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Topic: Bill in Kiwi DVD by Cloutier
Message: Posted by: Devilix (Apr 21, 2005 09:53AM)
Anyone have seen this new DVD by Carl Cloutier offered by Penguin. What do you guys think about it? What is the difficulty level of this effect?

Message: Posted by: Werner G. Seitz (Apr 21, 2005 11:22AM)
Very difficult..pls. don't do it!
Message: Posted by: Devilix (Apr 21, 2005 03:47PM)
Someone can be a little more specific?

Message: Posted by: Doomo (Apr 21, 2005 10:26PM)
Well, it is certainly an amazing effect! It would be hard to top it!
Message: Posted by: magicinsight (Apr 22, 2005 10:21AM)
How is Mr. Cloutier's version or routine different than the Bill in Kiwi done by Martin Sanderson on his Corporate DVD?

Best regards,

Message: Posted by: Bosko (Apr 22, 2005 10:54AM)
I don´t know nothing about this DVD, but there is a nice version of "Bill in Limon" in Flickfinger´s "The Movie" DVD! My strongest recomendations for it!!!

Here is a link to "Bill in Kiwi":
Message: Posted by: asdfgh (Apr 22, 2005 01:39PM)
I do billoon and the reactions are great. I probably won't change my routine. Looks cool though.
Message: Posted by: JeremiahZuo (Apr 22, 2005 04:12PM)
Bosko are you referring to Manuel Muerte's Dvd? I don't believe there was a bill in lemon effect on "The Movie"
Message: Posted by: korttihai_82 (Apr 22, 2005 05:53PM)
Cloutiers method is explained in his old tapes. Why bother paying penguin for something that has been on marked for years and years. It is at least in his international magic lecture tape.

I used Cloutiers routine for years and it is very very good. The difficulty depends on the method you wanna use. The dirty work could be done in many different ways and some of them are easy, some of them are more difficult. Cloutier performed this at World Greatest magic 4 tv special.
Message: Posted by: niva (Apr 23, 2005 03:51PM)
[quote]Cloutiers method is explained in his old tapes. Why bother paying penguin for something that has been on marked for years and years. It is at least in his international magic lecture tape. [/quote]

Because it's now on DVD?????
Message: Posted by: korttihai_82 (Apr 23, 2005 08:14PM)
As are other his tapes
Message: Posted by: niva (Apr 24, 2005 02:31AM)
And the Kiwi as well??
Message: Posted by: fasr eddie (Apr 28, 2005 07:02PM)
MAGICINSIGHT when I asked Sanderson THE SAME QUESTION AT bLACKPOOL THE ANSWER WAS "I HAVE FOUND A WAY TO KEEP BILL DRY"I was so amazed I had to wipe my chin with a piece of kitchen roll.
Message: Posted by: evolve629 (Apr 28, 2005 07:45PM)
Well, it's more like the bill is moist not dry... Well, Martin Sanderson sure came up with a way to keep the signed bill slightly dry so as to not upset his cooperate clients (I'm not trying to be scaristic) with a wet bill as we all don't like it. It's all in the prepartion and I have to say I like the way Martin performs this Bill In Kiwi trick. It's simple and bold at the same time. However, sleight of hands knowledge is essential in this performance. I give Martin a 9 out of 10 in his version of Bill In Kiwi. I still think it's a rather bold move and it's a risk. But with practice, it can be done to truly baffled your audiences without sleeving or topit.
Message: Posted by: niva (Apr 29, 2005 02:27AM)
Hi everyone.

I got a chance to watch this 2 DVD set. So that no one gets disappointed, let me say from the start that there aren't any new ground-breaking methods here. I method that has been used before with other fruit, but this time it is used witha Kiwi.

I think the strengthsof the routine are:

- First it's simple to prepare and to l**d. I thought there was going to be a lot of preparation, but there is not. Mr Cloutier kept it simple and it works.

- Secondly, it uses a Kiwi. I sometimes feel the bill in lemon is so popular among magicians that some spectators might imagine what is going to happen from the beginning, thus ruining the surprise. (Remember John in Bill Malone's DVD??) A kiwi is something different.

- Finally, the kiwi is handed out to the spectator before the bill is even handed to the magician.

I liked the Bill in Kiwi. It's practical even for walkaround, just as Mr Cloutier has used it over the years.

The second DVD contains some other great material. It's apparent that Mr Cloutier likes the transportation of objects to other locations, because he has a lot of them on the second DVD. My favourites are the Slim Fast routine and the Dream Tear. In Slim Fast a card/s appears inside a Slimfast can. So easy and so fast. I never saw this coming, because of the way Mr Cloutier uses it in a routine. Dream Tear is a torn and restored page from a magazine, where upon restoration, the last piece is missing and is found in an envelope that has been with a spectator from the beginning of the show.

For those that do not know Carl Cloutier, he is an expert Topiter and Sleever. One of the best. He uses these techniques in all of his routines, although in some of them, like the Bill in Kiwi, it's not necessary.

I liked this DVD set. The production is great, and everything is thoroughly explained. Ther are also instructions in French on the DVD. This is a great thing for people that have a hard time learning in English and something that is not seen in every DVD that comes out. Overall I would give this set 9/10. It's full of practical and hard hitting magic.

Hope this helps.
Message: Posted by: millarhouse (Apr 29, 2005 05:24AM)
Thanks for review Ivan.
I have always loved Carl's Bill in Kiwi routine, and have just ordered this DVD set.
By the way this set can be also ordered at http://themagicwarehouse.com , and is $19.95 cheaper than Penguin.
Message: Posted by: evolve629 (Apr 30, 2005 10:12AM)
Thanks niva for the nice review. I was thinking of getting this dvd, and now I really have to get it. Even though I don't use topit and sleeving method in my performance, I think it'd still be an worthwhile endeavor to watch one of the best expert Topiter and Sleever in action. It's my own bias, but I think a lot of magic is designed with a man's outfit in mind - such as a jakcet with inner pocket and big pockets on outside the jacket. I'm thinking if I really like Carl's method, I'm going to have seriously having my jacket professionally alter by a tailor :)
Message: Posted by: niva (Apr 30, 2005 05:08PM)
Yeah you are right. But sleeving should be no problem.
Message: Posted by: Jeremy L. (May 6, 2005 09:54PM)
On 2005-04-29 06:24, millarhouse wrote:
Thanks for review Ivan.
I have always loved Carl's Bill in Kiwi routine, and have just ordered this DVD set.
By the way this set can be also ordered at http://themagicwarehouse.com , and is $19.95 cheaper than Penguin.


[url=http://www.madhattermagicshop.com]Madhatter Magic Shop[/url]has it for only $20.92 [url=http://www.madhattermagicshop.com/magicshop/product_info.php?products_id=2634&osCsid=78247f3eb217030cbac9709554440fb5]Here[/url]! Not $20.95 cheaper just $20.95.

How is this one diffrent from the Bill in Kiwi on Corporate Close-Up?
Message: Posted by: Hart Keene (May 8, 2005 09:14PM)
Is this on one of his original tapes put out by A-1 on topiting and sleeving?
Message: Posted by: froggyman (May 11, 2005 12:06PM)
Got it, Love it! High recomend it.
Message: Posted by: millarhouse (May 12, 2005 04:23AM)
I really enjoyed all of Carl's routines on this DVD.
His explanations of his routines are generally very good.
I was hoping for more information on his Topit device, in fact you only see his device briefly during one of his explanations. So it is certainly not a definitive topit resource, although loadings for both the topit and sleeving are well explained.

I have two gripes
1. The Dream Tear explanation is missing the set up instructions for the illusion that the envelope is empty.
2. The card to sock gimmick is not shown. Carl briefly explains the principle but does not go into any technical detail. I would be interested to know if this is explained on any on his earlier DVD's/Videos.

One of my favourites is the "Pepper routine", in which a signed silk is found inside a pepper. What makes this routine great is that the spectator opens the pepper with a knife in his or her own hands to reveal that there is a silk inside the pepper.

Overall an excellent DVD, which highlights why Carl Cloutier is a multi award winner.

PS. Thanks to Jeremy for putting my on to Madhatter Magic Shop
Message: Posted by: Glenn Godsey (May 16, 2005 11:50PM)
I am a big fan of Cloutier's magic, but I was not aware that he is such a humorous performer until I saw the real show for a real audience on CD #2. He is a very funny, as well as a very skilled, magician.

Best regards,
Glenn Godsey
Message: Posted by: icentertainment (May 17, 2005 08:54AM)

Do you really need a DVD to do the bill to kiwi???

Oh my -just buy a kiwi and look inside it to see how you could easily set it up
Message: Posted by: froggyman (May 17, 2005 10:08AM)
It is not only the bill in the kiwi, but the handling and set up. Cloutier is very clear and explaines all the subities. Also the 2 nd DVD is an added bouns.
Message: Posted by: icentertainment (May 17, 2005 01:11PM)
In which a signed silk is found inside a pepper. What makes this routine great is that the spectator opens the pepper with a knife in his or her own hands to reveal that

What???? A signed silk?

where would you perform this miracle??
Message: Posted by: icentertainment (May 17, 2005 01:17PM)
Niva quote

I liked the Bill in Kiwi. It's practical even for walkaround,

what kind of walkaround

I realise my posts are negative but seriously- what kind of performer carries 6 kiwis around with him.

It is not practicle at all.
and the signed silk in pepper- where would you perform this. and how much does it cost to keep buying silks- or does he wash the ink out every performance.

Practicle you say- I say you are inexperienced and don't know what you are saying.
Message: Posted by: millarhouse (May 17, 2005 03:37PM)
Hi Ice
Have you seen the DVD ? Have you seen any of Carl Cloutier's performances ?

"Pepper in Silk" - It is hard to expand on what I have already said without giving away the routine. To the spectators, when an audience member opens the pepper with a knife in their own hands to show that there is a silk inside the pepper, it is revealed to be the signed silk. The cost of buying cheap silks is nothing compared to the reactions this trick will produce. IMHO this trick has no limitations on where it can be performed.

This DVD contains more than just the Bill in the Kiwi, the following routines are also included.

-Sports Ball Routine
A plain ball, a soccer ball, a golf ball and a mini basketball transpose between each other in a great routine.

-Bounce No Bounce
A bouncy ball fails to bounce for the spectator.

Four signed cards to different pockets (including card to sock)

-Slimfast Routine
Signed card(s) appears in sealed can.

-Pepper Routine
Signed silk appears in the middle of a pepper.

- Magazine Routine
Carl's Dream Tear explanation. A page is torn from a magazine, ripped into four pieces then restored.

- Cards Across
Cards move between two spectators.

- Liquid Asset
A signed glass with liquid in it disappears from Carl’s hands, then reappears in Carl’s pocket.

- Coin Trick
A coin routine ending in the production of jumbo coins.

Message: Posted by: icentertainment (May 18, 2005 12:46AM)
I have seen his performance on )worlds greatest magicians)

The bill in kiwi

4 cards to pocket and sock

You still don't get it

Where is it practicle- where are you going to perform it professionally

In the video does he perform with out a table ever.

Your in Newzealand- If you do these routines over there then look out for me
because I am going to be stealing your business- I'll get around to many more people without the reset and more people will be entertained.
I won't spend my time going back to the room to get more kiwis, I won't walk with a limp (sock)
and the audiences are going to die laughing and feeling amazed. and your going to be in the back room loading up those kiwis, getting more silks.

but but but this happens and the card appears in the can and then silk in pepper and whatever- it's not practicle

Good luck to you
David Welzman
Message: Posted by: niva (May 18, 2005 01:37AM)
I take a large bag or suitcase with me when I do table hopping and leave it behind the bar etc and carry only the essential things. One kiwi is enough. A normal jacket usually has about four pockets in all. Don't tell me a kiwi does not fit in one of them, or I will start banging my head on the screen.

I may be inexperienced, but Carl surely knows what he is talking about when he says he has used it for walk around.

The silk trick should be done for secial occasions only. It would not be worth it to do it every night.

I have a simple advise for you, if from the demo and reviews you don't like it, don't buy it. It's your money. See you.
Message: Posted by: millarhouse (May 18, 2005 03:53AM)
Hi Ivan, good advice to icentertainment. (Perhaps he does not get it)

Carls entire performance on the DVD is done with him standing directly in front of an audience, freely moving about. It was certainly practical for Carl's performance.

Message: Posted by: icentertainment (May 18, 2005 04:56AM)
More business to me
Message: Posted by: Majestic12 (May 18, 2005 07:58AM)
Hey ice,

Not everything has to be "practical" for it to be a great piece of magic. It is very possible to perform it in walkaround and strolling situations. I am not saying this would be done at every table, you just need to use common sense when performing a routine like this.

Sometimes I take 1 or 2 routines that I know I will only be able to do once during the night because they will take to long to reset, but it really spices up a group when you need that "big" finish.
Message: Posted by: Majestic12 (May 18, 2005 08:01AM)
On 2005-05-17 14:17, icentertainment wrote:

It is not practicle at all.
and the signed silk in pepper- where would you perform this. and how much does it cost to keep buying silks- or does he wash the ink out every performance.

Practicle you say- I say you are inexperienced and don't know what you are saying.

If you are performing professionally and regularly the cost for silks should not even be an issue. They are inexpensive and as someone has already said before the effect on your audience is well worth the small expense of a tiny silk handkerchief.
Message: Posted by: Majestic12 (May 18, 2005 11:11AM)
Did I forget to mention the silks and all the other props are business expenses? lol
Message: Posted by: icentertainment (May 18, 2005 03:53PM)
Yes it is a great piece of magic

but whoever originally wrote that it was practicle.

which is what I was refering to.

I guess it depends on what type of silks you use. I buy expensive silks so it would cost me more-it's all image.
Message: Posted by: montz (May 19, 2005 04:16AM)
Getting back on track, I bought this a couple of days ago simply because I'd heard Carl Cloutier's name but never seen any of his work. I've watched the second disc, and there's some seriously good stuff. He's obviously a very intelligent magician with some very usable and strong material. Well worth the money, pick it up.

Message: Posted by: icentertainment (May 19, 2005 07:54AM)
I agree -Carl Cloutier is a super good magician

(Just thought I'd get the last word)
Message: Posted by: ruijorge (May 19, 2005 08:38AM)
To me he is the best. No words to describe him.
Anyone knows if he has a website?
Message: Posted by: niva (May 20, 2005 02:32AM)
I would really like him to release that gimmick to get the card in the sock. So Coooool!!
Message: Posted by: Larry Davidson (May 20, 2005 08:30AM)
The card in sock gimmick was released quite some time ago and is still available.
Message: Posted by: froggyman (May 20, 2005 09:34AM)
Anyone know how to get in touch with him for lectures etc...?
Message: Posted by: Alym Amlani (May 21, 2005 03:26AM)
I would also like to know what the gimmick was for the envelope routine...
And if anyone has a link for the card in the sock gimmick please let me know!

Overall I liked the dvd set but although Carl is an excellent magician, his teaching leaves a LOT to be desired - ie you had better be proficient at sleeving and topitting already before owning this DVD or you won't be able to perform many of the routines...
Message: Posted by: Larry Davidson (May 21, 2005 05:49AM)
"Card in Sock" [url=http://www.stevensmagic.com/shopping/shopexd.asp?id=908]link[/url].
Message: Posted by: SteeleFusion (Jun 6, 2005 09:28AM)
I would agree that I found it difficult to understand some of the instructions due to the fact English is not his first language, and he tends to miss a few steps, or assumes you can do all the moves.

Message: Posted by: Werner G. Seitz (Jun 6, 2005 09:43AM)
Carl Cloutier is a GREAT performer, also and especially re the *Bill in Kiwi*.

His 'instructions' though are adequate for all who have a deeper understanding for magic, but still ppl not having studied so many fascets in magic, could use a better explanation.
Here I really can recommend the Martin Sanderson DVD, because Martin does cover some other points especially re preparing and cutting the kiwi.
For pure and good instructions get the Martin Sanderson DVD.

However, the Murphy produced *Bill in Kiwi* re Carl Cloutiers work also gives a lot of very fine and interesting routines apart from his signature piece..so unfortunately one should also get this 2 part DVD set..it is fun and a pleasure to se him work for normal ppl, he's actually a very good entertainer apart from the fine sleight of hand stuff he does..
I can highly recommend this 2 DVD set too.
[b]BUT, watch out and don't order from Penguin![/b]
Do a google search for:
Carl Cloutier Bill in Kiwi
and find much cheaper sources, you almost there can get this 2 DVD-set for half the price and with a much better service and delivery time..

I ordered only once, a single time, from Penguin and I wil NEVER do it again..spare me for the details, but there really IS a reason for I don't order anything from them again..
Message: Posted by: froggyman (Jun 6, 2005 10:18AM)
Great routine! Great DVD!
Message: Posted by: cashy001 (Jun 10, 2005 04:16PM)
I just got this dvd and can only say its one of the best buys I have found on ebay only £10 for 2 dvds
Message: Posted by: Nat (Jul 12, 2005 07:31AM)
Which dealer has the best price on the Cloutier DVDs? Thanks.