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Topic: Contacting Silly Billy
Message: Posted by: Wayne Brockway (Feb 15, 2009 04:23PM)
Hello,

I've been having a hard time getting a response from Silly Billy by email. I was wondering about the Kids Kards, and if he will ship this month? Anyone else out there having this concern?

Wayne...
Message: Posted by: jimhlou (Feb 15, 2009 07:49PM)
David is busy, busy, busy. I ordered some wands and got them right away. Try contacting him again- or try calling him at 212-645-1299.

Jim
Message: Posted by: magicbern (Feb 16, 2009 06:52AM)
Silly Billy dealt with this issue in a seperate thread. basically he explained that the delays were out of his control and he put a possible shipping date at February (we're only on the 16th...there's still 1/2 a month to go!). He also ordered a full refund back then and presumably you didn't take him up on it.

As Jim said above, he's a busy pro so cut him some slack and remember...patience is a virtue!

I'm not worried as I preordered back in July '08 I think,...anyway, he'll come good on this I'm sure!


By the way, the item is called 'Pack-Kid' Tricks...not 'Kid's Kards' which is a different trick altogether!
Message: Posted by: keeblem (Feb 16, 2009 02:41PM)
[quote]
On 2009-02-16 07:52, magicbern wrote:
As Jim said above, he's a busy pro so cut him some slack and remember...patience is a virtue!
[/quote]

As already stated, this has been brought up on another thread. But personally, if someone has set up an online shop - there should be someone there to deal with these problems. What would a parent have to say if I said I was too busy to attend their child's birthday party (even though I took their money!) :)

Mark
Message: Posted by: magicbern (Feb 16, 2009 03:57PM)
Not exactly the same thing is it? I'm sure if something like that happened and the parent was offered a full refund that he/she would not be too happy but would accept the situation and resolution.

I wonder if you do know the genesis of the problem and whether you have bought the product or read the thread which deals with it.

The problem was due to unacceptable design on the part of the manufacturer/supplier - and not on Silly Billy's end! So what was he to do? release a substandard product and incur the wrath of his customers? He did the best thing - which was to send email updates explaining the situtation to buyers; pull the ads from major magazines and offer the option of a FULL refund (which Im sure not many took him up on). Many of his satisfied customers like me opted to wait patiently for what is sure to be a first-class product!

Perhaps, to use your irrelevant analogy of a performer who took the money and did a 'no-show', your solution would be to find 'somebody there to deal with it'...like an amateur performer who could not live up to the standards and expectations set by Silly Billy. If this had happened, do you think the parent affected (and her kkids) would be appeased by this 'solution'?

Mark, why don't you (if you indeed purchased this product or are familiar with Silly Billy's services) try to empathize with what is obviously a stressful and frustrating situation for Silly Billy. I'm sure he didn't want this to happen.
Message: Posted by: sibbie (Feb 16, 2009 05:08PM)
http://www.themagiccafe.com/forums/viewtopic.php?topic=121095&forum=17
Message: Posted by: Wayne Brockway (Feb 17, 2009 02:57PM)
Jim,

Thanks for the contact number for David. I do have this and another. He is busy for good reason!

Magicbern, as the kids say "my bad" on the name I was typing to many things at once. I stand corrected on the card trick names. I'm not worried either and do know about the troubles at the factory. I will wait until next February for them to be delivered, knowing from dealing with David for years it's not his fault. I've been contacted by David and offered my money back. I did decline his offer. My concern is and was that everythings well and it's not like him not to respond. I ordered from him just two weeks ago and got the product that again is not my concern, just if all is well!!!

Wayne...
Message: Posted by: keeblem (Feb 18, 2009 09:16AM)
[quote]
On 2009-02-16 16:57, magicbern wrote:
Mark, why don't you (if you indeed purchased this product or are familiar with Silly Billy's services) try to empathize with what is obviously a stressful and frustrating situation for Silly Billy. I'm sure he didn't want this to happen.
[/quote]

I don't want this dragging on to be another irrelevant thread (and maybe I should just keep my opinions to myself), BUT, Wayne's original posting stated that he can't get a response from Silly Billy (nothing to do with the problems of the design of the manufactuer/supplier).

I know Silly billy is very busy (everyone keeps telling me this) but if he is running an online shop then he should be answering emails (or getting someone to do it for him) and if he is too busy to do this - then he shouldn't be running an online shop. Simple.

I'm sure Silly billy is a great guy - and I love his books/dvds/products. But I'm puzzled why people defend poor service. I go out of my way to give the best possible service I can (whether I'm busy or not). And if I gave poor service - I wouldn't expect to stay in business.

I'll shut up now - and I won't mention this again ;)

Mark
Message: Posted by: kerpa (Mar 11, 2009 01:09PM)
As a follow up FYI, I just got a VERY complete e-mail from Silly Billy regarding the card order. It was totally satisfying, and professional. Without getting into details, he is being extremely open, honest - and fair, regarding the circumstances beyond his control.

The e-mail was exemplary, I think. Everyone who has ordered the cards will have gotten one, I imagine. I also would think that, like myself, everyone will look forward to continued business with Silly Billy.
Message: Posted by: TRUMPETMAN (Mar 11, 2009 03:13PM)
I will back up what Michael said in his post. I received contact from David yesterday, and not only are two of the effects close to shipping, but David is going way out of his way to make it up to everyone who preordered with a special offer for his online store. Been dealing with David for almost five years, now, and will continue to be a satisfied customer of his for the foreseeable future.

Mark
Message: Posted by: magicbern (Mar 11, 2009 06:06PM)
I also received his email with the alternative solutions for those who have ordered and are patiently waiting for the tricks to finally arrive (at least two of them!).

I think he has tried his best to make amends for a drawn-out saga that was out of his control. I, for one, will continue to support him and look forward to new products in the near future.
Message: Posted by: stempleton (Mar 11, 2009 08:51PM)
I'll agree with Mark. Being in the upper eschelon of your profession does not entitle you to any more latitude in the quality of customer service when running an online business. It would serve everyone's interest if David were to have someone devoted to order fulfillment, if he indeed desires to continue offering a web based business.

I have bought his products from other online dealers, never directly from him. I enjoy his work, but prompt responses and good communications in the face of unexpected delays from third parties is critical. I'm sure he gives nothing less to his performance clients.
Message: Posted by: TommyJ (Mar 12, 2009 09:33AM)
Steve and Mark are right. If you're going to run an online business and you can't be there all the time to answer questions or respond to e-mails, then hire someone who can do it for you. There is no excuse for bad customer service . . . . . period.
Message: Posted by: magicbern (Mar 12, 2009 10:13AM)
Saem moaners and complainers...did you buy this product from Silly Billy? If so, you would have received his explanation and offer to repair the damage to his customers. Its easy to be an armchair critic - try to run a business yourself and see if you can maintain the high standards you are preching!
Message: Posted by: TommyJ (Mar 12, 2009 11:07AM)
Magicbern, nobody is moaning and complaining. Re-read the first post. "Having a HARD TIME getting a response from Silly Billy." David is a great guy, we all know that. We know he is very busy. What we are saying is, if you run a business yourself then you should get back to customers in a timely manner and if you can't, then hire someone to do it for you. Hence, good customer service.

If I order something online and I'm not only talking about magic supplies, and I have a question and I e-mail that company then I expect an answer that day or the next day. Hence: GOOD CUSTOMER SERVICE

Mark, the reason people defend poor customer service is that they are Kissing a - -.
Message: Posted by: magicbern (Mar 12, 2009 04:33PM)
I really don't think this is a case of kissing a** or any other delightful phrases you choose to use. Its a matter of empathy and trying to understand that in life things do happen that are out of our control. The only thing we can do is to make amends as best we can - and this is what David Kaye has done - to the overwhelming approval of those affected.

As for your desire for instant gratification - this is typical of the trend nowadays of "I want it ...NOW'! In days past, we would be capable of sending a letter by post and waiting patiently for a reply. But now we have been spoilt by the instant replies possible via email and instant messaging. However, have you considered that people (including professionals like Silly Billy) aren't sitting by their phones and computers every minute of every day waiting for our orders to pay the bills?

Sorry but I DO think people like you are 'moaners and complainers' and the bottom line is that there are some (like myself) who try to give others (like Silly Billy) the benefit of the doubt and are happy to wait. If you are not, then perhaps you can find dealers who can satisfy your desire to be at your beck and call.

Nothing to do with a** kissing - which, by the way, was an uncalled-for and rather insulting insinuation.
Message: Posted by: TommyJ (Mar 12, 2009 05:02PM)
Call my comment what you want. If the shoe fits . . . .

Looks like you are having a hard time understanding this thread. It is NOT about the troubles of the cards being printed. We all know that here. We KNOW it is beyond Davids control and we all KNOW that David is making good on them. And people have no choice to be patient and wait for the new ones to be printed.That is not the issue. And if you didn't re-read the original post like I asked, I will type it AGAIN: "Having a hard time getting a RESPONSE from Silly Billy."

My comments and others comments on this thread were about "Not getting a response in a timely fashion." A RESPONSE: A call back, an e-mail etc. If someone is running an online business, they should respond to customers phone calls/e-mails in a timely fashion.

YOU started the uncalled for comments "Moaning and complaining" I'm not moaning and complaining. I did not order these products and after seeing the online demonstrations I wasn't interested. (Sorry David, but very creative.)

One thing you ARE right about is YES! We live in a society of instant gratification. And technology has kept up with the times. We now have e-mail and we have cell phones that can retrieve e-mails from the road. If you ARE on the road and your cell phone does not get e-mails, you can check your e-mails at just about any hotel you are staying. So there is no reason NOT to get a response from someone in a timely fashion. I'm a busy entertainer too but I get back to people in a timely fashion. When I am on the road I check my e-mails at least twice a day. People don't want to wait 3-4 days for me to return their call or they will go to someone else.
Message: Posted by: magicbern (Mar 12, 2009 05:28PM)
I don't need to be taught how to read a thread...I am fully aware of the origins of this thread and the tangents which it has taken off on. If YOU have trouble with this then perhaps you don't understand the nature of forums. I believe both of these issues are inter-related and therefore I have posted reponses dealing with my views on them.

Your defensive retorts shows that you do love an argument and I will not continue with you in this manner. There is no need for you to reiterate that you're a 'busy entertainer'...I don't think it is of relevance here how you live your life. I am sure that you will continue to live it in your 'instant gratification' way and just hope that everyone and everything can go along and satisfy your expectations. Otherwise I'm sure you'll take out your frustrations on all those who can't.

Therefore, according to your 'logic', as Silly Billy can't answer people like you in a 'timely manner' shouldn't run an online business (see your earlier post). I'm sure many others who have actually ORDERED products and have received them (maybe not instantly) will think its a real shame if he did decide to close his online business because he can't satisfy people like yourself - who demand that everyone's world revolves around your time specifications.
Message: Posted by: keeblem (Mar 12, 2009 05:37PM)
[quote]
On 2009-03-12 18:02, TommyJ wrote:
We now have e-mail and we have cell phones that can retrieve e-mails from the road. If you ARE on the road and your cell phone does not get e-mails, you can check your e-mails at just about any hotel you are staying. So there is no reason NOT to get a response from someone in a timely fashion.[/quote]

Exactly.

I was in discussion (via email) with Mark Worgan about a possible purchase of his rabbit production box - WHISLT he was working a cruise ship and sailing round Easter Island. He replied to my emails every day.

A few years back I was lucky enough to take a holiday in the Maldives. There was ONE PC on the island with a dial up connection (I've seen paint dry quicker!) I still checked my emails every day.

What with the global financial melt down, I think it's more important than ever to offer the best possible service. There is really no excuse not to reply to an email.

Mark
Message: Posted by: Donald Dunphy (Mar 12, 2009 05:40PM)
While I can't speak for Silly Billy, I do know that people run their businesses in different ways. Some people are much more attached to their computers and email than others, and are very technology saavy.

For example, when I went on a 6-day trip to Philadelphia back in November, I didn't check my email the whole time. I don't own a laptop, and had no real way of checking it from the hotel, especially show inquiries that come through my domain and aren't aimed into a "free" email account like hotmail or aol.

However, on my website, I really encourage customers to call me in preference over email. And the ones that did call me either got ahold of me, or got a prompt return call, because I had my cell phone with me, and my business line was forwarded to my cell.

So, I was responding to one of the ways to get ahold of me.

When I got home from that trip, I had to respond to a couple of email show inquiries. But one of those people had called me as well, a few hours after emailing, so she got service quicker.

BTW, I enjoyed my trip, and my break from the computer.

However, on the other hand, we do like customer service in the way we like it. If a supplier can't meet our expectations for customer service, we often find some other provider. That is why several have suggested ordering some products from dealers, instead of from the creators themselves.

- Donald

P.S. Did you notice that Silly Billy's phone numbers are much more prominent (bigger point size) than his email on his sillymagic.com website? I don't know if that means anything, but it's an observation.
Message: Posted by: keeblem (Mar 12, 2009 05:47PM)
[quote]
On 2009-03-12 17:33, magicbern wrote:
If you are not, then perhaps you can find dealers who can satisfy your desire to be at your beck and call.
[/quote]

I believe this is what running a business is. I AM at the beck and call of my customers. I've had people phone me at 7.30 in the morning and at 10.30 at night. I respond with a smile and answer their questions as courteously as I can. I know this is a rather trite cliche (but also very true): THE CUSTOMER IS KING.

Mark
Message: Posted by: Donald Dunphy (Mar 12, 2009 05:57PM)
[quote]
On 2009-03-12 18:47, keeblem wrote:
I believe this is what running a business is. I AM at the beck and call of my customers. I've had people phone me at 7.30 in the morning and at 10.30 at night. I respond with a smile and answer their questions as courteously as I can. I know this is a rather trite cliche (but also very true): THE CUSTOMER IS KING.

Mark
[/quote]

While that is one perspective, it isn't the only one.

Some people (especially those who are self-employed) learn to "turn off" their business at times, and let it go to voice mail. Call them back later on, or tomorrow. You don't have to answer that business call while in a restaurant or in a movie, or when spending some quality time with loved ones. Sometimes it's ok to read and respond to that email tomorrow (also, checking too often is actually a time waster, and inefficient use of your time).

Healthy lives and relationships need some down time, some private time, and also some family time. Also, it is respectful to give your full attention to others when you are with them. We don't all have to be workaholics, just because others *choose* to be.

People who work at a "normal job" aren't expected to dedicate 80+ hours a week to it, unless that is a clear agreement between the employee and employer. I have made no agreements with my customers to be at their beck and call 80 hours a week, or more.

Sometimes, it's ok to "close the store." After all, regular businesses, which are also successful, do that.

- Donald
Message: Posted by: TommyJ (Mar 12, 2009 07:14PM)
I agree with you Donald. I am not available to speak to customers 24/7. We ALL need down time. I JUST got back from going out to eat with my wife. I do not take calls at that time. If I get a call after 9:00 at night, I usually let the answering machine pick up. But I will get back to them first thing tomorrow . . . hence: in a timely fashion.

Magicbern: I do NOT love an argument. In fact I dislike conflict. But YOU started it with the "Moaners and Groaners" comment, and NOW look who's Moaning and Groaning. If you don't want a conflict, then don't start one.
Message: Posted by: stempleton (Mar 12, 2009 10:08PM)
Again, more sweeping generalizations.

I don't fit into the "same moaners and complainers" category. I checked...I haven't made a negative comment about any supplier. But then again, I've never had a bad communications problem from a supplier when a delay occurred.

I spent a decade in retail and outside sales. Way back then, customer service was paramount. That was before the "self serve" mentality of most retailers, which continues even though poll after poll indicates the majority are extremely dissatisfied with the level of customer service. But this thread has been so perverted by some as to suggest that no empathy is present to those suppliers who have legitimate delays in their fulfillment processes. Nothing in the original posts indicates this. It is simply a matter of communication.

No one is suggesting a five or six day wait without response is not acceptable. However, it is very easy to provide an auto response to any incoming emails, or to include a brief explanation of your absence on your voicemail, regarding your current "out of office" status. Jeeeeeeseee! You'd we were talking about access to the president!
Message: Posted by: Donald Dunphy (Mar 13, 2009 12:12AM)
We don't really know what Wayne specifically meant when he said he was "having a hard time getting a response from Silly Billy by email".

We don't have the facts of the situation. We have no idea if he tried once, or several times. We have no idea if he was polite, or rude. We have no idea if he waited 24 hours or 3 days or 7 days or 14 days for a reply. We have no idea if he tried the phone as well as email. We don't know if emails were sent, but lost, going either way.

And really, that is none of our business. It's between him and Silly Billy.

As I see it, we really can't offer any informed opinions about this specific situation without the facts. It's just guesswork otherwise. We might very well be making a mountain out of a molehill.

- Donald

P.S. Wayne even admitted that it's unusual for Silly Billy not to respond to an email.

[quote]Wayne Brockway (Posted: Feb 17, 2009 3:57pm): My concern is and was that everythings well and it's not like him not to respond. I ordered from him just two weeks ago and got the product that again is not my concern, just if all is well!!![/quote]
Message: Posted by: keeblem (Mar 13, 2009 02:06AM)
[quote]
On 2009-03-13 01:12, Donald Dunphy wrote:
As I see it, we really can't offer any informed opinions about this specific situation without the facts. [/quote]

I think we've all said what we wanted to say. I think it's time for a group hug! :)

Mark
Message: Posted by: TommyJ (Mar 13, 2009 06:04AM)
Ok I'm Hugging lol
Message: Posted by: Donald Dunphy (Mar 13, 2009 09:13AM)
Peace and hugs! :lol:

- Donald
Message: Posted by: stempleton (Mar 13, 2009 05:06PM)
Anyone know the words to "Kumbaya?"
Message: Posted by: TommyJ (Mar 13, 2009 06:42PM)
Good one Steve. I LOVE that song!
Message: Posted by: JimbosMagic (Mar 17, 2009 09:53AM)
Quite Right Donald.
Its none of our business. and I'm up for a group hug.
Message: Posted by: Joshua Barrett (May 5, 2009 11:07PM)
Iv ordered in sep and still not got these. I asked for a refund but no response for months. of course to some that's ok cause he is "busy"....
Message: Posted by: muzicman (May 7, 2009 01:03AM)
[quote]
On 2009-05-06 00:07, Joshua Barrett wrote:
Iv ordered in sep and still not got these. I asked for a refund but no response for months. of course to some that's ok cause he is "busy"....
[/quote]

I would believe I would have an issue if I ordered something in Sept and I have not received the product or a refund by now. There MUST be more to it than that. I believe there are other ways to handle it besides on a public forum but I'd like to hear more if you're willing to share.

There are a variety of reasons this could happen to someone and I don't want to assume anything.
Message: Posted by: Joshua Barrett (May 7, 2009 12:12PM)
David just sent me a email. he told me he thought he refunded me, and according to pay pal records never happened. the only reason I put on a public forums is because they are still listed for sale on his site and that bothers me if he never got the product. hopefully will know more soon when David gets back to me.
Message: Posted by: keeblem (May 7, 2009 06:01PM)
[quote]
On 2009-05-07 02:03, muzicman wrote:
[quote]
On 2009-05-06 00:07, Joshua Barrett wrote:
I believe there are other ways to handle it besides on a public forum but I'd like to hear more if you're willing to share.
[/quote]

I would say this is precisely what a public forum is for. As long as it's done in a factual and resonable manner.

Mark
Message: Posted by: stempleton (May 7, 2009 07:03PM)
[quote]
On 2009-05-07 19:01, keeblem wrote:
[quote]
On 2009-05-07 02:03, muzicman wrote:
[quote]
On 2009-05-06 00:07, Joshua Barrett wrote:
I believe there are other ways to handle it besides on a public forum but I'd like to hear more if you're willing to share.
[/quote]

I would say this is precisely what a public forum is for. As long as it's done in a factual and resonable manner.

Mark
[/quote]

I agree. I've had it with lousy customer service. When it can't be worked out after good faith attempts, take it to the masses. And I think it's a great service to those who can be saved from similar experiences.
Message: Posted by: Joshua Barrett (May 11, 2009 06:13PM)
Refund recieved =)