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Topic: Doves 101
Message: Posted by: Kingry (Jan 9, 2003 03:32PM)
Has anyone seen this video? What is your opinion? I already own all of Tony Clarks tapes. Any differences? Thanks.
Message: Posted by: Dave Scribner (Jan 9, 2003 06:51PM)
I haven't seen the video personally but it did get a thumbs up by Dale Salwak of Chavez and Lance Burton. Looking at the topics covered, it doesn't seem to have much new in subject matter and if you already have the Tony Clark series, you probably already know more than what is covered. Judging by the title alone, I would think this is a beginner video.
Message: Posted by: kingsnqueens (Jan 10, 2003 12:47AM)
Hello Kingry,

Andy's 101 tape is excellent, and I recommend it.

Also Marty from martinismagic@hotmail.com you can get General Grants "Stealing for a living" on DVD.

Then with what you already have. You'll have the best there is out there.

Unless you get the Peter White tapes, or maybe the Victor-Diamond tape. Or maybe the Ice tape or, or, or.....

Really, you'll get a lot from Dove 101.

With these & a lot of love, practice, and patience you'll be great!

Good Luck with your doves.......

Manyfingers
Message: Posted by: Dave Scribner (Jan 10, 2003 06:20AM)
Kingry, all of the videos mentioned by Manyfingers are good. The list of sources goes on and on. It all depends on what you are looking for.

If you want advice on care, feeding and training, then Gen Grant's "How to make a living Stealing.. Doves of course" won't help and neither will the Victor and Diamond tapes. These are lecuture videos showing their effects and methods. Good sources if you're looking for ideas, though.

Tony Clark's as you already know, covers every phase of dove handling and work. Although very difficult to get, the videos by Amos Levkovitch, "Dove Tales" and "Just do it", are great sources for dove care and handling plus you get to see his entire stage act which is outstanding.

It never hurts to increase your library. There are many books and videos available on Dove work, and my suggestion to you, if you are really serious about doing a dove act, is to get as many as you can and study techniques and presentations.
Message: Posted by: sperris (Jan 11, 2003 04:08PM)
Hey what's up, Andy's video is KILLER. By far the best dove video out there after the DDIS of Dove Magic video series. D101 is a MUST have no question. Tony's is okay too, Tony covers more on traveling and care than Andy's.
Message: Posted by: Dave Scribner (Jan 11, 2003 04:27PM)
sperris: Have you seen the entire Tony Clark series? They take you step by step in care, feeding, handling, training, performing, as well as props, gimmicks, and clothes. I think you may get a lot of argument from dove workers by saying "Tony's is OKAY." To be honest with you, in all my years of magic, I have never seen a "bad" dove book or video. Again, as I mentioned in a previous post, it all depends on what you are looking for. Since I don't have the Doves 101 vid, I can't really comment on it's content or value but I do intend to get it for my library.
Message: Posted by: jlareau (Jan 13, 2003 12:37AM)
Hey Dave....any suggestions on books on dove work. I'm not a video fan. (Although My mother and I watched the video you sent me and she is in the process of tailoring my tux...thanks again!)

-jlareau
:bluebikes:
Message: Posted by: Dave Scribner (Jan 13, 2003 05:57AM)
The list of dove books is tremendous. I'll list a few here in no particular order.

Unmasked...... Tony Clark
How to make a living Stealing Doves. Gen Grant
Enclyclopedia of dove Magic.... Ian Adair
Enclopedia of dove Magic... Chavez

There are more, but this is a good start.

There are quite a few small paperback books that have good ideas such as "come out flying" and "cagey doves". Both are available from Abbott's and probably most other dealers. I have all of these that I've mentioned but am the opposite of you. I am better with videos than with books.
Message: Posted by: sperris (Jan 14, 2003 10:41AM)
Whoa man, I didn't mean Tony's video is OKAY as far as meaning it totally sucks, that's not what I was getting at. I threw it in as a plug for Tony's, knowing that I'd get arguments about Tony's videos. Yeah I have the full Tony Clark series and yeah they are good, I would just rank Andy's more so on effects. However, for the serious dove worker I feel that the best videos are the Deep Dark Inner Secrets of Dove Magic from P&A. Peter's thinking in dove magic is so far ahead of everyone else's that I've seen that after you watch the video you WANT to and feel you NEED to take your act to the next level. So no offense to Tony and sorry to anyone who was offended by what I had written saying my view of his videos.
Message: Posted by: Dave Scribner (Jan 14, 2003 11:23AM)
Sperris: No offense taken by me. Peter is a personal friend of mine and I agree that his approach to Dove Magic, and all other aspects of magic, is far beyond most others.
Message: Posted by: omnibozo (Jan 15, 2003 04:31PM)
You might also check out videos and lecture notes from Victor and Diamond. There is a national dove organization that has a website with info on caring for doves... don't have the address handy, but a quick google search will pop it up.
Message: Posted by: Dave Scribner (Jan 16, 2003 06:08AM)
Omnibozo: The address of the dove association is http://www.doveline.com however, they will not have the information Jon is looking for. His question was about working with doves in magic. The dove association is a great source for breeding, care, handling etc.
Message: Posted by: Kingry (Jan 21, 2003 06:26PM)
Received the tape. Horrible production quality, but tons of great info. Highly recommended.
Message: Posted by: kingsnqueens (Feb 26, 2003 07:37PM)
I've found that if you really want to grow in a particular field of magic.

That it's wise to gather as much information as you can get about the subject your interested in.

Look & read everything you can, and I think you'll find something that works for you. Even if only to learn that what they're doing isn't your style.

I'm always amazed when I buy a trick that stinks. Only to see someone come up and perform it like a miracle.

How about when you go to a lecture, and when it's over you come out, and everybody carrying a load of notes, and props.

A few weeks later there's a bunch of these items for sale on eBay.

I guess what I'm trying to say try it all out, and from there you'll start finding what's you, and make it yours.

Just my 2cents worth....... Manyfingers
Message: Posted by: Visual_Close_Up (Jun 21, 2008 04:10PM)
I just got Doves 101 by Andy Amyx and it is the best dove DVD out there today he explains everything so well and I loved the tips he gave me.
Message: Posted by: Kyle^Ravin (Jun 22, 2008 09:36AM)
Greg Frewin's videos cover a lot too... I would rank it as my favourite.
Message: Posted by: Dynamike (Jun 23, 2008 09:32AM)
[quote]
On 2003-01-14 11:41, sperris wrote:
However, for the serious dove worker I feel that the best videos are the Deep Dark Inner Secrets of Dove Magic from P&A.
[/quote]
Can someone give more info on this?
Message: Posted by: dove-boy (Jun 23, 2008 11:07AM)
This is a home made video: Shot underground starring Peter White & his student Jason Purdy(Co-invented with Cliff Wigg for the PWPro Cage).

This sells for US$100.00 plus a full information of doves lecture notes at that time.

If I recall correctly, there is suppose to be 3 Vol...but when I bought it a few years back...Peter only manage to complete till vol 2...he told me he will be sending vol 3 once is ready......but a few years passed...NO news on Vol 3, now I can't find the dove tapes on sale at his site too.

There are tons of valuable information in it, esp. the thick dove lecture notes...but the quality of the video is bad cos is home made....very similar to the quality by another underground rare 2 vol. dove video by 3rd place FISM comedy winner, Norlin Crawer (Doveworker who teaches a neat idea of the dove appears from the mouth, aka rubber dove.

Hope this helps :)
dove-boy
Message: Posted by: Dave Scribner (Jun 23, 2008 12:14PM)
Discussing which is the best video is like asking what is the best card trick. There are many videos on the market and they are all good.

A lot of them have been mentioned in this topic. Just read all the posts here and you'll get a good idea of what is covered in each. Let's not forget Greg Frewin's series either. Talk about an in depth dove tutorial. It's a bit expensive but covers everything.
Message: Posted by: Dynamike (Jun 23, 2008 01:03PM)
Thank you for the information gentlemen.

Dove-boy, is the video still being sold?
Message: Posted by: Dave Scribner (Jun 23, 2008 01:56PM)
Mike, it's probably better to contact Peter directly. That way you'll know for sure.

His email is

peterwhitepasilks@yahoo.com
Message: Posted by: Dynamike (Jun 23, 2008 02:23PM)
That I will do Dave. I never knew anything about them.
Message: Posted by: Dave Scribner (Jun 23, 2008 03:34PM)
BTW, dove-boy isn't exaggerating about the quality of these videos. They have good information but don't expect studio quality. In fact, don't even expect you-tube quality.

Peter gave me a set of these years ago since we're friends and I think I got a little better quality but not much.
Message: Posted by: jasanchez (Jun 24, 2008 06:00PM)
I think Andy Amyx's Video is great, if your really into dove magic you show should purchased every single dove video, their so many things to know about dove magic, you want to get all the information possible. Each Video out their teaches you different methods of training and producing birds. So I recommend getting every video on dove magic.
Message: Posted by: close_up_act (Jun 27, 2008 12:45PM)
Speaking of dove productions....Shimada's DVD on dove magic shows some nice productions.
Message: Posted by: Hansel (Jun 30, 2008 02:16PM)
Andy Amyx video is GREAT!!! Have easy stuff for the beginner and Excellent for the Pro!
Thanks,
Hansel!