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Topic: Nice idea with a candle
Message: Posted by: roi_tau (Jul 5, 2006 04:58PM)
Hi guys.

I have seen someone on TV do like a pain test that he held his habd above a burning candle and sufferd the pain for 10 minutes.

I know there is some wax or somethinkg like that you can rub on your hand in order not to feel the heat.

Do you know what is the name of it?

I posted this in the fire forum but I may catch here someone new..

Please PM me-I have a cool routine with that.

Have fun
ROi
Message: Posted by: Pricholas (Jul 5, 2006 06:30PM)
I thought of this, what if you could put your finger in a flame, call yourself satan and not feel anything. That would be good. I was thinking of trying to find some kind of wax that would do this for me, but with a high melting point. Now that would be cool.
Message: Posted by: doctorrigormorto (Jul 5, 2006 07:40PM)
I'm afraid that you have heard wrong, there is no such thing as Cold Fire or ANY ointment that you can put on your hands to stop the heat. I have worked in Sideshow for 14 years.... and fire is THE MOST DANGEROUS element that you can work with. It WILL Burn!

I have done every type of Heat Resistance act in our show from drinking Boiling Water to eating Red Hot Coals... to eating and breathing FIRE. Never have I come across a piece of literature (or heard in my community) a way to make yourself impervious to a flame.

You can handle Fire for around 5 seconds on your hand or body ... but really what is burning is the fuel and once its gone.... its Barbecue time.

I have always like the Heat Resistant routines.... but this one is a wives tale.


Scott McClelland
Carnival Diablo
http://www.carnivaldiablo.com
Message: Posted by: Dr Spektor (Jul 5, 2006 07:46PM)
Maybe it was an optical illusion he used as opposed to actually having his hand in the flames?
Message: Posted by: Slim King (Jul 5, 2006 08:32PM)
I've read that there is a Cancer causing chemical that burns very cool....?????
Hence we don't hear about it.
Message: Posted by: Gede Nibo (Jul 5, 2006 09:08PM)
[quote]
On 2006-07-05 20:40, doctorrigormorto wrote:
I'm afraid that you have heard wrong, there is no such thing as Cold Fire or ANY ointment that you can put on your hands to stop the heat. I have worked in Sideshow for 14 years.... and fire is THE MOST DANGEROUS element that you can work with. It WILL Burn!

I have done every type of Heat Resistance act in our show from drinking Boiling Water to eating Red Hot Coals... to eating and breathing FIRE. Never have I come across a piece of literature (or heard in my community) a way to make yourself impervious to a flame.

You can handle Fire for around 5 seconds on your hand or body ... but really what is burning is the fuel and once its gone.... its Barbecue time.

I have always like the Heat Resistant routines.... but this one is a wives tale.


Scott McClelland
Carnival Diablo
http://www.carnivaldiablo.com
[/quote]

Hey Doc, you RULE!!!! where yu been all these years on this place?????

and there is an old hindu stunt involving ALUM soaked hands that allow one to resist burn for a bit longer...BUT don't TRY IT ON MY WORD ALONE.....

we need that one guy..ah, whats his name....SANSCAN!! to come in and lecture us...

Baba
Message: Posted by: doctorrigormorto (Jul 5, 2006 09:34PM)
Yes, and I am glad that no-one has published the chemical properties for THAT Act ..... in an old book on Fire and Heat Resistant Acts, there was a GREAT Routine about drinking Molten Lead. The secret was instead of using Lead, you used Mercury.

(Bangs head against computer board)

Anything is possible.... but at a grave expense.

For anyone that has wanted to DO Fire, here is a quick liddle story...

Once upon a time, 1992, a performer (me) decided to add fire to his Sideshow.
I was taught by the best in the industry and swapped ideas and formulas with Fire Breathers that had been working in the biz for years.

I became VERY Good at Fire, I had a strong act for the Finale of our show and performed it many times from 1992 thru 1995. In '95, I was brought on board the series 'Lonesome Dove' and was cast as a Medicine Show performer.

The director of the show I was employed to perform on had NO clue as to how dangerous performing fire is on an outdoor set. In my contract I had specifically asked that they had fire blankets, emergency first aid and an emergency vehicle on set, just in case something went wrong. When it came time for my scene, I performed a couple sideshow feats and then was asked to do what we call in the industry a 'Volcano' (blowing a fireball with your mouth). I performed the 'volcano' 7 times for the cameras and on the 8th time the director asked if I could do a double blow. I said I had never attempted that before, but he said that maybe now was a good time to try. I wanted to make a good impression on the staff and crew and give them what they wanted. So I performed my first 'Double Volcano' on camera. It went without a hitch, but right when I had finished the blow, the director stated that camera 2 was off, please do it again...cameras are still rolling. He gave me no chance to wipe my face of the excess fluid and made me feel that time was of the essence, so I proceeded on my second blow. Immediately I saw the color orange in front of my eyes and knew that my head was on fire! I was lucid enough to know not to panic and run, but to tuck into myself and smother the flames, which I did.

 

The crew panicked and tried to put the fire out by kicking dirt into my freshly created wounds. I was told that they had NO nurse on hand, NO Emergency truck and NO First Aid! I was sent to a hospital in a cargo van. When I got there the doctor and nurse spent 4 hours picking rocks and dirt out of my wounds. I learnt later that the tents that I had been performing in front of were never fireproofed and that was just one more lame story about how negligent they were when it came to employees safety. I spent 5 months doing skin peels and thankfully now, you would never know that I was once a burn victim.

 
Two years later I was back on the horse and doing Fire in our show. I allways knew that Fire was not my friend and I also understood that it could turn on me again at ANY time.

Now, you may think that it was Fire again that made me stop performing the Act.

NO.

In early 2004, I contracted a thing we call in our industry 'Fire Lung'.
This is a deadly malady that happens when you do to many Fire shows. Apart from the Fluid used to do fire weakening and rotting your teeth, it slowly poisons your system, until eventually you get Liver Cancer.
AND, then if by chance... and this WILL happen if you do as many shows as we do... the (fluid) can get into your lungs. And their it sits.... FOREVER.

You get a chronic cough and have a hard time breathing..... and this persists for around 8 months to a year.
But NEVER does the (liquid) leave your lungs. Slowly shortening your time on the planet.

I have stopped ding Fire in my show, and the one performer that does it in our show now is also looking to get out of the Fire-Eating Business. All the seniors in Sideshow will tell you similar stories. We have been Naive for to long, now ALL of us are paying for it. Each new performer thinks..'Oh THAT will NEVER happen to me'. But over time YOU WILL BE BURNT and YOU WILL SUFFER ILL EFFECTS FROM THE CONSUMPTION OF THE FUEL USED.

PERIOD.

I know that this was a bit off topic, but I want to make sure that ANYONE contemplating Fire as a routine to think twice. Is your health and life worth it?

Scott McClelland
Carnival Diablo
http://www.carnivaldiablo.com
Message: Posted by: doctorrigormorto (Jul 5, 2006 09:36PM)
Hey Gede Nibo!

I just discovered this place a few months back... silly me, Touring all the time.

Its Great to be on board!
Message: Posted by: Bill Ligon (Jul 5, 2006 10:38PM)
DoctorRigorMorto, I am glad to see you here and I have enjoyed your posts. Actually, I didn't realize you were so new here, which speaks for the quality of your messages, I guess. I am glad to see someone talking sense about fire (not that I know anything about fire eating).
Message: Posted by: doctorrigormorto (Jul 5, 2006 11:12PM)
Thanks Bill, its wonderful to see so many people dedicated to the Art of Magick and keeping the Secret Arts alive!

With X-Box 360 and Home Theatre Systems the rage.... we NEED to inject some NEW life into the ART and keep our public wanting to see and EXPERIENCE MORE!

I am happy to see people swapping ideas and giving truthful critiques on New Effects on the market. It keeps the producers in check and also helps performers form better routines then the generic stuff that comes in the instructions.

There are many great thinkers on this board and many Fantastic Entertainers that work professionally in the industry. What a wonderful neighborhood to learn and play in!
Message: Posted by: Tony Iacoviello (Jul 5, 2006 11:19PM)
I've done fire eating for years and fire walking as well. I was lucky and never was seriously hurt.

Last year while cooking a boiled dinner, I had an accident with a pressure cooker. Once again, I was lucky, third degree burns on both my hands, but luckily it only hurt for a few hours, then the nerves died. 10 months later, I'm left with scared hands and little feeling in one of them.

I lost all of my usual October work, and that was my busiest month.

While I was recovering, looking at the damage a split second of steam and water caused, it dawned on me. Why the 7734 was I exposing my flesh to fire? (Never mind inviting it into my body.)

We have all seen the pictures of those burned and most think, that cannot happen to me, I'm too careful... Well, I was careful in the kitchen. Accidents happen and you have to ask yourself, is it really worth it?

Tony
Message: Posted by: Bill Ligon (Jul 6, 2006 09:06AM)
That's a terrible story, Tony! Does the loss of feeling affect your magic? BTW, pressure cookers have always seemed dangerous to me.

Bill
Message: Posted by: roi_tau (Jul 6, 2006 09:56AM)
Hi Guys.

Let me explain it again:

No one touches the flame but he put his hand 10 cm ABOVE a candle.

Im sure that in those conditions,there must be something you can rub on your hand and do it.

here is a link to the video:
http://vod.walla.co.il/?w=//914785
It's in hebrew but you get the idea.

Have fun
ROi
Message: Posted by: airship (Jul 6, 2006 10:35AM)
No. There isn't.

Heat rises. You can boil water 10cm above a candle. Even if you have some material that is highly efficient at dispersing heat, it will eventually become the same temperature as the flame if there is no medium taking that heat away. Even a ceramic Space Shuttle tile, which is one of the most efficient heat dissipators ever developed, will become too hot to hold in under a minute. There is no 'invisible cream' that could possibly do the trick.

However, I have heard of idiots like G. Gordon Liddy holding their hands over a candle for quite awhile. But they're just macho idiots who don't care if they're seriously injured as long as it proves how tough they are.
Message: Posted by: roi_tau (Jul 6, 2006 11:33AM)
There must be a trick there!

I will find and let you know.

Take a good look at the video.

ROi
Message: Posted by: JAlenS (Jul 6, 2006 11:51AM)
Shalom roi_tau. After reading doctorrigormorto's post about fire I'm not going to pursue it anymore, until a safer way is thought up. The video won't play on my computer but I was thinking, if you're on stage you could use a fake flame and hold it under your hand for as long as you want. On stage the audience probably couldn't tell the difference.
Lehitraot.
Message: Posted by: doctorrigormorto (Jul 6, 2006 12:14PM)
Hi JAlens, Phew... I am glad that my post hit home.
Message: Posted by: Black Hart (Jul 6, 2006 03:24PM)
[quote]No one touches the flame but he put his hand 10 cm ABOVE a candle.[/quote]
[quote]Heat rises. You can boil water 10cm above a candle[/quote]
Bang on there Airship. You could hold your hand UNDER the flame perhaps. Heat is dissipated by radiation, convection or conduction. The convection of the air over the flame will be pretty good. The radiated heat less so. Listen to the expert advice Roi.

Keith Hart
Message: Posted by: magickdabid--uk (Jul 6, 2006 03:48PM)
Didn't Derren Brown do something like this on one of his earlier shows?


Dave
Message: Posted by: Scott Xavier (Jul 6, 2006 11:13PM)
Check into a product called stunt gel. that's all I can say on here.
Message: Posted by: JAlenS (Jul 6, 2006 11:23PM)
[quote]
On 2006-07-06 13:14, doctorrigormorto wrote:
Hi JAlens, Phew... I am glad that my post hit home.
[/quote]

I figure if you've been doing this for 14 years then you know what you're talking about so I'll heed your warning. I can't find anyone around here that knows anything about fire eating anyway so I'll just stick to flash cotton and paper, and some candles. I'm trying to stop smoking and I don't need any more health risks. Thanks.
Message: Posted by: Rev.moonchild (Jul 6, 2006 11:28PM)
A lot of killer Info on here .Thanks guys . Hey Doc good to see you on here And thanks for the comment on my page ,love the baby in the jar .
Message: Posted by: Freak Prodigy (Jul 7, 2006 12:35AM)
Can someone translate what this kid is saying in the video?


Brett.
Message: Posted by: Dr Spektor (Jul 7, 2006 07:42AM)
I am now convinced it must be an optical illusion of some sort with proper angle set ups or something Tony and I were talking about involving a Peppery spirit ;)
Message: Posted by: Leland Stone (Jul 7, 2006 08:38AM)
Hiya, Doc:

Thanks for a fascinating look at your niche of the Art, and thanks for passing along the warnings and info that have cost you so dearly to acquire.

[Tangential, potentially rambling anecdote follows, submitted FWIW.]

I trained as a blacksmith when younger, and while no longer horseshoeing I continue to do wrought iron work, meaning that I routinely work with steel glowing light orange in the 1900 degree F range. Zero significant injuries there from, 28 years and counting.

Last week baking bread in a 350 degree oven, I seared the end of my finger -- raising a nasty blister and leaving an unsightly gash.

I suppose if there's a point it is this: Your words of caution are wisely to be heeded, whether one is working with a fireball...or a candle flame.

Leland
Message: Posted by: doctorrigormorto (Jul 7, 2006 09:28AM)
Thank you Leland,

Stunt Gel goes on like vaseline... I think that the public would know whats up. LOL
Message: Posted by: Gede Nibo (Jul 7, 2006 10:14AM)
I AM SICK of thinking for you people...

all you gotta do is CHOP SOMEONES ELSES HAND OFF, and stuff it in your sleeve...then when your ready to "burn your hand", you simply SWITCH HANDS....

geeezzzzzzz....








:) :)
Message: Posted by: Bill Ligon (Jul 7, 2006 10:27AM)
Now, why didn't any one else think of that? :huh:
Message: Posted by: Gede Nibo (Jul 7, 2006 10:48AM)
..not everyone can be a mad man genius like Us Naljorpa...

also, Us mage are known to be a bit lazy sometimes...if someone asks for a hand...well, just throw it at 'em :(



HA.
Message: Posted by: Spellbinder (Jul 7, 2006 08:46PM)
Holographic flames. It's an optical illusion.
Message: Posted by: Midnight333 (Jul 8, 2006 02:38PM)
Why would you want to do this? Its not even a very good effect, what would you be trying to prove? And who would you be trying to prove it to? don't take this as a personal attack. Im just posting what I think, and I don't think the effect would ever be worth the risk.
Message: Posted by: David Parr (Jul 8, 2006 04:26PM)
A scene in the movie Taxi Driver shows Robert DeNiro holding his hand over a gas flame as the camera tracks in a semi-circle. It really looks as if he's holding his hand just above the fire. Gene Siskel asked DeNiro how it was done, and DeNiro said it was just an illusion of perspective. His hand was some distance behind the flame. (In film this is called "foreshortening"). The camera move really sells the illusion. But there's no magic chemical that will enable one to do this in real life. Heed the sensible advice that has been given here. No magic effect is worth the possibility of permanent injury.
Message: Posted by: Avrakdavra (Jul 10, 2006 08:32AM)
I saw a stage performance in which an actor (Leonard Nimoy, as it happens) placed his hand over a candle flame and held it there for 10-20 seconds. I've always been curious how they managed it-- the lights dimmed as he placed his hand over the flame, leaving it spotlighted, which I assume was not simply for theatrical enhancement but related to the method. It's fascinating to learn that this was not accomplished with some sort of protective substance on his hand.
Message: Posted by: Autumn Morning Star (Jul 10, 2006 09:44AM)
Very interesting, indeed. In the 1980's there was a chemical which could be used on gloves to make them flame we sold in our magic shop. I never touched the stuff because it was a chemical and the skin is one of the best means of "drug delivery" to your system. (Think "nicotine patch" and you will realize I am telling the truth.)

There was a guy in our magic shop, a teen who breathed fire using white gasoline because Everclear was too expensive. He did not heed warnings and thought himself to be fire proof, bullet proof and immortal. I saw him set his hair on fire at a disco, a girl's hair on fire on a dance floor, and his chin on fire when blowing a fireball. He liked to throw flash paper around in the dark on crowded dance floors and set his date's hair on fire on more than one occasion.

Today, this former teenage fire eater is an old man way before his time. Last time I saw him he was totally blind and his teeth were crumbling away from holding torches in his teeth. He agrees with me now, but it is way too late.

I also always heard about Cold Fire. Some people swear it exists, but from everything I know it does not. The candle in the video must be some sort of trick. From the physical gestures and body language in the video I feel this is an inspirational exercise that deals with mind over matter. (Sort of like the people who learn to believe in themselves by walking over hot coals or broken glass.)

It is great to believe in yourself, but the candle can do serious damage before you realize it. And you are damaging your HAND! And what do you use to do magic...

Ok.
Message: Posted by: Bill Ligon (Jul 10, 2006 02:59PM)
I hope those who are tempted to play with fire take all this advice to heart. I am afraid, however, that there are those who do believe they are immortal and immune to the dangers. Please, please listen to what more experienced performers have to tell you. They are not trying to keep "secrets" to themselves, and they are not just trying to lord it over you. They have your best interests in mind!
Message: Posted by: Autumn Morning Star (Jul 11, 2006 12:27PM)
[quote]
On 2006-07-10 15:59, Bill Ligon wrote:
I hope those who are tempted to play with fire take all this advice to heart. I am afraid, however, that there are those who do believe they are immortal and immune to the dangers. Please, please listen to what more experienced performers have to tell you. They are not trying to keep "secrets" to themselves, and they are not just trying to lord it over you. They have your best interests in mind!
[/quote]

Bill speaks the truth. I lost my eyebrows and lashes and more in a flashpot goof during rehearsals. (I also had to cut bangs for a while until the burned hair in front grew out.)

I was also injured ONSTAGE in Dalhalla, Sweden when an experienced stagehand set off a flashpot too early. Flaming pieces of magnesium (?) adhered to and burned my cheek during the finale'. (Ice, Aloe vera, vitamin e, and good dermatologists are true blessings.) I do not use flashpots anymore.

I promise you...we have no special secrets regarding fire.
Message: Posted by: Tony Iacoviello (Jul 13, 2006 06:50PM)
Sorry, I have been away making a name for myself in Canada. Those in Toronto may have seen me on the news this past Tuesday (I walked by a reporter as she was filiming a story about the new Pirates movie). I also caused the CN Tower to bend by touching it at it's base I do have photos from the base looking up at the bend and from the top looking down (instead of spoons I bend buildings and minds).

Bill: The loss of feeling in my left hand did not affect my sleight of hand too much, but I also have spine damage and have lost the feeling and some of the function of the last 3 fingers of the left hand, I lose breaks rather easily and have problems typing.

Last month Vlad Deich (founder of Gothic Magic) introduced me to a rather special "thing" that would allow you to told your unprotected hand over a flickering candle for as long as you wish. Contact me via PM if you are interested in using this. There are a world of possibilities in this find.

Doctor Spector, what we discussed would allow you to place your hand into a roaring fire for as long as you wished, but I'm not ready to release that concept publicly yet.

Tony
Message: Posted by: Tony Iacoviello (Apr 22, 2007 11:34PM)
With all this talk of bending, and due to several requests, I posted one of the photo's of my bending the CN Tower in Canada last July on my blog.

[url]http://psychiclife.blogspot.com/[/url]

Tony
Message: Posted by: egregor (Apr 25, 2007 02:09AM)
After seeing Buddhist monks raise their body temperatures to 103 degrees while sitting naked in a cave at 11 degrees below zero in the himilayas, I believe the human body can accomplish things we have not yet discovered without a gimmick or trickery. At one time the sheer idea of a human body being able to run a 26 mile marathon followed by a five mile swim, followed by a 50 mile bike race seemed like science fiction.But triathalons are real.
Message: Posted by: Bill Ligon (Apr 25, 2007 07:32AM)
I believe so, too, Egregor.

Bill
Message: Posted by: Gotama (Apr 25, 2007 09:04AM)
[quote]
On 2007-04-25 03:09, egregor wrote:
After seeing Buddhist monks raise their body temperatures to 103 degrees while sitting naked in a cave at 11 degrees below zero in the himilayas, I believe the human body can accomplish things we have not yet discovered without a gimmick or trickery. At one time the sheer idea of a human body being able to run a 26 mile marathon followed by a five mile swim, followed by a 50 mile bike race seemed like science fiction.But triathalons are real.
[/quote]

There is, however, a major difference between raising body temperature and withstanding a flame. Raising body temperature requires the a widening of the capillaries to the skin area to increase the blood flood. While this type of action is usually subconscious, you can learn to control it (usually through a process such as meditation or biofeedback). Likewise, with the proper training, you can raise or lower your heart's beating rate (within certain parameters - you can not lower it to a dangerous level as you will pass out and your body will reassume a normal state).

Holding a hand or finger over a flame, however, is in a different ballpark. There is no known procedure to allow unprotected skin survive the heat of a flame for more than a few seconds. Please do not ever try something this dangerous. I have worked for a fire department (as their administrator) and have seen the effects of fire on the human skin. If they survive, burn victims suffer constant pain for the rest of their lives, numerous operations for skin grafts, suffer from frequent infections, and never fully recover the use of arms, legs, or other body parts.

Gotama
Message: Posted by: saracen (Apr 25, 2007 10:00AM)
10 years ago there was a company that sold a product called "Fire check" it was being sold at the ideal home show in london Earls court. The idea was to put it on your furniture and carpets so if a naked flame were to make contact the substence would prevent it from burning. I tried soaking my hands with it and allow in to dry (clear). The result was great, I could hold my hand to a flame longer than anyone down the pub(up to 50 seconds. What was more freaky is your hand would have a black soot appear where the flame made contact. Once the bottle ran out I got some more from the company but the new batch never had the same effect, the resistance was about 1 tenth of the previous bottle. don't think these guys realised the potential of what they had created originally
Message: Posted by: handa (Apr 25, 2007 10:35AM)
There is another brand name called "Flame Barrier" that is designed for use on fabrics. I don't have an MSDS sheet in front of me to say what it does to skin on contact when wet.

Chris
Message: Posted by: KOTAH (Apr 25, 2007 11:12AM)
If I may jump into this subject with pure speculation What if rather than having applied something to his hands, he held something palmed in it? i.e, a silver dollar which had rested on a freezer pack on a servante or cushion on his lap. The cold coin would absorb the heat, and take a while to become to hot to hold?
Pure conjecture, and nothing more.
Message: Posted by: Gotama (Apr 25, 2007 11:27AM)
Again, we are playing with fire.
Message: Posted by: supercool (Jun 14, 2007 06:50AM)
Here is an idea what about a pull like the raven with some kinda heat shield instead of the pk part.
Message: Posted by: supercool (Jun 14, 2007 06:57AM)
There is also a trick to raising your body temp it envolves eating a secret something, but it seems dangerous.
Message: Posted by: Dr Spektor (Jun 14, 2007 08:13AM)
Lava?
Message: Posted by: docsteve (Jun 14, 2007 08:25AM)
I think the original effect described is not a fire resistence 'trick' as such, but an expereiment in suggestion.
As Airship said, 10cm above a candle is actually quite hot. At 12cm you get 'surges' of heat, as parrafin gas billows, but it's quite bareable.

The challenge is to have someone match you.
I've hinted at the method, but I won't disclose it here.
Rest assurred its about 85% succesful, and doesn't use any kind of chemical or shield.
I've been doing this for just under 10 years now, and no-one has ever guessed the 'method' (such as it is) and it remains one of my impromptu pub tricks.
Steve
Message: Posted by: supercool (Jun 14, 2007 11:56AM)
DR Spektor your close but not the lava your thinking of if you want to know just pm me
Message: Posted by: Bill Ligon (Jun 14, 2007 01:48PM)
You don't have to eat it. Just put a piece in your armpit.

Bill
Message: Posted by: supercool (Jun 14, 2007 02:07PM)
I did not know that bill. maybe I will pull a jimi and put some under my head band. LOL
Message: Posted by: RJE (Jun 15, 2007 11:05AM)
A follow up a year later, doctorrigormorto there is a fairly well known performer from your neck of the woods (Toronto) that had to have a liver transplant. He was a prolific fire eater and the scuttlebutt is that the fluid was the cause. His initials are G. E. and his wife still performs. It gave a lot of us veterans cause to remove it from our acts.

There was another performer from the States who used to hold a lit cigarette between his thumb and middle finger with the filter on his thumb and the lit part against his middle finger. He did a lecture at Morrissey's Magic in Toronto about 20 years ago. I don't remember his name. He said it was nothing but repetition until the finger didn't feel heat anymore. I wasn't that dedicated and never took up the trick.

All the best,

Rob
Message: Posted by: Bill Ligon (Jun 15, 2007 11:35AM)
[quote]

There was another performer from the States who used to hold a lit cigarette between his thumb and middle finger with the filter on his thumb and the lit part against his middle finger. He did a lecture at Morrissey's Magic in Toronto about 20 years ago. I don't remember his name. He said it was nothing but repetition until the finger didn't feel heat anymore. I wasn't that dedicated and never took up the trick.

All the best,

Rob
[/quote]

Rob, there is a rather easy way to perform this that does not require killing pain sensors or damaging yourself in any way. Certain conditions are required, but they are usually not difficult to set up. PM me if you are interested.

Bill
Message: Posted by: docsteve (Jun 15, 2007 12:10PM)
Following on from the above posts, I'd urge anyone to read Sam Dalal's Swami/Mantra series, which are available in a hardbound collection at a great price (from Kaufman).
Actually there's quite a lot of Bizarre & Mentalism in there too which I'm sure would appeal to anybody who browses this forum of the Café.
Cheers
Steve
Message: Posted by: RJE (Jun 15, 2007 05:37PM)
Hi Bill,

20 years ago, I would have taken you up on your offer! ;) However now, with the unpopularity of smoking and myself having quit smoking about 5 years ago, I'm going to pass.

I do appreciate the offer though. Very kind of you.

All the best,

Rob