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Topic: Illusions Exposure Masked Magician
Message: Posted by: STEPHANE-ARNOW (Apr 29, 2006 04:04PM)
Hello,
I just buy the 3 volumes of the ****'in masked '' magician '' (for 15 euros only, but it is too much for that ****-sorry) , and I feel it disgusting...
Lion Cage, Shadow box classic, zig zag classic etc... Often that's old version of the illusions... but I have seen on the video of the valentino site other stage illusions, with total explications... Even a Woman sawing in half , top version whithout boxes !!! When Valentino will be stopped in his way ???

I have seen he has a full stage illusions show in tour(!) with millions of fans in brazil and asia!!!
I don't understand... Where is the respect for the creators of the effects? We spoke in the forum about the ripp off illusions (dominik magic etc....) but that is here very very worst! Is it the end of the classic illusions?

Do you know if all the exposures passed on TV : in USA, and in Europe ??
In france, just few illusions of valentino passed on TV, but on the TV cable, I heard that's more... And now, he continue unmasked with the most modern illusions...

Can you give me your impression (you, live on stage); do you have lots of spectators who knows how work some illusions? what is the audiance reaction? for the classics, but the ''advanced version too'' ?
For example:
[b]Bed of Spikes
Shadow Box
Woman Sawing in Half
Buzz Saw
Mismade, etc.,
etc..[/b]
Message: Posted by: silverking (Apr 29, 2006 11:51PM)
Tell us again why you bought the 3 volumes of exposure videos?......I missed that part.
Message: Posted by: Micheal Leath (Apr 30, 2006 12:47AM)
He is against the exposure, but yet he supports it by purchasing the videos.
Message: Posted by: kregg (Apr 30, 2006 02:15AM)
If life's ironies are in working order, he bought a bootleg copy!
Message: Posted by: MarvinSanRemo (Apr 30, 2006 02:17AM)
Things that make you go hmmmm....
Message: Posted by: J Sleight (Apr 30, 2006 08:42AM)
(Kregg) hehehe now that's funny.
Message: Posted by: IllusionJack (Apr 30, 2006 11:23AM)
Any copy that he buys is a copy someone who is not legitimately interested in the art of magic won't be able to buy.

It's not magicians who we'd rather keep from seeing these - it's the people out there who see magic shows just for the enjoyment.

--Jack :pepsi:
Message: Posted by: magicofCurtis (Apr 30, 2006 11:58AM)
Hmm that is life... Continue....
Message: Posted by: STEPHANE-ARNOW (Apr 30, 2006 12:41PM)
I just read the post.. I think you don't understand what I spoke.
I have bought the videos on ebay (not new also), just to know what is expose and what is not expose! I never watch them. I would just have a notion of this danger. I 'm magician professional since 10 years, and amateur since 20 years.
I don't have the need to know the secret of our art! Thanks.

But I have a impression : this subject is a ''tabou '' (in French), something about nobody want to speak. I just want to know the reaction of your audience, in the world. Here, the valentino programm is on TV sometimes, but not like in others countries. I don't want to make publicity of this ''magician''. Just have your opinion about he presentation of illusions which are explained.

You can keep your bad reflexion. My topic is serious. Thanks
Message: Posted by: Face (Apr 30, 2006 06:25PM)
This Masked Magician makes me really furious!
Message: Posted by: Shrubsole (Apr 30, 2006 08:03PM)
I think basically what STEPHANE is saying is that he brought the Videos to see what illusions had/have been already exposed, and do we think that that has had an effect on the audience?

Basically, he is asking can we still do these old illusions because most people (audience) have forgotten what was exploded and how OR has the Masked twerp ruined these illusions for all time?

Opinions...???
Message: Posted by: Shrubsole (May 1, 2006 05:43AM)
I'll answer my own transcript then as no one else has: :lol:

No I don't think that the Masked Magician has hurt many of the old illusions.
Generally I have found that audiences have the attention span of about 10 seconds. So if they can actually remember seeing the illusion that you are doing, then there is very little chance that they will remember it's workings.

If anyone is so paranoid that people will remember, then in a way, you are agreeing exactly with the Masked Magician and should be updating your illusions to something new. (A whole other debate)

I simply don't entertain people who like to be smart arses in the first place: Anyone who rushes up to me and says "I know how you did that" instantly gets the reply; "Then there are at least two people here who know then!". If that doesn't shut them up and they go on to tell you (speculate) how they think it was done, (either right or most times wrong) I reverse it and ask, "Why are you telling me how it was done? I already know!" - I simply don't put myself into there game of trying to find out. They want to get you into a position where they are arguing with you and trying to be a smart arse - If you use the two lines above, you will never be in that position.

Having said all that, there are many on here who would argue that it doesn't matter about the secret, it's how you perform it. I don't know that I fully agree with this. How you perform it IS most important, but doing really old tricks where the secret is almost public domain, then I think the Marked Magician actually has a point: Get some new illusions!
Message: Posted by: MagiCol (May 1, 2006 05:53AM)
Expose on TV: Only a portion of those who do watch TV on that day would have seen the expose. And, I think, not many of them that did see it will decide to NOT go to a magic show as a result. Or how many will discuss the exposes in depth with those who didn't see the program and spread how the trick is done? Those who are in the know are going to still be astonished at how WELL the tricks are performed. For magicians there will be admiration at the high level of performance that the magi demonstrates. Any magician knows that most tricks and illusions take hours and hours of thinking about and practicing and a good performer is to be respected.
Message: Posted by: Shrubsole (May 1, 2006 06:00AM)
Yes I agree sch, I don't go and see Copperfield and wonder at how he does whatever illusion, I watch it as a magician and enjoy the performance and production. (If only I had that sort of money!) :lol:
Message: Posted by: Steven True (May 1, 2006 03:24PM)
Well here we go again,jumping on a new memeber for posting what some here feel is wrong. Comments like Micheal Leath made have become,IMO,the way to answer someone that does any posting here. Stephane-Arnow was just asking a question, you rememeber the things that the Café' is here for,to learn,to ask,to seek help. Some of you made a good attempt at really trying to answer the actual post where others just seem to want to sit on some high throne and look down on people that come here,again,IMO. I do get angry when we,yes I did say we me included,sometimes look past the post and try to condemn someone for their inquiry about some topic. Maybe we spend to much time trying to put down fakes,frauds,and charletons that we jump at the slightest idea of someone that is sincerly trying to get a question answered.
IllusionJack,Face,Shrubsole,sch, thank you for actually answering rather than jumping on the slam wagon. The masked jerk was one that hurt a lot of magicians but we have recovered to a better level than we were before. Lets stop being petty in some of these posts and really try to answer the new people,instead of making them think,"why did I come here".
I know that this post will bring down the forces that are and oh well so be it. I have been a memeber here at the Café' for awhile now and I will continue to come here for help and guidence,as well as giving the same to some people. I will not leave this buy saying,"can we all just get along",but rather "Lets help them,or we will be no more".
And by the way Micheal Leath,please continue to post here at the Café' because there is a lot you can learn and help others learn as well. Thank you for your post.
Steven
Message: Posted by: gsidhe (May 1, 2006 03:52PM)
I look at the whole Masked Magician like this...
The times when technology grows the fastest is in times of war. Technology is forced to take a great leap in a very short period of time in an arms race.
I am not happy about the idea that some one took it upon themselves to show the trick behind my "Mysterious Fill in the blank", but by doing so, I was forced to look at the way I did that illusion, forced to improve it. Now my "Mysterios Fill in the blank" is "The Amazingly Mysterious Fill in the blank".
I feel that this cad of a magician forced a lot of us to step up our game, and that is not necessarily a bad thing. There are a lot of new effects coming out all of the time, and lots of improvements to the olds stuff. I think that the whole exposure might have something to do with it.
I certainly won't thank him for it...But I will welcome the chance to grow.
Anything is better than stagnation.
(Dons flame proof underwear)
Just m'thoughts.
Gwyd
Message: Posted by: STEPHANE-ARNOW (May 1, 2006 05:12PM)
Hello,
thanks for the answers! I put this post, cause I was anxious about the evolution of this type of programm. I wanted to add the Shadow box classic in my show, and I will do it...Maybe with 2 or 3 little thinks different from the version exposed in the Masked magician programm. And maybe with an other design of the illusion.

LAst question : He explain the LAZER CUT, version Copperfield (Steve Ferson) in a programm in Asia. Can really do the creator of the illusion against this man? When do you think this man will stop his exposure?? Is this type of programm very popular? Not here in France! The minister of culture has stop the programm on the public channel before the passage! Cool! Really a politic thing to censure the programm ! But a part of this programm passed on a private channel (on cable). The magicians group (AFAP) in France have won a battle! But not the war :)
Message: Posted by: ssucahyo (May 2, 2006 06:16AM)
Well, now what we should do? we have IBM, SAM...can that clubs do something? Write letter to TV station to not broadcast that episode? Seem hard ha???
Message: Posted by: Shrubsole (May 2, 2006 08:01PM)
I agree that we have and do and must move on anyway regardless of the Masked Magician trying to force people to do so.

When I dream up a "new" illusion, I normally start with an old one and then say; "Well that's the way they used to do it, so I now have to come up with a new way". Sometimes when I have changed the method, it then allows me to do so much more that the original allowed. Sometimes the whole think mutates so much that it no longer has anything to do with the original idea.

I think we must all stop being complacent and look at what we have already got and improve, improve, improve!

However, that doesn't mean that I need to expose the old stuff to force people to change - Why should I? If I'm moving forward whilst "Some" others stay behind, that isn't hurting me at all!

Besides, no one has the right to force anyone to do anything: People should just get on with their own act and stop trying to change others.

But thanks to the Masked Magician's exposure of "The Table Of Death", I have come up with a whole new design that doesn't use the old method and (I still have to build it) will look impossible)

:)
Message: Posted by: Shrubsole (May 2, 2006 08:05PM)
Just a side note: If the Masked Magician exposes an illsion that the inventer still has a comercial interest in; can't the inventer sue the TV company for loss of earnings?
Message: Posted by: Magic Patrick (May 6, 2006 09:55PM)
Don't do crack and don't buy Masked Magician videos. You can't do one without doing the other.
Message: Posted by: jwebyra (May 8, 2006 09:40AM)
[quote]
On 2006-05-02 21:05, Shrubsole wrote:

Just a side note: If the Masked Magician exposes an illsion that the inventer still has a comercial interest in; can't the inventer sue the TV company for loss of earnings?


[/quote]

If I remember correctly, I think Andre Kole did for the "Table Of Death" illusion.
Message: Posted by: booker (May 10, 2006 11:47AM)
I had to dig out my old race driving fireproof suit b4 I post this:

1. How long ago was this stuff on Fox? 10 years or so. How many lay people have the attention span to remember who was voted off "American Idol" 2 weeks ago?
2. I have all of the MM shows on tape (taped off tv by the way) and use them as a tremendous resource. I learned how to use a ball pull, adapted the radio vanish for a corporate client and am putting the doll house in my kid show this summer.
3. Watch his explanation of "Metamorphisis" then watch it performed by The Pendragons or Criss Angel. 'Nuff said!

Let it die in piece people.

Booker
Message: Posted by: eb02 (May 11, 2006 05:35AM)
Why did you bought it, you have it all the time on different TV channels.
Eran