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Topic: New to manipulation
Message: Posted by: LDM (Oct 7, 2007 06:07PM)
For the last half-year, I have sadly (or perhaps happily) faded out of magic. Probably because I have been busy with sundry other things. When I [i]was[/i] practicing magic, it was, like the rest of my life, very all-over-the-place: mnemonics one moment, coin magic the next. However, magic calls me once again and I feel that now is the time, at 15, to really "get into it."

Recently, I have been beginning to write some music. I may be putting a band together, but regardless, my second love is most definitely listening to, learning about, and performing music. Listening-wise, I have been almost religious about following The Beatles. I've become a wannabe audiophile and have thus been learning all about vinyl, bit rates, headphones, et al.

I digress-- because of my even more so increased love of music and magic, I have thought about combining the two. I envision some sort of stage/platform performance in which I can sing and also perform magic. Manipulation thus comes to mind, as it is both visual and could fit alongside vocals. There are probably other possible things to do (rockin' out with cups and balls?), but McBride-like stuff seems to be ideal. Not only that, but I have always had a love for the visual aspect [and challenge] of manipulation.

So. Does anyone have any suggestions for learning sources (books, DVDs, etc.) or any tips overall? I am aware of the McBride sets, both card manipulation and general. I am aware that you guys probably receive "I'm new, please help me" questions all of the time, and I'm afraid that I'm just another one of those. Any pointable-directions or helpful suggestions are appreciated. Thanks!
Message: Posted by: The Great Danton (Oct 7, 2007 06:54PM)
Hey welcome to the Café! You are right, and there are and have been many "I'm new" posts. These can prove very helpful when you are looking for ways to get started. There is also the "The Good, The Bad, and The Garbage" forum, where you can fin reviews on just about any thing you could want (as long as it has to do with magic).

I hope this helped you in some way, and the you have a great time learning about and performing magic!

The Great Danton
Message: Posted by: LDM (Oct 7, 2007 07:06PM)
I'm not new to the Café, nor to magic, really. I've been into it for a few years now, if you search around under my username, you'll see my somewhat "active" past. It's just that a) I have faded somewhat in the last few months, and b) manipulation itself is a mostly new, unpracticed style to me. I can do basic thumb fans and whatnot, but I'm also looking to do more than just card manipulation (though cards are fine).

Like you suggested, though, I have been searching around on the forums and reading various topics, all of which have been helpful. Keep in mind I'm on a budget, so books (and inexpensive props) are just as useful as videos.

Message: Posted by: JamesTong (Oct 8, 2007 03:50AM)
There are so much materials and resources to recommend, LDM. As you have mentioned you are on a tight budget, and your choice would really depends on your budget. Perhaps it would help if you could just give us an indication of your budget and what exactly you are looking for?

* Props and accessories?
* Books?
* DVDs?

All of the three above? Or your budget only allows for one of the three above?

We would like to help.
Message: Posted by: LDM (Oct 8, 2007 08:49AM)
I'd like to get my money's worth, that's all. I can afford both DVDs and books, but I'd just like to get a lot out of them. For instance, Royal Road holds much more value than a single-trick Ellusionist DVD. Like I said, I'm not new to purchasing magic, so I know who is reputable and what mediums work for me. It does not really matter if all of the best material is in video, likewise in books. Value is the key, with a low price preferred but not needed.

The one thing I will stray away from, at the moment, are expensive props. I am quite aware that for manipulation, some larger, well-built props can cost quite a bit of money yet are worth it in the end. This is fine, but I feel that at this stage, I am not ready for those nor do I need such props.

The bottom line is that I want to know which direction I should begin to head in. I've been around long enough to know about various esteemed DVD sets and manipulation tools, but I wanted to hear some opinions. Thanks.
Message: Posted by: The Great Danton (Oct 8, 2007 10:53AM)
Opps, I apologize for that, I should have looked at your post count a little closer. =]

Welcome to the manipulation forum anyway. (unless you've been here for a while as well, in which case, nice to see you back)

Are you looking for card manipulation resources, or are card something you would like to stay away from? I would suggest a good DVD to start with for cards, being Tony Clarks Award Winning Card Routine. I got this after a few other manip. videos, and wished I would have gotten it sooner. The good thing about this video is it covers enough to really get you started, and later you can get say...the McBride DVD's. Tony's is one video so it doesn't cost as much, as the three McBride videos.

I am actually trying to get my hands on some better Ball manipulation material at the moment, so I'm afraid I can't help you there.

As for books...I can't think of any really good ones right now, I know there are some out there though.

Message: Posted by: JamesTong (Oct 8, 2007 11:02AM)
Before we go into the books, dvds and props, perhaps we can identify what you want to go into. There are quite a few things we can do in manipulations and they are ...

* Card fanning and productions
* Multiplying Billiard Balls
* Linking Rings
* Candles
* Canes
* Zombie
* Thimbles
* Cd manipulations
* Cigarettes, cigars and pipes manipulations
* Coins manipulations and misers dream
* Eggs manipulations
* and more

All of us have personal preferences to the list above. Some likes to do half the list and some want to do all.

Before we can suggest which direction you should begin to head in ... we should also identify what your preferences are from the list above. From there we can suggest all the resources pertaining to your preferences. Stage manipulations is very very wide and not everyone would like everything in the list above.
Message: Posted by: LDM (Oct 8, 2007 01:47PM)
Danton, I will check out the Tony Clark DVD.

Mr. Tong, I'm not looking for anything in particular; that's why I'm posting here. Resources like McBride's Word Class Manipulation DVDs or Manipulation Without Tears may be for me, because they offer a wide variety of magic. Thus, I'm wanting to know if there are similar learning resources like those DVDs, or maybe those are the best. Also note my original goal: to perform manipulation... in a band. Thus, props like a zombie ball may be a bit tacky (or not), if you catch my drift.

If you're [i]really[/i] looking for categories of interest, I'd probably lean towards cards and away from cigarettes, eggs, and thimbles. Cards, mainly because I'm more familiar with them and they seem most adaptable to what I'm looking for.

Again-- I'm looking for your thoughts on my thoughts. Thanks.
Message: Posted by: Dizzy (Oct 8, 2007 07:28PM)
Lewis Ganson's Routined Manipulation. When you are looking for particular things, search the Café, I've found great advice and ideas from fellow Café members. Good luck,

Message: Posted by: ibm_usa (Oct 11, 2007 10:07PM)
I sense a very unique act in progress!
Message: Posted by: LDM (Oct 12, 2007 08:45PM)
Indeed. :D Doubtless I'll have to perform a Beatles cover sometime. Your Mother Should Know, maybe?

I will most likely purchase Tony Clark's Award Winning Card Routine DVD, as it looks like a great introduction into card manipulation magic. Can anyone else chime in on the Routined Manipulation volumes, or any other suggestions?

Message: Posted by: Nedim (Oct 13, 2007 04:58AM)
Get Jeff McBride's series. There are great Dvds on the market for manipulation.

You can learn every kind of manipulation from them.

magicially yours,

Nedim Guzel
Message: Posted by: JamesTong (Oct 13, 2007 07:11AM)
If you are to perform in a band, then I would suggest the following manipulation categories ...

* canes ... appearing and dancing cane
* microphone manipulation ... productions, levitations, multiplications, etc
* fire manipulation ... fire from hand ... fickle fire
* rose and flower manipulation ... roses production, color changes, levitations

Just food for thoughts.
Message: Posted by: T.G Kenny (Oct 16, 2007 11:38AM)
If you are new to manipulation , then you can get Tony Clark's Card manipulation DVD .
If you only want to know more ways to produce a card , eg: perfect production , eclips production and etc etc . Get McBride's card Manipulation series !

Anyway , I highly recommend you to get Tony Clark's DVD if you are new !

Message: Posted by: The Great Danton (Oct 16, 2007 12:44PM)
If you where to come out on stage with the band, and then produce your mic stand..that would be a nice piece of magic.

I hadn't thought about mic stand manipulations (hence why James is such an awesome guy), but that would probably be a good idea for you to look into.

other then that, have fun with it. =D
Message: Posted by: magic4u02 (Oct 16, 2007 01:10PM)
You can also do a microphone suspension much like a broom suspension. It ties in nicely and gets a great reaction for sure. Flip stick moves with drum sticks could also be imployed and used. Just food for thought.

Message: Posted by: LDM (Oct 16, 2007 06:47PM)
Thanks a lot, guys. I'll definitely be purchasing Tony Clark's DVD. I'll be looking into other general manipulation, and will do searches on more specifics.

Have any recommendations for purchasing cheap Bee cards? I've used Bikes for years, and I know that it doesn't [i]really[/i] matter, but I'd like to see what Bee's are like.

Message: Posted by: T.G Kenny (Oct 16, 2007 09:48PM)
If you are interested in using a normal poker-size deck , BEE is definately the WAY to go ! And don't forget to get yourself a Cardpress by Nelson because after you break into the deck , you need something to press the cards .

About the ways to break into the deck , I suggest you to get McBride's DVD series .

Message: Posted by: Dynamike (Oct 19, 2007 11:55AM)
LDM, I would advise you not to purchase anything yet. The number one reason is it might be difficult and cause you to put it aside and just get dusty. You will need the following to perform magic:

Practice time

You have already taken a big step by asking us the question. I would advise you to next join a magic club in your area. They will be able to help you with some of the above things I mentioned. They will be able to show you in person how hard the skill is. Then you can make your own judgement on if you have the interest and motivation into spending your money and time.

In the future if you forget anything I was talking about, please always remember this:
"To Look is one thing.
To See what you look at is another.
To Understand what you see is a third.
To Learn from what you understand is still something else.
But to Act on what you learn is all that really matters."

LDM, "May the force be with you."