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Topic: Most effective yet easiest card force
Message: Posted by: scrivomcdivo (Mar 27, 2006 02:17PM)
Just wondering what people think is the easiest yet most effective card shuffle / cut to do to force a card on somebody?
Message: Posted by: zennomind (Mar 27, 2006 02:20PM)
I think handing them the card YOU want is the best force. Just kidding. I use the riffle force most just because that was the first I learned.
Message: Posted by: Erdnase27 (Mar 27, 2006 02:44PM)
The riffle force
Message: Posted by: SOHA (Mar 27, 2006 03:11PM)
Hindu shufle as aforce.
Swing cut as a force is very good as well.

The riffle force is pretty hard actually.
Message: Posted by: NeoMagic (Mar 27, 2006 04:43PM)
The Overhand Lift Shuffle is a particular favourite control of mine, so I can recommend the Lift Shuffle Force that goes with it. It isn't overly difficult and looks convincing IMHO. It's in The Royal Road to Card Magic, towards the end (don't have my copy with me right now).
Message: Posted by: jwebyra (Mar 27, 2006 04:44PM)
I prefer the riffle force because it is the most convincing force I have learned.
Message: Posted by: magicman226 (Mar 27, 2006 04:45PM)
Riffle force definitely and then use the convincing control to get it where you want

Michael
Message: Posted by: james-harrington (Mar 27, 2006 05:53PM)
Cris-cross force is very effective and you can't get any easier than that!
Message: Posted by: jonzola (Mar 28, 2006 01:00AM)
One way deck is the easiest by far
Message: Posted by: DanielCoyne (Mar 28, 2006 01:25AM)
Peguin (I know, I know) has a cheap instant download of five forcess taught by Oz. There's sure to be at least one useable and easy force that's fits your skill level and style.

I just learned a super devious force today from Harrison at Tannen’s. It involved putting a few cards face up on the bottom... PM me for details if interested.

-Daniel
Message: Posted by: Thoughtreader (Mar 28, 2006 11:36AM)
The Cross-Cut Force is the easiest with an ungimmicked deck and there are a few variations that make it even more effective than the usual one most are familiar with. The Hindu Force is also a very good in the hands, just think of a card type force, the one way deck is very effective as is a Svengali deck and when handled properly including shuffling it, comes very close to a perfect force. Granted the best looking ungimmicked force is still the classic force and there are a few good gimmicked decks such as the Pop Eyed Eye Popper Deck or Chris Kenworthy's "Mastermind Deck" that allows for you to spread a deck face up showing all cards different, spreading them face down and they will always take the force card.

PSIncerely Yours,
Paul Alberstat
Message: Posted by: ALEXANDRE (Mar 28, 2006 01:21PM)
You should study as many forces as possible and see which one fits you naturally.

That'll be the best force for you.

You don't want to do a force that requires you to handle the cards differently then how you usually handle them.

In my opinion the secret to effective Magic/Mentalism is naturalness in performance.
Message: Posted by: Jaxon (Mar 28, 2006 04:36PM)
My answer is kind of confusing because this force is very easy to do but not all that easy at the same time.

The Classic force. Now some will argue that it's not a 100% effective and I suppose they'd be right. No matter how well you do it there is always a chance that they won't pick the right card. But for the most part the force is very easy to execute.

The best way to master this force is to do it as often as you can. Every single time you spread the cards for a selection try to classic force a card on them. Do this even when (perhaps especially when) you don't need to force a card. This is a great way to practice. Confidence plays a huge part in the classic force. If you act like it doesn't matter what card they pull out then they are less likely to care which one they grab. After all they can't see the faces of the card so even they won't know what card they are grabbing. Act like it really doesn't matter what card they pull out then the classic force becomes very easy and more full proof.

Here's a little experiment you can do from time to time. This is the easiest force in the world but requires you to be able to really convince your spectator that it really doesn't matter what card they select.

I call this the [b]The forced classic force[/b].
Have the force card on top of the deck. Shuffle the card but keep the force card on top as you shuffle. Cut the force card into the middle fo the deck and keep a break above it. Spread the card as you say something along the lines of, "I need you to remember one of these cards" and casually drop one on the table or just put it in their hand. That's right. You just give them the card instead of them taking one. As you do this act as if it doesn't matter which one they select. AS soon as you drop their card or place it in their hand tell them to remember it and show it to their friends. Then have them put it back into the deck.

If you honestly made them believe that it doesn't matter what card they pick and give them no reason to question you. Then this simple force will blow right over them. It's all in your ability to act like it's no big deal yet. No trick will happen until I find the card in some way. It's easy to get the method mixed up with the magic. The selection is nothing magical. So if you treat it this way they won't question it. They'll only remember the outcome of the effect.

Give it a try sometimes. This is also a good learning tool for learning the traditional classic force.

Ron Jaxon
Message: Posted by: abc (Mar 28, 2006 10:55PM)
[quote]
On 2006-03-28 17:36, Jaxon wrote:
Here's a little experiment you can do from time to time. This is the easiest force in the world but requires you to be able to really convince your spectator that it really doesn't matter what card they select.

I call this the [b]The forced classic force[/b].
Have the force card on top of the deck. Shuffle the card but keep the force card on top as you shuffle. Cut the force card into the middle fo the deck and keep a break above it. Spread the card as you say something along the lines of, "I need you to remember one of these cards" and casually drop one on the table or just put it in their hand. That's right. You just give them the card instead of them taking one. As you do this act as if it doesn't matter which one they select. AS soon as you drop their card or place it in their hand tell them to remember it and show it to their friends. Then have them put it back into the deck.

If you honestly made them believe that it doesn't matter what card they pick and give them no reason to question you. Then this simple force will blow right over them. It's all in your ability to act like it's no big deal yet. No trick will happen until I find the card in some way. It's easy to get the method mixed up with the magic. The selection is nothing magical. So if you treat it this way they won't question it. They'll only remember the outcome of the effect.

Give it a try sometimes. This is also a good learning tool for learning the traditional classic force.

Ron Jaxon
[/quote]
I guess what I do is kinda the same. I run through the deck as if I am going to do a classic force and ask them to say stop when they feel ready to look at a card. By controlling the speed at which you spread through the cards exactly as the classic force they say stop very close to or at the card you want to force and then you just hand it to them or let them peek at it. I only do this when the spec is the kind of person who will try to take a card from the top or bottom of the pack if asked to take a card but then again you can do another force.
Message: Posted by: Utkarsh Sinha (Mar 28, 2006 10:58PM)
I usually use the Vernon force if there is a table nearby, and the riffle force if its not. Both of them are quite easy to do.

And... Jaxon, your forced classic force is a great one! I tried it on a few people! It fools everyone!!!!
Message: Posted by: Justin R (Mar 29, 2006 01:06AM)
My vote would be for the "Cut Force" descriped on Page 17 of Card Conspiracy volume 1.

Jaxon- I really like your thinking, I've always been afraid of the classic force, but I'm really excited to go out and try your way. Thanks for sharing.
Message: Posted by: DomKabala (Mar 29, 2006 03:53AM)
[quote]
On 2006-03-28 17:36, Jaxon wrote:
It's easy to get the method mixed up with the magic.
Ron Jaxon[/quote]

Words of wisdom. The method is a means to an end (the magical effect). Jaxon, thank you for the enlightenment. The Balducci cut deeper force is also nice n' easy. And BTW I likes your method also! :thumbsup: :righton:

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<<<KRaZy4kardz>>>
Message: Posted by: scrivomcdivo (Mar 29, 2006 08:07AM)
Great suggestions by everyone. Will get my research glasses on now and start looking into all of these forces in more detail
Message: Posted by: scrivomcdivo (Mar 29, 2006 09:13AM)
I've just watched Mark Mason's Real World Magic DVD and he does a force he calls the 'Attitude Force' which I think is identical to the Classic Force. I am just a little sceptical though as I can see this not working at times.
Message: Posted by: Mago Gregorio (Mar 29, 2006 08:10PM)
The best and easiest is the Balducci Force (see Card College vol 1 p86)

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Message: Posted by: johnwolfe (Mar 29, 2006 10:40PM)
The hindu shuffle force is very effective. Most of my performances are in banquet and club settings and the revelation of the card is the key to the routine's success and entertainment value. The finess that you may need at the close up table is not quite as critical in those settings. I have never had anyone question the legitimacy of their card selection in hundreds of shows.
Message: Posted by: lilkohn (Mar 30, 2006 01:14AM)
I find the riffle force to be very effective, especially using a lot of the subtleties from card college. But make sure you switch up your forces during your routine. If you aren't doing the classic force, doing the same force over and over may start to cause suspicion. I say using the simplest forces for times like these are the best such as the balducci, hindu shuffle, or even just get them to touch a card and do a top change before they look at it.
Message: Posted by: lylaster (Mar 30, 2006 09:25AM)
I just stick with the Riffle force because "riffling" the cards is something I like to do. For instance, I like to do the LePaul Bluff pass, and also I like to "riffle" the cards as the magic "move" in my abitious card routine (as opposed to snapping). It just shows consistancy.