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Topic: Dean Dill's explosion
Message: Posted by: 2003 user (Feb 23, 2003 12:05PM)
Please post a review of Dean Dill's "explosion" coin trick. Does it need a lot sleight of hand or just by the gimmick?

Thanks
Message: Posted by: marko (Feb 23, 2003 01:41PM)
Certainly, just give the thousand bucks and I'll try it out for you. :lol:
Message: Posted by: Doug McKenzie (Feb 23, 2003 03:42PM)
It requires both sleight of hand (what Dean Dill references as a purse palm), delicate timing, and finesse. If you do matrix or other assembly effects already, this might be a nice addition. Not the most practical of effects though, and the gimmicks are delicate.
Message: Posted by: harris (Feb 23, 2003 04:08PM)
I have only seen one person do this in person. (St.Joseph's Jason D. who won KC IBM close up contest with it as part of his routine)

When done in the right place it is awesome.

IMHO it take more than just the coins. You would have to work with them and the "purse palm" to make it look magical. In Jason's hand it is.

Harris
Message: Posted by: JasonDean (Feb 23, 2003 06:38PM)
Thanks Harris,where have you been?
Message: Posted by: magicxman (Feb 24, 2003 08:50AM)
May I know what is a "purse palm" ??
Thanks
Message: Posted by: harris (Feb 24, 2003 10:03AM)
XMan

I believe it is in Bobo's

_______________

Hey Jason,

It has been a busy season working the Nearly Normal Programs as well as my regular
counseling gig.



Also stay tuned. In a couple of weeks I hope
to launch the new and improved nearly normal
web site. The artist putting it together is awesome and also a perfectionist. It
will have a few magical surprises. Erich is
going to use drawings as well as digital photos. (I think he even gave me a bit more hair.)

I have been going to S.A.M. Talk on Yahoo since I can't get into this site(Magic Café)
at work. It is a blocked site on the school system. The Magic Café rules.

Although my programs are "puppet heavy" I like to include some strong magic.
Explosion is definetly strong. In our area it
is associated with Jason D. I think I will start doing what I call a Nearly Normal Explosion, my application of Rick Johnsons "Lids"

Keep growing and glowing.



Harris
Message: Posted by: Dan LeFay (Feb 25, 2003 03:49AM)
Explosion combines gimmick and technique in a fascinating way.
It combines most of the moves and plots of the matrix routines he teaches on coinmagic 2000.

The techniques used are not particularly difficult for someone who's done his homework, however it needs a very delicate handling and expert timing, which is much more difficult to master.

Besides that it is almost impossible to perform the routine without his awesome close-up pads. So if you decide to do it be sure you have a good and large surface to work on.
Which brings us to the biggest drawback:
You really have to ask yourself if you have the venue (or can create it)to perform this thing. This can not be done at the average strolling gig or tablemagic performance. It is a piece that demands and deserves a real "intimate" setting, as Dean used to call it.

I see it as a theatrical piece of close up magic and treat it like that.
If you do, you have the most magical coinroutine you could wish for with a climax that will never be forgotten!
Message: Posted by: Masilon (Feb 25, 2003 04:17AM)
I saw a magician performing it with a beautiful music in background during a closeup competition. He won!

Luca
Message: Posted by: WilliamWHolcomb (Feb 25, 2003 11:20PM)
For a thousand bucks it should come with an entire string quartet that plays everytime you do the effect! :rolleyes:
Message: Posted by: MJ Marrs (Feb 26, 2003 01:29AM)
It should be illegal for anyone (except me of course) to perform Explosion! You start off with four coins and some cool assemblies, and then an instant assembly occurs, and then all of a sudden you've got 16 coins that have appeared from nowhere. I wish that Mr. Dill would charge $10,000 bucks for this effect. It'd still be worth every cent! Exaggeration??? Experiencing this routine firsthand will elicit emotions which will remind you why you got into magic in the first place. I can't think of too many routines that can do that.
Message: Posted by: Larry Davidson (Feb 26, 2003 11:38AM)
MJ, have you performed the effect for laymen, and if so, what has been the reaction, especially compared to the reaction you get to other coin effects you perform?

I've seen Dean perform Explosion and know exactly how it works so for me it didn't elicit the kind of emotions you experienced. At the bottom line, though, I don't care if an effect fools me, I care only if it fools laymen and how they react, which is the basis for my question...how does this play in the real world?
Message: Posted by: Dan Watkins (Feb 26, 2003 12:09PM)
[quote]
On 2003-02-26 02:29, MJ Marrs wrote:
Exaggeration???
[/quote]

Yes
Message: Posted by: Dan LeFay (Feb 26, 2003 02:15PM)
Some time ago there was a thread in which I mentioned a performance of mine where I did Ult.3-Fly. The scientist for whom I performed were convinced there was an extra coin in play and were entertaining themselves in guessing where the extra coin was. Although their guesses were rather ridiculous it was not very fulfilling for me...

As an encore I did Explosion. They were absolutely silent for a few seconds and then roared with laughter, adressing one particular analyzing type with "Well, did he just pour 20 coins from his sleeve or what?"

That WAS very fulfilling I can say.
Message: Posted by: JasonDean (Feb 26, 2003 03:20PM)
The explosion coins and the routine are a piece of art.It goes far beyond just be a trick.Everytime I have preformed this effect it has brought every kind of emotion from tears to overwhelming laughter.I also agree that this effect is worth way more than what its priced for!--Jason Dean
Message: Posted by: MJ Marrs (Feb 27, 2003 01:43AM)
Larry, you wanted to know what kind of reaction Explosion gets with laymen:

I'm glad that you're trying to appreciate the routine from a layman's eyes.
I think that magicians often have a difficult time removing themselves from the actual workings behind a magic trick. We are aware of shells, and rough and smooth and stuff like that, so sometimes it isn't easy to appreciate the real power of certain effects. For me, so far, Explosion has been an extremely powerful routine to perform for laymen. A reputation maker.

Being a scientist myself, I often perform for scientists, engineers, doctors and other groups who are very analytically-minded (and who have the dough to reward handsomely someone for a well-polished evening of entertainment). These guys are problem solving machines who love the challenge of trying to figure out magical effects. Some laymen are bothered by magic, other laymen just like to enjoy it, while most of the folks who I perform for take pleasure in attempting to methodically dissect the workings behind magic tricks. I only perform Explosion on special occasions, but when I do, my audiences let me know that experiencing this particular routine was one of the most amazing things they've ever witnessed.

Dan Watkins: I sincerely believe that I have gotten MANY times over (both artistically and financially) what I paid for such a marvelous routine. That's no exaggeration.

I don't perform every trick that enters the magic market. Rather, I've decided to carefully choose a smaller number of routines which I feel will both fit my character and play well with audiences. I think that I chose wisely with Explosion. Best of luck to anyone else who is looking to learn an extra special routine!!
Message: Posted by: 2003 user (Feb 27, 2003 05:37PM)
I think there are more routine can use with this special coins set.
Message: Posted by: Schaden (Feb 27, 2003 05:43PM)
I can dup this effect with a table. Open handed and no funny moves. Can someone post an video of this? I've came up with a better explosion that uses the spectators hands and arms.

Lee
Message: Posted by: Full Effect (Mar 1, 2003 04:49PM)
[quote]
On 2003-02-27 18:43, pyro_magic wrote:
I can dup this effect with a table. Open handed and no funny moves. Can someone post an video of this? I've came up with a better explosion that uses the spectators hands and arms.

Lee
[/quote]

Mr. Pyro
where do you live? I really would like to see this and with your permission
I wouldnot mind video taping it and post it on the net.

Please PM
Message: Posted by: Schaden (Mar 1, 2003 05:20PM)
Don't worry i will make a a video on The Video Pot. I just need a couple of more coins. Send me some Lins and i can do it :).

Lee
Message: Posted by: coinlover (Mar 4, 2003 06:15PM)
I saw it live,its amazing!!!!!
Message: Posted by: Koji Takada (Mar 5, 2003 02:36AM)
Hi

When I watched "explosion" in his video of Coin Magic 2000. very amazing. But I can not buy this trick, because of very expensive!!

Koji
Message: Posted by: Dean Dill (Mar 12, 2003 02:13AM)
I am glad that people think enough of
Explosion to talk about it. I appreciate the positive comments and I am glad that people look at it from both sides. It is not for everyone. Thank goodness. Dean Dill
Message: Posted by: h_A_Z (Jan 20, 2005 07:58AM)
Which of Dean Dill's Close Up mats will fit the final 16 coin display? I'm thinking of getting the Ultimate Close Up pad. Will that be good enough? And is Mr. Dill ever planning to make the instructions for the effect on DVD? It will be a long time till I'll able to save up, but just wondering.
Message: Posted by: what (Jan 20, 2005 09:52AM)
Dean Dill also teaches an 9 coin version of explosion which utilizes fewer gaffed coins (and the gaffed coins are ones that you probably already have). It is an amazing routine.

Mike
Message: Posted by: Pete Biro (Jan 20, 2005 12:04PM)
If in L.A. area, this Sunday Dill will be demming at the Dealer Day evenet at the Magic Castle. As will Joe Stevens, Mark Burger and George Robinson.
Message: Posted by: Jonathan Townsend (Jan 20, 2005 12:22PM)
Hi folks,

Still amazed that folks are NOT applying Dean's method for explosion to other tricks like the Cylinder and Coins, Coins Across, Coins Through Table etc.

How about the classical "Free and Unlimited Coinage" trick done using modern technology?

As a silly person, I keep thinking about a five coin repeat where a magician sets up to do a great four coin trick but keeps on winding up with five coins.

It's temping to fork over a paycheck for the item.
Message: Posted by: Mike Wild (Jan 20, 2005 01:49PM)
Jon,

I'm still amazed that everytime a "new" (well, new last year) thing hits the market it's capable of inspiring such blind consumer loyalty... as long as the right name is attached to it. I don't think one pay check is enough... it should cost more.

RE: "Which of Dean Dill's Close Up mats will fit the final 16 coin display? I'm thinking of getting the Ultimate Close Up pad."

I also wonder which Dill mat I need for this. I mean, 16 coins is quite a few, and only a genuine Dill mat would be suitable... right? Also, which Dill shoes and socks should I be wearing when performing it? So many questions... hopefully there's a DVD on the market to tell me exactly what to do... ugh :hrmph:

Sorry for the sarcastic rant. Next time I'll pause for a moment and ask myself... "What would Dean do?".

Mike
Message: Posted by: Jonathan Townsend (Jan 20, 2005 02:12PM)
Mike it's okay. Not going to get sarcastic about brand / name stuff here.
IMHO the item has much more extensive use than the production sequence at the end of a chink-a-chink routine.

Imagine a [i][b]Sorcerer's Apprentice[/i][/b] type presentation for a coin assembly using "real" magic cards or a "borrowed wand". And then coins keep appearing! That could be funny!

As to using a special closeup pad... I've stated my position on that matter over twenty years ago and have not changed my opinion. Simply not my style to isolate the magic from the audience in that way.
Message: Posted by: joeKing (Jan 20, 2005 02:17PM)
Is there a cheaper solution for this effect??
Message: Posted by: Jonathan Townsend (Jan 20, 2005 02:26PM)
Effect, yes. That particularly empty handed clean looking version... not really. Even dove steals would not give you exactly that look.
Message: Posted by: Daren (Jan 20, 2005 02:39PM)
I tell you guys something if you are a working performer, this effect is like gold, I performed it for a group of people last weekend and it absolutely killed them!

One of the best investments I have made in a lonnnnggg time.

Thanks Dean for putting out such a great effect.
Oh, by the way, price it for $2,000.00. It is way worth it!!!
Message: Posted by: Mike Wild (Jan 20, 2005 02:50PM)
I am a working performer... that's why I can't afford it ;) Actually, I've spent a lot of time and money in pursuit of those items that I think or thought at the time I needed. I sometimes wonder if my bar act and books bring in enough to cover the expenses... but that's a question for a different forum. I can definitely understand the excitement of finding an item that fills a gap or answers a question that's been bothering you. So if this product gives you that special feeling... I say go for it!

Mike
Message: Posted by: Daren (Jan 20, 2005 02:52PM)
If you are a working performer, then why would the price bother you?
Message: Posted by: Mike Wild (Jan 20, 2005 02:56PM)
Hey, money's no object... the more expensive the better I always say!
Message: Posted by: Christopher Williams (Jan 22, 2005 03:31PM)
It sounds nice, and I wouldn't mind getting one at some point. The purse palm as I am aware can be learned on Cultural Exchange 1 by Shoot Ogawa.
Message: Posted by: Dan Watkins (Jan 22, 2005 05:30PM)
The purse palm taught on the CX DVD's (if you are referring to the "Apollo Palm")is completely different than the front finger hold used for assembly work. They aren't interchangeable.
Message: Posted by: Adam Keisner (Jan 22, 2005 05:40PM)
Jon Townsend wrote:
As to using a special closeup pad... I've stated my position on that matter over twenty years ago and have not changed my opinion. Simply not my style to isolate the magic from the audience in that way.




Jon, are you saying you don't use or advocate a close-up mat?
Also regaridng 'Explosion' for those who have and perform the effect, do you not find that due to the startling appearance of an extra 12 coins, people want to check the coins out?

Adam
Message: Posted by: Jonathan Townsend (Jan 22, 2005 06:03PM)
All I'm suggesting is that you CAN work without apparent "special" magician stuff.

I had the feeling there would be a "can I see those" moment at the end of the routine and I don't like producign things only to put them away after all that magical energy was expended. Such is why I not buy the thing. It would be so cool to do it with chocolate coins and give them out at the end.
Message: Posted by: Mike Wild (Jan 22, 2005 07:21PM)
I tend to agree Jon. That's why I tried to bridge the gap between special magician stuff and every day stuff by using a smily face mouse pad as my close up pad. It seems to blend in almost anywhere in this digital age... and a big yellow smily face is also good for a disarming chuckle or two from the spect's.

Mike
Message: Posted by: Dean A (Jan 23, 2005 06:32AM)
Hi Mike

That's an interesting idea but does it not distract from the simplicity of the magic itself after the initial chuckle stage has subsided

I would have imagined that the least attention, drawn to the mat, the better.

Dean Atkinson.
Message: Posted by: Mike Wild (Jan 23, 2005 08:58AM)
I don't think so, however, it may distract some people. I think it's more of a "one and done" gag as opposed to an ongoing source of interest or an attention hog. It certainly doesn't scream "Magician's close up pad here!".

I do the majority of my material in the hands, or I may need a dry surface on which to rest something here and there. I don't do a lot that requires the audience to focus intently upon the smily face :)

Mike
Message: Posted by: KirkG (Jan 23, 2005 09:30AM)
Interesting, I don't think of a close up mat as distancing me from my spectators. It is just a protection for the table top as I toss coins and cups around. It also serves to be my little stage to focus attention on the area to watch.

I tend to agree a blank mat is preferred, so as to make it as low key and non competing with my props. You can also add to the ambiance by using a Walnut edged, Hunter Green leather toppeed, cabriole legged close up pad to go along with the Sherwood Cups! :)

KirkG
Message: Posted by: Mb217 (Jan 23, 2005 05:00PM)
Is there a vid anywhere of Dean doing his Explosion? And is the coin production by Gertner on the Johnny Carson show (vid on Shane's site), a sort of Explosion-type of effect??? The guy must've produced as many as 12 or so coins, various sizes at the end of the routine. It was great. :)
Message: Posted by: Dan Watkins (Jan 23, 2005 05:25PM)
Marion,

Dean performs explosion on his Coinmagic 2000 video, his Extreme Dean Vol. 1 DVD, and on the LVMI DVD. Hocus Pocus has the the Coinmagic 2000 performance in Real Media format [url=http://www.hocus-pocus.com/static/clips/explosioxn.rm]HERE[/url]

The Gertner effect is different. Explosion uses no card covers, it is a bare handed assembly mixed with translocation type routine which climaxes with coins all over the mat.
Message: Posted by: Mb217 (Jan 23, 2005 06:19PM)
Thanks Dan...;)
Message: Posted by: Dean A (Jan 23, 2005 06:41PM)
He does it with Dollars on The LVMI doesn't he? Very pretty. I personally prefer to see the effect performed with Liberties but I have to admit the larger coins do add an extra element of Mystery, indeed impossibility, due to their size.
Message: Posted by: Paul h. (Jan 23, 2005 07:59PM)
I owned this effect in half dollar sized coins for a few years and it is a reputation maker, no doubt. I still have people ask me about it at my place of work. I did a free show at the school I work at for special needs kids--aka troubled kids thrown out of public school. They loved it because it was for them; they get so little positive attention as it is, and this made for a great moment for them.

It is by no means self-working, but well worth the effort to make it look right.

Best,

Paul h.
Message: Posted by: Dean A (Jan 24, 2005 02:06AM)
Regarding your comments about the routine not being self working Paul. It reminds me of my theory that that subtle combination of gaffs and some nice sleight of hand really make for impossible magic. One element seems to cancel out the other when the theory is approaced with sensibility

Dean
Message: Posted by: Christopher Williams (Jan 24, 2005 01:20PM)
Can I ask, and I am by no means undermining or want to intimdate a fine magician such as Dean Dill, but $1000 is a lot to pay for a trick, and I live in the UK, so it would cost more to ship, is a trick worth that much money?
Message: Posted by: Jonathan Townsend (Jan 24, 2005 01:30PM)
Chuds, one guy has his libery set up for 800 dollars.

If you have the skills to routine an act around the thing, you are set, big time.

It is what it is. Nobody can tell you objectively whether or not what it is worth to you.
Message: Posted by: Mb217 (Jan 24, 2005 02:19PM)
I think both of you guys are right...It is what it is, and it's also a lot of money for a trick. I guess to some folks money is no object if it's something they want and can find some way to afford it. But that doesn't mean that that something might also be a bit pricey. If JT's principle is right, then he should say the same thing if it is was $5,000 but somehow I think the old proverbial "buck" would stop...:) Usually when folks think something is ridiculous in relations to a price, that's where they will draw their own line...Ultimately Chud, you have to draw it...If you initially think it's a bit much, gut feeling, it usually is, at least for you...I mean it is a great piece of magic but in this case you and your wallet are the only things that matter here...;) Ask around, sometimes folks are willing to part with their effects.
Message: Posted by: Jonathan Townsend (Jan 24, 2005 02:36PM)
[quote]
On 2005-01-24 15:19, Mb217 wrote:
...Ask around, sometimes folks are willing to part with their effects. [/quote]

* it occurs that folks are being awful respectful and forgetting that the community will also take what it wants when it wants.

What would it mean to you if someone simply posted the basic idea and mechanics?
Message: Posted by: KirkG (Jan 24, 2005 05:15PM)
Jon,

I think MB17 was just suggesting that he may find a more economical purchase through the used market.

Kirk
Message: Posted by: Mb217 (Jan 24, 2005 08:09PM)
Thanks KirkG...that's about it. ;)
Message: Posted by: Dan LeFay (Jan 25, 2005 06:23AM)
When people come up arguing about the price of a trick (and keep doing so) it always seems to be in the sense of "This is too much money for me but I want it anyways. How can I get it for less". Which leads to making something exclusive rather common. One of the major downsides of the internet IMHO.
Message: Posted by: the74rock (Jan 31, 2005 11:00AM)
People should understand that things don't come cheap. if you want a good trick them expect to pay for it. if you cant afford it save up or don't buy it. people should stop whining about the price.
Message: Posted by: Dan LeFay (Jan 31, 2005 01:01PM)
Not completely true. The trick I perform that gets the best magical reaction I could wish is also the cheapest in my repertoire (I'll leave the guessing up to you guys;-). But in my view professional magic is not only presented in cheap, borrowed or everyday objects. So I mix cards with napkins with 500$ cups and turn of the century silver coins.
I advocate variation, both in presentation, effect and props.

I always shyed away from close-up pads. Now since I do Explosion I sell a lot more "formal close-up". In my perception the pad adds class.
Message: Posted by: MSD921 (Jan 31, 2005 01:23PM)
Dan - Yeah, that nickels to dimes is the ultimate!