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Topic: A Younger Generation
Message: Posted by: teedpop (Mar 11, 2011 09:31PM)
I just wanted to know everyone's opinion on the youngsters we have joining the force. Do you have any tips for us? Mabye somthing you wish you were told earlier on?

I hope this isn't TOO general...
I couldn't find a thread like this, so I am very intrigued to see the responses. Also, I wasn't sure if this is in the right place. So...

-Teed
Message: Posted by: Wes65 (Mar 11, 2011 11:11PM)
Here's a few things I wish I knew earlier and some I wish I knew better now:
Simple is usually better.
Trace the new back to its origin; you'll probably find it's not that new.
A sleight is the smaller part of an effect.
An effect is a smaller part of a performance.
Entertainment is the goal.
Subtleties work.
Unmotivated action creates doubt.
People love winners but they pull for underdogs, give them reason to pull for you. Strive for excellence but don't take yourself too seriously.
Take the spectator's mind to the place you both want it to go. Lead him to see what he should see; what he really wants to see. But remember, his mind is all that really needs to see it.
Message: Posted by: Mike Maturen (Mar 11, 2011 11:21PM)
Excellent advice, Wes! I wish I had heard those things 35+ years ago!
Message: Posted by: gamechy41 (Mar 12, 2011 01:53AM)
[quote]
On 2011-03-12 00:21, worldofwondermagic wrote:
Excellent advice, Wes! I wish I had heard those things 35+ years ago!
[/quote]
It's never too late unless you quit.
Message: Posted by: jimhlou (Mar 12, 2011 07:50PM)
Join your local magic club. I learned more in one year with the club than I did for the past 10 years on my own.

Jim
Message: Posted by: teedpop (Mar 12, 2011 08:53PM)
[quote]
On 2011-03-12 20:50, jimhlou wrote:
Join your local magic club. I learned more in one year with the club than I did for the past 10 years on my own.

Jim
[/quote]
Hmm...
My friend said that he did not learn anything at the club and I probably wouldn't benefit from it.
Maybe it's because he was there for so long. (He was also president of the local)
Any insight?

-Teed
Message: Posted by: gaddy (Mar 13, 2011 04:28AM)
Brush your teeth twice a day.
Message: Posted by: Bob Sanders (Mar 13, 2011 06:07AM)
Clubs and magicians are not all a like. If you have nothing to contribute, don't expect much. Never for get that enthusiasm is a major asset.

Bob Sanders
Magic By Sander
Message: Posted by: P.Synenberg (Mar 13, 2011 09:16AM)
Wes did a great job of summing it all up. Gaddy is no chum either, nobody wants you doing magic for them with funky breath! When I was young, I spent a lot of time and money buying gaffs. Sure, they were useful and visual, but as I began to get older I had found myself wishing I had learned more slights. Practice is also very important, and just as Wes said, remember you didn't invent the wheel. Even though you may be the one of the few that do magic at your school, or maybe the only one as I was. You'll encounter many hecklers and lots and lots of attention. Don't insult people, It will get you nowhere. It might even get you enemies, just be nice to everyone and keep it jovial!
Message: Posted by: Yellowcustard (Mar 13, 2011 09:38PM)
All I am going to say is,
- Donít dress like a cross between Chris Angle and David Blaine.
- Every effect by Sanky is the best ever effect, a real worker. But not necessary for you.
- If your at school or college try and get involved in a form of dance and drama acting.

The reason it works for Angle and Blaine is because it works for them. They are both good magicians. Sanky produce great stuff but you donít want to many gaffed things. And Varity is the spice of life. Doing a trick is a very small part of being a magician. Being a entertainer is a large part of being a magician.

Thatís all I have to say at the moment as its time for this 36 year old afternoon nap. So donít go clunking those linking rings to loud you hear me.
Message: Posted by: gaddy (Mar 13, 2011 10:54PM)
Chris Angle...

:goof:
Message: Posted by: Andrew Morse (Mar 13, 2011 11:03PM)
There are a few good nuggets here.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tUwY-hb8I_I
Message: Posted by: Yellowcustard (Mar 13, 2011 11:13PM)
[quote]
On 2011-03-13 23:54, gaddy wrote:
Chris Angle...

:goof:
[/quote]

Yeah his magic is Angel proof. I love Dyslexia don you.
Message: Posted by: rsylvester (Mar 13, 2011 11:33PM)
I second @Yellowcustard's advice for taking some drama or dance classes. It will improve your performance and gracefulness.

As @gamechy41 said, keep at it. Don't give it up. Once you get hooked on magic, you'll keep coming back. You'll be much better if you don't drop in and out.

Magic clubs, and even forums such as these, are important. Magicians need support from other magicians. And you can learn better from being around and watching than from all the books in the world. If nothing else, see if there are any conventions anywhere near you that you can attend.

And remember some people will love magic and some will just be frustrated. They are jealous. Don't pay them any attention. Focus on the people who enjoy it.

If you like the effect, you will do it well and others will, too. Don't get caught up in the coolest, latest thing. And don't get caught up, as some do, with trying to do magic for other magicians. It's the lay people who you will entertain, and they haven't seen many of the tricks that are considered "standard," or you will put a new spin on them that make them seem new. Look around you and see how many people are killing with the cups and balls -- one of the oldest effects anywhere. Still pretty sweet.

And have fun.
Message: Posted by: Wes65 (Mar 14, 2011 04:29AM)
[quote]
On 2011-03-14 00:33, rsylvester wrote:
And remember some people will love magic and some will just be frustrated. They are jealous. Don't pay them any attention. Focus on the people who enjoy it.
[/quote]

People not liking what we do seems to bother magicians more than other entertainers.
Message: Posted by: 55Hudson (Mar 14, 2011 05:57AM)
Teed -

SAM and IBM have thousands of members. There must be some reason these people get together on a monthly basis. Your local club may be okay or great, but you won't know if you don't check it out a few times. Some meetings will be better than others. The cost to attend a few meetings is typically free - usually you can go to a few meetings without joining, and even joining is inexpensive - relative to buying the latest DVD or gaff.

You will find experienced magicians there that are happy to help you on your journey and, if you are lucky, a great magic teacher.

Good luck,

Hudson
Message: Posted by: Ed_Millis (Mar 14, 2011 09:23AM)
Magic is an ~entertainment~ art, not a puzzle art!
Entertainment means taking people on a ride they enjoy.
"I fooled you!" creates antagonism and diminishes the entertainment value.
Wrap your foolers in an entertaining package and you can't lose!
Concentrate on making people feel small and fooled, and you won't win.

Ed
Message: Posted by: silksock (Mar 14, 2011 10:25AM)
Great thread enjoying reading all of the posts. Really got me thinking about the way I perform my magic.
Message: Posted by: HerbLarry (Mar 14, 2011 10:56AM)
Can you tell a joke?
Remember the story?
Get the punch line in the right spot?
Keep a steady rhythm?
Hold people's attention?
If so you will probably make a good Magician, not comedy Magician necessarily, just Magician in general. If not you might wanna work on it till you can tell a joke first.
Message: Posted by: Tom Fenton (Mar 14, 2011 01:07PM)
Buy decent props right off, it saves replacing them when you "progress".
Message: Posted by: Yellowcustard (Mar 14, 2011 02:35PM)
This is just a sugestion from me in getting started I see there a few new users in this topic so I thougth ill redo it.In a topic about about starting out before Christmas. I mentioned how I help someone start in magic. And from this I drew up this list.

1- Invisible deck /TT plus silk/ spotty dot paddles- 15pounds (This introduces the 3 trick routine idea)
2- Mark Wilsons book/ 2 pack Cards/ Sponge balls/ rope. 22pounds (A little of every thing a great foundation)
3- Cups and balls/ multiplying balls. 30pounds (Classics)
4- Darlys Fooler Dooler DVD. 75pounds (A little of every thing along with introduction of magican and there work)

This all in all cost 142pounds . I fill that this set has a variety of tricks and also introduce impromptu stuff as well.
(All cost are in English pounds. But all the stuff is avibale world wide and afforable)

Hope this is some help to someone.
Message: Posted by: DomKabala (Mar 14, 2011 03:22PM)
Become a bookphile and read the classics, practice, and read some more. Find your niche (close-up, stage, parlor, street, etc.) and remember no one will ever be as good at being YOU as you are... so be natural... be yourself.

Cardamagically,
Dom :) ;)
Message: Posted by: satellite23 (Mar 14, 2011 04:48PM)
Remember, with a new generation of humans comes a new generation of magic. Being a youngster myself, I know that better than any one else. Here are a few things I say all the time, and you other members can tell me if you've heard me post these:
1) Magic styles change with each new age. Top hats and wands are a thing of the past. Trust me, Dai Vernon is one of the greatest magicians/entertainers of all time, but if you walked onto the stage twirling a wand/hat, the audience would automatically think you're crazy. Maybe you wanna seem that way, suit yourself. But think about it, add some more technology to your act, and do your best.
2) I know I may get ridiculed for this, but scour YouTube. Watche very little bit of magic you can find, including REVEALING VIDEOS! Make a few magican YouTube friends and you'll be set.
3)Get out there and perform. Get over your anxiety and do it. Doing is a lot better than trying or dreaming. Maybe walk around with a few friends one day and perform close-up/street magic for everyone you meet. You will get gret experience that way.

In terms of technology, I really remember this one site from Joshua Jay's Methods in Magic, I just don't remember what it is. Go to your local library and find that book.
Message: Posted by: Yellowcustard (Mar 14, 2011 08:02PM)
Satellite23 that is a interesting post. I do agree with it and see were your coming from. But there a few comments I like to make. Magic style dose change with age. And yes the tux cane twirler is a old image of magicians. But as we say if you do right it will work and a modern day audience wont think youíre crazy. Lance Burton has a very classic look and routine people love him. Simon Drake did old in a new way not a crazy way. Yes it a uneasy way and a bit weird I grant.

You tube is great to look at the old masters. See some real workers and share stuff with other magicians. As for REVEALING VIDEOS! I think it wrong to go out buy a trick someone markets then expose it. Also these tend to be badly filmed, badly excruciated and no performance of any effort. I hate the youtube exposure crazy I think it could affect magic begin released. Just to get the point across. Imagine you spend a year or two putting a effect together or a routine you have used for years. You do all the research to check it is yours and unique. You then get the production and retail set up. Along with all the marketing done. Then someone in their bedroom reveals it and loads of people use the effect but you donít get a bean for your hard work. And belive me even a good selling effect dosent always get the creator a stack of money.

Sorry this is not a rant. And your comments are good but I just wanted to highlight a few bits. And make sure my point is clear. Your third point on just getting out there and do stuff. I canít agree more.

Hope this helps and yes it is just my view on your view. Lets see what others think.
Message: Posted by: teedpop (Mar 14, 2011 08:45PM)
I agree that revealing magic is demeaning to the art, but it's POPULAR! :o Masked Magician anyone? This is why I encourage people to buy them anyway. But Performance videos are GREAT! I love watching good magic! :) Youtube is very contoversial.

-Teed :)
Message: Posted by: Mike Maturen (Mar 14, 2011 09:13PM)
Amen to that! I had taken some time off from performing. Last year I did a large stage show, and am doing another next week. I am really enjoying it, and have decided to also now learn close-up...something I never took the time to do over the last 35+ years.

Just got Harry Lorayne's Close-Up Card Magic today, and I sell the Original Tarbell Lessons in Magic (single volume), and will be buying it from myself soon.

Should be a great adventure!
[quote]
On 2011-03-12 02:53, gamechy41 wrote:
[quote]
On 2011-03-12 00:21, worldofwondermagic wrote:
Excellent advice, Wes! I wish I had heard those things 35+ years ago!
[/quote]
It's never too late unless you quit.
[/quote]
Message: Posted by: 55Hudson (Mar 14, 2011 11:02PM)
[quote]
On 2011-03-14 17:48, satellite23 wrote:
Remember, with a new generation of humans comes a new generation of magic. Being a youngster myself, I know that better than any one else. Here are a few things I say all the time, and you other members can tell me if you've heard me post these:
1) Magic styles change with each new age. Top hats and wands are a thing of the past. Trust me, Dai Vernon is one of the greatest magicians/entertainers of all time, but if you walked onto the stage twirling a wand/hat, the audience would automatically think you're crazy. Maybe you wanna seem that way, suit yourself. But think about it, add some more technology to your act, and do your best.

[/quote]


Styles may change, but the principles remain the same. Cups & Ball = Two in the Hand, one in the pocket = Coins Across.... These effects can be done with coins, balls, paper napkins, rocks, or any other co mon objects.

Understand the classics and you can apply the skills and principles in any situation. Sponge balls have been around for a long time and they still kill. Pick up a classic reference book, a couple DVDs, join the local magic club, and go to work learning the basics. You won't regret it.

Hudson
Message: Posted by: Ed_Millis (Mar 15, 2011 09:15AM)
Actually, much of the performing styles have NOT changed much. There have always been close-up, parlor, street/busking, and even bizarre performers. (Remember the old stories about ripping the head off a goose and restoring it?)

What has changed, though, is the ready access to "the secrets". And so anyone who watches a YouTube video now thinks he's a magician because he knows a couple of moves!!

Yes, that was me too. And what I wish I had been told early on was that the secret does not make a magician - it makes a trickster. Read all the posts from high school and college kids that complain about the classmates that only want to bust them. You immediately pick up that while this "magician" knows how to do a trick, he has no clue [b]how to perform[/b]! He has no idea how to create a story that draws in the audience. He has no idea how to present a mystery without challenging his audience or making them feel stupid. And he doesn't have the amturity to take a rough audience and flow with it and come out on top. Because all he knows is secrets - he doesn't know how to perform.

You can probably do technical things that I can't do. I know one guy that is very good, but does a routine with the personality of a block of wood. And others who perform with attitudes like:
-- "Guess that one! I dare you!!"
-- "Hah! Gotcha good, didn't I!!"
-- "Hey y'all - watch what I can do."

When you perform, you give something to the audience.
When you do tricks, it's all about you sucking life out of the audience.

Ed
Message: Posted by: Mark Jarvis (Mar 15, 2011 10:06AM)
Hi.....

Wow! Some great advice above.

Keep it simple.....Join a local IBM or SAM Ring. As said earlier, you will learn a lot by watching and being around other magicians.

Get 2 or 3 books (J B Bobo Modern Coin Magic, Mark Wilson's Complete Course in Magic, Volume 1 of Card College) and study them and learn from them. Pick out some moves, practice them and take them to your friends at the local IBM or SAM you join. Let them give you tips and advice on technique. Invaluable!

Check out some magic conventions near you over the next year and sit in all the lectures and see magic props and gimmicks first hand.

If there is a local magic shop nearby, visit it. Ask them if they can help you build a network of friends in magic. I am sure they belong to the local clubs. Purchase some inch and a half sponge balls and a thumb tip. Have the owner of the shop show you a few tricks with these items.

This will help you build a good foundation from which you will build upon for years of enjoyment.

But most of all.....Have Fun!
Message: Posted by: Mike Maturen (Mar 15, 2011 12:36PM)
I am also a bit of a traditionalist in my approach to magic. In my show next week, I will be wearing black pants and a billowy red "pirate" style shirt for my first set, black pants and a different shirt for my second, and a tux for the 3rd.

I still think there is a place for the Blackstone-style of magic. We don't see near enough of it in my opinion.
Message: Posted by: satellite23 (Mar 16, 2011 02:12PM)
Wow, I never thought my single post could be so popular!In terms of revealing on YouTube, here's some more just to fuel the fire:

I know that revealing on YT has helped me a lot, especially guys like the Card Trick Teahcer and so forth. For me, as a magician, if I look up a GIMMICK trick, I'm too lazy to make it myself so I'll probably either buy it or forget about it. With SLEIGHT tricks, I will practice a bit and see if I like it or not.

Generally, as you guys have said, the revealers are little kids that film from their bedroom. How often do you think lay people specifically watch little kids, in thier, bedrroms, with a terrible webcam, just to see how a trick is done? Very little percentage. If they do, however, they'll probably have forgotten it in a short while anyways! I know people who try to tell me how to do simple math tricks, and they cannot remember how to do them!
Message: Posted by: Yellowcustard (Mar 16, 2011 08:13PM)
There are problems with Magicans exposing in front of other magicans as well just lay persons. Yes we do show each other out little bits and special bobs when were in private. The ownwer of a shiny thing migth reval it at a convention if he or she fells fit. But showing other pepole bits of with out premison or there backing is wrong.



(I have made a predication of a comment ill back for the above post)
Message: Posted by: Cyberqat (Mar 19, 2011 06:35PM)
The latest, greatest effect will be forgotten tomorrow when the NEW latest greatest comes along.

If you want to be noticed then don't do a levi 'cause everyone does one. Do a great cups and balls cause NOONE is doing it right now. People crave *new* experiences and that's what you should strive to provide.

Anything sufficiently old is new. Look to the classics. There are reasons they never die.

**something I just learned recently** Don't buy into the idea that there is much of anything you *can't* do. If you are having trouble learning something, don't give up. Practice more and/or find another teacher. Not all people learn the same. I gave up on the double lift years ago as I just couldn't learn it from my otherwise favorite book. I recently picked up a DVD just on the Double Lift and I learned it in about 3 hours of work.

Imitate and expand. As others say, what works for David Blaine probably wont work for you, but if you LIKE his approach start there and then find what you cna do with it that DOES work for you. Develop your own style, but recognize that style comes with time and experimentation. It took Chris Angel something like a decade of hard work and constantly trying and failing to hone his shtick. Which gets me to the next point...

A decade is a magic number in the arts. If you are talented, dedicated, hustle and work *hard*, in 10 years (if you are lucky) people will start to notice you.

Study as MANY magicians performances as you can. There is something you can learn from EVERY performance, even if its just what NOT to do.

Expect to fail. You cannot learn if you don't fail.

Recognize that more then half the job of any self-employed person is looking for your next gig. And its the *hard* part of the job. being self-employed means always being on a job hunt/unemployed. Make sure that's really what you want to do with your life.

Stay the hell off of you tube. or at least, don't do anything on youtube that you havent done for real people first.
Message: Posted by: Bandon (Mar 19, 2011 06:46PM)
[quote]
On 2011-03-19 19:35, Cyberqat wrote:
recognize that style comes with time and experimentation.
[/quote]

I think this is really important, it's often given as a rule never to imitate others. However, you have to start somewhere, and the more you perform the more presentation and style shift away from what you're imitating and into what comes naturally for you, it will grow organically over time, and the most important thing for developing a character is to get out there really, in my humble opinion anyway
Message: Posted by: Cyberqat (Mar 19, 2011 09:41PM)
[quote]
On 2011-03-16 15:12, satellite23 wrote:
Wow, I never thought my single post could be so popular!In terms of revealing on YouTube, here's some more just to fuel the fire:

I know that revealing on YT has helped me a lot, especially guys like the Card Trick Teahcer and so forth. For me, as a magician, if I look up a GIMMICK trick, I'm too lazy to make it myself so I'll probably either buy it or forget about it. With SLEIGHT tricks, I will practice a bit and see if I like it or not.

[/quote]

This is really another topic but I think there are two reasons many here dislike the youtube revealer phenomenon:

(1) As you said, many are incompetent kids who can't even bother to learn to do the illusion well. Its a cheap way to try to get some attention and it cheapens the art.

(2) Even when its a good performance and worth while teaching... its just too easy to find. How much value to you *really* is an illusion you can find in a minute or two of you tube searching when ANYONE you show it to is likely to run to the web and do the same thing?

The reason why there is a sub-culture of magicians and magic shops is partly to keep those only interested in knowing the solutions from finding them.
Message: Posted by: MasterGracey (Mar 19, 2011 11:31PM)
[quote]
On 2011-03-19 19:35, Cyberqat wrote:
The latest, greatest effect will be forgotten tomorrow when the NEW latest greatest comes along.

If you want to be noticed then don't do a levi 'cause everyone does one. Do a great cups and balls cause NOONE is doing it right now. People crave *new* experiences and that's what you should strive to provide.

Anything sufficiently old is new. Look to the classics. There are reasons they never die.

[/quote]

I made my first visit to the Castle a few weeks ago, and of all the performances that stood out in my mind, I am still thinking about the triumph and the cups and balls I saw that night. It may be my personality, but I really appreciate seeing good, honest performances of the classics. There is something special about getting caught up in a suspension of disbelief watching an effect that has been fooling people for centuries.
Message: Posted by: sleightlysilas (Mar 20, 2011 05:40AM)
I work with youngsters on a regular basis, having a bunch of students and coaching fresh performers, tossing them into gigs and events I organize.

What I notice nowadays, perhaps with the dawn of flourishing and XCM, is that a lot of the focus is bein put into sleight of hand perfection. For the most part, sleight of hand is the back stage work, not really meant to be the defining piece of any play. If you watched a movie with the most insane Spielberg special effects on the face of the planet, but your story has no substance and the acting is no good, you got yourself a Hollywood flop.

By all means, polish up your moves, but the most important kind of sleight, is sleight of mouth.

Talk to people. Be around people. Learn to be comfortable in a crowd. Try to be the life of the party, because when the day comes, you might just be hired to be.
Learn how to make fast friends. When you're performing, logically speaking, people will like what you're doing more if they like whoevers doing it. If they hate you, and you fly, at the end of the day, they'll just be hating the flying dude.

Just my two cents
Message: Posted by: satellite23 (Mar 20, 2011 07:49AM)
[quote]
On 2011-03-19 19:35, Cyberqat wrote:
If you want to be noticed then don't do a levi 'cause everyone does one. Do a great cups and balls cause NOONE is doing it right now. People crave *new* experiences and that's what you should strive to provide.
[/quote]

Yes, do learn a cups and alls routine and screw the levitations; they're so tough to perform correctly anyways. Right now, my cups and balls routine is my pride and joy. Learn a good one, practice it a ton, it'll pay off.
Message: Posted by: rsylvester (Mar 20, 2011 12:36PM)
Just a note on the YT reveals. Aren't the instructions and the items sold for magic protected by copyrights and patents? And aren't these the same as performing someone else's song or posting a video from a TV show that's not in the public domain? If so, I would think the people who own the rights or the sellers complain to You Tube and get a lot of these removed. Of course, stuff like the cups and balls are public domain -- being 5,000 years old. But I'll bet with a concerted effort by the IBM, SAM or some other advocate, making this argument to YouTube, you could get a lot of this stuff nixed. YouTube and Google (the owner) are really pretty good about this stuff with musicians -- why not magicians? Just a thought.

It also might be worth manufacturers adding a note saying something like "this material is protected and may not be electronically performed without written permission," or something like that. Note: I am not a lawyer, but I cover the courthouse, and as my wife -- who is an attorney likes to say -- I have played on on TV. :)

BTW, @sleightlysilas, great movie analogy. Really nailed it.
Message: Posted by: satellite23 (Mar 20, 2011 07:24PM)
Hmmm....interesting. I never thought about copyrights.
Message: Posted by: Cyberqat (Mar 20, 2011 07:53PM)
Actually, people get confused about IP all the time, both what it is and what it isn't.

Copyrights do not cover ideas. They only cover the copying of artistic expression fixed in a tangible medium. So, they don't cover method exposure. About the only thing they *might* cover is the words of the routine if they were scripted, but by definition any trick that comes with a script comes with an implicit right to perform it, so that's out too.

Very few tricks are ever patented. Patent is expensive, requires that you publicly register it (and thus expose the method) and in as derivative an art as ours is highly likely to fail in court anyway due to "prior art."
Message: Posted by: rsylvester (Mar 20, 2011 10:27PM)
That's what I figured. Just thought it might make a good argument. Drats. But @Cyberqat is absolutely correct. It's like I learned you can't really copyright a recipe for cooking. Methods for magic probably comparable. Too bad.

Now back to the topic:

[quote]
On 2011-03-15 13:36, worldofwondermagic wrote:
I am also a bit of a traditionalist in my approach to magic. In my show next week, I will be wearing black pants and a billowy red "pirate" style shirt for my first set, black pants and a different shirt for my second, and a tux for the 3rd.

I still think there is a place for the Blackstone-style of magic. We don't see near enough of it in my opinion.
[/quote]

Since this is titled "younger generation," this reminded me of a show I did a couple of weeks ago. I had picked up a used tux at a local Goodwill for $6. That's right. My daughter took a picture of me and that's it in the avatar.

My wife, who besides being an attorney did her undergraduate in drama, convinced me that people expect magicians to look a certain way, and that I should dress the part. "It's like you're going from being, Ron, who everyone knows, to a different character: the magic guy."

What this has to do with the younger generation is that the teens in the audience were most excited about the magic. One young lady learned what I was doing and said, "are you going to wear and cape and the whole bit?"

I didn't have a cape, but they loved the outfit. To them, I looked like their conception of a magician. And these are bright kids, who I have known for years and watched them grow up. Even in the days of Chriss Angel and magicians who try to look like hipsters, even the youngsters still think of magicians in traditional dress. (This is not to be seen as a slam to Chriss Angel: I think he's great and understand he invited all the teens competing in the World Magic Seminar in Vegas recently to his house)

I just thought this was interesting and fit in with the thread. Now they may only expect and old guy like me to dress like this. But it was still interesting.

And you always hear that in a tux, well, that's really the best a man is going to look.

No matter what his age.
Message: Posted by: Cyberqat (Mar 20, 2011 10:44PM)
I've had the pleasure of performing in tux once.. and it was *wonderful*. A Tux makes you *feel* like a magiciain!

Plus theres lots of black and places to hide things ;)

I actually have on my "toy" list to buy a tux just for performing. They aren't all that expensive, you can get one at men's Wearhouse for $200 or so.

P.S. Your wife is absolutely right. People's expectations and perceptions conform to the uniform you wear. You can tell her my wife did a whole unit on this in undergraduate psych.

P.P.S. Congrats on scoring a decent fitting tux for $6.00 Treasure it!
Message: Posted by: satellite23 (Mar 21, 2011 06:08PM)
Okay, we're getting off topic. Here's something else I thought of today that I subconciously do:

Cherish all of the good comments you recieve, but don't let them get to your head. Hate all of the bad comments you recieve, but use them as the basis of your desire to become better.
Message: Posted by: rsylvester (Mar 21, 2011 07:44PM)
Actually, the jacket didn't have the sleeves hemmed, but my wife helped me fix it with permanent fabric tape. I then went and got a vest/bow tie combination at Burlington Coat Factory for $15 - more than the tux. So actually, the entire outfit was a whopping $20. And you know what? When you spend $6, you can experiment with adding pockets, loads and holders and not worry that you're going to screw up an expensive suit.

Really, wait another couple of months. Go to a DAV or Goodwill in the most upscale neighborhood of your town. There will be parents who will buy -- not rent but buy -- their kids a tux for prom then donate it the next day. Because seniors come in all sizes, you might find something. Men's suits have lots of extra fabric, I've learned and can be altered easily. You can get a good alternation done on a suit for $30 (at least in the Midwestern USA), and you're still ahead.

@Cyberqat, I'll pass that onto my wife. She'll enjoy that story.
Message: Posted by: Ed_Millis (Mar 23, 2011 09:41AM)
[quote]
On 2011-03-21 19:08, satellite23 wrote:
Okay, we're getting off topic.
[/quote]
Actually, we're not!!
[quote]
Do you have any tips for us? Mabye somthing you wish you were told earlier on?
[/quote]
If you read through the posts by teens in this forum, you'll find a lot complaining about how they're not taken seriously by their peers or family (the majority of the people they perform for). You also find that a large protion of their focus is on method and technique.

Yes, to execute a trick properly requires good method and technique. But to deliver a good magical presentation and experience requires an understanding of the audience's expectations and how to fulfill them. What do they want a magician to look like and sound like? For these people in this ssetting, how can you create an environment where magic is possible and reality can be twisted? I can do that in a cubicle at work; most "younger generation" people haven't thought through what they want to do and who they want to be, and bomb when they try it at school or home.

That's why the YT videos are usually just kiddies - it's all about them sucking attention from you.
Good magic is the opposite - it's about you giving them a wonderful experience.

Ed
Message: Posted by: Cyberqat (Mar 23, 2011 02:09PM)
Two thumbs up, Ed!
Message: Posted by: Yellowcustard (Mar 23, 2011 02:33PM)
Two thumbs and my TT up at yeah.
Message: Posted by: teedpop (Mar 23, 2011 03:17PM)
[quote]
On 2011-03-19 19:35, Cyberqat wrote:

If you want to be noticed then don't do a levi 'cause everyone does one. Do a great cups and balls cause NOONE is doing it right now. People crave *new* experiences and that's what you should strive to provide.
[/quote]
Actually, I have only seen two live levitations so far, while I have seen like 7 cups and balls...
Message: Posted by: Cyberqat (Mar 23, 2011 06:24PM)
That's cause most of the levis only work on youtube :P

Kidding... kind of...

But wow, if yo'uve seen lots of cups and balls routines you must hang around with a lot of magicians. I cant remember the l;ast time I saw a professional presentation of them.

But the key point was simply, don't try to do what you've just seen and "looked cool" cause everyone else has already seen it too. Do some thing you *haven't* seen done lately or at all.

Oh and find a good brick and mortar and then let the owner help you find those things.