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Topic: Bicycle Vintage Series 1800
Message: Posted by: LegendaryEgos (Jan 2, 2007 01:11AM)
Does anyone have a pack of these yet? I know they just came out today but maybe someone has a promo deck or something. If anyone has them, can we get a review?

I just ordered some so when they come, I will give my review. The possibilities with these are endless! I can't wait.

If you want to see them or get some, here is the link:
http://www.ellusionist.com/cart/category.php?cat=190

Marc
Message: Posted by: Dave V (Jan 2, 2007 01:27AM)
Ordered a three pack this afternoon. Should have them in a couple of days.
Message: Posted by: Jessiah (Jan 2, 2007 10:30AM)
Ill be ordering a case... they seem like the kind of deck you could really put a story too. "These were my grandfathers cards" or "I found these in the basement, and they are actually quite magical". whatever whatever.

Its a shame they didn't use the best finish they have (Masters stock). But hopefully the stock is better than the regular bikes us playing card company puts out. The cut usually sucks. Tally Ho's are great though. I bet there just fine!

I was thinking you could get rid of that box, and just beat up an new box (cuts/rips). That might add to the realism. -Jesse
Message: Posted by: rippedandrestored35 (Jan 2, 2007 11:35AM)
I wish they werent so expensive. Its like 11 dollars altogether because of shipping.
Message: Posted by: Mystician (Jan 2, 2007 12:44PM)
These seem made for the bizarrist.

w00t !
Message: Posted by: magicmind (Jan 2, 2007 01:34PM)
[quote]
On 2007-01-02 12:35, rippedandrestored35 wrote:
I wish they werent so expensive. Its like 11 dollars altogether because of shipping.
[/quote]

12 decks = $59.95 + shipping ($6.00 for me in alabama) $66 /12 = $5.50 each

This price is not any different than balck tigers in a retail setting. How did you come up with $11 each?
Message: Posted by: LegendaryEgos (Jan 2, 2007 02:51PM)
What I did to make the shipping not an issue is I bought something else that I have had my eye on. (Ghost Gaff Deck-now this is expensive!) So my advise is either wait until you are going to buy something else and then throw the cards in or just find something right now that you want and get them now.

Marc
Message: Posted by: magicmind (Jan 2, 2007 04:43PM)
[quote]
On 2007-01-02 15:51, gobrownstd54 wrote:
What I did to make the shipping not an issue is I bought something else that I have had my eye on. (Ghost Gaff Deck-now this is expensive!) So my advise is either wait until you are going to buy something else and then throw the cards in or just find something right now that you want and get them now.

Marc
[/quote]

agreed! I just could not see how he came up with $11 each. This deck, as I pointed out is not anymore expensive than some of the others...except Ghost Gaff Deck ;)
Message: Posted by: tdowell (Jan 2, 2007 07:27PM)
One deck plus shipping can be pricey. Better off to buy in quantity.
Message: Posted by: Jessiah (Jan 3, 2007 12:50AM)
ALWAYS! I love to collect... I'll probably get a case of these. Great gifts for fellow magicians!
Message: Posted by: niva (Jan 3, 2007 02:29AM)
[quote]
On 2007-01-02 13:44, Mystician wrote:
These seem made for the bizarrist.

w00t !
[/quote]

I wouldn't use them as a bizarrist, if you want to be believed it's an authentic old deck. Although they look awesome, they don't look real. They are neatly cut, all straight and fan in a great way; All the opposite of how an old deck should behave.

But they DO look great!!!
Message: Posted by: niva (Jan 3, 2007 02:32AM)
Jessiah, can I be a fellow magician of yours :lol:
Message: Posted by: Roth (Jan 3, 2007 02:40AM)
Are these new cards that have a "worn" design? In other words you can't pass them off as actually "old" cards?
Message: Posted by: pkg (Jan 3, 2007 03:02AM)
Give a new deck a spin in the washing machine and then dip it in tea.
forget fanning/shuffling though!
Message: Posted by: Cameron Francis (Jan 3, 2007 12:10PM)
Well, you could say that it's an old deck that you had re-coated or something.
Message: Posted by: Jeff J. (Jan 3, 2007 12:46PM)
Laymen may believe a lot of stuff, but I don't know how many people would believe that there is actually a place that re-coats cards :)
Message: Posted by: ryesteve (Jan 3, 2007 01:01PM)
[quote]
On 2007-01-03 13:46, Ibd1Mon99 wrote:
Laymen may believe a lot of stuff, but I don't know how many people would believe that there is actually a place that re-coats cards :)
[/quote]
I think that place is next to the place where I get my sneakers retreaded :)
Message: Posted by: niva (Jan 3, 2007 02:04PM)
Lol

or else a spell that maintains there smoothness although their age :S


Rick any old deck from you? Actually this is a good idea to elaborate on. Rick?
Message: Posted by: RicHeka (Jan 3, 2007 03:32PM)
[quote]
On 2007-01-03 13:10, Cameron Francis wrote:
Well, you could say that it's an old deck that you had re-coated or something.
[/quote]

Actually,I just sprayed some old cards with 'Rustoleum'Painter's Touch flat clear coat.They dried perfectly in about 10 minutes smooth flat finish.

I have not seen these cards first hand yet,but it may not be too far a stretch to say you sprayed them for preservation.

I have these on order,and I am working on a routine that includes a couple of other antique objects.The guest's will never have to handle the cards.

Best.

Rich
Message: Posted by: tdowell (Jan 3, 2007 03:43PM)
How about saying you magically recoated them using an ancient polymer paint spell you found in a druid's oracle. Yeah, cool.
Message: Posted by: Bill Palmer (Jan 3, 2007 03:45PM)
Why they went to the trouble of putting out a "vintage" deck of cards in a "vintage" case with a UPC code on it is beyond me. Think about this, guys. If you want to snap people back into the 20th/21st centuries really quickly, bring out a box with a UPC code on it. You can't have an 1800's card case with a 1971 bar code on it. No bizarrist in his right mind (or his left mind or his wrong mind) would use a card case like this and represent it as a really old deck of cards.

They could have solved this problem by putting a sticker on the cellophane wrapper.

The Texan 45 cards look more authentic than these -- even though they have the bloody bar code.
Message: Posted by: RicHeka (Jan 3, 2007 03:57PM)
Yes Bill..I agree about the silly bar code.However,I guarantee that within an hour of receiving my deck that barcode will will no longer be visible. :)

Rich
Message: Posted by: Dave V (Jan 3, 2007 07:37PM)
I also think they would do better if they used something other than standard Bicycle backs. I think they came into being around 1894 or so when USPC came into existence.

The old Safety or Racer backs would have been a better choice for the period and even those didn't come around until the end of the 19th century.

That's not stopping me from looking forward to getting my hands on these. I'm sure I'll find a use for them.
Message: Posted by: Roth (Jan 3, 2007 08:02PM)
[quote]
On 2007-01-03 15:04, niva wrote:
Lol

or else a spell that maintains there smoothness although their age :S


Rick any old deck from you? Actually this is a good idea to elaborate on. Rick?
[/quote]
We've been working on an effect with aged cards (con man mentalism/western theme). I won't go into detail, or hijack this thread, but they will pricey.

I do think that there are countless routines that you guys will develope with the "odd" aged card in a deck revelation.

I love the "time glitch" storyline of the spec selecting the only card that has traveled from the past, into a new deck.
Message: Posted by: Chessmann (Jan 3, 2007 08:56PM)
The demo video is so tricked up that you don't get a real good look at the cards.

Fortunately, there are photos.
Message: Posted by: Cameron Francis (Jan 3, 2007 09:28PM)
I was thinking out loud with the whole re-coating thing. But, hey, I've heard crazier.

That's the main problem with these cards. They look cool, but what the heck are they? How do you use them? If they aren't "re-coated" or whatever, then how do you explain them?
Message: Posted by: Newb2 (Jan 3, 2007 09:39PM)
Just handle them slower than you would with a regular deck of cards. Why does the audience HAVE to know they feel exactly like new cards?
Message: Posted by: LegendaryEgos (Jan 3, 2007 09:41PM)
Well I think, at the very least, you will have a deck of cards that the spectator will remember. Although you could come up with something. I think what I will use is these are vintage cards that were restored and coated so they wouldn't fall apart...then I'll say "I probably shouldn't be using them but I just can't resist" or something like that...

I can't wait...should be here tomorrow.

Marc
Message: Posted by: Jessiah (Jan 4, 2007 03:33AM)
Niva, count yourself in bro! The next big convention, I got you! Or if your at Hank's on Saturday... :)
Message: Posted by: Steve Dela (Jan 4, 2007 08:22AM)
I have several presentations involving the invisable deck and one of these releates to an old pack of cards that has been in my family for years.

The fact that these look old from stage but will act like a new pack will be great for the routine I do.

I will probably make most of mine into invisable decks.

Steve Dela
Message: Posted by: justini (Jan 4, 2007 03:43PM)
I bought a dozen and was also thinking of making a few into Invisible Decks. Although I haven't thought of patter yet, it seems like some type of story about an old deck with magical qualities passed down through the years would fit. I agree that the bar code might be a problem, so maybe there is a way to cover, scratch or somehow make it less noticeable. All in all, though, I think these are just really cool to look at. I think any card trick might look more interesting to the audience when being performed with this deck. Can't wait to get mine!
Message: Posted by: justini (Jan 4, 2007 03:48PM)
One more thing - anyone know if they are coming out with a Vintage gaff deck, like the Red, Tiger and Ghosts? I know that the deck itself is almost a gaff, but it might be interesting to get some of the gaff cards in this vintage design.
Message: Posted by: Chessmann (Jan 4, 2007 04:50PM)
With the darker color of these cards, the aging of the card would not be nearly so noticeable.
Message: Posted by: Cameron Francis (Jan 4, 2007 05:12PM)
Invisible deck... now that's a good idea!
Message: Posted by: Mercury52 (Jan 4, 2007 09:52PM)
For those worried about the barcode and logo, why not cover it with some opaque tape? Could work even better if you bang the box around a bit first. It's so old, it has to be taped together...

Kevin
Message: Posted by: Charlie Justice (Jan 4, 2007 10:23PM)
[quote]
On 2007-01-04 18:12, Cameron Francis wrote:
Invisible deck... now that's a good idea!
[/quote]
The very second I saw these decks that's the first thought that came to mind.
They're going to fit into my routine very nicely. I'd like to have these in mini-bikes too.

peace, charlie
Message: Posted by: LegendaryEgos (Jan 5, 2007 03:28PM)
Well I got mine today and I am not disappointed! These cards are top quality just like all of http://www.ellusionists.com stuff. These cards look so amazing! I love all the face cards with all the cracking they look wicked! I will definatley be using this deck a lot and coming up with some good patter for them. Right now I think I'll say that they were real old and found in some cellar somewhere, maybe an old magician or something. Then I'll say I had them restored so I could still use them. Which would explain the barcode on the box...because the box they made, while the cards, they just sealed. Oh well, if the tricks are good, no one will think about the story!

If you are thinking of getting these cards, just go get them...they are definatly worth the money!

Marc
Message: Posted by: LegendaryEgos (Jan 5, 2007 07:21PM)
Just used these cards for a couple tricks and used the patter in my above post. The reaction was awesome. These cards add so much to a trick! How many other cards can do that?? I know the Ghost deck got some great responses too but these cards have their own patter. One person did say "sure those are old" but after the trick he was blown away and didn't mention the cards again, only to say they look cool.

Again, go get these!

Marc
Message: Posted by: Dave V (Jan 6, 2007 01:56AM)
I just got my 1800 cards. From a moderate distance they look very nice! Old and brown just like I expected them to be, but they handle like new.

Here are some early observations:

The card box looks old and torn, but in reality it's a fresh new box. Even the holes and cracks are painted on. Again, good from a distance but would never pass having someone believe it's actually an old box. Plus, the "E" logo and bar code are a dead giveaway that these aren't what they seem.

The cards have a "pseudo-random" pattern on the back. Let me explain:
All the backs start out with the same brown texture paint. An added bonus is that this texture isn't symmetrical so the deck can be used as a "one way" deck by reading the edges. Example: if you reverse the four aces in the deck, simply fanning the face down deck identifies the location of these four cards.

There are seven distinct back patterns imprinted on the brown back. These don't seem to be suit based, and if there's a numerical pattern to them I can't find it. (This would have been a GREAT idea if they had thought of it. You could have had a stacked deck that could be read from the back) The seven patterns vary in the intensity of the red pattern, but things like black smears or breaks/tears in the pattern are uniform. Some pattern groups have nearly twenty cards while one group consists of just one card that matches only the "E" advertising cards. One edge of Ten of Spades is visibly darker front and back than any other cards and it's the same on all three decks. That means the Ten of Spades visibly stands out from all the other cards in the deck whether it's face up or face down. It's painfully obvious with even a casual glance so I'd avoid using this as any kind of force card.

I can see people taking advantage of these pattern differences to set up potential marked hands or some other trick that requires locating a card (or group of cards) easily.

All in all, it's a great start. If I want to make them truly authentic, I'd keep the box in my back pocket for a few days and maybe use sandpaper to wear down the finish to coincide with the printed wear marks. Of course I'll also have to scratch off the bar code and even the Zip code off the flap as Zip codes weren't invented yet.

The cards can be used as is and would look great in front of an "Old West" reenactment group (as long as I don't hand the deck out for inspection, but I never need to so that shouldn't be a problem) The only glaring inconsistency is that the Bicycle pattern wasn't sold until around 1897 or so. They could have chosen a better back pattern than Bicycles if they wanted them to look truly "authentic."

These cards aren't for everybody, but they will fill a need for antique "looking" cards if your routine warrants it. My particular application is for a variation of the "Ten Card Poker Deal" where I will have only the cards I need in an old card box that I "found" somewhere along a dusty trail or in an old saddle bag from days gone by.
Message: Posted by: donkeys and waffles (Jan 6, 2007 02:09AM)
How do they feel as far as doing color changes and d lif*s and such ? I would think they would have a little getting used to time since they are painted or whatever ? Thanks in advance !!
Message: Posted by: Dave V (Jan 6, 2007 02:55AM)
Actually I should have said "printed" not "painted." All the coloration is printed in, then the card finish was applied. There is no difference in feel whatsoever.
Message: Posted by: donkeys and waffles (Jan 6, 2007 03:21AM)
Thanks, that was a concern, seems like they may feel like a grabby feel to them. Good to know, the Invisible deck would be real nice. I am too lazy to spray a deck but I am sure they will come out with one in good time. Thanks again
Message: Posted by: niva (Jan 6, 2007 06:17AM)
Thanks Jessiah! :) My next convention will probably be the IBM/SAM one.

And great idea Mr. Dela.
Message: Posted by: LegendaryEgos (Jan 6, 2007 09:36AM)
Dave V,

Awesome detailed review! I didn't even notice the backs like you did. I did notice they all looked different but that is great! I bet that Ellusionist will take heed to what you said about making a marked deck and put one together.

Great job!

Marc

PS Brad Christian has posted on this thread so I am sure he will see your review!
Message: Posted by: nukraze (Jan 6, 2007 10:32PM)
I got myself a few decks of these, and while I was waiting for them to arrive I set about making a leather case for them. I've seen some leather card cases before, but all I've seen have been black, so I got myself some brown leather and set to work. I attached a picture of what I have so far, all that is left is to toss the case around a bit to give it an "old" look, and then I have nothing to worry about with the card box, although I do hate covering its "beauty". Let me know what you think.
Message: Posted by: LegendaryEgos (Jan 6, 2007 11:33PM)
Nukraze...

That is sweet! Now that is a magician...figure out how to solve a problem!

Great job!

Marc

PS you should sell those!!
Message: Posted by: RicHeka (Jan 7, 2007 01:51PM)
I used the two advertising cards to solve the modern printing problems with this deck[bar code,zipcode,flap printing etc.]
I carefully cut the ad cards to fit the dimentions of the sides,bottom and flap.I eliminated all borders on the cut outs,and used a glue stick to attach them,thus covering up all modern printing.

Now the card box looks like something from the 19th Century with the red Bicycle pattern all around and NO modern printing.It actually turned out better than I expected. :)
I also used slightly diluted tea extract to color tint the GLARING whiteness of the box interior.I also brushed some on the card edges so they don't look so fresh.

Best.

Rich
Message: Posted by: DStachowiak (Jan 7, 2007 03:13PM)
[quote]
On 2007-01-04 22:52, Mercury52 wrote:
For those worried about the barcode and logo, why not cover it with some opaque tape? Could work even better if you bang the box around a bit first. It's so old, it has to be taped together...

Kevin
[/quote]
There was another thread about these, I suggested going to a stamp shop and finding a foreign stamp and just pasting it over the bar code like a tax stamp or something
Message: Posted by: LegendaryEgos (Jan 7, 2007 05:54PM)
PaleoMagi...

great idea! I am going to try that.

Marc
Message: Posted by: RicHeka (Jan 7, 2007 10:16PM)
I unsuccessfully tried to attach a couple of photos to a post here.If you would like to see my altered 1800 card box,just PM me with your e-mail address.

Best.

Rich
Message: Posted by: pegasus (Jan 9, 2007 03:02AM)
Are these available in Blue stock?
Message: Posted by: templetrickster (Jan 10, 2007 02:48PM)
Great stamp idea-i'll have to try that
Message: Posted by: tdowell (Jan 10, 2007 02:51PM)
Even with the minor inconsistancy of a bar code and perfect edges, these are a must have. I love em'.
Message: Posted by: pegasus (Jan 10, 2007 02:54PM)
[quote]
On 2007-01-09 04:02, pegasus wrote:
Are these available in Blue stock?
[/quote]
Message: Posted by: magicday (Jan 10, 2007 02:56PM)
No.
Message: Posted by: davidpaul$ (Jan 10, 2007 09:50PM)
Danny Archer markets a trick called "The Grandpa Deck"
(think along the lines of the trick called PHIL)
Anyway the patter in the instructions talk about a Grandpa who remembered the
names of his children and grandchildren by writing their names on the backs of cards. This deck would be perfect for Danny Archer's routine.
check out http://www.dannyarcher.com/grandpadeck.htm
you can easily adapt the vintage deck to fit this.
Message: Posted by: wolfsong (Jan 14, 2007 11:17PM)
I have been playing with this deck for a week or so and 2 things I noticed. One the boxes seen to fall apart rather quickly much quicker than most boxes and while this may work with the look of the deck the inside of the box is not aged and the clean white inside look strange in an aged box. Also when you tear a card in half a white powdery stuff kinda puffs out. anyone else notice any odd stuff with this deck?
Message: Posted by: Dave V (Jan 16, 2007 03:11AM)
I haven't torn up any cards so I haven't seen the white powder thing happen. I did notice that they're a bit "waxy" feeling. It causes them to drag against each other a bit making even a simple overhand shuffle difficult to control. It reminds me of the feel of a deck after applying fanning powder. I've been experimenting with making a stripper deck out of these and this drag makes stripping very difficult to control.
Message: Posted by: davidpaul$ (Jan 16, 2007 07:23AM)
[quote]
On 2007-01-10 22:50, davidpaul$ wrote:
Danny Archer markets a trick called "The Grandpa Deck"
(think along the lines of the trick called PHIL)
Anyway the patter in the instructions talk about a Grandpa who remembered the
names of his children and grandchildren by writing their names on the backs of cards. This deck would be perfect for Danny Archer's routine.
check out http://www.dannyarcher.com/grandpadeck.htm
you can easily adapt the vintage deck to fit this.
[/quote]

I posted the above quote and I am in error. Although the Granpa Deck is a great effect you "cannot" easily adapt the Vintage Deck. It would take at least 26 decks unless they come out with a one-way deck. If Ellusionist does, I will most certainly get it to do the Danny Archer effect. Sorry for the mistake.
Message: Posted by: MikeMetal2006 (Jan 16, 2007 02:53PM)
I really love the vintage series cards!!! I bought 3 packs and it was the best 22 dollars I have ever spent!!!
Message: Posted by: DerZauberer (Jan 19, 2007 10:48AM)
I received my Vintage Cards today. The cards are exactly what I had hoped for. They will be used constructively in my routines. I really like how they look.

Two problems though. Although it has already been pointed out – the Ellusionist logo and barcode on the bottom of the box detracts from the theme of an aged vintage deck of cards. E blew it with this one. They had a great idea and screwed up the packaging.

Upon opening one of my packs, I noticed that they were not cut squarely. The entire deck was off when cut. The 6 Spade was so far off, you can see the printer’s crop marks and the 6 is off the edge of the card. I opened two more of the 6 decks to see if this was an isolated problem. The two other decks are slightly off square when they were cut, but it’s not so noticeable that I cannot use these cards. I hesitate to open the other 3 because I wanted to keep some in mint condition.

I emailed my concern to Ellusionist and they requested that I take a photograph so they can investigate the problem. They also asked me to open my remaining 3 sealed decks. OH BOY – the other 3 were worse than the first one. My photos will illustrate what I mean. Out of 6 decks, 1 is fine, 2 are questionable and 3 are unusable. If you bought these cards, I recommend you check them right away, if you are considering purchasing these, look at them the moment they arrive.

http://www.derzauberer.net/images/series_1800_1w.jpg
http://www.derzauberer.net/images/series_1800_2w.jpg
http://www.derzauberer.net/images/series_1800_5w.jpg

So much for E claming they have the highest quality standards with their specialty playing cards.
Message: Posted by: Charlie Justice (Jan 19, 2007 10:55AM)
I too noticed upon a close examination that the backside of ten of spades is easily spotted in a facedown spred. While it may or may not be a good force card it makes for an excellent key card.

peace, charlie
Message: Posted by: DrTodd (Jan 19, 2007 11:00AM)
I ordered a six pack of these and I am generally pleased. Not keen on the big E and a bar code on the box, but the cards are great. 10s is real special, as it can be a face down key! Kind of a dirty deck card.....I use a pack of these in the Val Evans Stop Trick from Viking and in my presentation of my mental effect Cogito Ergo Sum....
Message: Posted by: LegendaryEgos (Jan 19, 2007 12:24PM)
Guys come on...I have 3 decks of these and of course they are off center!! These cards were printed so long ago that the printing press wasn't as good as it is now...jeesh..

Marc
Message: Posted by: DerZauberer (Jan 19, 2007 12:43PM)
[quote]
On 2007-01-19 13:24, gobrownstd54 wrote:
Guys come on...I have 3 decks of these and of course they are off center!! These cards were printed so long ago that the printing press wasn't as good as it is now...jeesh..

Marc
[/quote]

Excuse me; did you see how off center my cards are? These weren’t printed long ago, they were printed last month! Aside from the modern day bar-code, the printers CYMK color-key is showing, so the suspension of disbelief is pretty much blown.

Bicycle took great pride in the quality of their cards 100 years ago, they were hand cut, so finding cards off-center were not even this bad. Its not the printing press you speak of, it’s the cutting.

I have defective cards – I was accepting of two packs that were a little bit off, but 3 out of 6 decks is ridiculous!
Message: Posted by: LegendaryEgos (Jan 19, 2007 12:59PM)
DerZauberer

I am just joking...of course they weren't printed a long time ago...sorry, I thought you would see the comedy.

But seriously, that does suck...I have an unopened deck that I really didn't want to open and now I might. Make sure you post the fix that E provides you.

Thanks,

Marc
Message: Posted by: Charlie Justice (Jan 19, 2007 01:27PM)
The 7 of hearts is literally printed on the very edge of the card in my decks. While this irks the retentive side of my character, I'm not seeing it as a downside to the routines I'm using. I suppose that in with this particular deck I can "live with it" BUT I would still appreciate a more quality cut & print.

peace, charlie
Message: Posted by: magicmind (Jan 19, 2007 01:45PM)
As far as the bottom of the box, could you not cut one off another box, stain it and then glue in place? I know it would not be perfect, but would hide the E and such.
Message: Posted by: djrdjr (Jan 19, 2007 02:17PM)
[quote]
On 2007-01-19 13:43, DerZauberer wrote:
I have defective cards – I was accepting of two packs that were a little bit off, but 3 out of 6 decks is ridiculous!
[/quote]

Wow. You're more accepting than I am. I would expect them all to be perfect — that's what I'm paying for. Those photos you posted are making me leery of purchasing.
Message: Posted by: LegendaryEgos (Jan 19, 2007 03:58PM)
In my experience with Ellusionist they are always top notch when it comes to customer service and making things right. I had 2 things that I needed to return before...one was a card clip, which they took back and refunded me and the other was a DVD which since they didn't carry it anymore, they ended up letting me keep it and giving me a credit..

djrdjr, you don't have anything to worry about if you have some patience and that is only if your cards are messed up...mine are perfect.

I have to say that does really suck though...

Marc
Message: Posted by: DerZauberer (Jan 19, 2007 05:15PM)
Okay – it’s past my bedtime here in Europe but I wanted to show you this email I just received before I retire:

[quote] Hi George,
Ellusionist will, of course, replace the decks for you at no additional cost. I am concerned about shipping to Germany, however, as occasionally customs delays parcels for inspection. If you are willing to wait until you get to California that would be simpler, especially as we are based in California.

Let me know what you would like us to do, and we will do our best to accommodate your request.

Incidentally, the matter of the defective cards is being addressed with the manufacturer by Brad himself, as we are not pleased with the defects. We expect better, and so do our customers.[/quote]

Marc - I usually have a pretty good sense of humor and if I had read your post any other day I would have gotten the joke. But' it’s been a trying week for me and this was icing on the cake. I hope it did not appear as if I was snapping at you or getting personal – I am sorry about that…
Message: Posted by: LegendaryEgos (Jan 19, 2007 05:25PM)
DerZauberer,

no big deal at all...I'd be upset too. I hate when you wait for something for so long and then it arrives and there is something wrong with it...especially so far away!!! I knew Ellusionist would take care of you...in all my experience's with them they have been nothing but top notch. If they say they will fix the problem, they will.

Have a good night my friend!

Marc
Message: Posted by: djrdjr (Jan 20, 2007 04:49PM)
Okay, just picked up 2 decks this morning at the local brick 'n mortar. They are perfect!

I am relieved.

--d.
Message: Posted by: scrapdizzy (Jan 26, 2007 10:31PM)
Bought 2. Love them!

Paid $6.99 each.

Anyone know where to find the best deal on a case of 12?
Message: Posted by: Mercury52 (Jan 26, 2007 10:54PM)
There's a post by J Bayme over on Ellusionist's forums stating that all future runs of E cards at USPCC will now be done on the machines used for Casino Cards, resulting in an incredibly low percentage of printing/cutting errors. See the following...

"Guys,

We chatted this morning with the head of the printing and finishing department at the US Playing Card Company. This was a big meeting for us. Over the past few weeks, we've received reports of miscut cards. Some of these were just minor defects that did not render the deck unusable, but others were quite severe. As always, our customer service department has been replacing decks for any of you guys that have received a deck with severe printing defects.

We've sent every single reported incident to the USPCC. Every time one of you guys received a miscut deck (which was already extremely rare-- only around 35 reported issues with the Series 1800 out of thousands), the USPCC heard about it. Trust me-- we let them know.

This morning, the issue was made clear. Custom designed cards are printed on a separate machine at the US Playing Card Company. This machine, although equal in printing quality, lacks some of the quality control sensors that the Casino Grade machine allows. These sensors ($60,000 a piece) detect and prevent printing errors-- they stop them in their tracks. The Casino Grade machines achieve extraordinary quality-- simply put, casino decks cannot have a defect. Imagine what would happen in a high-stakes round of Vegas poker if a defect card was pulled off the top of the deck.

So here's what we're going to do. All Ellusionist cards printed from this point thereafter will be done on the CASINO grade machine. This will not guarantee 100% quality-- there could still be a mistake here and there-- but quality (and I quote) "should surpass 99%".

Outside of a Vegas casino, Ellusionist will be the only place to get custom cards of this quality. We're excited about this development, and we hope that this takes our cards up to an even higher level."
Message: Posted by: LegendaryEgos (Jan 27, 2007 04:45PM)
I knew Ellusionist would take care of this problem! Bravo!

Marc
Message: Posted by: Bill Palmer (Jan 28, 2007 01:08AM)
Actually, you can thank Richard Turner for this, to a certain degree. He was at the Castle a couple of weeks ago, and during that time, he visited Ellusionist. David Blaine walked in, handled a deck of Richard's cards and realized that the Turner cards had the feel that he had been looking for.

Richard's cards are cut on those casino machines, with the cutting being done the old way, not from the wrong side of the paper, which is what happens to the normal bikes we have come to know and love so well.

Blaine made a comment that Turner's cards made his cards feel like, well, fertilizer. So now the Blaine cards are going to be printed on the same stock as Richard's and cut from the same direction.

I got three of the Turner decks a few weeks ago, and have marvelled at how nice they are to work with. They almost second deal themselves.
Message: Posted by: Steve Dela (Jan 28, 2007 03:05PM)
Richard Turner is an amazing guy! I was watching the demos on his website and I was gobsmacked at his un-surpassed level of skill.

I also handled one of his gambler decks last week and I noticed a nice difference.

I would now like ellusionist to do a semi old deck... maybe a few face scratches here and there but printed on a subtle creamy stock, kinda like the texan re-prints.

Steve Dela
Message: Posted by: LegendaryEgos (Jan 28, 2007 11:53PM)
Wow....that is all I can say. (forgive me for going off topic here)

I have heard of Richard Turner and his quality cards over the years. I've never seen his playing cards. From the above 2 posts I found his site with google (www.richardturner52.com) and oh my God. If you haven't seen this guy with a deck of cards, you have to check him out. And on top of being the greatest with a deck of cards, he is LEGALLY BLIND! Here is a link to his site and a 12 minute demo that shows some of the most amazing card handling I have ever seen....and he's legally blind!?!?

http://www.richardturner52.com/performances.html

As far as his signature playing cards, I really don't like the look of them, but I am going to buy some just based on the reviews I have heard over the years and the video I just watched.

Thanks Bill for mentioning Richard Turner.

Marc
Message: Posted by: templetrickster (Jan 30, 2007 12:38AM)
Again, I hate the logo and code on the bottom of the box. Did it really take an extra month to release these cards and they still have stuff they should have re-thought? Also, the teaser pictures from the original proofs were perfect, they should have went with those from the beginning. The stock is okay, but I do feel as if they are sort of waxy come to think of it. Lastly, I like the cards a lot but I absolutely hate the "JB" hidden on the ace. When I buy cards, they are mine--they shouldn't be tagged with other magicians initials. Instead, they should make interesting ways to reveal a selected card--like the ghost deck. I hear after the first edition sells out, they are going to re-release these cards with some type of change(s).
Message: Posted by: LegendaryEgos (Jan 30, 2007 01:13AM)
Templetrickster,

Wow...I didn't even see that...who is JB?

Marc
Message: Posted by: RickVancouver (Jan 30, 2007 02:10AM)
I lucked out and got a good deck, no miscut cards. The E at the bottom of the box doesn't bother me at all.

A suggestion would be to also have the inside of the box "aged" as well.

Rick
Message: Posted by: Kjellstrom (Jan 30, 2007 05:03AM)
If you live in Europe, check this shop out, they have these cards:

VINTAGE SERIES 1800

http://www.my-magicshop.com/accessories/00000098c31219e02.html
Message: Posted by: Mercury52 (Jan 30, 2007 10:37PM)
JB, as signed on the Ace of Spades, is Jason Brumbalow, the main designer of the 1800 deck, as well as E's Red Gaff deck. He often goes by JBone online, and you can see his "JBone" signature on the box for the 1800's as well.

Kevin
Message: Posted by: ClouDsss (Jan 31, 2007 09:08AM)
My first reaction was "wow they had barcodes in 1800s?"


Then I realised that it must have been a mistake on E's part :( hopefully they will change this in the 2nd batch?
Message: Posted by: magicinsight (Jan 31, 2007 09:20AM)
I am going to wait a while before orderign these from E so they can sell out their "old" and defective batche and wait for the new ones to arrive.

Michael
Message: Posted by: raether (Feb 4, 2007 10:23PM)
I just got mine. I must say, they are very nice! They look real urban and gritty - even close up. I have not had any printing problems in the two decks I have opened.
Message: Posted by: Charlie Justice (Feb 5, 2007 10:02AM)
I'm now using these Vintage cards with Kollosal Killer and a re-tooled presentation to match the look of the cards.

I can't say that the reactions are any better (can you really improve KK -lol-) but the whole package (cards & routine) sure looks and feels better.

peace, charlie
Message: Posted by: paisa23 (Feb 8, 2007 12:26PM)
Charlie, since I currently do Heirloom. I love KK and wanted these cards mainly for that reason alone. What wallet do you use? Anyway I didn't get a chance to order the first batch. Now I have to wait. But I also wish they would take the masters Blue and red into consideration for there re-release of these for the simple fact of Collor Changes or other issues like Tricycle, or other little things that would need to change in order for me to make massive orders to make these the only cards I use. Any word on re-release or anything like that?
Message: Posted by: RickThibau (Feb 8, 2007 06:32PM)
Im still waiting, solt out.
arg!

The off-center thing looks terrible, I had problems with a Tally-Hos but kept for fun (in fact I have a exagerated one way back).

These cards suit me a lot. I need 100 packs.
Message: Posted by: Kjellstrom (Feb 14, 2007 06:48AM)
Haunted Deck, where the cards spookily moves forward must be a perfect trick to do with the new Vintage 1800 Deck. Yo can tell them that you found this deck in a old haunted house... Put some Zink Powder (fanning powder) on the cards before performance, and blow, it will look like its an very old deck! -"what a dust there is!"
Message: Posted by: A_Blake (Feb 15, 2007 04:04PM)
I have a massive collections of card decks (over 2500) and these attracted me when I saw them at Ellusionist... I ordered a case of 12 and they arrived a week ago... These are very, very nice... look great, feel great, handle very nicely... When I showed them to my friends Shoot Ogawa and David Minkin at the Castle last Friday they instantly loved them and will be ordering their own cases...

As for the bar code and "E" logo on the bottom of the case... I fixed that in 2 minutes flat... take a thin knife (I used and Exacto) and pry the bottom flap apart... simply glue the flaps together in reverse with the one that has the bar code on the inside... the new top flap is going to be mostly white (it has a slight edged border but the area where it was under the original top flap will be white)... this is easily remedied by painting it with some brown and burnt sienna markers, watercolors, crayons or oil pastels... I used some watercolor and oil pastels and mixed a color that matched the aged look on a small piece of paper... then using my finger I put a bit on the end, smeared it a little and then applied it to the flap by rubbing it in... I played with the coloration till it matched the rest of the aged box... once the paint was dry I used some black crayon to add a little more aging and voila, it looked perfect!...

As for the inside of the box... take a little water color paint in brown and burnt sienna... water it down well... then with a thick but fairly plyable brush simply paint the inside of the box... then take some Q-Tips and rub in areas where you want it to look a bit worn... on the card flap add a little extra paint, maybe a few streaks of black and then let the card box dry... as long as you don't get the box too wet it won't warp on you... later take some fine grit sandpaper and sand the top flap to make it look a bit more worn...

My modifications, both outside and inside took me all of 10 minutes to do and it improves the look so much...

Also, don't be too worried that 808's weren't available 100 years ago... most people don't know the provenance of cards and will never notice... also, I look at these cards not as 100 years old but that they might be a well used deck that's 30-40-50 years old (well within the 808 life range)... I use a story that it's one of the first deck of cards I ever got and because they are my "lucky" cards I've never thrown them away...

Hope this helps...

Success!!!

Tony Blake
The Thoughtreader
Õ¿Õ¬
Message: Posted by: RicHeka (Feb 15, 2007 04:24PM)
[quote]
On 2007-01-07 14:51, PaleoMagi wrote:
I used the two advertising cards to solve the modern printing problems with this deck[bar code,zipcode,flap printing etc.]
I carefully cut the ad cards to fit the dimentions of the sides,bottom and flap.I eliminated all borders on the cut outs,and used a glue stick to attach them,thus covering up all modern printing.

Now the card box looks like something from the 19th Century with the red Bicycle pattern all around and NO modern printing.It actually turned out better than I expected. :)
I also used slightly diluted tea extract to color tint the GLARING whiteness of the box interior.I also brushed some on the card edges so they don't look so fresh.

Best.

Rich
[/quote]
Nice thinking Tony!

I stated earlier in this thread[above]as to how I 'antiqued' my card box.All the members who PM'd me with their e-mail have reacted positively to my photo's,that I will gladly send to anyone who request's them.
It's just another way to accomplish the same goal,but I must say my cardbox really looks like something from the 19th century. :)
You may want to give this a go for comparison purposes.

Best.
Rich
Message: Posted by: ChinaMan (Feb 21, 2007 10:05AM)
Just got this from http://www.ellusionist.com. Sorry to say, the Bicycle Vintage 1800 Series is now out of stock but will be back by April.

Best,
the ChinaMan
Message: Posted by: LWright (Feb 21, 2007 10:48AM)
With a lot of improvements apparently.

Hopefully to the box as well.
Message: Posted by: vanishingrabbit (Feb 21, 2007 10:18PM)
Vintage cards are cool but my customers say that they smell bad and I agree. I have about 18 decks left. PM me if interested. They going fast
Message: Posted by: e-man (Feb 22, 2007 01:29AM)
Go here to see a real vintage Bicycle deck
http://web.mac.com/merlin_ink/iWeb/MERLIN/Library.html
Message: Posted by: daffydoug (Apr 9, 2007 07:04PM)
This is an interesting concept...because I was always taught that your props (cards and coins, ropes and whatever) reflect you as a magician. Thus if your props are old and dirty and worn, it reflects unfavorably on you as a performer.

HOWEVER, this seems to be the exception to the rule!

It has really set my mind to thinking.
Message: Posted by: Starromeo (Apr 10, 2007 06:52AM)
Looking forward to the new revised version
Message: Posted by: The Amazing Noobini (Apr 26, 2007 07:24PM)
Yes, I'm hoping that the new ones (that are out now) will be less yellow. The rumors have said that they would be, but the Ellusionist page for the decks doesn't say anything about that specifically (which I find a bit odd if the tint was indeed changed since they do like to list everything they possibly can as new and completely wonderful.)

In any case they are now even more "worn" and are also available in blue. Which is nice. (I'll buy red anyway).

And most importantly: They now come on "thick casino stock", whatever that actually is exactly. I do not like thin flimsy cards.

Anyway, I'm sure everybody who are into cards like these already know all of this.

I would love to hear some first impressions from someone who have gotten their new decks.
Message: Posted by: gmmagic124 (Apr 27, 2007 10:07PM)
I like it from what I can see so far.

Thanks Bill Palmer for the sticker idea.
Message: Posted by: rorythegreat (Apr 29, 2007 12:21AM)
Just received these today. They do look better than the older ones but they still haven't taken the bar code off of the box! Other than that I am very pleased.
Message: Posted by: The Amazing Noobini (Apr 29, 2007 05:41AM)
Sounds good! I ordered 6 decks without the patience to wait for feedback from someone who has gotten theirs. I think 6 decks of these will probably last a lifetime. It's a special occasion item in a way.

I don't think this kind of box looks convincing anyway if it's the same as the one the last run of cards came in. Too glossy and modern, only with wear clearly prited on. Would look great in a video but not up close in my opinion.

Real old decks come in boxes with much older looking design and cardboard. Besides, in real life, really old decks all come with a rubber band around them. :)

Wonder if one could use smoke to age the sides without ruining the feel of the deck. Just thought of that as I was typing this.
Message: Posted by: RicHeka (Apr 29, 2007 05:55AM)
[quote]
On 2007-04-29 06:41, The Amazing Noobini wrote:


Wonder if one could use smoke to age the sides without ruining the feel of the deck. Just thought of that as I was typing this.
[/quote]

I just scraped some soft pencil lead on some paper smeared my finger into it and rubbed it all over the white edges of the deck.Voila!

Rich
Message: Posted by: Xenafor (Apr 29, 2007 11:00AM)
Burn Frankincense on a burn safe surface, and while it's combusting it releases it's oil in charcoal black. don't get too close, but put the edges of the deck only slightly in the visible black line of smoke. Instant smoke-dye.

Michael
Message: Posted by: Chris Oberle (Apr 29, 2007 11:27AM)
[quote]
On 2007-02-22 02:29, e-man wrote:
Go here to see a real vintage Bicycle deck
http://web.mac.com/merlin_ink/iWeb/MERLIN/Library.html
[/quote]

e-man, Which photo are you referring to?
Message: Posted by: RicHeka (Apr 29, 2007 11:48AM)
[quote]
On 2007-04-29 12:00, Xenafor wrote:
Burn Frankincense on a burn safe surface, and while it's combusting it releases it's oil in charcoal black. don't get too close, but put the edges of the deck only slightly in the visible black line of smoke. Instant smoke-dye.

Michael
[/quote]

That must be the Biblical method. :)

Rich
Message: Posted by: The Amazing Noobini (May 5, 2007 05:57AM)
I won't be burning any incenses in this apartment I think. Tried it with some old candels which I was going to throw out because they give off way too much soot. But that had no effect. Maybe I'll try the pencil idea or some other charcoal or graphite from my old artists toolbox.

The new 1800s arrived today. They do look a lot less yellow than the first series. All in all a paler deck of cards with more uniform backs. I kinda liked the red ink tone of the first run tho, which is now gone as the extra shiny yellow ink coat is no longer boosting the reds. I won't complain about that however since I have gotten my wish fulfilled of more authentically aged looking cards.

Having finally now used the first 1800s for a week while I was waiting for these, I have to say that the first edition rank among the nastiest cards I've ever had to work with. I think these will be better. Hope so.
Message: Posted by: magic777 (May 5, 2007 05:02PM)
They are OK. I like the tip for aging the edges with soft pencil lead which I will be applying to my set. Why is there a barcode on the box? The box should be authentic.
Message: Posted by: The Amazing Noobini (May 5, 2007 05:29PM)
[quote]
On 2007-05-05 18:02, magic777 wrote:
Why is there a barcode on the box? The box should be authentic.
[/quote]

A_Blake has some good barcode removal tips a few posts above yours.

Having said that, I would have to agree that a bar code is unneccessary. Why not have it on a removable piece of paper or on a removable sticker?

Having said that too, the box looks absolutely nothing like an old box of cards. It looks like a very new very glossy modern box designed to look aged to a slightly ridiculous degree.

It is beautiful tho. It's just not authentic looking. Of course.. the cards aren't the least bit authentic looking either. Without the numerous white cracks over the pips and with the same amount of "wear" at the edges of the faces and hardly any except for a slight color tint at the middle, it would look authentic.

Having said... well... it's a very cool deck really. And there are no better retro looking decks around. (The Texan 1889 deck is a lot prettier but also waaay too yellow)
Message: Posted by: tdowell (May 5, 2007 06:54PM)
[quote]
The Texan 1889 deck is a lot prettier but also waaay too yellow
[/quote]Where can I find the Texan 1889 deck???
Message: Posted by: The Amazing Noobini (May 5, 2007 07:50PM)
[quote]
On 2007-05-05 19:54, tdowell wrote:

Where can I find the Texan 1889 deck???
[/quote]

You may already know these as many refer to them as Texan '45 (which is confusing since there are at least two other decks people like to call Texan 45).

The box says "Texan, first produced in 1889". But they are order number R45, which may stand for "Russel & Morgan Texan 45" or "Reprint 45". Or something.

Anyway, I got mine from the UK a while back, but I now like to buy my cards from this eBay seller: http://stores.ebay.com/Full-Boat-Dealer-Playing-Cards
I won't post the direct link to the cards since the long url will break the layout here and make everyone's posts hard to read. But he has some nice scans of them as well. Check out the nicest Ace of Spades I think have ever seen.

Here is another eBayer I think I can vouch for: http://stores.ebay.com/Merz67

The UK site, which I also like a lot: http://www.cards4magic.co.uk/acatalog/Cards.html

Kardwell also have them, but they are very expensive on shipping charges.

These cards are like I said also quite yellowish, or cream colored. A bit too much. They also have the odd oily feel when they are new. But they are still very very nice cards. I love the old looking court cards and the tiny index numbers.
Message: Posted by: Tom Jorgenson (May 6, 2007 09:18PM)
I love the incredible one-way-ness of these decks. Has anyone played with this? See you in the Inner Thoughts.
Message: Posted by: djrdjr (May 6, 2007 11:08PM)
I can get you sealed Texans at $3 per deck plus actual shipping if you message me.
Message: Posted by: The Curator (Jul 4, 2007 04:29AM)
[quote]
On 2007-01-02 13:44, Mystician wrote:
These seem made for the bizarrist.

w00t !
[/quote]

My first bizarre routine with the cards.
Cold Case Closer...

[img]http://img299.imageshack.us/img299/2239/closer1weblo9.jpg[/img]
Message: Posted by: mesmer (Jul 7, 2007 06:30PM)
A small tips.....I open the card case and breakdown the box, so I can colour the inside of the box....I used Yellow Tea....rub it in with a wet sponge and let it dry overnight.....then after its dry, BEFORE I glue the box back together...I put it on a floor then put stacks of Hardcover Books on top of it, to make it lay flat again.....wait for an hour or two, then I glue the box back together.....its look waay much better now, since its ilogcal for the outside of the box to look that old but the inside look so white and pristine!.......
Message: Posted by: RicHeka (Jul 7, 2007 06:47PM)
[quote]
On 2007-07-07 19:30, mesmer wrote:
A small tips.....I open the card case and breakdown the box, so I can colour the inside of the box....I used Yellow Tea....rub it in with a wet sponge and let it dry overnight.....then after its dry, BEFORE I glue the box back together...I put it on a floor then put stacks of Hardcover Books on top of it, to make it lay flat again.....wait for an hour or two, then I glue the box back together.....its look waay much better now, since its ilogcal for the outside of the box to look that old but the inside look so white and pristine!.......
[/quote]

Hi Mesmer:I also used slightly diluted tea extract,however why go to all the trouble of breaking down and re-glueing the box?

I just used a medium artists paint brush to paint the inside and it looks naturally old.

I also rectified the issues with the exterior of the box as I stated in an earlier post.If anyone would like to see the result ..just PM me with your e-mail. See previous post here.

http://www.themagiccafe.com/forums/viewtopic.php?topic=191875&forum=109&start=30

Best.
Rich
Message: Posted by: mesmer (Sep 16, 2007 09:48AM)
Hmmm......I never tought of using a paint brush.....since Im a perfectionist so....

hey thanx for the link tho!

I used this with Heirloom in a premontition effects + Manhattanville + My own version of Pegasus Page using Manhattanville + Murphy Chest + The Relic.....its all inside the Murphy Chest....that I calim as a Heriloom from my Great Uncle Charlie