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Topic: Geller to claim £1m ?
Message: Posted by: Drewmcadam (Nov 25, 2007 12:37PM)
Shipi just sent me this....
http://www.free-press-release.com/news/200711/1195834662.html
Message: Posted by: Lord Of The Horses (Nov 25, 2007 12:41PM)
I thought Criss Angel should have known better...

You can't fool Uri with such childish challenges.

Heck, Uri has faced so many challenged in his life from people far more "dangerous" in terms of press than Criss "I am the only one doing Mentalism, the others do magick tricks!" Angel.

Drew, once again, extend to Uri my compliments next time you talk with him.
Message: Posted by: Jim-Callahan (Nov 25, 2007 12:49PM)
As well as here

http://en.wikinews.org/wiki/Geller_Angel_$1,000,000_challenge

Were the updated release mentions I also was ready to take Angels' money.

A side note is that Gerry McCambridge helped me write the first page of my prediction that was to be used on the show the final night.

When I heard Uri start talking and were he was going I figured he was going to nail the thing and that was why the producers did not read my prediction.

(Uri's show and if he can make a million he gets his shot first I thought to myself.)

Jim
Message: Posted by: coupcoupdaddy (Nov 25, 2007 12:58PM)
Fascinating! Thanks Drew and Jim for update!
Message: Posted by: Mind Guerrilla (Nov 25, 2007 01:30PM)
[quote]
On 2007-11-25 13:37, Drewmcadam wrote:
Shipi just sent me this....
http://www.free-press-release.com/news/200711/1195834662.html
[/quote]

What kind of site is this? When I went there I saw an ad for what looked like a green card scam.

At any rate, this notion that Geller was "zoning in" is tantalizing on first blush but Geller never said he was trying to reveal the contents of the envelope and he seemed to be going all over the place talking about himself, Angel, ages, birthdates, spoon bending etc. Aren't there more practical reasons as to why Angel "cut him off" (besides the fact that Geller never explicitly said he was trying to name the envelope's contents) i.e. the show was in its closing moments and Angel had his heart set on having the spotlight to himself?

It's a romantic notion though. No doubt about it.
Message: Posted by: Micheal Leath (Nov 25, 2007 01:35PM)
[quote]
On 2007-11-25 13:49, Jim-Callahan wrote:
A side note is that Gerry McCambridge helped me write the first page of my prediction that was to be used on the show the final night.
[/quote]


So you needed help to write the number 911? It took at least a page to do it?
Message: Posted by: Magnus Eisengrim (Nov 25, 2007 01:36PM)
Ahh. How mentalists love the tendencies of those who desperately want to believe. Who knew what easy prey other mentalists would be?

Lovin' it.

John
Message: Posted by: Lord Of The Horses (Nov 25, 2007 01:41PM)
Magnus,

Just because some Mentalists want to believe this could have been, I find your comments about them being desperate or easy prey, very condescending at best and possibly offensive.

If I had to pay you back with the same kind of money you use, I would have to say that you are an idiot.
Message: Posted by: Turk (Nov 25, 2007 01:44PM)
As I stated on another thread, I would have lost; I thought the number Criss had was written down was 116.
Message: Posted by: Lord Of The Horses (Nov 25, 2007 01:49PM)
[quote]
On 2007-11-25 14:44, Turk wrote:
As I stated on another thread, I would have lost; I thought the number Criss had was written down was 116.
[/quote]

Well, Mike, actually you could have claimed half-million. :)
Message: Posted by: Dr Spektor (Nov 25, 2007 03:02PM)
Except Cri$$'s $1M is in old Confederate bills or... y'know, since Luke Jermay used to consult to him - may actually have been a pile of Monopoly Money.

Fact is, never challenge people wiser, smarter and more experienced to a duel they are ready for...
Message: Posted by: Slim King (Nov 25, 2007 03:08PM)
WOW...Go Uri and Jim!
OR
Are we back to this?
http://www.themagiccafe.com/forums/viewtopic.php?topic=232301&forum=15
Message: Posted by: Magnus Eisengrim (Nov 25, 2007 03:38PM)
[quote]
On 2007-11-25 14:41, Lord Of The Horses wrote:
Magnus,

Just because some Mentalists want to believe this could have been, I find your comments about them being desperate or easy prey, very condescending at best and possibly offensive.

If I had to pay you back with the same kind of money you use, I would have to say that you are an idiot.
[/quote]

Subtle and thoughtful. My hat's off to you.

John
Message: Posted by: Harry H (Nov 25, 2007 03:46PM)
Yawn.
Message: Posted by: Lord Of The Horses (Nov 25, 2007 03:53PM)
Burp.
Message: Posted by: Mind Guerrilla (Nov 25, 2007 03:53PM)
[quote]
On 2007-11-25 16:46, Harry H wrote:
Yawn.
[/quote]

Please cover your mouth. Thanks.
Message: Posted by: lane99 (Nov 25, 2007 04:26PM)
If you want to get technical, Gellar didn't just "come close" to meeting the challenge Crangel issued in the final show. If one reviews the tape I believe you'll find that he, incontestably, succeeded. And, frankly, so could have I under the same conditions.

But I don't think Angel is willing the walk the walk ( ), so I assume he won't pay voluntarily even though he lost.
Message: Posted by: modernmindreader (Nov 25, 2007 05:03PM)
I think it would be a funny twist to the whole story. I could tell Uri was zeroing in on the target. Of course the mega skeptics will hem and haw about the rambling aspect of the revelation... No surprise there. I will be interested to see how far this goes...
Message: Posted by: Mind Guerrilla (Nov 25, 2007 05:07PM)
[quote]
On 2007-11-25 17:26, lane99 wrote:
If one reviews the tape I believe you'll find that he, incontestably, succeeded. [/quote]

Well, that settles that!
Message: Posted by: Mind Guerrilla (Nov 25, 2007 05:09PM)
[quote]
On 2007-11-25 18:03, modernmindreader wrote:
Of course the mega skeptics will hem and haw about the rambling aspect of the revelation... [/quote]

Hem and haw about the hemming and hawing? Yes, I'm sure they will. The fools! Maybe not only the mega skeptics but the regular size ones as well!
Message: Posted by: modernmindreader (Nov 25, 2007 06:06PM)
[quote]
On 2007-11-25 18:09, Mind Guerilla wrote:

Hem and haw about the hemming and hawing? Yes, I'm sure they will. The fools! Maybe not only the mega skeptics but the regular size ones as well!
[/quote]

Hahaha... Brilliant! Exactly!

Are there regular sized ones? lol
Message: Posted by: Dr Spektor (Nov 25, 2007 08:28PM)
Do you want fries with those skeptics?
Message: Posted by: Mind Guerrilla (Nov 25, 2007 08:43PM)
[quote]
On 2007-11-25 19:06, modernmindreader wrote:
Are there regular sized ones? lol
[/quote]

I'm 5'11", 190 lbs, size 10 1/2 shoe.
Message: Posted by: Mind Guerrilla (Nov 25, 2007 08:51PM)
As if sitting around all Sunday posting messages on The Magic Café wasn't proof enough that I have too much time on my hands, I sat down and typed up a transcript of the envelope reveal from the PHENOMENON finale. Would you like to take a "gander" at this?


CA=Criss Angel UG=Uri Geller TV=Tim Vincent

CA: We’re gonna reveal one of the envelopes. The other envelope will be revealed on the premiere of MINDFREAK. Before I do that, I just would like to ask Mr. Uri Geller, in all due respect, would you like to take a gander at this?

UG: I knew you’ll challenge me once more…

CA: A million bucks.

UG: …but let me…

CA: Cash.

UG: …tell you something. Although we were born 1 day apart- I was born on the 20th of December and you on the 19th- there’s a lot of…

CA: I told you that. Correct?

UG: …a lot of years between us. 40 years. You were 1 year old when I came out with my spoon bending…

CA: I guess this is a “no.”

[MIND GUERILLA NOTE: TIM VINCENT AND URI GELLER SPEAK OVER EACH OTHER FOR THE NEXT COUPLE OF LINES, MAKING IT DIFFICULT TO UNDERSTAND BUT THIS IS WHAT IT SOUNDED LIKE TO ME:]

UG: …and I wish…

TV: Guys…we’re live on NBC…

UG: …and I wish you a lot of success for…40 years.

TV: …we need to know what’s in that envelope, please.

CA: Here it is. It’s a travesty…that happened…to people all around the world but specifically to…New Yorkers and people that were in New York. If somebody could predict and tell us on 9/10 that 9/11 was gonna happen maybe that could have prevented it. That’s why it’s a sad day that no one could do that and…

TV: An incredibly sad day…

CA: …people claim they can.

TV: …Thank you so much for revealing that. “9/11.” At last the mystery has been solved. Thank you, very much, Criss.
Message: Posted by: Dr Spektor (Nov 25, 2007 08:55PM)
C'mon MG - everything is a hit when you need it... c'mon... give me either a 3 digit # or some random object and I'll show you.
Message: Posted by: John Nesbit (Nov 25, 2007 09:00PM)
If it was the first time that he mis-used the word "travesty", one could let it pass. But he kept hammering it home several times over, on the interviews.
In the end, it was such a travesty.
Message: Posted by: Mind Guerrilla (Nov 25, 2007 09:15PM)
[quote]
On 2007-11-25 22:00, johnjnesbit wrote:
If it was the first time that he mis-used the word "travesty", one could let it pass. But he kept hammering it home several times over, on the interviews.
In the end, it was such a travesty.
[/quote]

If this was the first time that you brought up his mis-use of the word "travesty," one could let it pass. But you keep hammering it home several times over. Who are you, the Grammar Police? Aren't there nore productive things you could do with your time, like catching typos in Magic Café posts? Of course, I kid! :)

I'm not so sure Mr. Angel wanted to use the word "gander" either. That's the one which has been keeping me up at night!
Message: Posted by: Mind Guerrilla (Nov 25, 2007 09:16PM)
[quote]
On 2007-11-25 21:55, Dr Spektor wrote:
C'mon MG - everything is a hit when you need it... c'mon... give me either a 3 digit # or some random object and I'll show you.
[/quote]

Can the random object I give you be a live grenade?
Message: Posted by: John Nesbit (Nov 25, 2007 09:41PM)
Counter espionage for "guerrilla mind(freaks)". What could be causing you to lose sleep, may be that(mr. angel)is cooking his own "goose"/gander.

(Hey "Batman" don't you recognize "The Shadow") ? ;)
Message: Posted by: Dr Spektor (Nov 25, 2007 09:52PM)
Live Grenade - an explosion.... a terrorist device...etc. If you picture the grenade more clearly... 3 of the numbers on the serial code are 911 as well.

Now, now... the Shadow was too cool for school. MG reminds me more of Blue Beetle.
Message: Posted by: John Nesbit (Nov 25, 2007 10:08PM)
I know that you're the real Batman Doc. MG was just trying to impersonate you from yesterday. ;)
Message: Posted by: Dr Spektor (Nov 25, 2007 10:23PM)
That could make him my ol' enemy, Clayface.
Message: Posted by: John Nesbit (Nov 25, 2007 10:41PM)
So that's where the phrase "Here's mud in your eye", must come from !
Message: Posted by: howdoidisconnect (Nov 25, 2007 10:44PM)
When will claimed skeptics learn..the best way to expose is to shut up and let them talk!

I think the sad part about it, is that Criss didn't give Uri a chance, that cutting him off, was from the my POV his mind already wasn't interested in what Uri had to say, which shows Criss complete lack of experience in dealing with claimant of the supernatural....let them talk, something about give them enough rope and they will hang themselves.

However, in the fact Criss cut Uri off clearly, and Uri seemed to be getting close, Uri should call Criss out on that, after all what has he got to lose.

It also showed the stupidity of such tests, I am sure if this was opened to America someone would have guessed this correctly, so what does that prove psychic powers, or the law of averages.

I am glad I missed most of series.
Message: Posted by: ThomasBerger (Nov 26, 2007 01:17AM)
A classic case of confirmation bias.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confirmation_bias

And the more you talk, the more info that can be backfitted.

Moral of the story--take calculated guesses, lots of them.
The more the better.
Only the relevent items (to that person) will be remembered.
And the way it is remembered depends on your particular bias.
Backfitting at work.
Tom
Message: Posted by: tincture (Nov 26, 2007 03:47AM)
I really wonder what Chris thought he was getting into when starting to get involved with the show
Message: Posted by: Dr Spektor (Nov 26, 2007 08:18AM)
$$$$$$$$$
Message: Posted by: Magnus Eisengrim (Nov 26, 2007 10:33AM)
[quote]
On 2007-11-26 09:18, Dr Spektor wrote:
$$$$$$$$$
[/quote]

Good thing nobody who posts here has that interest.

John
Message: Posted by: Dr Spektor (Nov 26, 2007 11:31AM)
[quote]
On 2007-11-26 11:33, Magnus Eisengrim wrote:
[quote]
On 2007-11-26 09:18, Dr Spektor wrote:
$$$$$$$$$
[/quote]

Good thing nobody who posts here has that interest.

John
[/quote]

Indeed - everyone here walks around with a bowl and expects rice donations for their sharing of the Cosmic Principles.

On the other hand... getting wrapped up in the illusion of Maia can be fun sometimes.
Message: Posted by: Doug Higley (Nov 26, 2007 12:57PM)
Without that interest I'd be living under an overpass with an Albertson's home special with a wobbly real wheel.
Message: Posted by: cupsandballsmagic (Nov 26, 2007 01:35PM)
Not sure if it was intentional but Angel placed anyone who might have got it right in a terrible double bind.
Message: Posted by: magicusb (Nov 26, 2007 03:15PM)
It has hit youtube.com. The one million dollar challenge.

with the following quotes mostly taken from the news article.

"Criss Angel challenged Uri Geller $1,000,000.00 on the finale of NBC's nationally televised "Phenomonon" to tell Angel what was in a sealed envelope and then quickly cut Geller off when he appeared to intuitively begin zoning in on it's content. What was in the sealed envelope were the numbers 911. When Criss Angel asked Geller what was in the envelope Geller for some reason began rattling of dates that unknown to Geller were zoning in on the contents. Uri said Angel was born on the 19th, just 1 day prior to Geller's birthday. He then said that he had bent his 1st spoon when Angel was 1 (years old.) A nervous Angel, knowing what was in the envelope quickly cut him off, and diverted attention by quickly opening the envelope."

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G096iqoGIjY

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lyB3EgwSBjE

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oFYrYuxAzw4


the youtube article then continues....

"It is remarkable that Geller knew the mystery was a date, whereas it could have been a drawing, poem, or other inscription."

Dick Brooks
"Haunted!" Mind Mysteries & THE Beyond!
America's longest running seace show.
1433 N Main Ave
Scranton, Pa 18508
(570) 383-9297
http://www.Houdini.org
http://www.PsychicTheater.com
http://Supernormalist.com
Message: Posted by: Mariagi (Nov 26, 2007 03:56PM)
[quote]
On 2007-11-26 16:15, magicusb wrote:

the youtube article then continues....

"It is remarkable that Geller knew the mystery was a date, whereas it could have been a drawing, poem, or other inscription."

[/quote]

yes that's amazing in itself. it could be anything else or even an empty envelope and yet Uri Geller zoned in excludind drawings and words

and the way mr.Angel cut him off was really bad: Uri was going to get too close.

then again with consultants like banachek behind Criss angel who can say he had not an earpiece and banachek or someone else whispered in angels ear 'cut him off !! he is getting too close !! you may looose !!!!"
entirely possible I say
Message: Posted by: Dr Spektor (Nov 26, 2007 04:30PM)
Mariagi - PM Paolo ;) - you read my mind!
Message: Posted by: Lord Of The Horses (Nov 26, 2007 04:54PM)
Spektor,

You guys are naughty.


Are you suggesting that Angel or Banachek would cheat?

NEVER!
Message: Posted by: Jim-Callahan (Nov 26, 2007 05:07PM)
We will see Paolo, what the California Gaming Board has to say about Criss and NBC in the very near future.


Jim
Message: Posted by: Lord Of The Horses (Nov 26, 2007 05:12PM)
Jim,

I thought you knew me enough by now to get that MY post was tongue in cheek.

Your post, however, I hope was NOT (tongue in cheek).
Message: Posted by: Harry H (Nov 26, 2007 05:44PM)
Have I missed something.Uri was just babbling on.How can anyone take any significance of what was said?

Had Uri just said "9/11 is whats written" Or Jim for that matter then we'd have a topic.

He didn't.We haven't.

Soem people are extremely gullible.
Message: Posted by: Banachek (Nov 26, 2007 05:51PM)
Wow, first off, to win the million one had to mention what was in both envelopes. No if and but's just EXACTELY what was in BOTH. 119 would not count 191 would not count only 911 counts, no pictures of buildings, planes, smoke..no comments about hearing a scream, no mention of numbers, dates...no.. well you get the idea.

Also Uri never said it was a date in the envelope. You are assuming due to the fact he talked about how long he and Criss have been performing. And how close in birthdates (think astrology here) they are and as a result how their thinking is really not that far apart. At least that is what it sounded like to me.

As for the cutting off....first episode the producers were calling New York and having them remove segments videotaped so as to fit the show into the time slot. This was happening as it aired. The last episode was super tight too. That was on reason Jim Callahan's letter of what was in the envelope was removed. All acts were going over time alloted. Criss and Uri had both been told not to elaborate but to get to the point. Criss was doing as he was told. Show what was in the envelope. All Uri had to say was, I see the numbers nine, one, one...

Still one more envelope to go. Let's see how close others came.

As for what it is, I really don't know... I insisted Criss not tell me. Closest I have come is when Criss showed me the folded paper inside via a flashlight so as to make sure one could not really tell what was written.

Nice to see people enjoying the ride Criss set up.
Message: Posted by: Lord Of The Horses (Nov 26, 2007 05:59PM)
[quote]
On 2007-11-26 18:51, Banachek wrote:

Nice to see people enjoying the ride Criss set up.
[/quote]

I hope they are EXPLOITING the ride rather than enjoying it, Steve.

At least they will gain something from it too ... Even if not THAT million! ;)
Message: Posted by: FocusYourMAYND (Nov 26, 2007 06:15PM)
I think the challenge to Geller will only go to further his legend rather than debunk him or any belief in the paranormal. Seems to be a running theme with Uri! :)

Jonathan
Message: Posted by: Lord Of The Horses (Nov 26, 2007 06:18PM)
True words, Mentok, true words!

Long Live Uri Geller! :)
Message: Posted by: Dr Spektor (Nov 26, 2007 06:59PM)
Dear Banachek,

It isn't what is - its about what it appears - you taught me that from PsychSubt 1&2 and the DVD series and all the other wonderful books I collected of your amazing work!

It doesn't matter what the rules were - a lot of people will rewrite history, see patterns where there are none, and just do things that go into the realm of Borges :)...

The test or challenge wasn't under any scientific conditions, agreed or understood by all parties, and unclear who was being challenged at what times etc... or it was as clear as Uri's 911 :)... and y'know the ol' prattle of needing time to zero in etc. but it is "valid" if one can set up the experiment properly...

In other words, the action did provide a great drama and allowed characters to battle and interact - personally, I didn't care about the contents - or if anyone got the answer or not - it was about the human interactions (or played interactions)... i.e. bring out the lions!

Yes indeed - I for one am indeed enjoying the ride CA set up!

It has provided amusement, passion and creativity all over the place!

Oh, and I never thought both you and CA would cheat. However, I would believe you are his mentor and help guide him out of trouble, which I think is a good thing! Deny it if you wiil, but IMHO a major reason Criss is a success is due to you - which is a good thing!

What might be cool for MindFreak is to do the second Envelope with genuine scientific and mentalistic experts setting the rules and then allowing people to attempt guessing it under controlled circumstances... then, even if someone goes frothing on the floor singing the Fibrianci number sequences (Arnon - feel free to correct my spelling) - then wakes up and says "911!" (or whatever it is) should be OK.

In the end, it can also be seen as it all completely staged to allow Criss and Uri to both be "right" with an ambiguous ending to the series...

It is all illusions and dreams anyway.

G'nite

Dr S
Message: Posted by: Corona Smith (Nov 26, 2007 07:03PM)
Fibonacci.
Message: Posted by: rugged (Nov 26, 2007 07:07PM)
Hahahahaha love it banachek, wow, might as well just have criss talking, isn't that what criss is? A figure head for banacheks routines, and then **** like this happens when the figure head decides to speak for himself.
love the almost ambiguity, I could also be talking about our president. haha.


I LOOOVE your show Banachek, Mind Freak on A&E I just wished you chose someone else other than Angel, YOu should of chose me Rugged Demon.
Message: Posted by: Dr Spektor (Nov 26, 2007 07:07PM)
Thanks Corona! May you have a wonderful 1,1,2,3,5,8,13,21...etc. golden curve!
Message: Posted by: magicusb (Nov 26, 2007 07:53PM)
Hey Banachek;

Be fair.... For Criss Angel to turn to a "mind reader" and ask what was in the envelope, and for Uri Geller to intuitivy rant on right away, out of the blue, the numbers 19 11, etc., in this field has to be considered amazing hits, like it or not. Don't forget 116 is 911 upside down and in this field would also be a fantistic hit!

I am sure if Criss turned to anyone in the world including you the chance of blurting out those numbers is probably a million to one or more. There could have been a billion or more other things to say. A word, a picture, a number, and in this case a date, which is where Geller was going. The fact that he did not blurt out 911 off the top, does in no way invalidate what happened.

I am sure if it was you or even Randi that did it you would be shocked and amazed.

Love your work by the way and am a big fan, but fair is fair. You may be prejudiced by your current job.

Think this over and be fair. What you see is what you got.

My best wishes to you and your family,

Dick Brooks
"Haunted!" Mind Mysteries & THE Beyond!
America's longest running seace show.
1433 N Main Ave
Scranton, Pa 18508
(570) 383-9297
Message: Posted by: Mariagi (Nov 26, 2007 07:54PM)
Mr.banachek I agree with magicusb. be honest about the 'almost' hit by geller

And I think that joshua lozoff has a valid point

http://www.themagiccafe.com/forums/viewtopic.php?topic=235802&forum=62&1
Message: Posted by: John Nesbit (Nov 26, 2007 08:37PM)
[quote]
On 2007-11-26 19:59, Dr Spektor wrote:
then, even if someone goes frothing on the floor singing the Fibrianci number sequences (Arnon - feel free to correct my spelling) -
G'nite

Dr S
[/quote]

Doc, stand by for "Arnon/(Armageddon) ! You asked for it... ;)

[quote]
On 2007-11-26 20:03, Corona Smith wrote:
Fibonacci.
[/quote]

Best
John
Message: Posted by: Mind Guerrilla (Nov 26, 2007 09:34PM)
Didn't anyone read the transcript I posted on page 1 of this discussion?

(sigh) I work and slave for you people and I get no thanks.

Mr. Geller did not appear to be trying to guess the contents of the envelope. He was simply wishing Criss Angel success. I think he deserves credit for being gracious and showing some class but not for accurately naming the contents of the envelope.
Message: Posted by: Magnus Eisengrim (Nov 26, 2007 09:42PM)
I'd like to thank you, but the One Who Calls HimSelf Lord will tell me that I'm an idiot.

John
Message: Posted by: Slim King (Nov 26, 2007 09:56PM)
[quote]
On 2007-11-26 18:51, Banachek wrote:

Still one more envelope to go. Let's see how close others came.

As for what it is, I really don't know... I insisted Criss not tell me. Closest I have come is when Criss showed me the folded paper inside via a flashlight so as to make sure one could not really tell what was written.

Nice to see people enjoying the ride Criss set up.
[/quote]

According to the NBC board less than 10% as many guesses for envelope number 2...Basically little or no interest in it. Seems the ride has come to an end. The contest was a Non-contest in my mind since no one really knew the rules to begin with and no one really got to guess at the contents...Even the envelopes looked a little shady and I never saw the million (Like in all of the cool Poker tounaments).
I guess I do feel like I was taken for a ride :).......Thanks Criss....
Message: Posted by: Doug Higley (Nov 26, 2007 09:57PM)
I can attest that John is a Liberal leaning stuffed shirt Canadian but not an idiot. He just plays one on the Café according to certain unfair criteria and perceptions. In reality (on PMs) John is self effacing and funny and very bright. (For a mathmetician) and I will defend him to the end as being an ok Joe in my book. So what can I say...I'm an idiot.


I know what's in envelope #2. Would someone like my prediciton to hold and verify?
You keep the money. Unless it's real...then we split. :)
Message: Posted by: Harry H (Nov 27, 2007 03:51AM)
[quote]
On 2007-11-26 22:34, Mind Guerilla wrote:
Didn't anyone read the transcript I posted on page 1 of this discussion?

(sigh) I work and slave for you people and I get no thanks.

Mr. Geller did not appear to be trying to guess the contents of the envelope. He was simply wishing Criss Angel success. I think he deserves credit for being gracious and showing some class but not for accurately naming the contents of the envelope.
[/quote]

The truth hurts some on here MG.
Message: Posted by: Bambaladam (Nov 27, 2007 06:38AM)
If they were going to air Uri speak about the envelopes they should have let him finish.

This way it's all unresolved, no matter what some "psychic" "skeptics" here seem to think they know about what Uri was saying and would say next.
Message: Posted by: darrylasher (Nov 27, 2007 07:57AM)
[quote]
On 2007-11-26 18:51, Banachek wrote:
Wow, first off, to win the million one had to mention what was in both envelopes. No if and but's just EXACTELY what was in BOTH. 119 would not count 191 would not count only 911 counts, no pictures of buildings, planes, smoke..no comments about hearing a scream, no mention of numbers, dates...no.. well you get the idea.

Also Uri never said it was a date in the envelope. You are assuming due to the fact he talked about how long he and Criss have been performing. And how close in birthdates (think astrology here) they are and as a result how their thinking is really not that far apart. At least that is what it sounded like to me.

As for the cutting off....first episode the producers were calling New York and having them remove segments videotaped so as to fit the show into the time slot. This was happening as it aired. The last episode was super tight too. That was on reason Jim Callahan's letter of what was in the envelope was removed. All acts were going over time alloted. Criss and Uri had both been told not to elaborate but to get to the point. Criss was doing as he was told. Show what was in the envelope. All Uri had to say was, I see the numbers nine, one, one...

Still one more envelope to go. Let's see how close others came.

As for what it is, I really don't know... I insisted Criss not tell me. Closest I have come is when Criss showed me the folded paper inside via a flashlight so as to make sure one could not really tell what was written.

Nice to see people enjoying the ride Criss set up.
[/quote]

Well said.

There's a good deal of confirmation bias happening here. Had the envelope contained a drawing, some people would try to say that Uri's rambling had something to do with that. If it contained a name, some would have said "Oh, look! Uri used the exact same letters of the alphabet to form his words as Criss used in what he wrote!"

I haven't looked back at the video, but was it not also the HOST who was hurrying things along, not just Criss trying to "cut Uri off"?

I have said here before that I respect Uri more than I expected, despite the fact that I don't agree with the dishonesty of his claims. But I am more than a little surprised at the number of magicians rushing to his defence as if his claims were genuine. Do you hate (or are jealous of) Criss so much that you would rather support anyone but him? Or do you wish so much that your own powers were real that you hope Uri's are, because it gives you hope that you someday can be "real" as well?

It's a fascinating dynamic.
Message: Posted by: Mind Guerrilla (Nov 27, 2007 09:21AM)
[quote]
On 2007-11-27 07:38, Bambaladam wrote:
If they were going to air Uri speak about the envelopes they should have let him finish.[/quote]

Mr. Geller could not have finished speaking about the envelopes because he never began. Check out my transcript from page 1 of this thread. Nowhere does he say "I sense your evelope contains..." or "Criss, I will now reveal to the best of my ability the contents of your envelope..." or "It's '911!' I'm right, am I not? Open that envelope, you punk, and let the skeptics of the world tremble before my awe-inspiring power!"

This is what he said:

"I knew you’ll challenge me once more…but let me…tell you something: Although we were born 1 day apart- I was born on the 20th of December and you on the 19th- there’s a lot of…a lot of years between us. 40 years. You were 1 year old when I came out with my spoon bending…and I wish…and I wish you a lot of success for…40 years."

It seemed to me that he had completed his thought and had nothing else to say. If he did have something else to say, I think they would have let him say it since he was one of the producers of the show. I assume during the last commercial break the host would have been told exactly what was to happen during the show's last few minutes and whether or not Uri Geller was going to take a crack (or a "gander") at the envelopes.
Message: Posted by: Dr Spektor (Nov 27, 2007 10:54AM)
So? What does that have to do with the fact people will see and hear what they want?

MG, it is time to start a new travesty. This one is winding dowwwwwnn... can't you feel the heat death of this thread? No big crunch and boom coming... just.... slowing of molecules towards zero kelvin....

We must cross the threshold to a new reality!
Message: Posted by: Corona Smith (Nov 27, 2007 11:05AM)
Psychic cow from notepad?
Message: Posted by: Dr Spektor (Nov 27, 2007 11:22AM)
Infinibovina from the 5th Dimension
Message: Posted by: Slim King (Nov 27, 2007 12:41PM)
When I do a "Reveal" I don't just come out and say...37!!!!! I usually have some sort of relevant story or weird reason...Why would Uri be so different?
Message: Posted by: zeggman (Nov 27, 2007 12:58PM)
[quote]
On 2007-11-26 18:07, Jim-Callahan wrote:
We will see Paolo, what the California Gaming Board has to say about Criss and NBC in the very near future.
[/quote]
Ooh, ooh, can I make another spot-on prediction?

They'll have nothing to say about it. This wasn't gambling, unless you want to argue that you were gambling your reputation by pretending you were about to rise to the challenge.

It was a simple challenge, and you declined it.

If CA had said he'd give you a million dollars if you could unring a bell, or eat 100 hard-boiled eggs in less than an hour, it would have been the same thing -- a simple challenge, not an unlicensed game of chance.

I know grasping at straws when I see it -- they don't call me "Rumplestiltzken" for nothing.
Message: Posted by: Slim King (Nov 27, 2007 02:36PM)
Seems that NBC went along with the challenge putting them BOTH under it's jurasdiction(sp). IMHO :)

I never even read that Uri had accepted the challenge but I see CA "Kind of" gave him a chance ..But Jim Callahan openenly wanted a shot and CA denied him an opportunity similar to Uri's.
Bad Karma for CA in the long run.

I AM amazed the Uri got the numbers right!
Message: Posted by: John Nesbit (Nov 27, 2007 03:20PM)
Eggman, you keep insisting that Jim declined the challenge. Do you care to elaborate on that? How so ?
Message: Posted by: shane (Nov 27, 2007 04:40PM)
[quote]
On 2007-11-26 18:51, Banachek wrote:
Wow, first off, to win the million one had to mention what was in both envelopes. No if and but's just EXACTELY what was in BOTH. 119 would not count 191 would not count only 911 counts, no pictures of buildings, planes, smoke..no comments about hearing a scream, no mention of numbers, dates...no.. well you get the idea.
[/quote]

Banachek,
It was never mentioned that to win the million dollars you had to be exact.

And if it was that by definition means CA did not "bust Jim" as Jim never claimed to be able to name exact contents of an envelope he had never seen.

Hell when they locked an item he had seen, in a box he only got close to what it contained.
Red 4 weels metal.
This is not a direct hit.

I have seen you perform on several occasions and you never just name the item? Why are you a fake? Is it my right to come to your show and bring my envelopes? Agree or disagree with physic abilities. CA's attempt proved nothing except to make him and every in his camp look juvenile.

I hope to see you soon I will have my envelopes ready.

Shane
Message: Posted by: Lord Of The Horses (Nov 27, 2007 06:00PM)
And the plot thickens...
Message: Posted by: Dr Spektor (Nov 27, 2007 07:40PM)
[quote]
On 2007-11-27 17:40, shane wrote:
[quote]
On 2007-11-26 18:51, Banachek wrote:
Wow, first off, to win the million one had to mention what was in both envelopes. No if and but's just EXACTELY what was in BOTH. 119 would not count 191 would not count only 911 counts, no pictures of buildings, planes, smoke..no comments about hearing a scream, no mention of numbers, dates...no.. well you get the idea.
[/quote]

Banachek,
It was never mentioned that to win the million dollars you had to be exact.

And if it was that by definition means CA did not "bust Jim" as Jim never claimed to be able to name exact contents of an envelope he had never seen.

Hell when they locked an item he had seen, in a box he only got close to what it contained.
Red 4 weels metal.
This is not a direct hit.

I have seen you perform on several occasions and you never just name the item? Why are you a fake? Is it my right to come to your show and bring my envelopes? Agree or disagree with physic abilities. CA's attempt proved nothing except to make him and every in his camp look juvenile.

I hope to see you soon I will have my envelopes ready.

Shane
[/quote]

Give that Shane a ceegar.

Although, it would be cool to have people constantly popping up at CA's and his Machine's appearances constantly yelling to guess contents of envelopes....
Message: Posted by: Banachek (Nov 27, 2007 07:49PM)
Shane, those are not my rules, They were the rules that NBC and everyone knew.

Don't assume you know everything that took place at Phenomenon behind the scenes and on other shows related.

I did not say Criss busted Jim?? Not sure why that comes in your discussion with me. Just wanted to make that clear.

If anyone had said I know there are two ones and a nine in the envelope that I would consider a hit. The fact is no one did.

I have a huge disclaimer in my show. I state I am not psychic as you would know if you have seen my show. So feel free to bring your envelopes. Not sure what the purpose would be? To test my psychic ablilities that I state I do not have?? Kinda wierd if you ask me.

A little common sense should tell anyone that you are not going to get a million dollars with a near hit. However, since you seem to want to bring Jim into this, I never saw him have a near hit with the envelopes. Do you know something we do not know?

I'm not saying that a near hit does not mean your not psychic at all. In fact, if someone could do that consistantly I certainly would lean towards the idea they might be. Further testing would tell and seperate statistical chance from paranormal chance. In fact if someone stated that they could could come very close each time. That would be a fantastic claim if they could succeed. Bottom line is, rules can not be changed to fit after the fact.

Anyway, I am off back to work after a wonderful thanksgiving break so this will be my last word on this. It was fun for a couple of days.
Message: Posted by: Slim King (Nov 27, 2007 08:24PM)
Thanks Steve. I appreciate the fact that you bother to communicate with us (I'm not trying to sound demeaning) Most in your situation don't.
Thanks
Again
Dave
Message: Posted by: darrylasher (Nov 28, 2007 01:28AM)
Ditto to what Dave said. You have gone above the call to be gracious in posting here. I appreciate reading your thoughts. (Ha!)
Message: Posted by: shane (Nov 28, 2007 07:59AM)
[quote]
On 2007-11-27 20:49, Banachek wrote:
I have a huge disclaimer in my show. I state I am not psychic as you would know if you have seen my show. So feel free to bring your envelopes. Not sure what the purpose would be? To test my psychic ablilities that I state I do not have?? Kinda wierd if you ask me.
[/quote]

Are you saying that you show contains no false claims? I have seen your show several times and though you do not claim to be physic you do make false claims during the show.
Is it ok to make false claims as long as they do not involve claims of the supernatural? Is it ok to lie to people about science?

that's like saying its ok to steal, but only somethings.
Oh wait I did that today when I complained about magciains stealing my effects and then downloaded Britneys new CD for free.

Looks like we are all a bunch of liars and theives who only care about anything when it fit our agenda.

Banachek,
I hope you enjoyed your holiday at home. I was in no way trying to attack you, only hoping to point out that we all have bias on any subject.

"Think more, type less"

Shane

P.s. Brits new CD is off the chain!
Message: Posted by: Mind Guerrilla (Nov 28, 2007 11:01AM)
[quote]
On 2007-11-28 08:59, shane wrote:
Are you saying that you show contains no false claims? I have seen your show several times and though you do not claim to be physic you do make false claims during the show.
Is it ok to make false claims as long as they do not involve claims of the supernatural? Is it ok to lie to people about science?
[/quote]

Jiminy Cricket. What part of "this will be my last word on this..." do you not understand?

It seems "Baiting Banachek" has become almost as popular a sport here as "Attacking Angel." Godfrey Daniel.

This places one of the giants of mentalism in a no-win situation. If he doesn't reply, he risks some here saying, "See? The big shot thinks he's too good to talk to us." If he does reply, he risks lending some legitimacy to a sniping post. It's a tribute to his professionalism that he can respond and still maintain his dignity. If I were Banachek (Alas, I'm not and never will be) I would be a lot less diplomatic.

In the future, please consider contacting Banachek telepathically.

In Thoughts,
Mind Guerrilla
Message: Posted by: Terry Holley (Nov 28, 2007 11:59AM)
[quote]
On 2007-11-27 13:41, Slim King wrote:
When I do a "Reveal" I don't just come out and say...37!!!!!
[/quote]

I hope not, since you'd be wrong most of the time - unless you're still using that hackneyed psychological "you-know-what"!

[quote]
I usually have some sort of relevant story or weird reason...Why would Uri be so different?
[/quote]

Because he's a real psychic and you are an impostor! :)

Terry
Message: Posted by: Slim King (Nov 28, 2007 12:18PM)
What?...Where on my website does it say I'm an Imposter? Or even a Real Psychic?....Exactly where are you getting your info, or are you just making it up as you go along?
I'd love to see one of your performances...Got one on youtube? You love Banacheck but if my 11 year old daughter uses the number 37 in her act you are against it?
Have another beer :)
:cheers:

Martin Gardners 37 force came out before Banachek was born :)
Message: Posted by: Terry Holley (Nov 28, 2007 01:53PM)
[quote]
On 2007-11-28 13:18, Slim King wrote:

Martin Gardners 37 force came out before Banachek was born :)
[/quote]

You're sounding an awful lot like Uri when he was talking to Criss just before the envelope reveal! Are you getting ready to guess what's in the second envelope? :winker:

Terry
Message: Posted by: Slim King (Nov 28, 2007 06:25PM)
No one wants to know :). Less than 10% of people have guess on the NBC forum compared to envelope number 1.......Even worse...Less than 150 out of 5 or 6 Million viewers...Not too much interest there :)
I think that's about 3/1,000th of a percent :)
Correct me if I'm wrong....
Message: Posted by: Philemon Vanderbeck (Nov 28, 2007 06:38PM)
I made a guess to what's in the second envelope...
Message: Posted by: John Nesbit (Nov 28, 2007 06:41PM)
Care to share that ? :)
Message: Posted by: Doug Higley (Nov 28, 2007 07:07PM)
Please put this in context! Angel was a MINOR player in this show. Look at the last episode please for cryin out loud. He had almost no screen time or 'go to' time. The camera was on him like a flea hop.

Put it in the context of ANY show. Take a Play...it has writers and producers and directors and Consultants and is all together except they need a name. So they get some B or C list 'star' to put on the marqee in case it might attract a few butts in the seats. Here's a guy who had a magic show on a third rate network. Buy his name to paste on the show. If the show is a hit he's still a minor player in the production. If it flops he's back to his 3rd rate network. All in all he is insignificant to the overall show as it was presented. Banacheck was a hired gun...a TOP gun in the field but not a with name recognition like CA. Banacheck gets a job to make CA look better. An impossible task but who is to know that ahead of time?

If some sideshow hires me as a consultant and to provide gaffs and then they hire some punk who can't cut it to front it, and he turns a potentially good idea to crap, you going to blame me? And not buy my stuff? Screw you.

Did anybody ever hear of BENEFIT OF THE DOUBT??? Do you think Banacheck EARNED that over the years of outstanding output and service to us all? You bet your ass he did. So because he gets hired to do a job that can't be done yet has the honor to follow it through he is to be raked over the coals? Wow. All for some flea bitten replacement TV show and 4th rate 40 yr old goth boy?

Banacheck has nothing to live down...most all in this business have plenty to live UP TO his level of professionalism and thoughtfulness. I don't know Banacheck but I know his work and it SHOULD take a lot more than a **** ant TV show to call out the dogs and threats not to buy his stuff. Think.

Do you thnk maybe Banacheck has some LOYALTY to those he was working with other than CA? Does that count anymore?

Your milage may differ but but hired guns shoot thier best shot and work with what they have to work with. Just like me and you.


Now everybody say, "Doug is right...let's cut banacheck some slack and give him the benefit of the doubt."

Now that we are all in sync...buy a Demented Eye please.
Message: Posted by: magicusb (Nov 28, 2007 07:58PM)
On Uri Geller, who has to be considered one of the greatest mentalists of all time, it is pretty amazing that in less than 20 seconds after being challenged by Criss Angel as to what was in that envelope would have blurted out both the numbers 1 19 and 20 1. He, I am sure, was not told that it was numbers in the envelope and yet, no matter how you cut it, he blurted out those numbers, out of the millions of words in the English language. What you saw is what you got.

There is yet another youtube.com one that is long and avant guard,

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2RQWaMZgFkI

I hope the media picks up on this.

Best to all,

Dick Brooks
Houdini Tour & Magic Show
"Haunted! Mind Mysteries & THE Beyond
The countries longest running all year paranormal & seance shows.

Houdini Museum
1433 N. Main Ave
Scranton, PA 18508
(570) 342-5555
Message: Posted by: Terry Holley (Nov 28, 2007 08:43PM)
[quote]
On 2007-11-28 20:58, magicusb wrote:

There is yet another youtube.com one that is long and avant guard,

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2RQWaMZgFkI

I hope the media picks up on this.
[/quote]

I wonder what that guy was smoking when he put that video together?

Terry
Message: Posted by: Dr Spektor (Nov 28, 2007 08:55PM)
He was smoking the contents of whatever is in Envelope #2


Say, anyone getting a Monty Haul feeling?
Message: Posted by: magicusb (Nov 29, 2007 06:09AM)
Just to keep this Phenomenon thing going, someone just emailed me from Europe with the following...


on European computers, the month comes after the day. So 911 would be 119 or "one-nineteen" which is exactly what Uri Geller said to Criss Angel!


Dick Brooks
Houdini Tour & Magic Show
"Haunted! Mind Mysteries & THE Beyond
The countries longest running all year paranormal & seance show.
Houdini Museum
1433 N. Main Ave
Scranton, PA 18508
(570) 342-5555
Message: Posted by: magicusb (Nov 29, 2007 06:47AM)
WOW.... Here is yet another Avant Guard take on 911, Uri Geller, Criss Angel and the Phenomenon show. I believe by the same videographer. A bit strong, I think, but it makes its point.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3BVoUUEBx48


Dick Brooks

"Haunted! Mind Mysteries & THE Beyond
America's longest running all year paranormal & seance show.
(570) 383-9297
Message: Posted by: coupcoupdaddy (Nov 29, 2007 07:14AM)
We would have liked to take a gander to see if Buddha was folded into those papers CA discarded when he finally revealed the one with the three numbers. Should this be in Inner Thoughts?
Message: Posted by: Dr Spektor (Nov 29, 2007 08:23AM)
It is not the Bu**ha papers... silly, CCD - it is the Angel Scroll effect - Cri$$ invented the technique two weeks before Bu**ha was even born.... in fact, the word AVM stands for MMMIIINNNDDFFFTRRRREEEAAAKKKK
Message: Posted by: darrylasher (Nov 29, 2007 08:57AM)
[quote]
On 2007-11-28 20:58, magicusb wrote:
On Uri Geller, who has to be considered one of the greatest mentalists of all time, it is pretty amazing that in less than 20 seconds after being challenged by Criss Angel as to what was in that envelope would have blurted out both the numbers 1 19 and 20 1. He, I am sure, was not told that it was numbers in the envelope and yet, no matter how you cut it, he blurted out those numbers, out of the millions of words in the English language. What you saw is what you got.

There is yet another youtube.com one that is long and avant guard,

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2RQWaMZgFkI

I hope the media picks up on this.

[/quote]

The media didn't even pick up on the SHOW ITSELF, so I doubt they will pick up on a non-event that was part of that show.
Message: Posted by: KingStardog (Nov 29, 2007 09:19AM)
The look on Criss Angels face when Uri said those numbers....

In one single moment, he knew Randi was a con, and it looks like he may have pooed a little....

Discuss.
Message: Posted by: Lord Of The Horses (Nov 29, 2007 11:34AM)
[quote]
On 2007-11-29 10:19, KingStardog wrote:
The look on Criss Angels face when Uri said those numbers....

In one single moment, he knew Randi was a con.
[/quote]

If I were Geller I would throw a curse on Criss Angel...

Because Uri sure has no power to curse (or has he?)... it will sure be just a coincidence if short time after being cursed Criss Angel will pay him the million ;)
Message: Posted by: KingStardog (Nov 29, 2007 03:10PM)
Ok serious for a bit.

His plan was to utilize a looped billet switch from his jeans with just one convenient opening under his left palm, but he went into panic mode and could not make the follow through. Once he was in panic mode we can see the full face flushing and what we call a softening of facial tone. A subconscious tell that his mind was panicking and he was going through a mental beat down.

(Incidentally, a low daily dose of dopamine will stave off the panic rush. An old con mans trick balancing the blood to keep calm, done with oversize cigars like churchills or with herbals in pill or tea form)

As for a curse? Well it was a self defeat, as I predicted, when exposing the sigals reversed their ability to block second sight. Now to explain how this works is very difficult without teaching it in active lessons. Imagine a hive mind. Not a global one but a smaller one with only a few thousand connections. Each connection has a specific talent but all are facets or pieces unless that piece is given to the rest. At that point the piece of common knowledge is distributed. Now when the reality that a white piece of paper became evident, it became a distributed reality, and the other talents can build upon it. Here is the rub. More than one hive mind is available and distributed processing to all of the hundreds or thousands does take a little time. Though not long. In fact the time is only dependent on the belief of the connections. Time is relevant. To understand this better in order to react to pain your nervous system and brain must actually work about a second and a half to two seconds...in the past for it to be instant in the present. Moving forward Uri's contact with CA brought the hives together in a way that can only work with that contact. Lets think of it this way. You work with someone daily. eventually you start thinking the same thoughts at the same time. How is this possible? spouses and friends utter the same words at the exact same time? Twins do it more. When an individual from one hive is defending itself, that hive will milk or steal from another what is needed for its defense. Now here are the steps to Uri's win. 1.The defeat of the sigal. 2.Knowing from a distributed talent that there was white paper further blocking the vision. 3. The actual harvest of the information. all three being unknown, and unbacked by current science, but supported by philosophical laws. The one thing that is critical is belief, because what is believed and perceived is created. Go back to the slot test. The electron goes right, left, or splits itself and goes through both slots, but only until it is being watched. Once it is aware it is being watched it comes under the expected scientific outcome. Change the receiving plate and stop watching and the electrons go back to doing whatever they want to. Regardless of what we want to believe outside of conscious perception they do behave the way they want, showing the smallest particles of matter think on their own. The second law of thermodynamics tells us they even want to dis assemble and exist in their simplest form but an unknown and unexplainable by science power has control over the way matter exists.

The layperson will be so lost by now they will disregard this as rubbish.

For inquiring expanded minds, the first of two movies:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3QlZ5O8_bGk

You can see all 10 parts on youtube. After that you will need to see the second dvds which you can get used off of amazon or some where called "down the rabbit hole" which is two dvds.

When you understand all of the concepts and science and are ready to create, do so, with rigid testing procedures and record all results in a journal. When you have mastered the laws of creation, then you can email me and we can be serious about everything else going forward, and away from those not ready to enjoy the adventure because their minds can't accept it. Remember, they are right because whomever taught them they are right said so. As you believe, so it is unto you.

Uri believes.
Message: Posted by: Terry Holley (Nov 29, 2007 03:52PM)
[quote]
On 2007-11-29 16:10, KingStardog wrote:

The layperson will be so lost by now they will disregard this as rubbish.

[/quote]

You predicted it!

I feel like the Pincipal in Billy Madison who said, "Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul"? :)

Terry
Message: Posted by: Slim King (Nov 29, 2007 04:35PM)
I have the DVD and it is amazing!
Message: Posted by: KingStardog (Nov 29, 2007 06:37PM)
Killer DVD. Slim you need to get the second one, called Down the rabbit hole. It has two dvds.

I am kind of partial to The Secret, after those two, but it is always the choice if someone chokes on what the bleep. Teach these things straight from the Old and New testament too, which freaks people out pretty good. Teach them from Clymer's oldest volumes too. Its all the same really.
Message: Posted by: Slim King (Nov 29, 2007 08:01PM)
Makes most of these Café discussions seem so superficial!
Message: Posted by: Dr Spektor (Nov 29, 2007 08:44PM)
...GATCHAMAN... Cri$$ is secretly Galactor/Zoltar.... (depending which series version you watch)...
Message: Posted by: darrylasher (Nov 30, 2007 12:34AM)
Oh. Oh no. What the bleep. Really I mean that. What the BLEEP!
Message: Posted by: gamma105 (Nov 30, 2007 12:55AM)
[quote]
On 2007-11-29 21:44, Dr Spektor wrote:
...GATCHAMAN... Cri$$ is secretly Galactor/Zoltar.... (depending which series version you watch)...
[/quote]

holy tight pants batman.. that brought back memories! lol
Message: Posted by: KingStardog (Nov 30, 2007 09:16AM)
[quote]
On 2007-11-29 21:01, Slim King wrote:
Makes most of these Café discussions seem so superficial!
[/quote]

I think the best test is the right and left ear click tapes. They made two tapes exactly the same, with more clicks for the right ear than the left.(headphones) One was locked in a safe, and a random subject listened to the other, but was told to focus on hearing more left clicks than right. after listening a couple of times the tape was returned and the brought it back to the lab.

when the counted the clicks there were more left clicks. The control was removed from the safe. Now we would expect the electrons on the strip to be altered from the test subject but when the control was removed, it also had changed to more left clicks.

Th tester were stunned. The tapes were now behaving the way that two differing minds both thought they should.

Now go look at some old VCR tapes and see if they are fading the way your memory of them did....
Message: Posted by: KingStardog (Nov 30, 2007 12:22PM)
Leaving folks hanging without giving exact answers isn't really fair I suppose.
I don't want anymore emails on the subject either.

Q. Did Uri actually guess what was in the envelope and get cut off?
A. Yes. but he may have created the cut off through belief he would be cheated regardless of the outcome or accuracy. Others may have also created with the same thoughts. Uri however demonstrated, he is fully educated in at least the Philosophical laws, even if he didn't understand the quantum mechanics. Jim is also certain to have the same functional understanding, and either given the full opportunity to respond could have. Jim's choice would have been the same as mine, without the the actual cash present, I would also decline. My belief is there never was any intent to pay and he copied an old stunt from the 1890s where an offer of ten thousand dollars was made to prove a cage was gimmicked was put up by an escape artist. The same garbage copied by Houdini about 20yrs later and CA 80yrs later. Its a Con.

Q.Are there laws of science to explain the function of the method and is there a specific method to create a reality, from a thought construct?
A.Yes. There are several methods to use the laws, but oddly enough, multiple differing methods to achieve the construct, change the rate and speed,or as we know, alter time itself, forward, backward, or present depending on choices.

Q. Will you tell exactly how to guess the second envelope in advance?
A. I already have,i'm done spoon feeding. Didn't the Master Teacher tell you: All of these things I do, you will do and greater? Didn't he read the mind of the disciple under the tree?
Message: Posted by: Dr Spektor (Nov 30, 2007 12:47PM)
.... are you saying the envelope contains the name JUDAS?
Message: Posted by: KingStardog (Nov 30, 2007 01:00PM)
[quote]
On 2007-11-30 13:47, Dr Spektor wrote:
.... are you saying the envelope contains the name JUDAS?
[/quote]

He is a sort of magic judas eh?

My wife says Criss Angel is the OJ Simpson of magic.
Message: Posted by: Mind Guerrilla (Nov 30, 2007 01:17PM)
"WHAT THE BLEEP?!"

Aargh!
I weep! I wail! I gnash my teeth!

I never expected such new age jibber jabber to be accepted by those who are expert in the art of passing off baloney as filet mignon.

When it was running in the theaters, my friend and his wife recommended I go see it. They are new age types. I sent them my full review.

Luckily for you people I saved it on my hard drive and I now present it for your edification (whatever that means).
*
*
*
WHAT THE BLEEP DO WE KNOW!? (My rating: two stars out of four)
This one started out looking like it was going to be an at-least-three-star film, on par with a very good episode of NOVA. It starts off with a bunch of people discussing no less than the nature of reality and how quantum physics may reveal its inner workings to us. Can science be reconciled with religion? A lot of people have latched onto quantum physics as the missing link that can explain everything from Jesus Christ to psychic phenomena. Arguably, science is itself a religion but that’s a topic for another movie. So, anyway..yeah…a hell of a topic. I rubbed my hands and settled back thinking, “This oughta be good.” After ten or fifteen minutes, though, I began to get frustrated because none of the people on the screen were being identified. “Who the BLEEP Are these people?!” I wondered. Should I place any more value on what they have to say regarding the nature of existence than I would the ramblings of a random stoner? The fact that they were all basically agreeing with each other- that there was no dissenting viewpoint- did not help matters as far as keeping the discussion stimulating. Now one might assume that most of the people being interviewed in this movie are quantum physicists and/or theologians. If you sat through the end credits, you know this is not true. One of the people (the Irish guy) has some background in theology. Some of the other people are physicists but only a few have credentials which I would consider as making them experts on the subject matter of this film (and even those guys are associated with some rather obscure institutions (“The Maharishi University of Management?”)). One guy is an anesthesiologist (I think I might have seen him on a Discovery Channel special on a similar topic. I wonder if he makes his living now just sitting out in the desert discussing consciousness. It’s good work if you can get it.). As for the other “experts,” well, I’ll talk about a couple more of them in a bit.

A movie-within-the-movie endeavors to illustrate the points being made by the “experts.” It deals with a female photographer (played by CHILDREN OF A LESSER GOD’s Marlee Matlin) who is having a very weird day which includes running into a little boy playing basketball and spouting what sound like lines from THE MATRIX. This mini-movie features some amusing moments and cute animation but ultimately felt like so much filler. While standing on a train platform she learns of experiments done which seem to show that the molecular structure of water changes when exposed to various words and emotions. A man on the platform, played by Armin Shimerman of STAR TREK: DEEP SPACE NINE (he also played Kramer’s caddy on SEINFELD), reminds her that we are all composed mainly of water- so can you imagine what negative feelings must be doing to us? So what’s all this about changing the molecular structure of water? That’s alchemy isn’t it- lead-into-gold, quintessence, blah blah blah? Do negative emotions change water into peanut butter or what? The photographs on display do show the molecular structure of water. I don’t think that they ever actually mention that these are photographs of ice crystals. Some of the photos show very nice symmetric crystal formation. Is it because positive feelings and words were associated with this batch of water or is it because the water used was very pure? One photo shows an ugly, disordered scene. Is this because the message “You make me sick” was written on the container or is this because contaminated water was used? You be the judge! I don’t think we have much to worry about unless we are caught outside in a blizzard. If you freeze to death, I guess it would be embarrassing to have asymmetric crystal formation (“Not only did he freeze to death but he was thinking negative thoughts to boot!”). This is all based on the actual work of a guy called Mr. Emoto. Yes, that’s his real name (Domo arigato).

Now, believe it or not, at this point I still thought this was a decent three-star flick...well, two-and-a-half maybe. But the movie takes a weird left turn. It goes from discussing the nature of particles to the theory that we are all unable to makes changes in our lives because we are addicted to emotions. WTF? Many of the talking heads seen at the beginning of the film are absent in this portion of the movie. A Stuart Smalley-type guy seated in front of a fireplace dominates this section of the film although we occasionally also get words of wisdom from a husky blond woman who seems to be wearing Captain Kathryn Janeway’s dress uniform (As an example of how we can create our own reality she offers the example of a man getting a “hard on” while having a sexual fantasy. WTF?). It was during this portion of the film that I felt like the victim of a bait and switch. What began as a discussion of the nature of reality was now turning into some self-help infomercial-cum-cult that would put L. Ron Hubbard to shame (At the end of her weird day, the female photographer throws her medication away! This scene would give faith healer Peter Popoff a hard on.). The Stuart Smalley guy says that he creates his own day and that he then gets confirmation of this by receiving some sort of unambiguous sign. Unfortunately he offers not one concrete example of this (At one point he does create a new word though: “mediocricy.”). And what are this guy’s credentials? According to the end credits, he’s a chiropractor. Those chiropractors are all such know-it-alls! And who, pray tell, is the woman in the Starfleet uniform? Why, it’s Ramtha! Yes, that’s right, it’s the dame who, for the past twenty-five years or so has made big bucks by claiming to channel a 35,000 year-old spirit/warrior. Where are Penn & Teller when we need them?

The movie switches back to its more general theme toward the end and all the talking heads return. I had pretty much tuned out at this point.
*
*
*
I passed on the sequel.
Message: Posted by: Dr Spektor (Nov 30, 2007 02:04PM)
http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2007/03/majestic_borges.html

http://baires.elsur.org/archives/borges-judas/
Message: Posted by: KingStardog (Nov 30, 2007 02:23PM)
Mind Guerrilla, Are you sure you wrote that and not Stewy from the family Guy? :)
Message: Posted by: KingStardog (Nov 30, 2007 02:50PM)
I do find that persons of self absorbed or material nature do try to reject what they are too mentally challenged to even partially understand.

And I do think your review was 100% correct. I mean just look at this string of Harvard, Yale, and Stanford educated hacks.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kjLYv-fiaxw&feature=related
Message: Posted by: KingStardog (Nov 30, 2007 03:15PM)
And this definately busts that water crystal quack.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XWmWWqm1hFs&feature=related


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rZDOPQRdxJM&feature=related
Message: Posted by: KingStardog (Nov 30, 2007 03:27PM)
[quote]
On 2007-11-30 15:50, KingStardog wrote:
I do find that persons of self absorbed or material nature do try to reject what they are too mentally challenged to even partially understand.

And I do think your review was 100% correct. I mean just look at this string of Harvard, Yale, and Stanford educated hacks.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kjLYv-fiaxw&feature=related
[/quote]

Yep, now that I pause every caption and read them closely I can see I look up to the wrong sort of element and run in the wrong crowds. I am a total loser for not worshiping some mentalist from Queens.

Its so clear to me now.
Message: Posted by: JohnEBlaze (Nov 30, 2007 06:31PM)
[quote]
You predicted it!

I feel like the Pincipal in Billy Madison who said, "Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul"? :)

Terry
[/quote]

Knibb High Football Rules!
Message: Posted by: zeggman (Nov 30, 2007 11:09PM)
I think you may be too on something.

I also am exposed music and spoken word onto my cattle.

When speaking word "Criss Angel," de facto steaming symmetry, like a Fuji-san.

When say instead, "KingStarDog," explosive diarrhea.

Not to be cleaning that up, you betcha.
Message: Posted by: KingStardog (Dec 1, 2007 12:06PM)
Oooooooh! Zeggman! we have a new player....Perhaps you have some great insight too as to the actual methodologies that can be expressed in science?

Let me start off that I'm sure your racist overtones against the Japanese scientist, doing his best to speak English, were an attempt at humor at my expense. Certainly you are not the racist scum, that impedes globalism, and the advancement of mankind as a whole. On behalf of the good Doctor I accept your apologies here for him, unless of course you want to put on your white hood.

On to the items in question.

First off, your reference to the the ice crystal experiment shows you do not have even the slightest bit of understanding. The experiment is exactly this:

In order to follow the laws, it..... Can Not.... work double blind, if it did , it would show that direct thought does not create the outcome. The tested object must be exposed to consciousness. Go back to the double slot test and think it through again. You need to ask another question to figure out the answer, but are close. Since you have no belief in anything and, probably not even in yourself, you need to perform the rice test before actually bringing the bull patties out. In your case, I recommend you remove the control jar and store it in a neutral area and never in your presence. Remember everything must be sterilized including the lids.

The water molecule in its most ancient,perfect and natural form is a perfect pentagon shape... before...being frozen.

If you are in the top 20% this information is pure gold. If you are at the bottom you will never grasp it in this lifetime. Read this book and you will have some solid ground to comment from. Ultimate Computing: Bimolecular Consciousness and Nanotechnology. When you read it, we can discuss.

Remember, the detractors are always right, because whomever taught them they are right, said so. Now they believe it without ever thinking on their own.

So grades for the new pupils:

Mind Guerrilla: B Although you were repulsed and bored, and its just not up your alley you had presence to write down your opinions, from memory and had the receptive mind to try it out. For 80%, its just not their bag, no interest, nadda , zip.

Zeggman: D- Solely on the ability to grasp complex concepts, and not related to racism at all. Everything must be tested. You however need to work on how you will determine what to test and the correct methods.You need serious work on big picture thinking. You are focusing on a very small part.
Message: Posted by: KingStardog (Dec 1, 2007 12:13PM)
For the slower folks and those with very short attention spans the new microsoft enhanced DVD format will soon be available so when you get stuck on a concept you can click the drop down menus while the movie is playing.

We call this new format:

ADHD-HD-DVD It is also available in ADD-HD-DVD with less menus.
Message: Posted by: zeggman (Dec 1, 2007 01:08PM)
[quote]
On 2007-12-01 13:06, KingStardog wrote:
First off, your reference to the the ice crystal experiment shows you do not have even the slightest bit of understanding. The experiment is exactly this:

In order to follow the laws, it..... Can Not.... work double blind, if it did , it would show that direct thought does not create the outcome. The tested object must be exposed to consciousness.[/quote]
This requirement in no way precludes a double-blind test. Identical vials are filled from a single reservoir of water. Each vial is assigned a code number, which is known only to scientist 1. Water vials are randomly assigned to a "pretty thoughts" group, or an "ugly thoughts" group. A control group of "no thoughts" water may also be used, if desired.

Scientist 2 directs pretty thoughts at the pretty thought group, and ugly thoughts at the ugly thought group. He doesn't know the code number of any of the vials he is thinking at. If it is necessary to freeze the vials while they're being thought at, they're frozen using identical equipment, temperatures, etc., otherwise, the vials are randomly placed in a holding rack after the thinking is done, and frozen at the same time.

Scientist 3 assigns a numeric value to each vial of the resulting ice for whatever aesthetic criteria are being used. He is also unaware of the code number for any of the vials he evaluates.

Scientist 1 then correlates Scientist 3's evaluations with "pretty" or "ugly" information that's known only to him, and publishes the results.

The experiment can even be done in a triple-blind fashion, by allowing a fourth scientist to assign the vials to a "pretty" or "ugly" group based only on Scientist 3's evaluations, thus only allowing Scientist 1 (the only person in the experiment to know which code numbers were assigned to the "pretty" group) to publish how many were correctly assigned by Scientist 4.

[quote]
On 2007-12-01 13:06, KingStardog wrote:
The water molecule in its most ancient,perfect and natural form is a perfect pentagon shape... before...being frozen.[/quote]
Actually, a water molecule is triangular, though five water molecules may, under certain conditions, form a pentagonal cluster. Arguing over the health effects of "pentagonal" vs "hexagonal" water is a whole other branch of newage.

[quote]
On 2007-12-01 13:06, KingStardog wrote:
If you are in the top 20% this information is pure gold. If you are at the bottom you will never grasp it in this lifetime. Read this book and you will have some solid ground to comment from. Ultimate Computing: Bimolecular Consciousness and Nanotechnology. When you read it, we can discuss.
[/quote]
When there is a working application of the principles discussed in that book which does something useful, maybe it will be worth my time to read it. Let me know.
Message: Posted by: Mind Guerrilla (Dec 1, 2007 01:20PM)
[quote]
On 2007-11-30 15:23, KingStardog wrote:
Mind Guerrilla, Are you sure you wrote that and not Stewy from the family Guy? :)
[/quote]

Stop projecting.

Well, it looks like my little movie review came a little to close to the bone for "King." He wrote four- count 'em- four snipey replies!

[quote]
I do find that persons of self absorbed or material nature do try to reject what they are too mentally challenged to even partially understand.
[/quote]

You always know someone is secure in their opinion when they stoop to name calling instead of arguing a case on its merits. :)

[quote]
And I do think your review was 100% correct. I mean just look at this string of Harvard, Yale, and Stanford educated hacks
[/quote]

Dude, it was a move review. It's my opinion and not necessarily "correct" or "incorrect" in any objective sense. What school did you go to?

[quote]
Yep, now that I pause every caption and read them closely I can see I look up to the wrong sort of element and run in the wrong crowds. I am a total loser for not worshiping some mentalist from Queens.
[/quote]

If you are a total loser, as you say, it may be because you take it as a personal affront when someone has a different opinion than you.

As for being from Queens, at least I tell people where I'm from in case they want to come looking for me. :) I understand why you might wish to keep your location secret. If you ever visit New York, though, please let me know. I'd love to discuss this matter with you in person.

Oh, and you WILL worship me. One day you ALL will. BWAH HA HA HA HA!!!
Message: Posted by: KingStardog (Dec 2, 2007 02:27PM)
Zeggman, you have still failed to understand the principles. You have failed to move forward and I am cutting the line to return the undersized fish to the water. Study up and if you can suspend what you have been taught, you may understand. Keep studying.
Message: Posted by: KingStardog (Dec 2, 2007 03:00PM)
[quote]
On 2007-12-01 14:20, Mind Guerrilla wrote:
[quote]
On 2007-11-30 15:23, KingStardog wrote:
Mind Guerrilla, Are you sure you wrote that and not Stewy from the family Guy? :)
[/quote]

Stop projecting.

Well, it looks like my little movie review came a little to close to the bone for "King." He wrote four- count 'em- four snipey replies!

[quote]
I do find that persons of self absorbed or material nature do try to reject what they are too mentally challenged to even partially understand.
[/quote]

You always know someone is secure in their opinion when they stoop to name calling instead of arguing a case on its merits. :)

[quote]
And I do think your review was 100% correct. I mean just look at this string of Harvard, Yale, and Stanford educated hacks
[/quote]

Dude, it was a move review. It's my opinion and not necessarily "correct" or "incorrect" in any objective sense. What school did you go to?

[quote]
Yep, now that I pause every caption and read them closely I can see I look up to the wrong sort of element and run in the wrong crowds. I am a total loser for not worshiping some mentalist from Queens.
[/quote]

If you are a total loser, as you say, it may be because you take it as a personal affront when someone has a different opinion than you.

As for being from Queens, at least I tell people where I'm from in case they want to come looking for me. :) I understand why you might wish to keep your location secret. If you ever visit New York, though, please let me know. I'd love to discuss this matter with you in person.

Oh, and you WILL worship me. One day you ALL will. BWAH HA HA HA HA!!!
[/quote]

No not projecting at all. Poking a little fun and levity, that's all. No offense intended.

Four snippy replies. Well when the fishing is slow, you have to use what the call a multiple flasher or gang troll ahead of the lure to increase the probability of a bite. Again without them its not likely to get a response. Self absorbed nature? an interpolation not intended as anything but a random thought. Education? Even with our movie hosts,in years but always continuing. Probably till death. Queens and mentalism, well I didn't have enough flashing blades to get a response. Again no real offense intended. An affluent neighborhood in the near proximity of Seattle is my current location.

I didn't think much of the Ramtha reference either. This lady is a high occultist and added to represent philosophical views. The fact that she gets a check from running the school should have been left out, and the real field of expertise properly explained.

My latest contribution is the LT-LV-LCM process. It is the first method of laser cutting single cells from live biopsy tissue, removing the cells via liquid and vacuum. Cancer cells are the primary focus. Keeping them alive long enough to target eradication methods. My previous list is related to sub 20 nanometer semiconductor manufacture and I can not disclose further information. It is critical to 'play the loser' and direct jabs or people think you are too smart to be interested in what they have to say. In my case that is not true at all. I am very interested.

I did in fact appreciate the review and should have not joked around that much, with such dry material in the form of pranky snips. I will use a spray bottle next time. ;-)

Again the review was welcomed. This is not material or the direction of thought for the masses and the flip side of the coin should have been given respect.

If you have differing takes on some of the concepts it would be good to hear them.
Message: Posted by: zifferinolpm (Dec 6, 2007 10:47PM)
There are no [b]TRUE[/b] mentalists. :die: Anyone who is a magician should know this. It's [b]ALL[/b] a trick! Anyone see Uri get stumped on Carson. This shows his true talent. It's all a trick, nothing more, nothing less!
Message: Posted by: Philemon Vanderbeck (Dec 6, 2007 10:55PM)
Mentalist: (n.) a person who believes that the mind and its functions are a legitimate area of psychological research.
Message: Posted by: Jim-Callahan (Dec 7, 2007 06:26AM)
[quote]
On 2007-12-06 23:47, zifferinolpm wrote:
There are no [b]TRUE[/b] mentalists. :die: Anyone who is a magician should know this. It's [b]ALL[/b] a trick! Anyone see Uri get stumped on Carson. This shows his true talent. It's all a trick, nothing more, nothing less!
[/quote]

So you don't beleive in mentalists?

What about Paranormalists and the supernatural?


Jim
Message: Posted by: bdekolta (Dec 7, 2007 03:58PM)
Zifferinolpm said:
[quote]There are no TRUE mentalists. Anyone who is a magician should know this. It's ALL a trick![/quote]

Hmmm. I saw this on your website:

[quote]I am really excited about the new "Christianity and Psychics" show that discusses, in detail, how psychics mislead the public and what the Bible says about it. This show also involves many examples of mentalism and how psychics draw people in and keep them coming back for more.[/quote]

So it's all a trick? Except the supernatural beliefs that you hold? And performances like yours - are they designed to keep people coming back for more? What is the difference?

Do you expose mentalism effects in the course of this show? (That is a question and not an accusation.) If so how do you justify that?

Have you considered that a show like you present may actually leave people more vulnerable to the very thing you claim to be protecting them from? That is a serious question.

Please don't take these questions as anti-Christian statements. They are not.
Message: Posted by: Jim-Callahan (Dec 7, 2007 07:29PM)
Oh now I was leading up to that bdekolta, but wanted to play with him a bit first.

J ack

H.O.A-X
Message: Posted by: Mick Ayres (Dec 7, 2007 08:21PM)
Why pull the line when the fish is just getting interested in the bait on the hook, Jack? Let's test the drag on this...

I'm a devout Christian AND a true mentalist.

Best,
Mick
Message: Posted by: Dr Spektor (Dec 7, 2007 10:43PM)
And a Fiddler crab....
Message: Posted by: bdekolta (Dec 8, 2007 01:04AM)
[quote]Oh now I was leading up to that bdekolta, but wanted to play with him a bit first.[/quote]

Well you guys be sure and send me the syllabus next time! Besides that is a topic that can be played for quite some time as I'm sure you know. It also cuts to the heart of a lot of things.

Mick - Pastor and mentalist/magician here. Amazing to me where much of the thinking stops on this.

~ Dan
Message: Posted by: DJM (Dec 8, 2007 08:35AM)
Not sure if it has been posted.

http://biz.yahoo.com/prnews/071205/new029.html?.v=29
Message: Posted by: Slim King (Dec 8, 2007 08:55AM)
This should be all over the news.. Fact is, CA forgot to bring the cash :)
Message: Posted by: zifferinolpm (Dec 8, 2007 10:04AM)
[quote]
On 2007-12-07 07:26, Jim-Callahan wrote:
[quote]
On 2007-12-06 23:47, zifferinolpm wrote:
There are no [b]TRUE[/b] mentalists. :die: Anyone who is a magician should know this. It's [b]ALL[/b] a trick! Anyone see Uri get stumped on Carson. This shows his true talent. It's all a trick, nothing more, nothing less!
[/quote]

So you don't beleive in mentalists?

What about Paranormalists and the supernatural?


Jim
[/quote]

Absolutely not. No such thing. The only supernatural I believe in is the show that's on Thursday night. Not bad. As far as paranormalists, if you believe in them then your not a magician. Magicians all know it's fake.
Message: Posted by: zifferinolpm (Dec 8, 2007 10:11AM)
[quote]
On 2007-12-07 16:58, bdekolta wrote:
Zifferinolpm said:
[quote]There are no TRUE mentalists. Anyone who is a magician should know this. It's ALL a trick![/quote]

Hmmm. I saw this on your website:

[quote]I am really excited about the new "Christianity and Psychics" show that discusses, in detail, how psychics mislead the public and what the Bible says about it. This show also involves many examples of mentalism and how psychics draw people in and keep them coming back for more.[/quote]

So it's all a trick? Except the supernatural beliefs that you hold? And performances like yours - are they designed to keep people coming back for more? What is the difference?

Do you expose mentalism effects in the course of this show? (That is a question and not an accusation.) If so how do you justify that?

Have you considered that a show like you present may actually leave people more vulnerable to the very thing you claim to be protecting them from? That is a serious question.

Please don't take these questions as anti-Christian statements. They are not.
[/quote]

I do not expose any of the tricks that I do just explain to them that they are all tricks and so are all the ones that they pay money to have done such as readings and the like. They are being enlighted to the fact that it is all a trick. As far as my supernatural belief. God is spiritual, not supernatural.
Message: Posted by: Dr Spektor (Dec 8, 2007 10:26AM)
The trouble with people who think they are 100% right is that they miss the boat on a lot of things.

It would be nice if people would qualify their statements as IMHO or "My personal take/view/belief is...." versus blanket statements.

Respect other peoples' points of view is a nice way to moving towards truth...

Like most things in this ambigious universe... trust in those who seek the truth... beware those who claim they have found it.... some old proverb that seems to make sense at times.

Jim coined a great term, "Ideological Bigot" - it really is a fun thing to say out loud... 6+2 syllables long... it is fun to pronounce, isn't it....?

People need to chillax.

The people who like to change the world based on utopian ideals often tied to fundamentalist concepts (religious and secular) seemed to have caused the most death, destruction, trauma onto innocents and genocide throughout history - and there is more and more research on this supporting this concept.

In the end, we are all stuck on this blob of mud - so we all interact together, wether we like it or not.

Now, please send your Donations to the SPECTRE TEMPLE for further sermons.

(Am I Satan? Am I Nyarlathotep? Am I the False Prophet? Am I Ravana? Am I Iblis? Am I Judas? Am I Apep? Or am I just bored on a Saturday morning waiting for my wife to dry her hair so we can go for coffee and read the newspaper?)
Message: Posted by: Mind Guerrilla (Dec 8, 2007 03:38PM)
[quote]
On 2007-12-08 11:26, Dr Spektor wrote:
Jim coined a great term, "Ideological Bigot" - it really is a fun thing to say out loud... 6+2 syllables long... it is fun to pronounce, isn't it....?
[/quote]

Not as much fun as saying, "Jalalabad." Say it. Your tongue will thank you.

And I think both preachers and mentalists should offer disclaimers before they go into their acts.
Message: Posted by: Slim King (Dec 8, 2007 04:12PM)
How about used car salesmen? :)
Message: Posted by: Dr Spektor (Dec 8, 2007 06:50PM)
Yep MG - Jalalabad is fun to say too!
Message: Posted by: zifferinolpm (Dec 8, 2007 09:43PM)
[quote]
On 2007-12-08 11:26, Dr Spektor wrote:
The trouble with people who think they are 100% right is that they miss the boat on a lot of things.

It would be nice if people would qualify their statements as IMHO or "My personal take/view/belief is...." versus blanket statements.

Respect other peoples' points of view is a nice way to moving towards truth...

Like most things in this ambigious universe... trust in those who seek the truth... beware those who claim they have found it.... some old proverb that seems to make sense at times.

Jim coined a great term, "Ideological Bigot" - it really is a fun thing to say out loud... 6+2 syllables long... it is fun to pronounce, isn't it....?

People need to chillax.

The people who like to change the world based on utopian ideals often tied to fundamentalist concepts (religious and secular) seemed to have caused the most death, destruction, trauma onto innocents and genocide throughout history - and there is more and more research on this supporting this concept.

In the end, we are all stuck on this blob of mud - so we all interact together, wether we like it or not.

Now, please send your Donations to the SPECTRE TEMPLE for further sermons.

(Am I Satan? Am I Nyarlathotep? Am I the False Prophet? Am I Ravana? Am I Iblis? Am I Judas? Am I Apep? Or am I just bored on a Saturday morning waiting for my wife to dry her hair so we can go for coffee and read the newspaper?)
[/quote]

I think it's the [b][i]coffee and newspaper[/i][/b] thing!
Message: Posted by: darrylasher (Dec 8, 2007 10:55PM)
[quote]
On 2007-12-08 09:35, DJM wrote:
Not sure if it has been posted.

http://biz.yahoo.com/prnews/071205/new029.html?.v=29
[/quote]

"The world is abuzz"???? Really?

Oh, wait. It's not a news article. It's a press release. That 'splains it.

-Darryl
Message: Posted by: Mind Guerrilla (Dec 10, 2007 06:37PM)
[quote]
On 2007-12-08 17:12, Slim King wrote:
How about used car salesmen? :)
[/quote]

I sometimes think people apply more skepticism to buying a car than they do when adopting a system of beliefs.
Message: Posted by: Gilgamesh_The_Librarian (Dec 19, 2007 03:13AM)
Couple of things strike me as funny on this thread :

1) We get some press releases from what appears to be a very pro Uri guy who directs the Houdini museum. I'm sure that Houdini would see the irony in that.

2) I am really, really, really concerned about the mindset of posters on the Café who will claim that they believe in the paranormal and psychic powers. You're not talking to lay people here, you are talking to folk who know that the collected works of Banachek, Corinda et al are sat on your bookshelves. What gives ?
Message: Posted by: KingStardog (Dec 19, 2007 08:50AM)
Your belief has made you hole.
Message: Posted by: magicusb (Dec 19, 2007 09:52AM)
To all: In discussing your beliefs, methods, psychology of mentalism, PK, mindreading, etc., please remember these pages are on a public forum and can be Googled.

Names of books or writers, etc., philosophy and philosophy of disclaimers are part of the real secrets of this art form. Some here may be giving laymen access to that information by posting here.

Many on this site may make a living in this field.
Some of the things said here might better on pages that have limited access.

Just my thoughts.
magicusb
Message: Posted by: magicusb (Dec 19, 2007 11:15AM)
Some one mentioned Houdini in regards to one of my postings..
[quote]
I'm sure that Houdini would see the irony in that.

I am really, really, really concerned about the mindset of posters on the Café who will claim that they believe in the paranormal and psychic powers...............What gives ?
[/quote]

Many, many, many related to our field are not aware, because of their own agendas or lack of education, that Houdini counted amongst his friends many mindreaders, clairvoyants, and mystery acts.

People currently make claims about Houdini's thoughts in this area that are completely wrong and and self serving. If you can, read Houdini's Conjurors Magazine. It came directly from his home in New York. He edited, wrote, published and controlled it, as naturally he would. Read it please and you will find many favorable reviews of mindreaders, mentalists, psychic entertainers, etc. He did not attack them.

He would not have attacked fellow performers the way many magicians think it is ok to do today. He had a respect for fellow performers, unlike many now do. In fact there are once in a while good notices of other escape artists besides Hardeen.

Get educated before you make claims.

His crusade and possibly beliefs were very narrow.

He even wrote a movie that he starred in that promoted reincarnation. "The Man From The Beyond!"

Regards
magicusb
Message: Posted by: Gilgamesh_The_Librarian (Dec 19, 2007 11:21AM)
[quote]
On 2007-12-19 12:15, magicusb wrote:
Some one mentioned Houdini in regards to one of my postings..
[quote]
I'm sure that Houdini would see the irony in that.

I am really, really, really concerned about the mindset of posters on the Café who will claim that they believe in the paranormal and psychic powers...............What gives ?
[/quote]

Many, many, many related to our field are not aware, because of their own agendas or lack of education, that Houdini counted amongst his friends many mindreaders, clairvoyants, and mystery acts.

People currently make claims about Houdini's thoughts in this area that are completely wrong and and self serving. If you can read Houdini's Conjurors Magazine. It came directly from his home in New York. He edited, wrote, published and controlled it, as naturally he would. Read it please and you will find many favorable reviews of mindreaders, mentalists, psychic entertainers, etc. He did not attack them.

He would not have attacked fellow performers the way many magicians think it is ok to do today. He had a respect for fellow performers, unlike many today. In fact there are once in a while even good notices of other escape artists besides Hardeen.

Get educated before you make claims.

His crusade and possibly beliefs was very narrow.

He even wrote a movie that he starred in that promoted reincarnation. "The Man From The Beyond!"

Regards
magicusb
[/quote]

I am not hugely knowledgable about Houdini so,in your opinion, do you think he would be comfortable with a performer who claimed they had real psychic powers ?
Message: Posted by: Gilgamesh_The_Librarian (Dec 19, 2007 11:23AM)
[quote]
On 2007-12-19 12:15, magicusb wrote:
Some one mentioned Houdini in regards to one of my postings..
[quote]
I'm sure that Houdini would see the irony in that.

I am really, really, really concerned about the mindset of posters on the Café who will claim that they believe in the paranormal and psychic powers...............What gives ?
[/quote]

Many, many, many related to our field are not aware, because of their own agendas or lack of education, that Houdini counted amongst his friends many mindreaders, clairvoyants, and mystery acts.

People currently make claims about Houdini's thoughts in this area that are completely wrong and and self serving. If you can read Houdini's Conjurors Magazine. It came directly from his home in New York. He edited, wrote, published and controlled it, as naturally he would. Read it please and you will find many favorable reviews of mindreaders, mentalists, psychic entertainers, etc. He did not attack them.

He would not have attacked fellow performers the way many magicians think it is ok to do today. He had a respect for fellow performers, unlike many today. In fact there are once in a while even good notices of other escape artists besides Hardeen.

Get educated before you make claims.

His crusade and possibly beliefs was very narrow.

He even wrote a movie that he starred in that promoted reincarnation. "The Man From The Beyond!"

Regards
magicusb
[/quote]

I am not hugely knowledgable about Houdini so,in your opinion, do you think he would be comfortable with a performer who claimed they had real psychic powers ?
Message: Posted by: magicusb (Dec 19, 2007 11:27AM)
I am not in a position to put words in the mouth of such a paramour in our field.

I can only tell you what he said and did. He did not come down on or attack mystery entertainers, or performers in general. That, I believe, is a fact.

Contacting the dead is another matter.

He did attack a few escape artists that he felt were stealing the escape act that he felt he originated.

magicub
Message: Posted by: Gilgamesh_The_Librarian (Dec 19, 2007 02:09PM)
[quote]
On 2007-12-19 12:27, magicusb wrote:
I am not in a position to put words in the mouth of such a paramour in our field.

I can only tell you what he said and did. He did not come down on or attack mystery entertainers, or performers in general. That, I believe, is a fact.

Contacting the dead is another matter.

He did attack a few escape artists that he felt were stealing the escape act that he felt he originated.

magicub
[/quote]

that's really useful , thanks.

Your comments have given me something to think about. I wonder whether mentalists claiming to have real powers is legitimate until they step into the territory of saying they can contact the dead.

Thanks again.
Message: Posted by: Jim-Callahan (Dec 19, 2007 07:52PM)
Wrong!

I have have a connection to the dead and have proven it on national live TV.

Jim
Message: Posted by: entity (Dec 19, 2007 10:58PM)
[quote]
On 2007-12-08 11:26, Dr Spektor wrote:

Respect other peoples' points of view is a nice way to moving towards truth...

- and -

The people who like to change the world based on utopian ideals often tied to fundamentalist concepts (religious and secular) seemed to have caused the most death, destruction, trauma onto innocents and genocide throughout history - and there is more and more research on this supporting this concept.

[/quote]

Are these two statements at odds with each other?
Should we respect all points of view?

- entity
Message: Posted by: Dr Spektor (Dec 20, 2007 02:36PM)
The key is a POV that involves harming another is not a good thing to respect...

Of course, what does respect mean?
Message: Posted by: czero (Feb 3, 2008 12:37AM)
[quote]
On 2007-12-19 20:52, Jim-Callahan wrote:
Wrong!

I have have a connection to the dead and have proven it on national live TV.

Jim
[/quote]

All you've proven on national live TV is that you're a putz (and a REALLY bad actor).

--Mike
Message: Posted by: Jim-Callahan (Feb 3, 2008 10:04AM)
Mike, you are lost and your ignorance blinds you.

Your last statement proves my point.

Randi could not expose me, so he talked Angel into trying to do what he was afraid to.

Thanks for playing

J ack
Message: Posted by: Dannydoyle (Feb 3, 2008 02:11PM)
Mike, Jim lives in a world where he thinks Randi and Criss know him, or care about him.

Don't take part in the debate as Jim stays in a world where he is "on" all the time. His supporters say it all the time. It is the key to being less frustrated by him.

He is not taking part in our world but one he has created in his own mind. Those who go to see him enjoy it if they are in his world, if not, he looks like a putz. No biggie, let him believe what he will. No way to change his mind, he chooses not to live in our world.

Jim, if you ever desire to stop by our world for a visit, I bet you would be an interesting guy to talk too. If you ever make it to our world let me know.
Message: Posted by: Tony Iacoviello (Feb 3, 2008 03:29PM)
[quote]
On 2008-02-03 15:11, Dannydoyle wrote:
Mike, Jim lives in a world where he thinks Randi and Criss know him, or care about him.
...
[/quote]

Danny, Criss does know Jim, they spent time together and have appeared together on TV, as for Randi, he has made reference to Jim several times.

This is the "real world."

Tony
Message: Posted by: lane99 (Feb 3, 2008 04:05PM)
You've had six weeks to come up with something, and that's the best you can do?

And here I'd been thinking the "czero" was referring to your name. My bad.
Message: Posted by: Dannydoyle (Feb 3, 2008 04:06PM)
Tony, you know full well I am not talking about that LOL. Please don't try to draw me into one of these silly debates. I get what Jim is doing and I admire you and Slim and anyone willing to go to the mat like that for a friend. Really I do.

But Jim would have been far better off simply saying something like "Criss, who ever said it was real? This is an entertainment competition right? Sorry you were so confused, but how was the performance?", then he would have been able to claim the high ground.

I mean he baited Criss PERFECTLY, I really think he did. I thought that it was a master stroke. BUT "Ideological Biggot" was LAUGHABLE. He had all the time in the world to see the pitch, and that was the best he could do? Try to sound fake smart? Oh man he biffed it completly.

He could have REALLY made an impact, instead of on a few internet chat boards.

I get what his "always on" thing is and is what I mean by not bothering to talk him from it.

I personally think that if anyone got past that nonsense, Jim would be a very interesting guy to have a cup of coffee with. Some of the things I have seen him put out there are very original, and could be very entertaining.

BUT when the worlds don't mix, each side looks silly trying to mix them. Be it Criss, Slim, Jim Tony or anyone on Criss' team. (Which they have simply avoided I think) It looks as if you guys are being really petty and you are LOL.

But please don't try to draw me into a silly debate, as I know Jim has his reality, and on occasion you guys are residents. Cool, I admire that tenasity. But please don't try to draw me into it LOL. In our reality, it did not come off that well for Jim.

I do want to say I wish him the best. I do think some of the things Criss does are WAY out of line as well. (as you guys may or may not choose to recall, I have said this since SEASON 1 and you argued with me, pretty ironic now you are on MY ISLAND!) I was actually looking forward to this and hoping Jim would really make a dent. I thought it would be pretty good for magic if we could stop the CGI stuff and get back to skill. I had hope that Jim would provide some extra push for it.

Unfortunatly all I got was "Ideological Biggot" which was a huge disapointment.

I wish Jim the best, I hope that he gets everything he expects in both worlds.
Message: Posted by: Tony Iacoviello (Feb 3, 2008 04:31PM)
Danny

I personally feel that if the Writer's Strike had not happened when it did, Jim could have exploited that incident far more and better. America eats up controversy... Look at those who have been on "reality shows" and who has profited from them. Not all of them are the winers, in fact, the most controversial and those kicked off the show sometimes do better than any who last and win, Amorosa from the Apprentice is a prime example.

The main purpose of those shows is to get exposure, and everyone must admit, Jim did that!

As you say, I may look silly saying this, but sometimes the truth is a silly thing.

The only thing now is, can he exploit what has happened and turn it to his advantage? My thinking is that he will find a way, time will tell.

One more thing, Go Pats!

Tony
Message: Posted by: Dannydoyle (Feb 3, 2008 05:44PM)
Tony, the strike should have been a GOOD thing for him.

But again, defend your friend, I admire that quality.

I hope it works for his advantage. Few can argue he has worked hard.
Message: Posted by: Tony Iacoviello (Feb 3, 2008 05:50PM)
The strike took the talk shows off the air.
Message: Posted by: Dannydoyle (Feb 3, 2008 05:59PM)
Hey, like I said I wish the guy the best. I am not getting into a spinning contest with anyone. It is simply not worth my energy, ESPECIALLY since I have no need to be seen as defending Criss.

As I said both acted like children, and Jim looked like the smaller child at this point. No biggie. I hope he can ride the wave and come out somewhere where he wants to be.

Everyone knows the "facts" at least at they see them LOL.