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Topic: Thumb fan.
Message: Posted by: munkywrench (Nov 1, 2006 01:58PM)
This may sound cheesy but I can swing cut, swivel cut, false deal, false shuffle, classic two hand palm, one hand top palm, hot shot, half pass, classic pass, charlier cut etc. But I can't do a thumb fan to save my life. Any help would be great.
Message: Posted by: James F (Nov 1, 2006 04:14PM)
Just practice. It should take a day or two to get a decent thumb fan. don't know if this helps, but I always found finger fans much easier. (Using the index finger instead of the tumb) Thumb fans have always felt kinda weird to me...Although after mastering the finger fan the thumb fan is easy. Just play around with the grip the left hand has and the pressure/speed used by the right hand. you'll get it faster than you think.
Message: Posted by: munkywrench (Nov 2, 2006 07:51AM)
Thanks bro.
Message: Posted by: James F (Nov 2, 2006 10:17PM)
No problem...post here or PM if you ever need any help...But Im sure you'll get this just fine after a little experimenting.

James
Message: Posted by: beaker (Nov 8, 2006 10:26AM)
How about a one-handed fan. I can't figure out the mechanics for the life of me. I have several books which purport to give instructions, but am still hopeless. Any tips?
Message: Posted by: artwo (Nov 8, 2006 01:03PM)
Just practice. that's the only real way to get good at fans without powder.
Message: Posted by: ToasterofDoom (Nov 8, 2006 02:33PM)
I would say use older cards. If they are not destroyed, older cards seeme to have better grip for fanning.
Message: Posted by: Robert Apodaca (Nov 8, 2006 09:39PM)
[quote]
On 2006-11-08 15:33, ToasterofDoom wrote:
I would say use older cards. If they are not destroyed, older cards seeme to have better grip for fanning.
[/quote]

I would argue just the opposite. I have a much easier time fanning new cards than old cards.
Message: Posted by: stoneunhinged (Nov 9, 2006 04:07AM)
Ahhh... but what are older cards?

The best cards I have for fanning are 20 year old bikes. I never did magic with them, so there are no crimps or anything. But they fan BETTER than new powdered cards.

It could be that cards today are manufactured differently than 20 years ago. Nevertheless, my 20 year olds are my best cards for fanning, and I wouldn't dare put powder on them.

Jeff Stone
Goettingen
Message: Posted by: stoneunhinged (Nov 9, 2006 04:10AM)
One other thing:

I can produce a beautiful thumb fan, but can't pressure fan for the life of me, though I keep practicing.

But why do I keep practicing? What's the point in pressure fanning if my thumb fan is beautiful? Why must I learn to do it all, rather than sticking to what I do well?

Monkeywrench: can you do another kind of fan relatively well? Are you saying that you can't do a thumb fan, or that you can't do a nice fan at all?

Jeff Stone
Goettingen
Message: Posted by: Jonas (Nov 11, 2006 06:40AM)
In my experience, pressure fans are easier to get even than thumb fans.

Also, I like the look of it from the front, how it kind of grows as it forms.
Message: Posted by: stoneunhinged (Nov 11, 2006 09:54AM)
Jonas, a pressure fan does look quite beautiful as it curls around index finger. I guess my point, which I made badly, is that monkeywrench lists several moves but not a single fan. So I was just curious whether it's the thumb fan which is sticking him up or just fans in general. So I could also ask my question thus: if you can do a beautiful pressure fan, why bother to learn a thumb fan.

I suppose in the Pastboard Frolics forum there are those who want to be able to do it all, and I respect that. I'm not one of them. I read this forum to get tips on improving the few flourishes I want to do. I've not yet bought Jerry's Encyclopedia, and am not likely to anytime soon.

Jeff Stone
Goettingen
Message: Posted by: PepeRuizSJ (Aug 7, 2008 04:25PM)
Perhaps I should post this question elsewhere, but I just can't find where.
Have you guys seen this fan where the cards from a full circle? The thumb fan and pressure fan can only go so far. But I recall seeing a couple of videos on-line, before I knew about the Café, where they would perform this flourish. I loved it but I can't find it anywhere. Would you guys know the name, or where to look? Thanks.
Message: Posted by: trashmanf (Aug 8, 2008 10:23AM)
Yes, search for "naoki ogi" or "360 fan" or "Sanada fan" on youtube/google and you will find some of the fans you're looking for.

unfortunately, these fans are usually un-even and goofy looking by design.
Message: Posted by: PepeRuizSJ (Aug 8, 2008 02:03PM)
Thank you very much. I'll look into it.

Man, I love the Café.
Message: Posted by: daffelglass (Aug 10, 2008 10:50AM)
[quote]
On 2008-08-08 15:03, PepeRuizSJ wrote:

Man, I love the Café.
[/quote]

I second that
Message: Posted by: MagicBosley (Sep 7, 2008 11:17PM)
If you can find it, Bill Tarr's "Now You See It, Now You Don't" is a great resource and has some excellent drawings
Message: Posted by: Pharaoh (Jan 9, 2009 12:54PM)
I would say that using a brand new deck that has been worn in a bit helps. I'd say perform several waterfall shuffles to break them in a bit. This helps to make them a little less slippery which should help you to learn to fan the cards.

(Incidentally,the thumb fan also lets you do a very quick and easy diminishing card effect).

I'm right handed and find that I have no problems doing a pressure fan with the cards in my left hand and no problems with doing a thumb fan with the cards in my right hand. The other way round and I have problems. This also allows me to do a blank deck type of display or to let an impromptu stooge know a correct card.
Message: Posted by: edh (Jan 18, 2009 04:42PM)
I was going to start a new thread before I came upon this one.

I have a question for you guys. I'm with the OP. I can do cuts false shuffles and various other slieghts. But I can't do a thumb fan that is at least a 3/4 quarter circle fan. The best I can do is a fan that is 1/2 circle that leaves a large clump of cards at the end of the fan. I hope this is clear.

I would appreciate any tips/advice to be able to get a fuller fan.

thanks
Message: Posted by: Demonbrn (Jan 18, 2009 06:14PM)
Don't feel bad munkey, I can't do any of those things but can do a thumb/finger fan, I still don't think I'm doing the preasure fan correctly to be practicing it, and I can't do a one handed fan period (always looks like I just ribbon spread the cards in one hand, lol).
Message: Posted by: trashmanf (Jan 23, 2009 02:25PM)
Hi Edh, if you use fanning powder the cards will stick together better and you can get a larger fan. Also you can try to divide the deck and do smear fans in both hands (with only half a deck it's easier to spread them so they are all visible) finally, try experimenting with different techniques in starting position so that your hands have further to move (i.e. start with the thumb even deeper and further on the left side of the deck, assuming a right handed smear fan)

oh yeah you can also try changing the shape of the fan, it's actually easier to make a larger spread if there is some "bend" in the shape! hard to explain in words but when you push the last part of the smear fan, you will notice it's not quite in line with the rest of the fan.
Message: Posted by: tstark (Mar 14, 2009 10:17PM)
The pressure fan is the more difficult of the two. If you can ribbon spread a deck of cards you have the correct feel for/of a thumb fan. The thumb never contacts any card too long and most of the action is at the top of the deck with the fan almost forming itself. Cards that are powdered or that have an excellent finish are an absolute. Dirt and oils from the hands will ruin the ability to thumb fan quickly.
The pressure fan can be done with most decks which is the advantage of that method. It is nearly impossible to describe in print but you must be able to spring cards from the finger side of the hand. The first, or first and second fingers, are placed at the upper right corner and the thumb at the rear of the deck. The bend is mild and you do not literally spring the cards but there is some spring involved. All of the rest is continuous practice and after considerable frustration you will simply begin to fan correctly. If the cards are too stiff it increases the difficulty in learning.
Message: Posted by: ying (Mar 16, 2009 12:19AM)
Bevel the cards before fanning. If you think about a fan as if you're doing a circular spread, it becomes much easier.

For some reason, I can't do a pressure fan though...

[quote]
On 2006-11-09 05:07, stoneunhinged wrote:
It could be that cards today are manufactured differently than 20 years ago. Nevertheless, my 20 year olds are my best cards for fanning, and I wouldn't dare put powder on them.

Jeff Stone
Goettingen
[/quote]

They are cut differently:

[i]Unlike other cards, the cutting blade used in “traditionally cut” cards starts at the card face and punches through to the back. As a result, a sharp edge is created on the backside of each card and a rounded edge, which facilitates easier card shuffling, is formed on the card’s face.

For over 100 years, traditional card cutting was the norm, but the process was changed about fifteen years ago. The casinos require a traditional cut as does Richard. Traditionally cut cards ensure that card men and magicians can easily interlace the cards to produce crisp, clean shuffles, especially with some of the more intricate shuffling techniques like the one-hand shuffle and the faro shuffle.[/i]
http://richardturner52.com/cards-games/bee-cards/
Message: Posted by: Outbreak Monkey (Apr 8, 2009 01:48AM)
This thread is getting a little old again, but I'll reply my 2c anyway...

[quote]
On 2009-01-18 17:42, edh wrote:
I have a question for you guys. I'm with the OP. I can do cuts false shuffles and various other slieghts. But I can't do a thumb fan that is at least a 3/4 quarter circle fan. The best I can do is a fan that is 1/2 circle that leaves a large clump of cards at the end of the fan. I hope this is clear.

I would appreciate any tips/advice to be able to get a fuller fan.

[/quote]

I found speed is quite important, too slow and I get clumping.

Also I noticed I roll my thumb, starting with my thumb pretty much pressing on the side of the deck, and finishing with my thumb with the pad nearly 'flat' on the back of the cards - you do the thumb roll as you sweep the cards across (allowing more cards to release).