(Close Window)
Topic: The best selfworker is ...
Message: Posted by: Steve James (Sep 1, 2008 12:19PM)
Well, in my opinion itís "Easy Location" by Aldo Colombini which is based on a variation by Richard Vollmer of the old trick in Martin Gardnerís "Mathematics Magic and Mystery" book. Lots of variations abound. Itís called "Numerology" in Card College 3 {But that's not a self working version}

I think the version in Aldo Colombini's "Impromptu Card Magic" page 2 is the very best. With the correct words and presentation this is truly impossible, the method is so well disguised. You can even use a borrowed deck and you don't even have to look at a single card face for the spectator to make their selection.

EFFECT..
The spectator cuts off a small group of cards after they shuffle.
They count the cards {lets say 13 cards are cut off}
The performer shows faces of pack one at a time to spectator, they remember card at their number {7h for example}
The pack is reassembled.

You say to spectator "YOU shuffled the cards so the order was set by YOU"
You now reverse count from 10 -1 if a cards value matches value of card you stop and deal new pile.
You end up with three piles and add the values of cards on top of each pile lets say... 8H 3S and a face down card {That pile was killed, no matches}
You add 8+3 and deal those cards down and get rid of them.
How on earth can the NOW top card of pack be the 7H but, it is.

I like to stress that because the spectator shuffled THEY set the order of cards.

If you donít know this one you will fool yourself when you try it. A beautifully disguised method.

This gets my vote.
Can be done with borrowed pack.
Spec shuffles.
NO setup.
Stunning.

All you have to make sure is that you have a 52 card pack, or if not 52 you can make an adjustment.

Donít pass this one up. Itís in the Aldo Colombini book "The Worlds Best Collection of Easy to do Impromptu Card Magic" This collection also contains the Peter Duffie Lie Detector trick which is a dream to perform.

Steve.
Message: Posted by: a brown 1968 (Sep 9, 2008 07:38AM)
Hi Steve ,

Having read your description, I went back to the book to find the missing elements.
Played with it last night , but kept coming back to the opinion - True method is hidden but it comes across as a puzzle , why the 3 piles ?? why stop when you do in each pile ?? I had no justifcation and therefore no magical premise - its still a puzzle!!. Time passed slowly , brain working overtime but still no joy , then my 6 year daughter comes in with a small toy and seeing the toy - the premise arrived in my head to solve the problem of the the 3 piles and stopping as and when you do. Kissed Tara and gave her a hug .
Message: Posted by: Steve James (Sep 9, 2008 11:55AM)
It's amazing where these ideas come from isn't it?
Message: Posted by: PaulGordon (Sep 9, 2008 03:02PM)
Hi Steve,

If you like the principle used (Henry Christ), see my "What A Kick" effects in CARD MAGIC COMPANION and my "Strike More Than A Match" effects in CARD COLLECTIVE. They take the self-working theme a lot further...a lot, lot further!

Best, Paul Gordon
Message: Posted by: ejohn (Sep 9, 2008 08:42PM)
Geoff Williams's "Devastation" from "The Lecture Your Mother Never Gave You" and, I believe, one of his DVDs.
Message: Posted by: Andrew H. (Sep 9, 2008 10:05PM)
Gemini Twins...I'll have to go look to see what book it is.
Message: Posted by: PaulGordon (Sep 10, 2008 03:39AM)
Gemini Twins is in Fulves' "Self Working" series, Vo. 2.

Paul Gordon
Message: Posted by: LLL (Sep 10, 2008 07:09AM)
Both Devastation and twins are lovely effects... Although you have to have a good spectator who can concentrate well for Devastation.


Andy
Message: Posted by: tltq (Sep 10, 2008 07:12AM)
Fulves' "Self Working" series, Vo. 2. A.K.A. More Self-Working Card Tricks
Message: Posted by: a brown 1968 (Sep 10, 2008 07:22AM)
Looking at a few old threads - Devastation received quite mixed reviews, hard pushed therefore to have it in the best ever category IMHO. Have not found so far any poor reviews of the Twins effect.
Message: Posted by: LLL (Sep 10, 2008 08:04AM)
A brown 1968 - Don't get me wrong.. this kills.. just sometimes, as with every effect the spectator doesn't follow the instructions properly... But for a hands off, borrowed and multi shuffled deck effect.. it's a beauty.
Message: Posted by: a brown 1968 (Sep 10, 2008 11:42AM)
Hi Mescalitoeyes ,

I remember seeing the demo many months ago when it first came on the scene. The method was appharent from the first viewing. (This does not mean an effect is bad, far from it , layman don't think always like us) . I thought then, why take the card out and put it back again ? A small weakness but one I did not care for. Played with the effect at home and changed the handling a little to remove this weakness, so you would look through the pack once, name their card and also the original position if so inclined. No need to take a card out or ask any questions. Still did not care for the effect even then and filed it away in my memory . Tried to find the demo again just now but not having much joy.
Message: Posted by: LLL (Sep 10, 2008 12:52PM)
It's not something I use in my show, but I still think it is lovely for those moments when someone hands you a borrowed shuffled pack..

might try your handleing out..

Andy
Message: Posted by: Glenn Morphew (Sep 26, 2008 05:20AM)
Anyone familiar with Bill Goldman's effect "One for the Money?" At the moment, I can't think anything else as strong... for the work involved.
Message: Posted by: a brown 1968 (Sep 26, 2008 07:17AM)
Glenn

Correct me if I am wrong but "One for the money" has a sleight near the end, a bold one to finish with the card at any number .

Yes an excellent effect but fails to meet the rules of this list

Andy
Message: Posted by: Glenn Morphew (Sep 26, 2008 08:50PM)
Sorry about that Andy, I guess technically it is a move, although Goldman says to make it a gesture. It is one heck of an effect for as little work as possible. Sorry again for not meeting the conditions.

All the best,
Glenn
Message: Posted by: a brown 1968 (Sep 27, 2008 02:35AM)
Hi Glen , no apology needed .

In fact it is such a good trick , that many people new to magic and looking at this thread , now have an opportunity to look it up.
Message: Posted by: fvdbeek (Sep 27, 2008 06:05PM)
The best self-worker is Ulti-Mate-M by Aldo Colombini .

Here's why:

- you use props that are not commonly seen by the spectators (jumbocards cut in four, that 's not the usual deck !)
- The spectator selects the cards by cutting the cards, it's very fair
- the magician fails to predict the right card (an anti-climax is always good to come back twice as strong when the real climax comes and it is funny)
- the real climax is something the audience has never seen before ( a strange card with a double index)
- for $10 you get the whole stufff !!
Look here: http://www.wildcolombini.com/cart/product_info.php?cPath=1&products_id=198
Message: Posted by: a brown 1968 (Sep 28, 2008 11:47AM)
Hi fvdbeek ,

An interesting proposal there ...

For me the best self-worker is one which you can use a borrowed deck if need be. It does not have to be even a complete deck or in particular good condition. Can be done walk around , at a table on the train for that matter . Can have different outcomes depending on how you present it and all the actions are natural and the effect receives a good respone from the spectator.

Ulti-Mate-M for me dose not meet enough of the above to make it the best as it lack flexibility.

Happy to be convinced otherwise :))))

Andy
Message: Posted by: fvdbeek (Sep 28, 2008 05:17PM)
>For me the best self-worker is one which you can use a borrowed deck if need be.

Yep, but that is another thread: selfworkers without a setup.

Frans
Message: Posted by: Josh Chaikin (Oct 4, 2008 11:06PM)
[quote]
On 2008-09-09 21:42, ejohn wrote:
Geoff Williams's "Devastation" from "The Lecture Your Mother Never Gave You" and, I believe, one of his DVDs.
[/quote]

It's largely Tom Daughetry's effect though, based on something from Greater Magic; and it's too good to share with other people. ;)
Message: Posted by: ullig (Oct 15, 2008 06:54AM)
My favourite selfworker is by far "Dead Reckoning" by John Bannon.
I eliminated the only sleight, which wasn't really a sleight.

Regards

Ulli
Message: Posted by: Oyama (Oct 15, 2008 07:00PM)
No Way! by Mick Ayres with a kicker ending from JB Bobo's Higher Mentality.

Aaron
Message: Posted by: rowdymagi5 (Oct 21, 2008 03:41AM)
Where can "No Way!" by Mick Ayres be found?
Message: Posted by: Picard (Oct 21, 2008 01:19PM)
[quote]
On 2008-10-21 04:41, rowdymagi5 wrote:
Where can "No Way!" by Mick Ayres be found?
[/quote]
Predict-Abilities by Mick Ayres.
Message: Posted by: Michael Peterson (Nov 14, 2008 05:00PM)
Pre deck ability by Aldo Colombini(which I can only assume is based on an Ayers effect) is my new favorite self worker (it does require a set up).
My other favorite self workers that can be done with a borrowed deck & no set up are-

Devastation by Geoff Williams
3 card prediction by Maurice Fogel
60 second memorized deck by Tom Frame
Timely departure by John Bannon

These 4 are [b]Killers!!![/b]


Mike
Message: Posted by: Picard (Nov 14, 2008 06:20PM)
[quote]
On 2008-11-14 18:00, Michael Peterson wrote:
Pre deck ability by Aldo Colombini(which I can only assume is based on an Ayers effect) is my new favorite self worker(it does require a set up).
My other favorite self workers that can be done with a borrowed deck & no set up are-

Devastation by Geoff Williams
3 card prediction by Maurice Fogel
60 second memorized deck by Tom Frame
Timely departure by John Bannon

These 4 are KILLERS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Mike
[/quote]
Predeckability by Colombini is not based on any Ayres effect as far as I know, only the names are similar.

As I always like to research new self-workers that I haven't yet discovered, could you describe 3 card prediction by Fogel? I am guessing it's something similar to Jay Sankey's ShuffleCutDeal but I may be wrong.
Message: Posted by: Michael Peterson (Nov 14, 2008 10:14PM)
The effect can be found in the book-Mastering the art of magic by Eugene Burger.

A spectator shuffles the deck, & you pull out 3 predictions. The spectator goes through a simple(& very fair looking) procedure to arrive at 3 cards(I can't explain it in detail, as it will give away the effect)& they of course are the mates of the 3 predictions.

This was one of the first card tricks I ever learned & it has never gotten a bad reaction.it's a real head scratcher.

Mike
Message: Posted by: Pastor Mickey (Nov 15, 2008 05:29PM)
These are some wonderful card tricks, but the best self worker has to be the invisible deck.
Message: Posted by: jocdoc (Nov 16, 2008 07:00PM)
I would cast a vote for "Will the Cards Match?."

-truly impromtu; can use a borrowed deck or flash cards
- no gaffs to worry about; cards are all examinable at the end.
- no sleights. If you can spell those words, then you can do this trick.
Message: Posted by: jtb (Nov 17, 2008 03:13PM)
Roberto Giobbi's Card College Light has easy tricks.

The opening two tricks in the book TNT and Intuition (Which is basically Out of this World) need a pre-arranged deck but are great tricks without sleights. They are done as a routine. (TNT ends with a deck ready for OOTW.) There is one move in TNT but it requires no skill.
Message: Posted by: Harry Lorayne (Nov 18, 2008 05:09PM)
You can find Will The Cards Match in APOCALYPSE. You might also want to check my impromptu card section in THE MAGIC BOOK, if you can find a copy. HL.
Message: Posted by: Oyama (Dec 18, 2008 03:02PM)
Brrr! by Thomas Baxter (aka entity)

You never touch the cards and it kills!

Aaron
Message: Posted by: loyaleagle (Dec 22, 2008 02:09AM)
My vote is for Emotional Reaction by Vernon. Found in Inner Secrets of Card Magic.

I've never had it fail, it's a POWERFUL effect that you can use as a closer if you present it right.

Even magicians seem impressed when the card is eventually revealed. Few guess the method and none have yet figured out the actual application.
Message: Posted by: aktino (Dec 22, 2008 02:50AM)
[quote]
On 2008-12-18 16:02, Oyama wrote:
Brrr! by Thomas Baxter (aka entity)

You never touch the cards and it kills!

Aaron
[/quote]


Where can I find Brrr! ?
Message: Posted by: Picard (Dec 22, 2008 06:25AM)
[quote]
On 2008-12-22 03:50, aktino wrote:
[quote]
On 2008-12-18 16:02, Oyama wrote:
Brrr! by Thomas Baxter (aka entity)

You never touch the cards and it kills!

Aaron
[/quote]


Where can I find Brrr! ?
[/quote]
You can find it here http://www.thoughtcontrol.ca/TheOpenPredictionProject/ , along with 50 other effects.

Or in a James File.
Message: Posted by: Mick Ayres (Jan 6, 2009 06:15PM)
[quote]
On 2008-10-21 14:19, Picard wrote:
[quote]
On 2008-10-21 04:41, rowdymagi5 wrote:
Where can "No Way!" by Mick Ayres be found?
[/quote]
Predict-Abilities by Mick Ayres.
[/quote]

Hi gentlemen,

Thank you for your interest in my work.

For the record, information about my book PREDICT-ABILITIES (Book Two in the Act-series) may be found at http://www.mickayreswares.com. A search on this forum will turn up a few threads that contain many unsolicited reviews about the book.

By the way...all the material in the entire Act-series is self-working.

Warm regards,
Mick
Message: Posted by: lukesy202 (Jan 6, 2009 07:39PM)
Eyes of the gods is the best self work trick I have ever seen. its on the A1 magic all-stars dvd set. I still don't under stand how it works, it just works out ever time. something to do with maths. maths sucks boiled eggs hehheehhehehe...
Message: Posted by: DanielCoyne (Jan 6, 2009 09:46PM)
I don't know many self-working tricks...I find many of the ones I've read seem to involve an insufferable amount of counting and spelling out. I think I'm too ADD to stay focused.

However, I did see a self-working trick taught as a freebie by Mark Wilson. I don't know if this is a well-known trick, but he calls it, "Fantastic Five." It's quick, visual, and it seemed pretty magical to me (at least on the initial viewing.)

Here's the lesson on Youtube:

Mark Wilson Card Trick - Free Magic Lesson -- Fantastic Five
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zXcfeugIQFs

-Daniel
Message: Posted by: DomKabala (Jan 7, 2009 06:08AM)
[quote]
On 2008-12-22 03:09, loyaleagle wrote:
My vote is for Emotional Reaction by Vernon. Found in Inner Secrets of Card Magic.

I've never had it fail, it's a POWERFUL effect that you can use as a closer if you present it right.

Even magicians seem impressed when the card is eventually revealed. Few guess the method and none have yet figured out the actual application.
[/quote]
SSSHH!! That's an inner secret. All kidding aside' "Emotional Reaction" is a great effect that Dai used to fool the best! Simple but, high impact.

Cardamagically,

Dom :) ;)
Message: Posted by: seraph127 (Jan 7, 2009 12:17PM)
[quote]
On 2009-01-06 22:46, DanielCoyne wrote:
I don't know many self-working tricks...I find many of the ones I've read seem to involve an insufferable amount of counting and spelling out. I think I'm too ADD to stay focused.

However, I did see a self-working trick taught as a freebie by Mark Wilson. I don't know if this is a well-known trick, but he calls it, "Fantastic Five." It's quick, visual, and it seemed pretty magical to me (at least on the initial viewing.)

Here's the lesson on Youtube:

Mark Wilson Card Trick - Free Magic Lesson -- Fantastic Five
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zXcfeugIQFs

-Daniel
[/quote]

Wow. Normally, I don't really consider myself an anti-exposure zealot, but this isn't cool. Wilson had this in [i]Complete Course in Magic[/i], but it's actually Nick Trost's "Significator Five-Spot" ("[i]The Card Magic of Nick Trost[/i], p.134). So not only is this being passed off without credit, it's being shown on a heavily-trafficked site for any layman to see.

I'll say it again.

Wow.
Message: Posted by: Turk (Jan 17, 2009 10:30AM)
[quote]
On 2009-01-07 13:17, seraph127 wrote:
***
Wow. Normally, I don't really consider myself an anti-exposure zealot, but this isn't cool. Wilson had this in [i]Complete Course in Magic[/i], but it's actually Nick Trost's "Significator Five-Spot" ("[i]The Card Magic of Nick Trost[/i], p.134). So not only is this being passed off without credit, it's being shown on a heavily-trafficked site for any layman to see.
***
[/quote]

Without commenting on the anti-exposure comments, is this effect actually original with either Mark Wilson or Nick Trost? If it is, which one of the two had the idea first (and so arguably, it is his to give away if he is so inclined)?

The reason I raise this question is because "The Card Magic of Nick Trost" was first published in 1997 ( http://geniimagazine.com/wiki/index.php/Nick_Trost ) and I know that the Mark Wilson book hit the stands back in the mid 1970s (1976, I believe). Of course, Nick put out a number of books prior to the above-referenced one. Hence, my questions as to which person, Mark or Nick, first publihsed this effect and was that published effect original with that person?

Thanks for the info.

Mike
Message: Posted by: seraph127 (Jan 17, 2009 12:53PM)
[quote]
On 2009-01-17 11:30, Turk wrote:

Without commenting on the anti-exposure comments, is this effect actually original with either Mark Wilson or Nick Trost? If it is, which one of the two had the idea first (and so arguably, it is his to give away if he is so inclined)?

The reason I raise this question is because "The Card Magic of Nick Trost" was first published in 1997 ( http://geniimagazine.com/wiki/index.php/Nick_Trost ) and I know that the Mark Wilson book hit the stands back in the mid 1970s (1976, I believe). Of course, Nick put out a number of books prior to the above-referenced one. Hence, my questions as to which person, Mark or Nick, first publihsed this effect and was that published effect original with that person?

Thanks for the info.

Mike
[/quote]

In the second paragraph of the Foreword, Trost says "Contained here are many of my best effects -122 of them- along with variations and presentations by fellow magicians[...]Most of the material has been in print, and I have selected what I consider the 'cream'."

Several effects are credited (ex: "Omega Bet", which he correctly notes is Karl Fulves'), "Significator Five-Spot" is not. I presume this means Trost claims it as original with him.
Message: Posted by: Turk (Jan 17, 2009 06:26PM)
Seraph127,

Thanks for that information. I can certainly agree that that is possibly what Nick is impliedly claiming.

Also possible is that the effect is as "old as dirt" and/or that Nick has no idea of the creator and/or that he might have considered the effect to be in the public domain.

That said, and with deepest respect for you and your beliefs in this matter, I respectfully ask that you consider the following:

My problem with such "implied claim of ownership" is two-fold (possibly three-fold):

For sure:

1. In the magic field, and "all things being equal", the person who first publishes is normally given the credit for the origination and considered the creator/originator. Mark Wilson's cited work was published in 1976 (a full 23 years ahead of the cited Nick Trost book). Hence my prior question asking if Trost published the effect in any earlier book and for certain in a book earlier than the Mark Wilson 1976 book.

2. It is very possible that these two magic creators could have simultaneously (or roughtly contemporaneously) had the same idea and come up with the same effect. [i]And, without publication, and without communication between themselves on the effect, they could have each gone on for years thinking that he was the first creator of the effect in question[/i]. Hence the importance of the date of first publication to (help?) end such uncertainties and potential disputes.

And, possibly:

3. The methodology for this effect is not a real complexity and, as such, it is possible (likely?) that many other persons (in addition to Mark and Nick) might have also had the same independent idea but never published "their" effect. As such, it is possible that these other people might have created "their" effect years before either Mark or Nick (or both) came up with the same idea. By this last comment, I certainly am not intending to suggest that either Mark or Nick stole the idea from someone else. Rather, I'm suggesting that the card plot of this effect and the methodology are so simple that I can envision the possibility that many people created this effect independent of many others--and that includes both Mark and Nick.

This is quite intriguing. Perhaps one of the notable card effect historians that frequent the Cafť (such as Hideo Kato or Jonathan Townsend?) might chime in here and add some pertinent and more complete information in this regard.

Best regards,

Mike

P.S. Additionally, I'm not aware whether or not Mark Wilson was a known approriator of other's effects. I've heard nothing untoward concerning Mark Wilson's magic ethics and, as such, I [i]must[/i] give him the benefit of the doubt until and unless evidence to the contrary is presented. I certainly am not willing to castigate him as an [i]knowing[/i] exposer of a Nick Trost effect without more substantial and compelling evidence to the contrary.
Message: Posted by: seraph127 (Jan 18, 2009 02:48PM)
I would also like hear from one of the more scholarly types.

I'm not sure that Wilson came up with much of anything that appears in his book anyway. I'd guess that most of the material was provided by the "co-authors": Walter Gibson, "Gen" Grant and Larry Anderson (the "Jawdroppers!" guy).

I also note that an effect in CCIM titled "Sandwiched Aces" is essentially identical to Lin Searles "Pre-Cannibal Cards" from [i]Epilogue[/i], March 1972. The principal difference being the use of a couple of DL's in the inital display in CCIM, in contrast to Searles' use of the D'Amico Spread. My guess would be that CCIM uses the DL's because they'd be much easier for the novice than the D'Amico spread.

I'm not trying to bash Wilson at all. My impression is that he's one of the nicest guys around (and a good friend of Denny Haney's, I believe - another reputable fellow). I'm just raising the possibility that he might have made an error in judgment.

Again, I'm not really into being the exposure police, but it's a pretty good trick (simple as it is) and I feel sure it's NOT one of those anonymous old standards like "You Do As I Do". My unease arises from a pragmatic concern, as I'm no absolutist on exposure. I just think Youtube is far too visible a repository for the revelation of the effect. If it had appeared on, say, the Allmagic Guide, I wouldn't have raised an eyebrow.

Well, here's hoping that wiser heads than mine will soon shed more light on the issue.
Message: Posted by: seraph127 (Jan 18, 2009 05:17PM)
Interesting new developments. I've just heard from someone.

[quote]I'm not sure this is the earliest reference, but a precursor exists in [i]The Encyclopedia of Card Magic[/i]. I currently have the Foulsham edition, and on page 188 appears this item:

[quote]

[b]Sure Locator
Grant[/b]

Take any spot card, preferably a 5, and reverse it in the pack, fifth from the bottom.

Having done this secretly, have a card chosen, being careful not to spread the cards near the bottom. After the spectator has noted his card, have it put on top of the pack, under cut about half the cards and drop them on top, burying the card in the middle. Say that you will cause a card to reverse itself in the middle to indicate where the chosen card is. Fan the pack, showing the reversed 5 in the middle. Cut at that card, and throw it face up on the table. Deal off four cards and throw the next one, the chosen card, face down. Have the card named and turn it over.[/quote]

The addition of having the interim cards be four aces makes absolutely no sense to me.[/quote]

My reply:
[quote]Thanks, Lance. I found it on p. 169 of the Dover edition. If the "Grant" referenced is UF Grant (who else would it be), that's particularly interesting, as he's one of the "co-authors" of CCIM. Maybe he introduced the Ace kicker ending between EOCM and his contributions to CCIM?

BTW, I wonder now if "Significator Five-Spot" was one of Trost's previously-published items.

This is turning kinda weird.[/quote]

Maybe a case of independent invention after all. Stay tuned for further developments...
Message: Posted by: Bill Hallahan (Jan 18, 2009 07:54PM)
This topic is continued at [url=http://www.themagiccafe.com/forums/viewtopic.php?topic=233277&forum=206&78]What's the Greatest Self-Working Card Trick?[/url].