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Topic: Question about Forgetful Frankie
Message: Posted by: Steven True (Nov 25, 2007 02:12AM)
I have this prop and am putting it in my new show. The only problem I have is the devil's hank that comes with it. I really don't like it that much. It seems a little awkward to work with, well to me that is. I was wondering if anyone here that has the Frankie, do you use the hank that came with it or did you go to a different type to do the vanish of his head?
Also, what types of reactions do you get when it is performed? I used to do a Forgetful Freddie a long time ago but just really liked the looks of Frankie. Any comments from those that use or used to use the effect?

Thankyou
Steven
Message: Posted by: kimmo (Nov 25, 2007 05:27AM)
I've never done forgetful Frankie but back when I worked with his cousin Freddie I used to use a coin fold to vanish the head. I think the idea was in Edwin's instructions for the effect although it could be something I came up with- I really can't remember.

I would fold the head in a large piece of stiff card (a parcel, to send back to Freddie)and offer an assisting child a choice of wand from a large hat. As I picked up the hat with my left hand and passed it accross my body, my right fingers would loosen their grip on the head and allow it to fall out of the paper into the hat.
I'd then put the hat away and be clean.

After repeated failed attempts to vanish the parcel I would give up and hand it to the child and say 'that's not working, take the head back out and we'll try something else'
There would then be a fun moment as the child opens the paper and can't find the head.
I would then exclaim 'You did it! - It's gone!' and then get the audience to applaud the assistant.

I used to consider this the most magical part of the routine - even better because it really does appear that the magic happens in the child's hands.
Message: Posted by: Regan (Nov 25, 2007 06:58AM)
Like Kimmo, I did Forgetful Freddie but not his cousin Frankie. I used a drawer box in my routine to vanish the head. It was a perfect fit for my presentation.

Regan
Message: Posted by: Spellbinder (Nov 25, 2007 09:49AM)
Jim Gerrish built an "Optical Delusionator" for use with his "Forgetful Whomever" from his Hardboard and Duct Tape Magic Show Book 1, on my site. There's a photo of it on the site and it won't cost you a cent to just look and see if it's something you might want to make. Basically, it shrinks the head down to the size of a silver dollar, and every magician should know how to make one of those vanish in a jiffy.
Message: Posted by: Steven True (Nov 26, 2007 03:00AM)
All good ideas. Not sure of how I am going to do it yet. Spellbinder, I could not find the effect on the website. Can you tell me where it si or is it in one of his books or videos?

Thanks.
Steven
Message: Posted by: Spellbinder (Nov 26, 2007 08:39AM)
To find the photos of Jim Gerrish's "Optical Delusionator" on my Web site, click on the "Hardboard Magic" button at the top of the opening screen. Then scroll down to "Forgetful Whomever," where you will see a small photo of the "Optical Delusionator." Click on the photo or the INFO button to see larger and more detailed photos.

For Frankie, it would be fun to add some laboratory spark generators and crank them up in order to shrink the head. You might also use this in combination with Bruce Kalver's "Growing and Shrinking Head Illusion." You could also have a kid sitting on the side wearing Brad Manuel's "Bucket Head Illusion."
Message: Posted by: Tony James (Nov 26, 2007 12:34PM)
Someone please tell me how Forgetful Frankie differs from Freddie.

I too have a variant I suspect Kimmo will recall from Supreme. Magic Scarecrow. It's a cutout scarecrow figure which is a combination of Forgetful Freddie and the old Card Star.

The cards I use are Farmyard Snap picture cards. The pack along with the balloon and the marker pen and a silk are all held in a Flap-Doodle Bag. Works as a change bag and vanish. I try blindfolding the scarecrow but he keeps peeping so the head and silk go into the Flap-Doodle along with the cards. The balloon is inflated and a face drawn on and it's fixed in place of the head.

The Flap=Doodle is then 'torn apart' and as it stretches between the hands the sudden tension causes the silk to shoot up in the air. Head, cards and anything else have gone.

The trigger on the scarecrow is released and the balloon bursts, the head appears and the two chosen cards appear at the tips of the outstretched arms.

Try a Flap-Doodle. If you can't buy one, make one. It's only a long narrow bag, folded bottom to top and held with a narrow strip of Velcro. It makes a useful two compartment change bag and with all but the silk in the bag proper, the tear apart = which makes an attention grabbing noise - and the visual of the silk flying high makes for an impressive vanish.
Message: Posted by: Brian Lehr (Nov 26, 2007 02:06PM)
I used FF for my halloween shows this year. I ended up using a different hankie to vanish the head. However, I just didn't like the effect very much. I love the look of the prop, and felt it added to the ambience of the the show, but I just never got the reaction I wanted. So I dropped it out of the last few shows until I have more time to work out a better presentation.

Brian
Message: Posted by: Steven True (Nov 27, 2007 03:26AM)
Spellbinder...thank you I did look at your site and found the effect you were describing. The effect I feel an be used at anytime not just a Holloween show. Like I already said, I used the forgetful freddie a long time ago and I liked it a lot. The Frankie statue is very colorful and can be used, in my own opinion, throughout the year.
Brian I would really like to hear what type of routine you come up with to use in your shows with this prop. I am not trying to use others materials, although it worked for Milton Berle for years. I just really like th elook of the prop and maybe I got it on an impulse buy. Oh well so goes the way of a lot of magical props. Thank you to those of you that posted and keep on posting. I really need your input on it.

Thank you
Steven
Message: Posted by: Steven True (Nov 27, 2007 10:53PM)
Tony the only real difference is that Frankie looks like a cartoon version of Frankenstien. Really cute and I am sure the kids will love it. I am going to try and upload a pic of mine for you.

Happy Magic
Steven
Message: Posted by: Steven True (Nov 28, 2007 01:18AM)
Ok I will try and see if I can upload this picture. It has not worked yet but maybe this time. It is a pic of my Forgetful Frankie.
Message: Posted by: Tony James (Nov 28, 2007 04:26AM)
Thanks for that. Strange. I see that image each morning when I shave!

Flap-doodle would vanish that head and the silk flying high is a great visual.
Message: Posted by: magicgeorge (Nov 28, 2007 07:53AM)
Funny, I've been considering doing a forgetful somebody recently. The version on Spellbinder's site is a good starting point for making your own. The "optical dellusionater" is a very interesting and original concept but I don't think it's the one for me, on this occasion, (although I might be able to use the idea elsewhere).

I was thinking it might be fun to have a perfectly round head that can be vanished a la sucker cd vanish/man on the moon.

I'm also building a R/C widget into my table that means I can set off card in balloons of forgetful freddy type effects by remote.

George
Message: Posted by: Spellbinder (Nov 28, 2007 08:00AM)
If you need help making a Flap-Doodle, as Tony calls it, you'll find it is very much like the Gambani Dove Vanish described in my Dollar Store Magic article on "Dove to Silk Mat" only instead of vanishing a dove, you can vanish anything that will fit inside the mat. These cam be made from table placemats found in any Dollar Store.
Message: Posted by: Tom Riddle (Nov 28, 2007 10:27AM)
"I was thinking it might be fun to have a perfectly round head that can be vanished a la sucker cd vanish/man on the moon."

George. This was put out by Edwin's Magic Arts. I have it. It is a sad clown(Forgettful Freddie principal). You take off the head, put the head in a Man in the Moon typing sliding box, vanish the head(it says "GONE" on the back of the slide...........a nice bit of sucker business). Blow up a balloon. Paint a happy clown face on it, and up pops a wooden happy face with a pin in the nose to burst the balloon!
Message: Posted by: magic4u02 (Nov 28, 2007 10:29AM)
Tom is right on with this. I have seen this as well and it plays very big. However I think you could still get the same reaction with the Forgetful Frankie. If you place Frankies head into any type of vanishing prop, there are always ways in which to get the children reacting because they feel you are hiding something. Good stuff guys.

Kyle
Message: Posted by: Tony James (Nov 28, 2007 10:47AM)
The only caution is that these effects are great for 6 years plus but at your peril for the 3,4 and 5 years old children.

At that age you've only to take a balloon out and some stupid infant will start mewling. Modelling balloons don't often break and when they do it's a quiet pop but rounds go with a fair old bang when hit by a pin. They'll yell their heads off.

Far better to keep such excitements for the 6's - they might jump but they're too big to yell. Or at least, they think they are.
Message: Posted by: magic4u02 (Nov 28, 2007 10:53AM)
Great point Tony. We do have to be mindful of the balloons and the osunds they make and the fear that young children sometimes have over them. I used to do needle through balloon but will only perform it for older kids for the reason Tony mentioned above. You also have to be cautious that some kids are really afriad of ballons in general. It sounds silly, but I had a kid in my SYM magic club who had a balloon phobia and was scared to death of them. Just a great point to think about. Thanks Tony.

Kyle
Message: Posted by: magicgeorge (Nov 28, 2007 11:16AM)
Cheers Tom, I'm glad it's been done before means it wasn't too daft an idea.

I really like the sound of that. I'm not keen on some effects that are completely based around a sucker trick but this seems like a good way to have some shenanagins in the middle of a routine but have a more satisfactory finish.

George
Message: Posted by: magic4u02 (Nov 28, 2007 12:38PM)
George. You can also always change a sucker style effect so that the sucker effect is played on you and not he helper or the audience. this way you still get the laughs (directed towards yourself), but also empower the children in the process.

Kyle
Message: Posted by: Ratty Roberts (Nov 29, 2007 03:03AM)
I also have this prop. Supreme did a rip off version: the Scarecrow. They all seem to work the same. I use a change bag, to vanish the head. When I look inside , I find the balloon. I actually have several in the bag, as I don't show it, they are always there in caseA). I break the balloon, and cover it by saying all monsters say TWO HEADS are better than one!, B). They are there for the next show. The balloons are not even green as is the head! Lots of humour can be gained by drawing his face whilst everyone says its not the right colour. This is when I put a light silk/hanky over the balloon, and say" lets not look at him then .... or shall we try magic to get it right?" This hides the head snapping up, and the hanky does sometimes shoot into the air (Thanks Dave/Noel!). Points to note, when you actually use this prop, there is a tendency to grabt the shoulders and also the head whilst inserting the balloon. This will drop the retaining pin out, so when you take away your hand the head shhoots up. The firat time I did this, that's what happened, and I also got the pin Stuck into my finger. Much Blood, lots of laughs and a lesson learned! PS His mum is always telling him not to BOLT his food!

Ratty Roberts
Message: Posted by: magic4u02 (Nov 29, 2007 09:51AM)
Ratty: Great ideas here my friend. Good thinking and lots of funny byplay to get the kids laughing and elevate the entertainment level. That reall is what it is all about. As you are aware, the journey we take the children on is often more fun for them then the trick itself. I like the silk over the head gag. Very funny. =)

Kyle
Message: Posted by: Steven True (Nov 30, 2007 12:54AM)
YOu know talking about the balloon sounds. I did a needle through balloon effect for a small Thaksgiving day gathering and a samll 5 yr old almost went nuts. She was so afraid of the sound that the balloon would make. She went running into another room when I was just about to put the needle into the balloon. It made me wonder about Frankie and the effect on small children. I am thinking it is more for the maybe 7 to 10 range. I never really thought a young one like her would react. Maybe she had a bad experiance with a balloon. Well makes me know a little bit more of where I can do the Frankie routine.
I love the thought of a change bag vanish. I havew an old cange bag that I have owned since.....well I have owned it a very long time..Lol It might just work and I am going to try it and see what I can do.
Tony, just to let you know that the Frankie comes with a ratchit noise maker and a spark emiter. That way when you take out the bolts, acting of course, it adds to the effect. I am not going to use them right now but maybe later. And if you look in the mirror each mornig and Frankie is looking back??? Well...awe forget it. Lol...Have fun with which ever Forgetful that you might chose. They do get a great audience reaction.

Happy Magic
Steven
Message: Posted by: magicgeorge (Dec 4, 2007 09:20AM)
[quote]
On 2007-11-28 13:38, magic4u02 wrote:
George. You can also always change a sucker style effect so that the sucker effect is played on you and not he helper or the audience. this way you still get the laughs (directed towards yourself), but also empower the children in the process.
[/quote]

Cheers Kyle, I prefer to empower myself by doing a sucker trick for a good 20 minutes then reminding the children how stupid they are at regular intervals throughout the show.

Only kidding, I think any entertainer worth there salt can change the focus of a sucker trick so the children do the magic and you don't end up with a 'na nyah na na nyah' finish. The reason I don't like some sucker tricks is that many of them over-rely on the sucker aspect of the effect and therefore don't have a very strong finish. Which is why I like the idea of the sucker aspect in the middle of a Forgetful Freddy type routine.

George
Message: Posted by: REV BILL (Oct 1, 2008 04:42PM)
I used to combine it with a card in balloon. Put a duplicate of the force card on the pin and have it appear with the head.
Message: Posted by: zimsalabim (Oct 6, 2008 03:44PM)
I have used Frankie in my show for some time and I use a devils hank that is blue as it is his "Blankie" its a bit tattered and the kids relate to the idea of the "Blankie" very well. I have a child hold Frankies head "ala" the old coin inthe hankerchief vanish and when that cloth is wisked away and shown on both sides and nothng is there well it gets a great response for me. I do the same bit with theh Stratoshepres ball.


Z
Message: Posted by: Acecardician (Jul 11, 2009 02:13PM)
I got the Frankie and I added the Sylvester The Jester's Makin' Sparks. the Funken ring with it was not that good. I also have a heavy duty watch winder that I got years ago and is a lot louder than the one that comes with it.

A routine I did was put different balloon face heads on it. This can be done with any "Forgetfull" effect. It especially works well with my Forgetfull Snowman. Check with any Qualatex Balloon Supplier. I use Larocks. They have 5" round balloons with faces such as:
Spiderman, dracular, jack o latern, a Disney Princess, a skull, frog, google eyed octopus, eyeball, pink catface on a heart, alien with a helmet, and a snowman! And others!

I blow up each one as a replacement for the head. I place it where the head should be and have the kids yell NO! And then let the air out of each one until we find the right head. The snowman head works well for the Forgetfull snowman. Then finish the routine in your favorite manner.

ACE