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Topic: Greatest effect with a memorized deck
Message: Posted by: todsky (May 12, 2005 09:43AM)
Please submit what you think is the greatest effect with a memorized deck, and why. I don't use a memorized deck, but if someone can convince me that a memorized deck can do something amazing that can't be done with a regularly-ordered deck, I will add this subterfuge to my repertoire.
Message: Posted by: Kjellstrom (May 12, 2005 09:59AM)
Make any named card jump directly to the top of the deck...
Looks like real magic, believe me :)
This is a reputation maker effect.
Message: Posted by: jcards01 (May 12, 2005 10:00AM)
Go spend 1 hour with Simon Aronson!
Message: Posted by: BarryFernelius (May 12, 2005 10:26AM)
Todsky,

I sent you a PM on this topic. Please read it.

-Barry
Message: Posted by: LobowolfXXX (May 12, 2005 11:29AM)
I'm kinda partial to Simon Aronson's "Everybody's Lazy." Michael Close's impromptu, examinable, ungaffed invisible deck is rather impresssive, too.
Message: Posted by: Magic Sam (May 12, 2005 11:53AM)
There are so many killer effects that can be done with a memorized stack (five-ten cards), so to me a memorized deck just seems like an unnecessary liability. What happens when the cards fall, or your false shuffle moves one card to the wrong position, or any number of things? Granted, there are plenty of good pros who use the memorized deck, but I can't think of anything that can't be done with a normal deck and a bit of off-beat culling.
Message: Posted by: Alewishus (May 12, 2005 12:02PM)
Twice as hard. Aronson.
A.
Message: Posted by: kerpa (May 12, 2005 12:32PM)
I'm a humble hobbyist, but I just love the Aronson stack.
For example, I like using the Aronson stack to stay one ahead for any pick a card effect. So, while everyone is looking at the chosen card, I glimpse the card just under (after controlling it). Then, if for any reason my control to the top or revelation of the chosen card fails, then I can "mind read" going through all the cards to find the card.
That's just for starters. Michael Close has some brilliant stuff, including his recent CD product, Closely Guarded Secrets (I think it's the "Luckiest Cards in Las Vegas") and also on one of his Workers videos/DVDs how to do an Invisible Deck and pass out the deck for inspection afterwards.
I could go on and on and on. Aronson's books are a great source. There are 3 poker/dealer stunts in a row built into the entire 52 cards, each one great. You can spell a card with positions 10 through 15 (I think).
I attended a fabulous Michael Close lecture in the Chicago area recently, and at my request, he demonstrated "jazzing" (which he refers to but does not describe in the CGS CD) with the Aronson stack - which consisted of rapid fire revelations of randomly thought of cards by 5 or 6 audience members. You can't do that without a memorized stack.
Learn it! It's really great.
kerpa
a/k/a Michael Miller
Chicago area
Message: Posted by: Scott Cram (May 12, 2005 12:40PM)
If you really want to see what the possibilities are with memory and cards, check out [url=http://headinside.blogspot.com/2005/04/memory-effects-galore.html]my regularly updated list of memory-related effects[/url].

Whether it convinces you to add the memorized deck to your arsenal is up to you, but it will give you plenty of food for thought.
Message: Posted by: jcigam (May 12, 2005 12:48PM)
I am a big advocate of Luckiest Cards in Las Vegas (Michael Close) and Method to/in Our Madness (MM) (Simon Aronson). I believe MM is probably one of the best effects to perform for your Magic Club; don't get me wrong, this is extremely strong for an intelligent group of spectators as well.

Sincerely,

Jered
Message: Posted by: Jay Elf (May 12, 2005 01:17PM)
Hello,

THE MENTAL TRIUMPH.

The first advantage:This leaps from a pick-a-card trick to a think-of-any-card effect.
The second advantage:This preserves a whole stack.
The third advantage:You don't have to do any false shuffle before or after this effect. The built-in sequential shuffles do all for you.

Thanks go to Dai Vernon, a father of the original Triumph.
Message: Posted by: Tim Sutton (May 12, 2005 02:07PM)
[quote]
On 2005-05-12 12:53, Magic Sam wrote:
There are so many killer effects that can be done with a memorized stack (five-ten cards), so to me a memorized deck just seems like an unnecessary liability. What happens when the cards fall, or your false shuffle moves one card to the wrong position, or any number of things? Granted, there are plenty of good pros who use the memorized deck, but I can't think of anything that can't be done with a normal deck and a bit of off-beat culling.
[/quote]

There are thousands of things that can't be done with a normal deck etc!
I started by using the Osterlind stack (a good intermediate step) but was subsequently convinced by a description in Steven Youell's manuscript to learn an entire stack. I'd say it's the single most exciting thing to happen to my magical life in the past year. Using the mem stack, I've developed an effect which I think is the best thing I've ever come up with. As to what happens when the cards fall, or your false shuffle fails, I would have to say, don't let your cards fall, or your shuffle fail. Or don't do magic with any element of risk. Or excitement. Hmm..
To put the above in a more positive light, use your quest to memorise a deck (it took me a couple of days of semi-intense work) as a reason to practise your shuffling, and your false shuffling. After all, if you were going to perform Sam the Bellhop, the same would apply. A memorised deck gives you a whole routine!

Good luck

Tim
Message: Posted by: landmark (May 12, 2005 05:50PM)
My favorite mem deck routines from Simon Aronson:

Past, Present, Future

Everybody's Lazy

The Invisible Card

Histed Heisted


Jack Shalom
Message: Posted by: LobowolfXXX (May 12, 2005 07:53PM)
Let's see...a spectator cuts off a packet of cards, looks at the card he cut to, shuffles up the packet and covers it with the rest of the deck. A second spectator does the same thing. A third spectator cuts to a card and hands it to you. You give him the card back, he puts it on top of this third stack of cards that has been cut off, and he covers that with the deck, too. You name a number, the first spectator names a card, and deals down to your number...whereupon he finds his card. You name another number, the second spectator names HIS card, and deals down to your number...finding HIS card. The third spectator names a number and you name YOUR card...he deals down to HIS number and finds your card. The deck has been cut three times by the spectators and the first two times a card was cut to, the packet was shuffled. You've never touched the deck. The only single card you've cut to is the one the spectator handed you. If you can do that with a normal deck and a bit of off-beat culling, more power to you.
Oh, and as for myself, the "unnecessary liability" never leaves me in any sort of worse position than anyone who doesn't use a stack - I just go into a non-memdeck effect.


[quote]
On 2005-05-12 12:53, Magic Sam wrote:
There are so many killer effects that can be done with a memorized stack (five-ten cards), so to me a memorized deck just seems like an unnecessary liability. What happens when the cards fall, or your false shuffle moves one card to the wrong position, or any number of things? Granted, there are plenty of good pros who use the memorized deck, but I can't think of anything that can't be done with a normal deck and a bit of off-beat culling.
[/quote]
Message: Posted by: todsky (May 12, 2005 08:12PM)
Several convincing reasons to memorize a deck, it seems. I think I 'm going to have to join the club. My next step will be to look into the material of Aronson and Close. (I'm surprised no one mentioned Tamariz.)
Thanks all!
Message: Posted by: Gianni (May 12, 2005 10:38PM)
[quote]
On 2005-05-12 12:29, LobowolfXXX wrote:
...Michael Close's impromptu, examinable, ungaffed invisible deck is rather impresssive, too.
[/quote]

I just saw this performed tonight, and it was impressive. The performer referenced one of the workers books, but it wasn't clear. So the question is, where can this be found?

Gianni
Message: Posted by: 10cardsdown (May 13, 2005 05:52AM)
In my opinion, the "GREATEST" effect is the Any Card, Any Number. With the proper framework and presentation, it's a stunner. I get about 8 minutes out of this and use it as a closer in my stand up routine. I can't top it and it leaves the spectators stymied. :wavey:
Message: Posted by: T. Joseph O'Malley (May 13, 2005 06:19AM)
[quote]
On 2005-05-12 23:38, Gianni wrote:
[quote]
On 2005-05-12 12:29, LobowolfXXX wrote:
...Michael Close's impromptu, examinable, ungaffed invisible deck is rather impresssive, too.
[/quote]

I just saw this performed tonight, and it was impressive. The performer referenced one of the workers books, but it wasn't clear. So the question is, where can this be found?

Gianni
[/quote]

It's in Workers 5. You can by all the Workers books as e-books from his site, on disc. Don't know if he still sells "hard" copies.

I'm going to his workshop tonight in Toronto. Should be great.
Message: Posted by: Sean (May 13, 2005 10:51AM)
In Aronson's "Try the Impossible" there's another Invisible Deck variation that's not as knuckle busting as Close's version. It's also a great starter effect for mem-deck work since you get to go through the deck looking for the "invisible" card.
Message: Posted by: Mesquita (May 13, 2005 12:12PM)
My vote goes to The Luckiest Cards in Las Vegas and Mnemocosis.

All the best,

:bluebikes: Mesquita :bluebikes:
Message: Posted by: NoahJLevine (May 13, 2005 04:00PM)
I don't understand why people are willing to give this to you on a silver platter. I think that you should read mnemonica or Workers 5. If this inspires you then start doing memorized deck work. Otherwise it should be left to the dedicated. I'm not one of these elitists who thinks you shouldn't get any help. I would much rather see a post like " I'm thinking about learning a memorized stack, what books would you reccomend I look at to decide if this is worth my time".
Message: Posted by: todsky (May 13, 2005 04:52PM)
Noah, I'm sorry, but you ARE sounding like 'one of these elitists." I've been performing professionally for over 20 years, and I do over 200 shows each year, so don't treat me like a dilettante. And thank-you for your book recommendations.
Message: Posted by: acehigher (May 13, 2005 08:53PM)
Imagine:

You hand a bunch of cards to each spectator up to maybe 10 people. They look at the cards and choose one, shuffle, a spectator collects the cards, shuffles and hand them back to you. You go though the deck reading the cards out 10 at a time, after each ten the spectaors who heard they're card named say, "i heard my card" you look back though the ten cards and name the card they were thinking of, this is repeated with all the spec's the last one is handed and envelope with a prediction inside, it's they're card.

Histed Heisted Aronson

What more could you want from a mentalist effect with cards,m and to top it all off this isn't even very hard to do.
Message: Posted by: todsky (May 14, 2005 03:23AM)
Acehigher, that's a very strong effect! Another good argument for studying Aronson's work! I am going to be very busy...
Message: Posted by: BMWGuy (May 14, 2005 09:47AM)
My vote goes for The Mnemonica stack.
I personally like Mnemocosis.
Do yourself a favor and memorize either the Aronson Stack, or Tamariz stack, it will change the way you do magic.

believe me

aleks
Message: Posted by: Kjellstrom (Jun 10, 2006 12:35AM)
I can recommend Simon Aronsons new DVD full with effects with a memo stack:

http://www.llpub.com/zenshop/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=2317&zenid=c6bdd8837f7dfd99e4ab5b79353423af
Message: Posted by: todsky (Jun 10, 2006 07:23AM)
Mats, thanks for renewing this thread. Ironically, I forgot all about my desire to memorize a deck this past year!
Message: Posted by: spycrapper (Jun 10, 2006 07:25AM)
Sure his new DVD is great! he teaches the basics of memorized deck
Message: Posted by: wsduncan (Jun 10, 2006 01:24PM)
Simon's Invisible Card handling with the mem deck (vs. his "take a card" version) is very impressive.

It can look exactly like the standard invisible deck effect and requires almost zero slight of hand.

I like it BETTER than the normal invisible deck routine because you get two effects. The thought of card vanishes from the pack and then it appears magically.

Youl could have the appear pretty much anyway you choose too. David Acer has a nice move called the Card Popout that could be used like this:

Have the named "invisible card" taken out of the pack and place face up on the table. Then show it has vanished from the pack.

Then visibly reach down and pick it off of the table, where it appears at yoru fingertips...
Message: Posted by: Scott Kahn (Jun 10, 2006 02:32PM)
Alain Nu's Any Card At Any Number effect, "Romeo & Juliette."
Message: Posted by: Mago Gregorio (Jun 10, 2006 05:44PM)
Control in chaos (Mnemonica) is a Shufflebored version but includes the revelation of each cards face up, once the packets have been shuffled several times by spectators.

This only trick worth the effort of memorizing a deck.
Message: Posted by: Sybilmagic (Jun 11, 2006 08:27AM)
Darwin Ortiz has some very good work in Scams and Fantasies. One imparticular is Zen master. It really builds up into a three phase killer.
Message: Posted by: Larry Davidson (Jun 11, 2006 09:28AM)
Although it's difficult to offer an unbiased opinion given that I've created a number of memorized deck routines myself, [i]808[/i] is my absolute favorite and one that I envision will [b]always[/b] be part of my working repertoire.
Message: Posted by: Mago Gregorio (Jun 11, 2006 12:05PM)
Larry

Where could we insights / buy the 808 trick ?

Can't find it on the Quicksearch option, and looking for 808+Davidson on Google I only can get the call center of Harley Davidson !
Message: Posted by: TheAmbitiousCard (Jun 11, 2006 12:30PM)
The 808 trick is on his DVDs
http://www.theambitiouscard.com/mSearchResults.cfm?criteria=scripted+insanity&ref=cafe

of which I'm a proud owner.
Message: Posted by: Kjellstrom (Jun 11, 2006 01:58PM)
If you combine a memorized stack with a marked deck you will have a super killer combination. This makes many effects easier to perform.
Message: Posted by: Larry Davidson (Jun 12, 2006 04:14PM)
Thanks Frank!

I agree with Mat Kjellstrom, and in fact [i]808[/i] as well as a number of other effects on my DVDs use a deck that's both memorized and marked (and my deck is marked in an "unconventional" way that greatly speeds the process of finding any-named card in the face down deck).

Larry
Message: Posted by: Kjellstrom (Jun 14, 2006 01:17PM)
[quote]
On 2006-06-11 09:27, Sybilmagic wrote:
Darwin Ortiz has some very good work in Scams and Fantasies. One imparticular is Zen master. It really builds up into a three phase killer.
[/quote]

I think yo can find 4 great memorized stacked effects in Scams and Fantasies with Cards. Last Laugh is one of my favourite quick effects yo can do with a memo stack.
This effects kills, especially if you can do a convincing false shuffle.
But its a rather hard routine to pull off smoothly...
Message: Posted by: sanjaya (Jan 16, 2012 07:34AM)
Old thread I know. I've been playing with 808. For anyone using it, try making the JH (or whatever card you use) end up BELOW the named card, rather than above it. It's smoother for me because you don't need to spread twice and when displaying the named card, rather than some additional handling to turn over the face down card, you just display the bottom card of the top packet.

[quote]
On 2006-06-12 17:14, Larry Davidson wrote:
Thanks Frank!

I agree with Mat Kjellstrom, and in fact [i]808[/i] as well as a number of other effects on my DVDs use a deck that's both memorized and marked (and my deck is marked in an "unconventional" way that greatly speeds the process of finding any-named card in the face down deck).

Larry
[/quote]
Message: Posted by: todsky (Feb 20, 2012 07:00PM)
Wow, this thread takes me back, so here's my update:

I memorized Aronson's stack, performed Histed Heisted a few times (killer effect!), and then forgot the stack because I don't perform mentalism routines often enough. I have all of Aronson's books, and since much of it is not Aronson stack-dependent, I'm planning to learn Martin Joyal's stack (which relies on a set of rules rather than memory or mnemonics), and apply some of Aronson's material. This way if there's a long time between mem deck performances, I won't have to worry about forgetting the stack.
Message: Posted by: ibraa (Feb 24, 2012 05:42PM)
I like Looch's performance on his DVD, where in one part of the routine he memorised a deck.
Message: Posted by: Josh Chaikin (Mar 1, 2012 02:38AM)
If you're concerned about forgetting the stack through non-use, there are ways to help you. When you're driving down the road, look at street signs, mile markers, license plates, etc...convert the numbers you see into cards in your stack. Really helps solidify things and helps pass those long commutes.
Message: Posted by: todsky (Apr 18, 2012 05:00PM)
[quote]
On 2012-03-01 03:38, Josh Chaikin wrote:
If you're concerned about forgetting the stack through non-use, there are ways to help you. When you're driving down the road, look at street signs, mile markers, license plates, etc...convert the numbers you see into cards in your stack. Really helps solidify things and helps pass those long commutes.
[/quote]

Unfortunately (or fortunately!) I don't have long commutes.
Message: Posted by: Steven Keyl (Apr 18, 2012 05:26PM)
Although I can't speak to Joyal's stack I can give a wholehearted recommendation for Doug Dyment's Quick(er)Stack. The original QuickStack is based on a simple set of rules that you can use to determine a card at a stack number or vice-versa. I've fully memorized this stack and am very comfortable knowing that I can always fall back on the stack rules if my memory gets rusty with disuse.

Those that have used the successor to QuickStack, known appropriately as QuickerStack, claim that it is a definite improvement over the original system. (As I've already memorized the original stack I have no need to learn the new one.) Having always been impressed with Dyment's stuff I'm sure QuickerStack is a keeper.

You can read more about it here: http://www.deceptionary.com/quickerstack.html
Message: Posted by: edh (Apr 18, 2012 07:22PM)
Run through the stack once a day. That's all I needed to keep the stack fresh.

As a matter of fact I'm now running through the stack twice a week. Still keeps the stack fresh in my mind.
Message: Posted by: mindexplorer (Apr 22, 2012 05:29PM)
On the Dennis Loomis website is an item called [url=http://dennisloomis.com/memdeck/memdeck18.html]Mary Mowderís Memorized Deck Solitaire[/url]. It describes how to play solitaire based on stack numbers rather than card values or color. Great practice and sets your deck up in your memorized order if you complete the round. You can change the rules since the idea is more to reinforce learning the stack rather than winning at solitaire.

I like to use the cards at position 1, 14, 27 and 40 as you would normally use aces. only to build stacks on instead of suits.
Message: Posted by: AdamChance (Apr 23, 2012 12:17PM)
I was watching osterlind's mind mysteries 2 the other day. he has a way of telling what card comes next in the deck (so he doesn't have to memorize the whole deck, just the mathematical formula that determines the next card).

so I want to try a routine where I have an Invisible Deck and the arranged deck sitting on the table. the spectator selects a card in the arranged deck by cutting to it... then they put this card upside down in the middle of the deck. I then name the spectator's chosen card. this is just the effect from the DVD. then I want to take it to the next level by then saying "i knew you were going to choose that card all along" and show them that their chosen card was upside down in the invisible deck the whole time.

so this will pack a double punch. because the basic effect where you name their card is pretty spectacular by itself. but then if I bring in the invisible deck, it will look like I knew what card the spectator choose before they even selected it. I think it's a perfect way to use the invisible deck.

I just watched the DVD last night... so I haven't tried the trick out yet... but I think it'll kill !!!

has anyone else done this? is this a well known trick? or am I the first one to think to combine these two effects together?
Message: Posted by: mindexplorer (Apr 23, 2012 04:59PM)
I don't know if the combination has been mentioned before but I wouldn't be suprised. Others here will be better able to answer that.

Using the BCS, you would know their card so you could reveal the invisible card first as a card you turned over earlier in the evening, then ask how they knew what card you would turn over and spread the BCS deck and show the card turned over to match the one in the invisible deck. This might have the advantage of making it look more like they did the magic. It also puts the focus on the BCS pack last, which can stand inspection or even be used in another trick.
Message: Posted by: AdamChance (Apr 23, 2012 06:55PM)
[quote]
On 2012-04-23 17:59, mindexplorer wrote:
I don't know if the combination has been mentioned before but I wouldn't be suprised. Others here will be better able to answer that.

Using the BCS, you would know their card so you could reveal the invisible card first as a card you turned over earlier in the evening, then ask how they knew what card you would turn over and spread the BCS deck and show the card turned over to match the one in the invisible deck. This might have the advantage of making it look more like they did the magic. It also puts the focus on the BCS pack last, which can stand inspection or even be used in another trick.
[/quote]

ya, that's a good idea. I guess there are a lot of ways it could be performed. it might be fun to have the spectator put the card in their pocket without looking... then reveal the 1 down card in the ID... then they pull the card out of their pocket as the finally.

but I think I like the idea of getting 2 magic effects out of the trick... I'm just trying to think of a way to present it so that there is some sort of explanation for what's happening.

I'm thinking I'll present the trick like: "this is one of those tricks where if you follow the directions precisely, you get an amazing card trick. I'm still not sure how it works, but it always seems to work everytime". [so you're basically setting it up like a mathmatical card trick or something to ensure that they follow your directions with the BSC deck and to provide some sort of explanation as to why they're going through these steps with cutting the deck rather than just turning over one card.]

I'll demonstrate with a green deck of cards how the card should be selected and turned over. I'll say "step 1, take cards out of the pack", "step 2, fan through the cards until you find a card you like" "step 3, cut the card to the front" "step 4, put this card face down, into the middle of the face up deck". I'll be facing backwards, demonstrating with my green deck over my shoulder.

then I turn around, tell them to put the deck in the case. then I'll put my hand over the deck and say that I'm supposed to just pick up on the vibrations or something... then reveal that I knew their card.

then for the ID deck part... I can say "this deck was sitting here the whole time, no one touched it" (or I could even have someone holding it throughout the whole trick). I'll say "now, that first part of the trick I really don't understand, but I seemed to pick up on the vibrations of the card... but this second part of the trick is the part that really confuses me. before the trick started, I closed my eyes, and turned one card face down. Now, I don't know what card I turned over, but for some reason, it always seems to be the card that the other person selects. it's super strange because I turned the card over even before you picked your card... and I don't even know what the card is because I didn't look, so I couldn't have influenced you to pick your card. but for some reason, maybe because of some cosmic energy or something, it's always the same card."

then reveal the face down card in the ID.

if there's a better way to present the trick and better patter to use, I'd love to hear it.

I guess a simpler way to present it would be to have kind of a cocky attitude and when they picked their card and put the deck back in the box... just say "oh, you picked the eight of clubs" (or whatever their card is). they'll be like "wow, how did you know that"... then I'll say "i knew you were going to pick that card before you even selected it". you can say something funny like "i knew what card you were going to pick even before you knew what card you were going to pick" they'll be like "no you didn't, maybe you saw the card somehow, but you couldn't have known what card I was going to pick before I picked it". then as proof that you knew what card they were going to turn upside down... you should them the ID with their selected card as the only one face down.

but I think this trick could be super powerful if presented correctly. it would be very difficult to figure out because even if you think you suspect one of the methods, it's hard to figure out both methods that are used. someone might think 'oh, maybe he peaked at the cards somehow, or he has a friend around giving him a signal or a camera hooked up or something'. so they'll figure that it must be something like that (which in a way, it is sorta)... but then when they see that their card is the only one that is face down in a pack of cards that has been sitting in the person's pocket during the whole trick... how do they even begin to rationalize that? maybe they could think like "oh, he flipped it over really quickly"... but now for someone to rationalize it... it means that the magacian peaked at a card under conditions that would make that virtually impossible... and he has to have the skill to flip over a card in a deck without me seeing it. at that point, even a sceptic would have to think "how did he make me choose that card... because I really did have a very free choice"

also, this trick is pretty easy to do... and all you need is a normal deck and an ID.
Message: Posted by: mindexplorer (Apr 23, 2012 08:17PM)
I think the best presentation will be the one you feel best about and gets you the best reaction. If you are going to go with the procedural presentation you could have the steps written down (ala Daryl) or even on a recording. This opens up new avenues for who is giving the instructions, where they came from, etc..
Message: Posted by: uri (Apr 24, 2012 03:39PM)
This is very similar to Darwin Ortiz's "You do as I did" from At the card table. You might want to check it out.
Message: Posted by: velcrowe (Apr 28, 2012 03:52PM)
Yeah, that's Darwin's. Learning how to get into Stebbins from NDO is worth the price of the entire set of "At the Card Table" and makes the trick you are describing an absolute stunner.
Message: Posted by: Danny Archer (May 3, 2012 06:32PM)
Birthday Book...
Message: Posted by: MagicJuggler (May 16, 2012 06:22AM)
I like Histed Heisted as well.

Oh, and one peice of advice for those that don't know already: Always carry two decks in mem deck order when performing, that way if something goes wrong you can just switch which decks you're using and continue to do the mem deck tricks you were planning on in the first place.

It's good to be able to think on your feet, it's better to have planned ahead so you don't have to.
Message: Posted by: nathanmorris (Jan 12, 2013 01:09PM)
One which I find gets stunning reactions is using the spectators name to spell down to a named card, or making the spectator select the card they named. or perhaps a weighing cards effect.
Message: Posted by: bunkyhenry (Jan 12, 2013 01:31PM)
[quote]
On 2012-05-16 07:22, MagicJuggler wrote:
I like Histed Heisted as well.

Oh, and one peice of advice for those that don't know already: Always carry two decks in mem deck order when performing, that way if something goes wrong you can just switch which decks you're using and continue to do the mem deck tricks you were planning on in the first place.

It's good to be able to think on your feet, it's better to have planned ahead so you don't have to.
[/quote]
Good advice! How many times has my onstage volunteer dropped the cards!!!
Message: Posted by: bunkyhenry (Jan 12, 2013 01:32PM)
[quote]
On 2012-04-18 20:22, edh wrote:
Run through the stack once a day. That's all I needed to keep the stack fresh.

As a matter of fact I'm now running through the stack twice a week. Still keeps the stack fresh in my mind.
[/quote]

Also a nice app called "stacked deck" which quizzes you every whichway.
Message: Posted by: Dennis Loomis (Jan 12, 2013 07:51PM)
I've got too many favorites to narrow it down to just one, but for Stand Up shows I have to go with Histed Heisted. For close up I'm partial to Aces Awry because it's usually my opener. But I love Two Beginnings and more recently The Legend of Southside Johnny.

Dennis Loomis
Message: Posted by: donny (Jan 15, 2013 05:38AM)
Whoa! Thread's eight years old an no: ACKERMAN'S OPENER? Best trick period! Shame shame MC.
Message: Posted by: JanForster (Jan 15, 2013 07:36PM)
You seem to know a lot :) Fortunately you are not alone :) Jan
Message: Posted by: arizona (Jan 15, 2013 08:30PM)
I would like to learn a stack to jazz around with its just the pinky counting I never got the hang of.
Message: Posted by: Mike Kirby (Jan 28, 2013 09:07PM)
The Aronson stack is such a powerful weapon. Well worth the effort to learn it.
Message: Posted by: glowball (Apr 1, 2013 08:15PM)
Greatest Effect - here is one I have seen:
Let's say you (Mag2) and a magic buddy (Mag1) are at the Waffle House before the magic club meeting and the waiter wants to see a trick. If you (Mag2) have a MD you can secretly give your MD to Mag1. Mag1 does NOT know the MD and is the performer. Mag2 (the shill) DOES know the MD and is pretending to be a casual spectator. Mag1 shows the deck is mixed and then turns it FD and asks the waiter to name any card. Then Mag1 asks another "spectator" (Mag2) to name any number from 1 to 52. You get the idea. Mag1 can then reverse it by asking the waiter to name any number and Mag2 to name any card. My one complaint is that my Mag1 friend is insistant on just touching the deck with his index finger (like it is a magic wand) and then deal to the number, wah la. I belive the better way is for the Mag1 to do a few FC's and then deal to the number.

The effect is somewhat different when no FC's vs using FC's.
The first way (no FC's) implies "He is doing a magic trick". The second way implies "He is a super card tech that can quicky get any card in the deck". The second way (using FC's) does much to erase the possibility of a stooge and the effect is just as strong.

The waiter may know you and your buddy(s) are magicians so it is not a big deal that Mag1 asks Mag2 to name a number because there probably won't be a neutral spectator handy. But Mag2 (you) have to act the part saying things like "well, let's see, oh, number 17". And later "I don't know how he does that"!

The irony is that the Mag that does NOT know the MD is the super star!

I've seen this fool other magicians.
Message: Posted by: JanForster (Apr 2, 2013 06:53AM)
And if you want to be the hero as you know your stack but your buddy doesn't you should read Simon Aronson's "The Aronson Approach"... :) Jan
Message: Posted by: Macphail (Apr 9, 2013 01:56PM)
Does anyone know if the Lennart Green effect where he pulls the cards out in order blindfolded uses an ordered deck, or some other method of retrieval?
Message: Posted by: Turk (Jan 3, 2016 12:06AM)
[quote]On Apr 2, 2013, JanForster wrote:
And if you want to be the hero as you know your stack but your buddy doesn't you should read Simon Aronson's "The Aronson Approach"... :) Jan [/quote]

Hi, Jan.

It's been a while since we last talked. I hope that you had a great Christmas season and that you will have a happy and prosperous new year.

I was killing some time on the Cafť and, in a serendipitous moment, I came across your above post. I'm intrigued. By those comments, are you suggesting the the entire "The Aronson Approach"? Or, more likely, are you suggesting that there is a great "you be the hero" effect in that book? I love all of Simon's books but I must confess that, without pulling out "The Aronson Approach", I'm not certain of the effect(s) of which you are referring. This suggests that it is time to once again pull out Simon's books and give myself a refresher course in all. (grin)

Best regards,

Mike Sturgeon
Message: Posted by: lcwright1964 (Jan 3, 2016 01:23AM)
Asi Wind's AACAAN.
Message: Posted by: Kjellstrom (Jan 3, 2016 02:56AM)
You should all try out Darwin Ortiz super strong mem-deck effect: [b]Test Your Luck[/b], page 255, from his latest book: Lessons in Card Mastery (2012).

Book: https://www.vanishingincmagic.com/magic/card-magic/lessons-in-card-mastery/
Download a video: https://www.vanishingincmagic.com/magic-downloads/card-magic-downloads/darwin-ortiz-on-memorized-deck/

I have done this effect 100s of times since I bought the book and I love the see and hear that people freak out almost every time.
The routine is very well-designed. Almost impossible to backtrack how its done.

Effect:
A spectator names any card. She then inserts a random card anywhere into the deck.
In the process, she herself locates the card that she had named.
Message: Posted by: Kjellstrom (Jan 3, 2016 08:27AM)
Another great mem-deck effect I have been doing many years: Shuffle Tracking by Simon Aronson.
http://www.simonaronson.com/volume3.html
This routine is great, you start with an "ordinary" deck of cards that the spectator shuffles.
And, in the routine you bring in a mem-deck in a very clever way...an "invisible" and very easy deck switch.
If you perform for sceptical people (hecklers & wise guys) - this routine will transform sceptical people to ordinary laymen, sure.
Message: Posted by: lcwright1964 (Jan 3, 2016 02:32PM)
[quote]On Jan 3, 2016, Kjellstrom wrote:
Another great mem-deck effect I have been doing many years: Shuffle Tracking by Simon Aronson.
http://www.simonaronson.com/volume3.html
This routine is great, you start with an "ordinary" deck of cards that the spectator shuffles.
And, in the routine you bring in a mem-deck in a very clever way...an "invisible" and very easy deck switch.
If you perform for sceptical people (hecklers & wise guys) - this routine will transform sceptical people to ordinary laymen, sure. [/quote]

I think this is an ideal situation for a marked deck in order to allow for a completely hands off identification of the selection. Some might deem it risky, lest an overly observant spectator inspect the deck too closely while shuffling, but I think the marks on the UMD or Phoenix MDs, which I prefer over the Lesley or a handmarked deck, scarcely jump out to the casual observer, so the bafflement factor makes it worth it. Think of it--the spectator has a completely free selection, throughly loses it in the deck, and then drops the deck himself into the magician's pocket or hat or whatever one uses. The magician then fishes out the card by feel alone, and in the process gets into play an unmarked (though stacked) deck that can tolerate scrupulous examination. Moreover, the audience thinks that the stacked ringer is the same hopelessly shuffled deck that went into the pocket or hat in the first place, making memdeck effects to come even more baffling! Shuffle Tracking is a beautiful effect. Simon used to include it in an earlier edition of the free "Memories are Made of This," but now it is to be found in Art Decko. A really great opening for any memdeck set of effects.

Les
Message: Posted by: J Christensen (Jan 5, 2016 03:46PM)
Past, Present, Future with the wallet index finale.
Message: Posted by: shakuni (Jan 9, 2016 01:50PM)
@J Christensen

Where can I find it? Thanks.
Message: Posted by: JanForster (Jan 9, 2016 02:28PM)
In "Simply Simon". Jan
Message: Posted by: FilmMagician (Jan 11, 2016 10:10AM)
[quote]On May 13, 2005, 10cardsdown wrote:
In my opinion, the "GREATEST" effect is the Any Card, Any Number. With the proper framework and presentation, it's a stunner. I get about 8 minutes out of this and use it as a closer in my stand up routine. I can't top it and it leaves the spectators stymied. :wavey: [/quote]

Do you do a "no touch" ACAAN?
Message: Posted by: doriancaudal (Jan 12, 2016 08:59AM)
[quote]On Jan 5, 2016, J Christensen wrote:
Past, Present, Future with the wallet index finale. [/quote]

I agree, the best one.
Message: Posted by: Count Zapik (Jan 21, 2016 07:54AM)
Having the magical ability to spell to absolutely any card is pretty good~ on its own, or as an extra astonishment after ACAAN.
~ not many do it!
Message: Posted by: mrehula (Feb 2, 2016 12:48PM)
I'm learning 'Billion Dollar Brain' from Darwin Ortiz's Lessons in Card Mastery. When I read it, I was blown away by the elegant method. Same is true for the direct 'Three-Card Location' by Steve Ehlers, from Alan Ackerman's Las Vegas Kardma.
Message: Posted by: Kjellstrom (Jul 19, 2016 10:56AM)
I have added something extra to Simon Aronsons super strong Invisible Card routine. I finish with Kennedy Mystery Box, a super ending. If yo have the box, try this out. When the vanished card shows up in the box, the spectators will freak out.
Message: Posted by: baobow (Jul 25, 2016 01:53AM)
Most memorable memorised deck effect?
The one your audience doesn't forget and members most :p

Challenge mind reading -waterline in my case
Message: Posted by: Tim Cavendish (Jul 25, 2016 01:04PM)
Here's a knockout one by Woody Aragon:

https://www.facebook.com/woody.aragon.7/posts/10210074286204358?pnref=story
Message: Posted by: Sudo Nimh (Jul 25, 2016 07:32PM)
I'm partial to Darwin Ortiz's "Zen Master", and Caleb Wiles "Armchair Mindreader" (but with a mem deck.)
Message: Posted by: jmbulg (Jul 26, 2016 03:49AM)
[quote]On Jul 25, 2016, Tim Cavendish wrote:
Here's a knockout one by Woody Aragon:

https://www.facebook.com/woody.aragon.7/posts/10210074286204358?pnref=story [/quote]

Wow !
Message: Posted by: Imirik (Sep 7, 2016 02:02PM)
Any ideas where to look up Woody's effect?
Message: Posted by: Count Lustig (Sep 7, 2016 06:06PM)
[quote]On Sep 7, 2016, Imirik wrote:
Any ideas where to look up Woody's effect? [/quote]
It cannot be explained. But Vernon tries to in [i]More Inner Secrets of Card Magic[/i].
Message: Posted by: TRI6KED (Sep 12, 2016 01:01PM)
[quote]On Sep 7, 2016, Imirik wrote:
Any ideas where to look up Woody's effect? [/quote]

You can work it out if you are familiar with a stack deck. There is a small section edited out of the video at 1:09 this is where he does a little dirty work.
Woody is a master and if you get a chance to get hold of any of his DVD's or books, you will not be disappointed. :-)
Message: Posted by: RiderBacks (Sep 13, 2016 12:53AM)
[quote]On Jan 3, 2016, Kjellstrom wrote:

You should all try out Darwin Ortiz super strong mem-deck effect: [b]Test Your Luck[/b], page 255, from his latest book: Lessons in Card Mastery (2012).

Book: https://www.vanishingincmagic.com/magic/card-magic/lessons-in-card-mastery/
Download a video: https://www.vanishingincmagic.com/magic-downloads/card-magic-downloads/darwin-ortiz-on-memorized-deck/

I have done this effect 100s of times since I bought the book and I love the see and hear that people freak out almost every time.
The routine is very well-designed. Almost impossible to backtrack how its done.

Effect:
A spectator names any card. She then inserts a random card anywhere into the deck.
In the process, she herself locates the card that she had named. [/quote]

I enjoyed watching the video. That said, both Test your Luck and Card Sense were trivial to figure out. I watched the video and immediately knew what was going on. Impossible to backtrack? Not so much. If I know what's happened after watching a performance video once, the effect is fairly easy to backtrack. If I don't know what's happening after a single viewing, but my wife does, the effect is harder to backtrack. (For the record, my wife nailed Test Your Luck on on a single viewing too, and did a simulated version without a memdeck instantly.) I'd call these effects fairly decent, but nowhere near mind-boggling. Worth performing, sure. But nowhere near the best effects.
Message: Posted by: JanForster (Sep 13, 2016 03:33AM)
O. k., coming back to the theme of this thread and without wanting to appear being immodest, I really believe that my "Under Test Conditions" (we were discussing it here in "Shuffle Not Stirred" in a different thread) falls in this category. It is impossible to backtrack, as there seems to be no explanation even for people supposing a memorized deck, and most important: there is no substitute for the method, so the method makes sense as there is no substitute available :) Jan
Message: Posted by: Drtriage (Sep 13, 2016 06:22AM)
Yes, 'under test conditions' is an excellent effect (as was your whole Penguin lecture!).

Very well thought out and even with the ability (to at least partially) fool magicians.


.. Also looking forward very much to your book, Jan, mentioned in the lecture.


[quote]On Sep 13, 2016, JanForster wrote:
O. k., coming back to the theme of this thread and without wanting to appear being immodest, I really believe that my "Under Test Conditions" (we were discussing it here in "Shuffle Not Stirred" in a different thread) falls in this category. It is impossible to backtrack, as there seems to be no explanation even for people supposing a memorized deck, and most important: there is no substitute for the method, so the method makes sense as there is no substitute available :) Jan [/quote]
Message: Posted by: RiderBacks (Sep 13, 2016 10:33PM)
It sounds to me like Jan Forster's "Under Test Conditions" is probably a variant of Histed Heisted, which would currently receive my top vote. I'd really like to see a performance video of "Under Test Conditions". =) Histed Heisted completely fooled me, but didn't completely fool my wife. If "Under Test Conditions" makes it somewhat more devious, that'd be pure genius, and my bet is that it probably does. Not that Histed Heisted needs to be made more devious, IMO. It's completely diabolical as it stands. But here I confess to posting in partial ignorance.
Message: Posted by: JanForster (Sep 14, 2016 12:20AM)
No, "Under Test Conditions" is not to compare in any way with "Histed Heisted". If you want to compare then you should more think into the direction of "Four Part Harmony", another often overlooked and great creation of Simon Aronson. Jan
Message: Posted by: Pasteboard Alchemist (Sep 14, 2016 09:25AM)
While there are a number of effects similar to "Under Test Conditions" (Ramůn Riobůo's "The Five Sense" from "Thinking the Impossible", Tom Stone's "The Etude" from "Flatland Fever", Greg Chapman's "Pure and Simple" from "The Devil's Staircase", etc...) I am most impressed presentation-wise with Jan's version he performed in the explanation portion of his Penguin Live lecture.

Even if you're well-read and familiar with the premise (Chapman's book has a [i]lot[/i] of great work on it n both the "Pure and Simple" and the "Mind-reading with a Memorized Deck" sections) you would still be remiss not to get Jan's lecture. His alternate method of performing it opens up a fresh world of opportunities.

An "Under Test Conditions"-like effect is now right up there with Mnemonicosis in what consider "greatest effects with a memorized deck."
Message: Posted by: JanForster (Sep 14, 2016 12:28PM)
Absolutely correct and well observed! I know all of the above mentioned routines. In my German book "Unerwartet Mental Angehaucht" I write a bit about the history, similar approaches and the final development of "Under Test Conditions". I still think that it offers quite a lot in different handling and presentation which makes it possible to be performed easily stand up or on stage (which was my main goal) compared to many other clever creations. Just look up my take on Simon Aronson's "Four Part Harmony" which I published here some time ago (same goal).

IMHO especially Riobůo's creation contains too much handling and procedure to make it work on stage. And BTW, while Greg was writing on his "Devil's Staircase" (a wonderful book!!)we were corresponding for some time, even considering putting my "Under Test Conditions" in his book. At the end we decided not to do so as it got too many similarities with some of his own fabulous creations :) . It seems impossible to reinvent the wheel, so my focus went in a different direction. Jan
Message: Posted by: Pasteboard Alchemist (Sep 14, 2016 01:16PM)
Very glad that your focus went in that direction, Jan. I can't believe how much tipping the presentation on its head (as you do in your alternate presentation in the explanation video) allows for so many additional possibilities and subtle reveals. There were times performing Greg's where I thought "If only I could find a sensible way to reveal the second spec immediately, since I already know it..." and your presentation gave the perfect reasoning. Thank you again!

On a different topic and in the spirit of the thread: I don't know if anyone has mentioned it yet, but "Twice as Hard" (from "Try the Impossible") is another great memorized deck effect. It's one of those where you read the workings, think to yourself "Wait... what? How?" then fool yourself with it a few more times before you can finally sit down and focus on a presentation for it. (simple to get back into stack afterwards, too, with just a little forethought!)
Message: Posted by: JanForster (Sep 14, 2016 02:20PM)
Yes, "Twice as Hard " is a fantastic routine :) ! Jan
Message: Posted by: Kjellstrom (Oct 30, 2016 11:15AM)
I can recommend the powerful effect "Catch me if you can" by Pit Hartling, page 18 from his superb book: In order to amaze.
Of course, there is many more great effects in this book.

The book: http://www.inordertoamaze.com/
Message: Posted by: CoffeeBeans (Nov 2, 2016 09:12AM)
I have to agree with Mats. Catch me if you can is one of my favorite things to do. It's my go to memdeck effect!
Message: Posted by: Illucifer (Jul 8, 2020 04:27PM)
[quote]On Sep 12, 2016, TRI6KED wrote:
[quote]On Sep 7, 2016, Imirik wrote:
Any ideas where to look up Woody's effect? [/quote]

You can work it out if you are familiar with a stack deck. There is a small section edited out of the video at 1:09 this is where he does a little dirty work.
Woody is a master and if you get a chance to get hold of any of his DVD's or books, you will not be disappointed. :-) [/quote]


I see no edits in this video. I can work out what he did, essentially, but I see no edits.
Message: Posted by: Illucifer (Jul 8, 2020 04:29PM)
[quote]On Jul 8, 2020, Illucifer wrote:
[quote]On Sep 12, 2016, TRI6KED wrote:
[quote]On Sep 7, 2016, Imirik wrote:
Any ideas where to look up Woody's effect? [/quote]

You can work it out if you are familiar with a stack deck. There is a small section edited out of the video at 1:09 this is where he does a little dirty work.
Woody is a master and if you get a chance to get hold of any of his DVD's or books, you will not be disappointed. :-) [/quote]


I see no edits in this video. I can work out what he did, essentially, but I see no edits. [/quote]

Ah, disregard! I see it now.
Message: Posted by: Cesar Munoz (Oct 18, 2020 03:06PM)
[quote]On May 12, 2005, LobowolfXXX wrote:
Let's see...a spectator cuts off a packet of cards, looks at the card he cut to, shuffles up the packet and covers it with the rest of the deck. A second spectator does the same thing. A third spectator cuts to a card and hands it to you. You give him the card back, he puts it on top of this third stack of cards that has been cut off, and he covers that with the deck, too. You name a number, the first spectator names a card, and deals down to your number...whereupon he finds his card. You name another number, the second spectator names HIS card, and deals down to your number...finding HIS card. The third spectator names a number and you name YOUR card...he deals down to HIS number and finds your card. The deck has been cut three times by the spectators and the first two times a card was cut to, the packet was shuffled. You've never touched the deck. The only single card you've cut to is the one the spectator handed you. If you can do that with a normal deck and a bit of off-beat culling, more power to you.
Oh, and as for myself, the "unnecessary liability" never leaves me in any sort of worse position than anyone who doesn't use a stack - I just go into a non-memdeck effect.

Where can I find this effect? I actually used to know itóbut I canít remember what book itís in!

[quote]
On 2005-05-12 12:53, Magic Sam wrote:
There are so many killer effects that can be done with a memorized stack (five-ten cards), so to me a memorized deck just seems like an unnecessary liability. What happens when the cards fall, or your false shuffle moves one card to the wrong position, or any number of things? Granted, there are plenty of good pros who use the memorized deck, but I can't think of anything that can't be done with a normal deck and a bit of off-beat culling.
[/quote] [/quote]
Message: Posted by: Sixten (Oct 19, 2020 11:34AM)
My greatest effect, using a MD: (Thanks to Mr. Thomas Baxter, entity, May He RIP) I will always be grateful!) "SI's ACAAN."
Message: Posted by: ltrblst (Oct 19, 2020 12:57PM)
I would love to perform Asi Wind ACAAN, but I'm still learning the Redford stack to a decent level.

[quote]On Oct 19, 2020, Sixten wrote:
My greatest effect, using a MD: (Thanks to Mr. Thomas Baxter, entity, May He RIP) I will always be grateful!) "SI's ACAAN." [/quote]

Is this published? Where?

Thanks.
Message: Posted by: goochelen (Nov 1, 2020 01:13PM)
[quote]On Oct 19, 2020, Sixten wrote:
My greatest effect, using a MD: (Thanks to Mr. Thomas Baxter, entity, May He RIP) I will always be grateful!) "SI's ACAAN." [/quote]

Hi,
Can you point me to where I can find a reference to "SI's ACAAN" as I have not been able to find it ?
Thanks in advance.
Message: Posted by: gotgot (Nov 14, 2020 03:01PM)
From one of his lecture, it seems Joshua Jay has a few routines with a memorized deck. He performs a variant of "three cards from one spec to the other" which is nice.
does anyone know if he published his other mem deck routines somewhere?
Message: Posted by: Kassim (Jul 11, 2021 09:00AM)
Asi winds acaan for sure
Message: Posted by: The_MetalMaster (Jul 12, 2021 01:38PM)
For me itís Simon Aronsonís Two Beginnings. Simple and effective. One person names a card, another picks a card, and itís the same card! Always impresses! I believe it was the first MD trick I learned and Iím always ready to go with it.