 employees and we had to go back and pull all the time cards for the past two years. Every minute was analyzed. Wow, you talking about some picky rules and regulations.  We came out ok but it was a headache.
Tom
The Daycare Magician Book
https://www.vanishingincmagic.com/amazekids/the-daycare-magician/ My Blog - https://boleware.blogspot.com/ |
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Posted: Oct 29, 2018 09:12 pm 
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