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Topic: Memorized Stack Trainer (Free)
Message: Posted by: huruey (Feb 28, 2010 12:08AM)
Hey guys,

This evening, for a bit of fun and also to help me learn the Mnemonica stack, I built a web-based memorized stack trainer which you are all welcome to make use off, too.

Find it here:
http://huruey.webs.com

If you have any comments or suggestions, please let me know. I already have a few ideas for improvements which I may include in a later version.


Joe
Message: Posted by: Scott Cram (Feb 28, 2010 01:16AM)
It's great!

It would probably be good to find a way to hide the stack list in some way. Having the ability to try and determine the card before and after in the stack would be nice, too.

It's pretty good as is, though, so I've added it to my [url=http://headinside.blogspot.com/2008/06/memorized-deck-online-toolbox.html]Memorized Deck Online Toolbox[/url].
Message: Posted by: Waterloophai (Feb 28, 2010 02:36AM)
Congratulations. Very handy trainer.
Scott Cram already mentioned it: Having the ability to try and determine the card before and after in the stack would be nice.
It would be handy too if you could "save" the stack somehow, so that if the visitor returns to the site, he has not to fill in his stack again. (cookie?)
Message: Posted by: Waterloophai (Feb 28, 2010 03:25AM)
A button to "pause" would be useful.
Eventualy a button "reset" to start again if one would do that in the middle of a training.
Message: Posted by: vinsmagic (Feb 28, 2010 05:30AM)
Teriffic I added your site to my favorites
vinny
Message: Posted by: Lawrence O (Feb 28, 2010 05:39AM)
Making the rank number flashing would probably be an improvement in helping memorization.

You could make a sort of Wiki extension so that it can be opened on the upper right cornner of the screen as we do something else on the computer like on the net or using MS Words or Excel.

Great site though for it is not restricted to one specific stack and can be used for mirror stacks as well.

Thanks for sharing
Message: Posted by: Waterloophai (Feb 28, 2010 06:11AM)
[quote]
On 2010-02-28 06:39, Lawrence O wrote:
Great site though for it is not restricted to one specific stack
[/quote]
Indeed! It's ideal for users who made their own stack.
Message: Posted by: huruey (Feb 28, 2010 07:20AM)
Thanks guys.

I've just uploaded a few changes:
- New stack presets menu, to which I have added Si Stebbins and new deck order
- Clicking load now resets the count instantly
- You may now test yourself by guessing the position of a given card

I intend to make the position flash as well, though I need to make a few more changes to do that. I also like the idea of guessing the next/previous card. I'll have a go at that at some point.

Joe
Message: Posted by: Mike Powers (Feb 28, 2010 09:12AM)
Hi Joe,

Here's the Aronson stack if you'd like to add it. It's likely the most used stack in the USA.

JS, KC, 5C, 2H, 9S, AS, 3H, 6C, 8D, AC, 10S, 5H, 2D, KD,
7D, 8C, 3S, AD, 7S, 5S, QD, AH, 8S, 3D, 7H, QH, 5D, 7C,
4H, KH, 4D, 10D, JC, JH, 10C, JD, 4S, 10H, 6H, 3C, 2S, 9H, KS, 6S, 4C, 8H, 9C, QS, 6D, QC, 2C, 9D

Mike
Message: Posted by: Lawrence O (Feb 28, 2010 11:33AM)
Huruey,

The drawback of the Si-Stebbins had always been the repeated alternation of the suites. There is however an "Advanced Si Stebbins" stacking which solves this issue. When the card is an even card jump one step in the CHaSeD order (thus, for example, after an even Hearts, you'd get a Diamond). When the card is odd just go to the next suite in the CHaSeD order (thus, for example, after an odd Hearts, you'd get a Spade).
This produces the following stack which looks totally random but is easy to trace and remember. One of the beauty of the Si-Stebbins is that given a number, is easy enough to calculate the identity of a card after several shuffles and given a card, it's easy enough to tell its position. This is the principle behind Juan Tamariz's Total Coincidence (the only effect to match the impact of Out Of This World).
AC, 4H, 7D, 10C, KS, 3D, 6C, 9S, QD, 2H, 5D, 8C, JS, AD,
4C, 7S, 10D, KH, 3S, 6D, 9H, QS, 2C, 5S, 8D, JH, AS, 4D, 7H, 10S,
KC, 3H, 6S, 9C, QH, QH, 2D, 5H, 8S, JC, AH, 4S, 7C, 10H, KD, 3C, 6H, 9D, QC, 2S, 5C, 8H, JC

Now I'm a fan of Palyndromic or Mirror stacks. Following this second principle, the Si-Stebbins is followed all the way up to one half of the deck and is then done in reverse order for the second half. The mirror stack offers a lot of advantages for getting at a card or different effects.
The Palyndromic or Mirror Si-Stebbins stack (the "Si-Stebbins Pro" Stack) uses the same Suite system as the Advanced Si-Stebbins
AC, 4H, 7D, 10C, KS, 3D, 6C, 9S, QD, 2H, 5D, 8C, JS, AD, 4C, 7S, 10D, KH, 3S,
6D, 9H, QS, 2C, 5S, 8D, JH, JC, 8S, 5H, 2D, QH, 9C, 6S, 3H, KC, 10S, 7H, 4D,
AS, JC, 8H, 5C, 2S, QC, 9D, 6H, 3C, KD, 10H, 7C, 4S, AH

I've formatted them so that you can copy/paste them in your software
Message: Posted by: kentfgunn (Feb 28, 2010 01:20PM)
Joe,

The Joyal Stack guys might appreciate this as a choice.

JH,6S,6H,4S,10D,AD,7S,4H,9S,5D,QH,AH,KC,7H,10C,4C,JS,
9H,KD,5C,7C,2S,QC,AH,10C,6C,9C,7D,QD,10H,KH,4D,3S,3H,
10D,9D,QS,3C,3D,2H,8S,2C,QC,2D,8H,8C,KS,AS,JD,5S,8D,6D

There are some variations on suit sequence. One of my pals has this sequence but a different suit order. Joyal kind of leaves one that choice.

I must say Scott Cram's site is a plethora of sources, information and all things stack. No disrespect Joe, but the best thing about this thread, for me, was finding Scott's website!

KG
Message: Posted by: Bill Hallahan (Feb 28, 2010 03:01PM)
Huruey, that's great. Thanks!
Message: Posted by: Mike Powers (Feb 28, 2010 04:17PM)
Thanks for updating with the new stacks!

Mike
Message: Posted by: Lawrence O (Feb 28, 2010 04:24PM)
Huruey,
Your tool is definitely interesting

Kent,
Thanks for mentioning Scott Cram's site which I didn't know about
http://members.cox.net/astonishment/questions.html

I only knew of Scott's publications in http://www.lybrary.com/scott-cram-m-187.html
Message: Posted by: Mike Powers (Feb 28, 2010 05:36PM)
Hi Joe,

The trainer is great! Many thanks for sharing.

Here's a suggestion: When doing a random run-through of the stack which seems like the best training, I think your progam makes each instance random. This means that if you run 52 items you may get the same one more than once and you may not get certain cards/numbers. In fact it's likely that certain cards would not show up for a long time just by chance.

An alternate that's easy is to randomize the array that contains the 52 cards. I'm sure you know this technique but if not here's a simple way:

Loop from 1 to 52 and switch array element I with a random element. In other words element 1 switches with a randon element. Then element 2 switches with a random element. Do this from 1 to 52 and the array will be randomized. Then, after the 52nd item has appeared, re-randomize the array. Now every run of 52 cards will contain one and only one of each of the stack elements in a random order.

This similates what people do with a deck i.e. put numbers on the backs of the cards and then shuffle. One run through will force you to try each item in the stack once.

The randomization routine only has about 6 instructions. It would be something like this:

for i:=1 to 52 do
{
dummy := array(i);
num:=rnd(1..52);
array(i):=array(num);
array(num):=dummy;
}
I don't know Java but it would be something like this.

Another cool feature would be to allow the user to input a group of card names and their stack numbers. The program would then only use these cards in the practice session. This way a user could work on a specific group of cards.

In no way are these comments a criticism. The programs is great as is. These are just a couple of suggestions for features that might make it even better.

Thanks for sharing!

Mike
Message: Posted by: huruey (Feb 28, 2010 06:27PM)
Good point, Mike. I was planning on recording the previous card to prevent getting the same card twice when on random, but a proper shuffle would indeed be better. I'll implement the standard shuffle, but I also have an idea for another mode which will allow you to enter the value you think is correct. For a single session (or potentially over multiple sessions using cookies) it will record which you get right and which you get wrong the most. It will then make the cards that you get wrong most often appear most often.

Additional changes that I'm planning on making in the next week or so are a details button for the preset stacks which provides additional information, credits and links to resources.

I would also like to add a way of generating and transforming stacks, doing things such as mirroring and cutting. I will also add a reverse order.

Another feature which I think might be cool would be a progressive training sequence which begins with a rabnge of one card, upon showing that card, it increases the range by one, goes through those cards, increases the range by 1 again and so on.

Saving by using cookies would also be nice, though it is unreliable.

Thanks again for your interest and suggestions. :)


Joe
Message: Posted by: CardWiz (Feb 28, 2010 06:30PM)
Nice idea Mike, but here is a more efficient way (IMO) of doing the randomization (in Java):

//assuming Card objects have been instantiated and the array used is deckArray[]

Random rand=new Random(); //creates Random generator rand

for(int x=0; x<10000;x++) //set the 2nd constant to a really high number
{
int rand1=rand.nextInt(52);
int rand2=rand.nextInt(52);
Card temp=deckArray[rand1];

deckArray[rand1]=deckArray[rand2];
deckArray[rand2]=temp;
}


This way the deck will really be shuffled (10,000 swaps).

But, anyway, Joe seems like he knows what he is doing.

CW
Message: Posted by: huruey (Feb 28, 2010 09:28PM)
Hi CardWiz. As you seem interested, I thought I'd explain why the more common shuffling algorithm as suggested by Mike is superior to swapping cards at random positions a large number of times. Firstly, the second algorithm produces no more random a result than the sequential swapping algorithm. In the first algorithm, every card in the deck is swapped to a random position at least once, meaning that regardless of the input order, all the permutations of the output are equally likely, which is as random as you can get. The algorithm you suggested, however, is in fact LESS random, as by only swapping random elements, regardless of the number of iterations, there is still a chance of some elements not being swapped at all. In terms of efficiency of the function, the first algorithm is also much faster, requiring only 52 iterations rather than say 10000.

I hope this makes sense. ;)

Joe
Message: Posted by: Tom G (Feb 28, 2010 11:44PM)
Thanks for offering that, maybe just maybe......
Message: Posted by: Steven Leung (Mar 1, 2010 12:30AM)
Thanks Joe, appreciate that effort.
Message: Posted by: msc455magic (Mar 1, 2010 02:33AM)
Great stuff. Thanks!!!
Message: Posted by: Harald (Mar 1, 2010 05:49AM)
Thank you Joe for posting. There is a software named stackview, available for free at stackview.com which also might interest you if you did not know that before.
Message: Posted by: Jasper-1975 (Mar 1, 2010 06:20AM)
Super!

I will definitely use this when trying to learn the Aronson stack.....again :)

But also Stackview, mentioned above, is a great tool.
Message: Posted by: CardWiz (Mar 1, 2010 10:21PM)
[quote]
On 2010-02-28 22:28, huruey wrote:
Hi CardWiz. As you seem interested, I thought I'd explain why the more common shuffling algorithm as suggested by Mike is superior to swapping cards at random positions a large number of times. Firstly, the second algorithm produces no more random a result than the sequential swapping algorithm. In the first algorithm, every card in the deck is swapped to a random position at least once, meaning that regardless of the input order, all the permutations of the output are equally likely, which is as random as you can get. The algorithm you suggested, however, is in fact LESS random, as by only swapping random elements, regardless of the number of iterations, there is still a chance of some elements not being swapped at all. In terms of efficiency of the function, the first algorithm is also much faster, requiring only 52 iterations rather than say 10000.

I hope this makes sense. ;)

Joe
[/quote]

Yes, I see your point, but with 10000-100000 loops (which only takes about .2 seconds) every card is practically guaranteed to be called upon, and with 52 loops there is always the chance of swapping a pair twice.

But I suppose it does not matter as both sequences get the job done.

CW
Message: Posted by: Medifro (Mar 2, 2010 04:20AM)
Joe that's AWESOME

~ Feras
Message: Posted by: huruey (Mar 2, 2010 05:13AM)
[quote]
On 2010-03-01 23:21, CardWiz wrote:

Yes, I see your point, but with 10000-100000 loops (which only takes about .2 seconds) every card is practically guaranteed to be called upon, and with 52 loops there is always the chance of swapping a pair twice.

But I suppose it does not matter as both sequences get the job done.

CW
[/quote]

It does not matter if a card gets swapped twice, because by the end of the loop there is still a 1/52 of any card appearing at any position in the array. If you are having trouble seeing this, consider an alternative algorithm which more clearly produces the most random deck possible (for pseudo-random numbers at least), which creates a second array then loops through each element of the input array, randomly assigning it to any empty position in the second, thus every element has a 1/52 chance of finishing in any position in the output array. The first algorithm achieves this same result. When the loop is on an element, it has a 1/52 chance of going to any position in the array. The other 51 iterations, it has a 1/52 chance of being swapped with the current element. Counting itself, as it may end up swapping with itself, this means that every element is equally likely to swap to any position.

Also, regarding speed, for a start you'll find older browsers take significantly longer, and rather than 0.2 seconds, it would be taking closer to 5 seconds, and just one more 0 would take that to 50 seconds, and just a couple more operations inside the loop would might double that again. Also, should you, for any reason, later want to repeat the operation many times in succession, for example to produce test data for some model which involves shuffling a deck of cards, multiplying your shuffling operation by just 10000 more could leave people waiting several hours. It is always best to use the most efficient algorithm because in real life, you don't necessarily know when you or somebody else may want to use a procedure for something more intensive, especially in industry when many people end up working on and using the same code.


Joe
Message: Posted by: Furniture (Mar 2, 2010 05:17AM)
I created a trainer in Excel few months ago. You may find some ideas, like the ACAAN trainer, for you web built-in version

[url=http://furniturecorner.blogspot.com/2009/12/tamariz-memorized-stack-mnemonica.html]tamariz[/url]
Message: Posted by: Close.Up.Dave (Mar 2, 2010 06:12AM)
Anyone remember this one? http://www.stackview.com
Message: Posted by: Mike Powers (Mar 2, 2010 07:53AM)
Joe's explanation is dead on. You really can't get more random than switching every card with a random card. And the loop is only 1 to 52. I think this is the standard way to "shuffle" a deck.

"It doesn't simulate a real riffle shuffle, though. In a real shuffle cards fall in clumps. Persi Diaconis worked out the math on shuffling. It takes 7 "good" riffle shuffles to randomize a deck. I think "random" in this case means that you can't find a pattern in the shuffled deck that gives you any info as to the initial condition of the deck before the 7 shuffles. "

From Wikipedia: ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shuffling#Randomization )

"A famous paper by mathematician and magician Persi Diaconis, and mathematician Dave Bayer, on the number of shuffles needed to randomize a deck, concluded that the deck did not start to become random until five good riffle shuffles, and was truly random after seven, in the precise sense of variation distance described in Markov chain mixing time; of course, you would need more shuffles if your shuffling technique is poor."

Mike
Message: Posted by: nspikito (Mar 2, 2010 10:40AM)
Thanks, Joe. This is a super tool, both for learning a stack and keeping it fresh.
Spike
Message: Posted by: leosx1 (Mar 9, 2010 04:01PM)
Thank you Joe, what a great tool ! adding a tune of a song to each specific card also helps me a lot in remembering the card.
Message: Posted by: Scott F. Guinn (Mar 10, 2010 05:54PM)
Hi Joe,

I'm one of those "Joyal guys", but I used CHaSeD instead of SHoCkeD order. Unless I'm missing something, that isn't an option in your trainer. How hard would it be to add the CHaSeD stack? I know I can put it in myself, but it might be good to have it as a preset, if it's not too much trouble:

JH,6C,6H,4C,10D,AD,7C,4H,9C,5D,QH,AS,KC
7H,10S,4S,JS,9H,KD,5S,7S,2C,QC,AH,10H,6S
9S,7D,QD,5H,KH,4D,3C,3H,10C,9D,QS,3S,3D
2H,8C,2S,JC,2D,8H,8S,KS,AC,JD,5C,8D,6D
Message: Posted by: huruey (Mar 16, 2010 10:40PM)
CHaSeD Joyal has been added. ;)

In other news, I am going to attempt to develop an app version over the next 6 weeks.

Joe
Message: Posted by: lunatik (Mar 19, 2010 07:52AM)
Hi Joe,are you planning on making an iPhone app? That would be awesome!
Message: Posted by: lunatik (Mar 19, 2010 09:01AM)
I was looking at your stck but I see 2 queen of hearts back to back, was this correct?

[quote]
On 2010-02-28 12:33, Lawrence O wrote:
Huruey,

The drawback of the Si-Stebbins had always been the repeated alternation of the suites. There is however an "Advanced Si Stebbins" stacking which solves this issue. When the card is an even card jump one step in the CHaSeD order (thus, for example, after an even Hearts, you'd get a Diamond). When the card is odd just go to the next suite in the CHaSeD order (thus, for example, after an odd Hearts, you'd get a Spade).
This produces the following stack which looks totally random but is easy to trace and remember. One of the beauty of the Si-Stebbins is that given a number, is easy enough to calculate the identity of a card after several shuffles and given a card, it's easy enough to tell its position. This is the principle behind Juan Tamariz's Total Coincidence (the only effect to match the impact of Out Of This World).
AC, 4H, 7D, 10C, KS, 3D, 6C, 9S, QD, 2H, 5D, 8C, JS, AD, 4C, 7S, 10D, KH, 3S, 6D, 9H, QS, 2C, 5S, 8D, JH, AS, 4D, 7H, 10S, KC, 3H, 6S, 9C, QH, QH, 2D, 5H, 8S, JC, AH, 4S, 7C, 10H, KD, 3C, 6H, 9D, QC, 2S, 5C, 8H, JC

Now I'm a fan of Palyndromic or Mirror stacks. Following this second principle, the Si-Stebbins is followed all the way up to one half of the deck and is then done in reverse order for the second half. The mirror stack offers a lot of advantages for getting at a card or different effects.
The Palyndromic or Mirror Si-Stebbins stack (the "Si-Stebbins Pro" Stack) uses the same Suite system as the Advanced Si-Stebbins
AC, 4H, 7D, 10C, KS, 3D, 6C, 9S, QD, 2H, 5D, 8C, JS, AD, 4C, 7S, 10D, KH, 3S, 6D, 9H, QS, 2C, 5S, 8D, JH, JC, 8S, 5H, 2D, QH, 9C, 6S, 3H, KC, 10S, 7H, 4D, AS, JC, 8H, 5C, 2S, QC, 9D, 6H, 3C, KD, 10H, 7C, 4S, AH

I've formatted them so that you can copy/paste them in your software
[/quote]
Message: Posted by: Scott Cram (Mar 19, 2010 10:37AM)
[quote]
On 2010-03-19 08:52, lunatik wrote:
Hi Joe,are you planning on making an iPhone app? That would be awesome!
[/quote]

There's already [url=http://www.stacked-app.com/]Stacked Deck[/url] ([url=http://itunes.apple.com/WebObjects/MZStore.woa/wa/viewSoftware?id=321808520&mt=8]iTunes Link[/url]).

[url=http://headinside.blogspot.com/2009/08/review-stacked-deck-native-app.html]I reviewed it here[/url], and then [url=http://headinside.blogspot.com/2009/10/even-more-quick-snippets.html]gave another review to the update[/url].
Message: Posted by: huruey (Mar 19, 2010 12:20PM)
[quote]
On 2010-03-19 11:37, Scott Cram wrote:
[quote]
On 2010-03-19 08:52, lunatik wrote:
Hi Joe,are you planning on making an iPhone app? That would be awesome!
[/quote]

There's already [url=http://www.stacked-app.com/]Stacked Deck[/url] ([url=http://itunes.apple.com/WebObjects/MZStore.woa/wa/viewSoftware?id=321808520&mt=8]iTunes Link[/url]).

[url=http://headinside.blogspot.com/2009/08/review-stacked-deck-native-app.html]I reviewed it here[/url], and then [url=http://headinside.blogspot.com/2009/10/even-more-quick-snippets.html]gave another review to the update[/url].
[/quote]

Ah. I was planning on doing an iphone version, but I guess there's no need or it. :P

Joe
Message: Posted by: Scott Cram (Mar 19, 2010 01:32PM)
You could still put one out, Joe. Who knows? Maybe you could do a better one!
Message: Posted by: lunatik (Mar 19, 2010 03:00PM)
Anyone else know the answer to my question about the two queen of hearts in lawrences modified si stebbens?
Message: Posted by: fyi2 (Mar 20, 2010 07:29PM)
Just a thought you might consider adding Osterlind's stack BCS as well. (You'd need to get Richard's permission but I have found him very generous)
Message: Posted by: Damon Zale (Apr 14, 2010 09:32PM)
[quote]
On 2010-03-19 08:52, lunatik wrote:
Hi Joe,are you planning on making an iPhone app? That would be awesome!
[/quote]

I find it already looks fairly good if you navigate to the link from the iphone.

Joe this is an awesome trainer (and I tried tons). I specifically like the fact that you write out the card (something I didn't see in others). One thing that would be cool is a mode (I can't exactly call it random) that mentions each card from the stack randomly once and then does the remaining ones before a chance of repeat (this is how the test in stackview does it) - going continuously the way all the modes work... not sure I even explained it well
Message: Posted by: huruey (Jul 7, 2010 05:14PM)
I have just made a couple of updates, including credits on the presets and a downloadable version for offline use.

I still plan on adding the shuffled deck order at some point. Maybe this week... :P

Joe
Message: Posted by: Tom G (Jul 7, 2010 11:28PM)
Just downloaded and sent a donation.


Tom
Message: Posted by: iluzjonista (Sep 2, 2010 10:05AM)
This is very usefull website for me. Thanks a lot.
Message: Posted by: gdw (Sep 2, 2010 01:36PM)
[quote]
On 2010-03-19 11:37, Scott Cram wrote:
[quote]
On 2010-03-19 08:52, lunatik wrote:
Hi Joe,are you planning on making an iPhone app? That would be awesome!
[/quote]

There's already [url=http://www.stacked-app.com/]Stacked Deck[/url] ([url=http://itunes.apple.com/WebObjects/MZStore.woa/wa/viewSoftware?id=321808520&mt=8]iTunes Link[/url]).

[url=http://headinside.blogspot.com/2009/08/review-stacked-deck-native-app.html]I reviewed it here[/url], and then [url=http://headinside.blogspot.com/2009/10/even-more-quick-snippets.html]gave another review to the update[/url].
[/quote]

Any possibility of an android based app? :D

Does this work with custom stacks, or only a predetermined set of stacks?
Message: Posted by: huruey (Apr 16, 2011 08:19AM)
It's been a while since I made any updates on this, but I've added some new features, recently. First of all, there is now the "shuffled" order, which is like "random", except you will go through all the cards within the specified range before having a card repeated, thus ensuring you don't miss any cards.

Secondly, you can now save and load custom stacks in the URL, which could be useful if you want to save a custom stack or share a stack with other people. To save a stack, append it to the URL in the form:

http://huruey.webs.com/?stack=2h,3d,js

Anything after the "?stack=" will appear in the stack field when this address is loaded. Once you have this URL you can save it as a bookmark to make it easier to load any custom stack you may be using.


Joe
Message: Posted by: Turk (Apr 20, 2011 02:36PM)
Hi, Joe.

First off, thank you for all your hard work and dedication to this project. You are helping the magic community in many ways.

Any chances of making an app for Android Smart phones? Also, any persistent requests for adding Doug Dyment's "QuickStack" memorized deck to the list? I have a friend who uses this stack and it would help him immensely I'm sure. But not a reasonable request to ask you to consider if very few others are using such a stack.

Finally, is there a way to download your trainer and then be able to use it off-line?

Again, thanks for all your help and dedication to this project.

Best,

Mike
Message: Posted by: SIX (Apr 21, 2011 10:02AM)
Do the Iphone app, I have the other and its not as good as yours.
Message: Posted by: rjs (Apr 27, 2011 04:51PM)
Nice work.
I really must try to master the Aronson stack.
Darwin Ortiz in a recent lecture said a perfectionist friend of his never got round to memorising a specific stack because there was always a better designed stack just around the corner... on the verge of being released...making previous ones redundant...etc , etc.
But you gotta take the plunge.
Message: Posted by: Matze (Sep 20, 2011 06:26AM)
Any chance this is still coming out as an app for iphone/ipod?
Message: Posted by: krmagic (Sep 25, 2011 01:07AM)
This is really cool! Thank you very much! Now I got to learn the aronson stack!

P.S. The pro si stebbins is something I have never heard of. Thanks Lawrence O.
Message: Posted by: Jeff Christensen (Oct 15, 2011 10:00PM)
This really is a wonderful resource. I'm now happy to say that I know the Tamariz Stack thanks to this. Next...a convincing deck switch.
Message: Posted by: jhereg (Dec 4, 2011 03:13PM)
This rocks! I am so glad to have run across this. Very generous of you! FYI there is a typo in the Joyal SHoCkeD; 12 should be AC
Message: Posted by: hcs (Dec 5, 2011 05:38AM)
[quote]
On 2011-09-25 02:07, krmagic wrote:
This is really cool! Thank you very much! Now I got to learn the aronson stack!

P.S. The pro si stebbins is something I have never heard of. Thanks Lawrence O.
[/quote]
"The Si Stebbins Pro Stack is highly interesting for any card stack enthusiast. Dr. Solka has taken the venerable Si Stebbins Stack and removed an inherent weakness, the rigid alternation of suit colors and strict suit rotation."
http://www.lybrary.com/si-stebbins-pro-p-4180.html?manufacturers_id=4881
Message: Posted by: dykstraj99 (Mar 9, 2013 07:57AM)
I ran across this free app from the apple App Store. It's pretty good for the price.
Search for mnemonicosis
Message: Posted by: TheAmazingSteveo (Jun 7, 2013 03:01PM)
Check out this app: http://www.audiostackeddeck.com
Message: Posted by: Horatio (Jun 12, 2013 07:21PM)
Thanks for sharing this, Joe. That adds to the variety of tasks I can use. Really useful.
Message: Posted by: bidbid (Aug 8, 2013 03:57PM)
Many thanks, I use your site a lot and I love it :D
Message: Posted by: Turk (Sep 10, 2013 06:01PM)
Is there [i]any[/i] memorized stack trainer for the Android Smart Phones that you know about? Thanks for any such information.
Message: Posted by: doriancaudal (Sep 11, 2013 12:44AM)
[quote]
On 2013-09-10 19:01, Turk wrote:
Is there [i]any[/i] memorized stack trainer for the Android Smart Phones that you know about? Thanks for any such information.
[/quote]

Good question, and for the Windowsphones ?
Message: Posted by: crozboz (Sep 15, 2013 09:57AM)
Anyone interested in learning the Shadow Stack - it's on Joe's website, but not as a preset
tiny.cc/shadowstack

Joe - you rule in spades! :D See you in October x
Message: Posted by: TheAmazingSteveo (Sep 30, 2013 07:55AM)
Here is one on the apple store that allows you to learn a mem deck while you are driving .. Audio Stacked Deck:

https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/audio-stacked-deck/id638757454?mt=8
Message: Posted by: YLyoo (Nov 22, 2013 10:30PM)
Amazing~ I just recommended the site to all my friends!
Message: Posted by: jasonmcconnie (Dec 12, 2013 01:53AM)
Fantastic work. Fun tool!
Message: Posted by: Burf (Jan 14, 2014 07:25PM)
Just found this, very good - will certainly help me in learning and remembering the stack.
Thanks Joe
Message: Posted by: MichaelMann (Jan 24, 2014 11:53PM)
This is a great thread! Thanks for all the info.

MM
Message: Posted by: boinko (Feb 3, 2014 09:31AM)
What would be a nice addition is the ability to add a randomly shuffled deck in addition to all the specific stacks. I've been looking for an application that allows me to quiz myself on stacks (and yours does this quite well) -- but also one that has the ability to randomly shuffle cards and then quiz myself on those random cards for memory practice. Obviously, it's the random idea is not useful for stacked deck magic, but it *is* useful for speeding myself up on memorizing a complete deck of shuffled cards.

I'm using the Dominic method with a mixture of the journey method and the Roman Room method -- and I've manged to create journeys specifically for Mnemonica and the Aaronson stacks -- but I've also got two journeys for randomly shuffled decks. I alternate between the "blank" journeys two so I can "forget" one as I use the other.

Anyway -- I hope this makes sense. I suspect there are others like myself who are memorizing stacks, but are also fascinated with simply speed-memorizing a shuffled deck (and then practicing). Surprisingly, there's not a lot of random deck shuffle quzzers out there.
Message: Posted by: Nick Pudar (Feb 3, 2014 10:37AM)
Boinko,
If you can tolerate a Windows Application, then StackView (at http://www.stackview.com) allows you to test/quiz from any deck condition, including random shuffles.
Nick
Message: Posted by: Harry Lorayne (Feb 3, 2014 10:42AM)
You might even take a chance and read one of the 17 books on memory training I've written just for you!!
Message: Posted by: alicauchy (Feb 11, 2014 07:39AM)
Although initially reluctant to try, I have to say that I benefitted from Mr Lorayne's books, and now (after a couple of days learning the system) I can confidently work with Mnemonica and, in addition, I memorized two other full decks. Average time for learning a deck: one hour (still a beginner in the peg system).

It is amazing that remembering a stack is as easy as recalling a short tale. How many tales can you remember?
Message: Posted by: Gorecki (Jun 13, 2014 09:01AM)
[quote]On Feb 3, 2014, Harry Lorayne wrote:
You might even take a chance and read one of the 17 books on memory training I've written just for you!! [/quote]
Mr. Lorayne, if I had to pick only one of your memory-training books, which one would you say is best used in conjunction with a memorized deck?
Message: Posted by: Harry Lorayne (Jun 13, 2014 11:57AM)
Gorecki: I've taught how to remember cards in most of my books on the subject (excluding Page-A-Minute Memory Book, and the books geared to students). So, AGELESS MEMORY or THE MEMORY BOOK would do it for you. You can learn more about them if you go to my magic website - 3rd one listed under this post - and click on "Memory Products". Best - Harry L.
Message: Posted by: Gorecki (Jun 16, 2014 10:07AM)
[quote]On Jun 13, 2014, Harry Lorayne wrote:
Gorecki: I've taught how to remember cards in most of my books on the subject (excluding Page-A-Minute Memory Book, and the books geared to students). So, AGELESS MEMORY or THE MEMORY BOOK would do it for you. You can learn more about them if you go to my magic website - 3rd one listed under this post - and click on "Memory Products". Best - Harry L. [/quote]
Thank you sir!
Meanwile, I've started reading your "How to Develop a Super-Power Memory" and I'm hooked. I was already using a peg system (which I learned in Corinda's "13 Steps") but your method is much more streamlined and effective. I love it. If nothing else, it makes it easier to create pegs for any number, whereas the Corinda system stopped at 30 -- after that, the reader was on his own with no clear guidelines.
Message: Posted by: TazBo (Jun 30, 2014 12:23PM)
Here is another iPhone app for Tamoriz Mnemonica Stack with speed testing and the ability to upload your results to see how you compare with others:

Memo Deck (Mnemonica Edition)By Thierry Baudhuin:

https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/memo-deck-mnemonica-edition/id817404892?mt=8
Message: Posted by: tpratt38 (Jul 23, 2014 02:26PM)
Thanks for all the great info and tips to all the posters, In want to say something about shameless @@@@@, But I will behave, we have been guilty of many of those other thing myself included.

Mentally Speaking,
Make your day the best it can be.
Message: Posted by: Steven Conner (Feb 10, 2015 10:03AM)
Whatever happened to Joe's website.
http://huruey.webs.com/stack=2h,3d,js
Message: Posted by: Waterloophai (Feb 10, 2015 11:41AM)
[quote]On Feb 10, 2015, Steven Conner wrote:
Whatever happened to Joe's website.
http://huruey.webs.com/stack=2h,3d,js [/quote]
I noticed it too some days ago.
Page is no longer available.
Message: Posted by: george1953 (Feb 10, 2015 12:25PM)
Anyone know of anything similar for learning the aronson stack ?
Message: Posted by: Steven Conner (Feb 10, 2015 05:55PM)
[quote]On Feb 10, 2015, george1953 wrote:
Anyone know of anything similar for learning the aronson stack ? [/quote]

http://simonaronson.com/quizzer/quizzer.htm
Message: Posted by: george1953 (Feb 10, 2015 07:29PM)
Many thanks Steven.
Message: Posted by: J-L Sparrow (Feb 11, 2015 06:20PM)
[quote]On Feb 10, 2015, Steven Conner wrote:
Whatever happened to Joe's website?
http://huruey.webs.com/ [/quote]

You can still access it via the Internet Archive's Wayback Machine here:

https://web.archive.org/web/20130429044059/http://huruey.webs.com/

Hope this helps!
Message: Posted by: IpswichRich (Jul 28, 2017 10:00PM)
Update for 'Memorized Stack Trainer'

The site has changed its location.
You asked to do the update so here it is: joecreates.co.uk
Operation is the same as before.

This is from Joe Williamson July 2017

Thank you Joe for the information and keeping this most valuable tool available.
Rich
Message: Posted by: IpswichRich (Jul 28, 2017 10:07PM)
[quote]On Feb 11, 2015, J-L Sparrow wrote:
[quote]On Feb 10, 2015, Steven Conner wrote:

Whatever happened to Joe's website?
http://huruey.webs.com/ [/quote]

As of July 2017...

I was just in touch with Joe and he mentioned to inform others that the new site is: joecreates.co.uk/magicians
Operates the same as his other one did.

Rich
Message: Posted by: Waterloophai (Jul 29, 2017 01:57AM)
It's simply the best trainer.
You can put in your own stack, download the trainer to use it off line and you can use it on your phone.
Attention: the Maigret stack in the trainer is the Dutch version. (not the English one)
Message: Posted by: rrubin98 (Jul 29, 2017 08:39AM)
Thanks for the link!

Another good one is here (for Aronson): http://iflipr.com/deck/practice/35501
For Mnemonica: http://iflipr.com/deck/practice/35379


Richard
Message: Posted by: Francois Lagrange (Jul 30, 2017 03:50AM)
Here's another one: [url=https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.solutionsbuilder.memdeckpro]MemDeckPro[/url] on Play Store.

Itís a [b]free and ads free[/b] standalone app, i.e. it does not require you to be online to use it.
It has a built-in stacks (Aronson, Mnemonica, BCS Ö) and allows you to maintain (create, delete, edit) your own.

It has many test settings: automatic or manual mode, time, card range, suit range etc.

Audio-training: the voice will ask the question and speak out the answer, if you check the option of course, and therefore you can practice your stack hand and eye free.

It has many more settings.

[youtube]_IVkOCqAZTw[/youtube]
Message: Posted by: FJR (Aug 26, 2017 09:15AM)
Thank you for the notice about this app - it's really excellent.
Simple and unfussy to use with just enough 'tweakability'. The fact you can put in your own favourite stack is great (and my key use for it).

Very best,
Francis
Message: Posted by: alistair.crompton (Aug 29, 2017 10:35PM)
Hi Guys,

Stack Master is now available for Android AND iPhone.

http://www.neo-hypnose.com/magic/stack-master

With the practicing module, you can learn a stack in less than one week, without pain :)
Furthermore, there are a lot of funny challenges to improve your knowledge !

Enjoy !
Message: Posted by: Claudio (Aug 30, 2017 01:38PM)
[quote]On Aug 26, 2017, FJR wrote:
Thank you for the notice about this app - it's really excellent.
Simple and unfussy to use with just enough 'tweakability'. The fact you can put in your own favourite stack is great (and my key use for it).

Very best,
Francis [/quote]

Thanks Francis for your comment, as the author of this app, I really appreciate it :) Do not hesitate to rate the app on Play Store.

[url=https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.solutionsbuilder.memdeckpro]MemDeckPro[/url] has today hit 2000 downloads :bubbly: and still has 1200 installs. Not bad for a niche market like this one.

Itís a [b]free and ads free[/b] standalone app.
Message: Posted by: lukkudlek (Sep 20, 2017 08:55AM)
Please add Redford stack!
Message: Posted by: Claudio (Sep 20, 2017 09:01AM)
[quote]On Sep 20, 2017, lukkudlek wrote:
Please add Redford stack! [/quote]

Just add the stack yourself. It'll take you a couple of minutes.
Message: Posted by: lukkudlek (Sep 20, 2017 10:02AM)
[quote]On Sep 20, 2017, Claudio wrote:
[quote]On Sep 20, 2017, lukkudlek wrote:
Please add Redford stack! [/quote]

Just add the stack yourself. It'll take you a couple of minutes. [/quote]

Oh, right! I didn't notice that you could add your own stacks. Thanks.
Message: Posted by: alistair.crompton (Nov 20, 2017 09:29AM)
Hello guys,
The Stack Master training application will have a Black Friday special price, good opportunity to get a good stack training efficient app for your iPhone or Android !
Message: Posted by: alistair.crompton (Feb 17, 2018 07:35AM)
The latest version of the Stack Master app includes two new training modules :

- A dedicated training module for one Pit's Hartling routine : "The core" (can be unlocked if you bought Pit's book or routine).
- "Perfect hit!" : a training module that uses some Mnemonicosis mechanisms.

These two new training modules have been added to the 15 embedded existing games, the 4 training modules and the "sandbox" module that simulates a deck of cards (deals, faros, cuts... etc... can be executed against a virtual deck of cards).
Message: Posted by: Chris Aguilar (Apr 27, 2019 09:55AM)
[quote]On Aug 30, 2017, Claudio wrote:
[quote]On Aug 26, 2017, FJR wrote:
Thank you for the notice about this app - it's really excellent.
Simple and unfussy to use with just enough 'tweakability'. The fact you can put in your own favourite stack is great (and my key use for it).

Very best,
Francis [/quote]

Thanks Francis for your comment, as the author of this app, I really appreciate it :) Do not hesitate to rate the app on Play Store.

[url=https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.solutionsbuilder.memdeckpro]MemDeckPro[/url] has today hit 2000 downloads :bubbly: and still has 1200 installs. Not bad for a niche market like this one.

Itís a [b]free and ads free[/b] standalone app. [/quote]

I am trying ot learn a stack and found that Memdeck Pro to be the most complete and usable app of the many I have tried.

It's also completely free, has no ads and can be customized to use any stack. Highest recommendation. Try this one before you spend money (or are forced to watch ads) on other apps.
Message: Posted by: jmbulg (Apr 28, 2019 03:24AM)
I very highly recommend the Stack Master app and for the price you really get a lot of features. No ads and quite some games and different situations in which to learn various stack properties, very naturally.
Message: Posted by: sandromagic (May 2, 2019 08:30AM)
Great trainers.Really helpful.Thank you.
Message: Posted by: TheAmazingSteveo (May 8, 2019 03:53PM)
Memdeck Pro for Android is the best app out there for learning a stack -- even better than my own app AudioStackedDeck the I developed for IOS.

I have tried them all. I use Memdeck pro every day.
Message: Posted by: Claudio (May 9, 2019 11:05AM)
Thanks for the compliment, Steve!

Not that anybody were holding their breath, but I'll have some free time this Summer, and I hope to work on MemdeckPro as I need to upgrade it so that it works more smoothly with the latest versions of Android. If you have any ideas on how to improve it, without sacrificing its simplicity, please let me know here or by PM.

Thank you.
Claudio
Message: Posted by: TheAmazingSteveo (May 14, 2019 05:58AM)
[quote]On May 9, 2019, Claudio wrote:
Thanks for the compliment, Steve!

Not that anybody were holding their breath, but I'll have some free time this Summer, and I hope to work on MemdeckPro as I need to upgrade it so that it works more smoothly with the latest versions of Android. If you have any ideas on how to improve it, without sacrificing its simplicity, please let me know here or by PM.

Thank you.
Claudio [/quote]

Hi Claudio ... I think it is perfect as it is! I use it everyday to keep myself up on my stack. If I were you I would make it available on IOS too.

Have a great day!

- Steve
Message: Posted by: Degio (May 14, 2019 02:31PM)
[quote]On May 9, 2019, Claudio wrote:
If you have any ideas on how to improve it, without sacrificing its simplicity, please let me know here or by PM.
[/quote]
It's fantastic as it is and I'm using it right now (in a desperate attempt) to learn the Tamariz stack.
Maybe, in addition to measuring the time for each card reveal, I would add a total time for the whole "game".
Thanks for your help and bravo!
:applause:
Message: Posted by: Claudio (May 15, 2019 01:13PM)
Thanks, Degio, for the compliment and the suggestion.

Giving the total elapsed time for the whole deck is certainly possible. Currently the app measures the time in seconds (and not in ms) as I thought that a finer granularity was not necessary. When I practice my stack (using the manual timing setting) I answer (tap) under one second and the clock still shows "00". Therefore, I would go through the whole deck in 0 seconds. Quite a feast!

Changing the clock to use ms is not a big deal though and I will certainly consider it. Would two clocks, side by side, showing current card time and the cumulative time, be a good idea, or would it be too distracting and showing the total only at the end be better?
Message: Posted by: Degio (May 15, 2019 04:19PM)
[quote]On May 15, 2019, Claudio wrote:
Changing the clock to use ms is not a big deal though and I will certainly consider it. Would two clocks, side by side, showing current card time and the cumulative time, be a good idea, or would it be too distracting and showing the total only at the end be better? [/quote]
To be honest, anyone answering each card test in less than 1sec is not going to spend extra time to read the partial clock in millisec, so I would keep the current granularity.
I would use millisec as "internal" measure though, so you can correctly calculate the total time for a game.
In other words: the 2 variables should be both measuring partial and total times in millisec, but both should be displayed rounded into sec.
Showing the total only at the end or showing two clocks side by side are both valid options: either would work.
Many thanks for taking suggestions into consideration!
Message: Posted by: IpswichRich (Jun 11, 2019 10:45AM)
[quote]On Apr 27, 2019, Chris Aguilar wrote:
[quote]On Aug 30, 2017, Claudio wrote:
[quote]On Aug 26, 2017, FJR wrote:
Thank you for the notice about this app - it's really excellent.
Simple and unfussy to use with just enough 'tweakability'. The fact you can put in your own favourite stack is great (and my key use for it).

Very best,
Francis [/quote]

Thanks Francis for your comment, as the author of this app, I really appreciate it :) Do not hesitate to rate the app on Play Store.

[url=https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.solutionsbuilder.memdeckpro]MemDeckPro[/url] has today hit 2000 downloads :bubbly: and still has 1200 installs. Not bad for a niche market like this one.

Itís a [b]free and ads free[/b] standalone app. [/quote]

I am trying ot learn a stack and found that Memdeck Pro to be the most complete and usable app of the many I have tried.

It's also completely free, has no ads and can be customized to use any stack. Highest recommendation. Try this one before you spend money (or are forced to watch ads) on other apps. [/quote]
Message: Posted by: IpswichRich (Jun 11, 2019 11:01AM)
Memorized deck helpful trainer aid /ACAAN: If you have an Amazon Alexa Echo or similar devise you can use it as a volunteer. Ask Alexa to select any card. You will get a reply. Next ask Alexa to select any random number as necessary. Again you get a reply. You now have a freely chosen card and number for location in the deck. Now you are able to work on your timing and patter at your own convenience. This has been a wonderful help for ACAAN