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Topic: Reinductions - do anchors expire?
Message: Posted by: Owen Mc Ginty (Feb 7, 2011 09:53AM)
Suggestion given to subject whilst hypnotized: (subject had number amnesia, laughed upon command and had the flavour of a drink hypnotically altered - incase that indicates "depth" of hypnosis)

"In the future, when you look into my eyes, and I touch your left shoulder, and I say <Sleep> as long as I have your permission, you will be able to return to this pleasant deep state of hypnosis and relaxation immediately"

According to your experience, will this anchor become less effective over time if it isnīt used?
i.e. you donīt see the subject for 1 day, 1 week, 1 month, 1 year etc etc ?
(Take for granted that next time I see the subject Iīll have their permission)
Iīll have to road test this myself, but Iīm curious about other peoplesī experience.
Thanks.
Message: Posted by: Anthony Jacquin (Feb 7, 2011 10:40AM)
Hi Owen,

my experience with any reinduction cue is that if your intent is clear then it will work - time makes no difference. Many beginners set one and then just say 'Sleep' without bothering to get the subjects attention in anyway. While I appreciate this can work in especially attentive subjects with most it does not. All it takes to get attention and communicate your intention to hypnotise, is 'Look at me', short pause for dramatic effect and your cue.

So don't think of it as a PHS wearing off, think of it as giving proper attention to your reinduction.

With regard to anchors, your question does have some merit. If the process of anchoring is based on conditioning a state with a special anchor gesture then surely it will get watered down with each firing in the unwanted state. i.e a little bit of that unwanted state becomes associated with the anchor. The only way I have found around this is to use post hypnotic suggestion.

Anthony
Message: Posted by: TonyB2009 (Feb 7, 2011 12:43PM)
I had a nightmare gig last summer. An art college who put up the posters at four for a show that was beginning at four. I got only a handful of people, but one had been hypnotised at my show the previous autumn. I reinduced her instantly, and if I hadn't I wouldn't have had a show. So it does last. But as Ant says, you have to set it up. I couldn't have just walked up to her in a corridor in the college and shouted sleep. It worked in the context of a new show.
Message: Posted by: Owen Mc Ginty (Feb 7, 2011 02:31PM)
I havenīt yet tested the re-induction anchor yet, but after I do Iīll change the anchor to one that is a less frequent occurrence in everyday life (to avoid unwanted "dilution"). The shoulder is a pretty normal place to touch someone in lots of situations.
My intent will be blindingly obvious! ;)
Thanks for the info guys.
Message: Posted by: bobser (Feb 8, 2011 05:46AM)
This is really interesting. In as much as I don't call what Tony did an anchor. And I don't have such a thing as a re-induction anchor as Owen describes. I guess we're back to constructs again but anchors for me are: 'to incite a feeling or memory' (other than an actual induction itself).
Where as the client who just left me half an hour ago went into hypnosis immediately due to the fact that I'd hypnotized her before, she expected to go into hypnosis, in fact had come here to do that very thing and of course I had given her a post hypnotic suggestion last time out that the next time I saw her she would go into hypnosis twice as fast and deep by looking into my eyes and hearing me say sleep.

Indeed I open up by telling clients (that I've hypnotised before) that I just want to talk to their subconscious for a moment if that's ok (with a smile) and then I'll tell them that because they are NOT in hypnosis they probably believe that they could easily lift that arm... get out of that chair... say their name.
When they say yes I then ask them if they'd be good enough to try and do that for me.

I can't remember who I saw do this for the first time (I suspect it may have been Anthony who I know uses it a lot) but it is now extremely popular with many of my colleague and I do believe it is absolutely the way to go for all past hypnotees as an opening. Success rate? It's extremely high (sorry but I honestly don't have a number/percentage), I can honestly think of just the one time where it's been unsuccessful and I think looking back that was down to my poor delivery at that time.

My point? This is NOT an anchor. But rather close to what Anthony calls 'permanosis'.
Hope it has some value,

Bob
Message: Posted by: mindpunisher (Feb 8, 2011 06:32AM)
My Granny had permanosis it was bright purple.

If you've been hypnotised once then its in your neurology. Your body knows how to do it. If you've taken drugs its in your neurology you can get back similat states and feelings without the drugs. You can numb your gums just by touching then the same way a dentist does without the meds.

An anchor is just an external stimulus for an internal state. A phobia is just an anchor. A trigger for the state of fear. Like wise a key reinduction is a kind of anchor.

A client sees you - your voice the room and the context are all anchors. Anchors can last a lifetime and be triggered off many years later.

I watched tad james once lecturing to a group of NLP students on hypnosis. He asked those that have been hypnotised to put up their hands. He put up his at the same time and just stared at them. One by one about a third of the room went into trance. I had to even fight it off myself.

However hypnosis is permanent. It isn't separate from everyday experience its part of it.
Message: Posted by: bobser (Feb 8, 2011 07:06AM)
I'd agree with all the above except for:

"A phobia is just an anchor. A trigger for the state of fear. Like wise a key reinduction is a kind of anchor."

A phobia is a totally different thing from an anchor but I can totally understand why someone would say that.
And I also think a reinduction is NOT an anchor, but again I'm happy to give. What a guy!
Message: Posted by: mindpunisher (Feb 8, 2011 07:18AM)
A phobia is an anchor. Its created the same way. IE emotional state plus external anchor ( sight, touch smell, sound or combination) Anchors trigger emotional states. Emotional states drive inner thoughts -- visuals sounds..

If you take agrophobia for example. It might start after a real frightening experience in a certain location. ( but nothing to do with the location)The location becomes the trigger for the fear ( anchor). Then the person experiences the same fear at a similar but different location. Now that becomes a trigger and on and on until their world shrinks. Everytime the fear is fired it adds another layer to the "gestalt" which is why most fears or phobias usually get worse over time.

A key reinduction is "sort" of an anchor but not really since it is created and removed purely by suggestion or the passing of time. But it is a trigger associated with a state or is it a condition? that's the weird thing about hypnosis it appears to be both.
Message: Posted by: JonChase (Feb 8, 2011 10:41AM)
I believe that an 'anchor' should be a post hypnotic suggestion which when correctly imbedded will not 'wear off'. However NO hypnosis is any more permanent than any other form of getting habitual ways of thinking. I've even seen phobias and allergies 'wear off'.

As far as reinduction is concerned the trick I find useful is to put the thing in, wakethem, fire the post hypnotic, wake them, fire the post hypnotic, wake them, fire the post hypnotic.

Give them some practice, they didn't learn to ride a bike in one go after all.

If you give someone a suggestion and they don''t follow it it's because of one of these things.

1, they were not hypnotised.
2, They didn't understand your suggestion, and you didn't check.
3, They have nothing to base the suggestion on. [ Don't suggest to an Indian who has never left the rainforest or seen a tv that they are riding a bike, they won't know what to do. ]
4 You didn't Know if it would work or not and had the wrong intention.

All of those are the concern of the hypnotist.

I don't believe that you need to get their 'attention' all the time, if you are firing a good suggestion then the subconscious will have no choice but to respond regardless of what their attention [conscious] is doing.
Message: Posted by: Chris Meece (Mar 4, 2011 11:24AM)
What about re-induction without PHS? I had mistakenly omitted this in my previous inductions. Is this absolutely needed or does it simply stack the deck in your favor?

[quote]If you've been hypnotised once then its in your neurology. Your body knows how to do it.[/quote]

I agree with what MP is saying. My body sometimes decides to do it without my conscious mind being aware. I stuck my hand to the table the other day while sticking another person's hand.
Message: Posted by: Owen Mc Ginty (Mar 4, 2011 04:07PM)
Apologies for opening a can of semantic worms or worm semantics, call the can as you wish.
Iīm going to road test this baby over the weekend with a bit of luck (i.e. if the same lady is in the same bar, and is again prepared to volunteer).
If not then Iīll do my best to find someone else to give it a whirl with.

I think a re-induction without PHS is perfectly possible - my belief is that if they go into trance/hypnosis/call it what you will once - then they are suggestible and you SHOULD try other inductions with the subject.

Like MP says - if itīs in your neurology, you know how to do it. I have often used Jonīs analogy of riding a bike when talking about the ease with which some people go into trance. (and I know some people who at the age of 28 still canīt forking ride a bike :P)

I donīt think that itīs necessary by any means, but it will save time when you are going to hypnotize them again. Iīm sure the same lady would go immediately back into trance if I did an expectancy induction on her completely cold with no other preparation.
Chris, can I ask how you went about doing the hand stick?
i.e. induction type, then was the hand stick the first thing you tried?
thanks.
Message: Posted by: Chris Meece (Mar 4, 2011 05:22PM)
Owen,

My first hand stick was with someone who knew I was in the learning stages. The order I went in was this:

Magnetic Fingers>Magnetic Hands>Finger Lock on Card>Hands Holding a Heavy Imaginary Book>Hand Lock

I did some deepening suggestions after the magnetic hands.
Message: Posted by: bobser (Mar 5, 2011 06:39AM)
Had another wee think about this.
I absolutely KNOW that anchors CAN expire.
I also BELIEVE that the knowing of how to get into STATE does NOT expire in the mind of the subject, ever.
That's simply my personal experience.
So.... I can fire off an anchor a couple days later and it might not work. But when I'm with someone that I've hypnotised before I absolutely believe that HYPNOSIS is there in the room, with us, waiting to potentially be initiated by me, the hypnotist. Rather like a 'hanging fascination'. Right there, in mid-air.
I don't however believe you CHOOSE the above to happen from a newbie's perspective. But rather, with experience, you can FIND IT to be that way.
It is like a form of morphosis, gained through the experience of doing.

Bob