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Topic: America, we are a FAT country.
Message: Posted by: kcg5 (Aug 8, 2011 09:56AM)
I am in Ohio, visiting family. Maybe its that Ive lived in California my whole life, but I am amazed on a hourly basis by the amount of overweight people/overweight kids/and incredible numbers of fast food places. For instance, in one strip mall near where I am there is: burger king, mcdonalds, wendys, taco bell/pizzahut, KFC/long john silvers (those last four we just two buildings), Bob Evans (where sausage is a desert), popeyes, and a couple others I cant remember. (in Ohio, the KFCs sell liver and gizzard.......)

I know I cant say much, I eat horribly also-but I am quite skinny, just lucky I guess. Is it wrong to make these observations?

One thing I wish America would catch on to is that YOU ARE MAKING YOUR KIDS FAT AS H#LL, AND THEY WILL NOT LIVE AS LONG BECAUSE OF IT-they will be picked on more than other kids, have poor self esteem, it truly never ends when it involves kids.
Message: Posted by: Harry Murphy (Aug 8, 2011 10:05AM)
Call me Pollyanna but I can see some positive element in most seemingly negative situations. The upside to the obesity issue is that future generations will not live as long and thus Social Security/Medicare will last longer! Of course I could be wrong.
Message: Posted by: critter (Aug 8, 2011 11:11AM)
Studies have shown that fat people who exercise (like me) live longer and stay active longer than skinny people who don't.
Message: Posted by: Magnus Eisengrim (Aug 8, 2011 11:35AM)
The web is full of contradictory information about who is how fat, so it's hard to be sure about these things. Here is a graph from an [url=http://www.oecd.org/document/45/0,3746,en_2649_37407_46064099_1_1_1_37407,00.html]OECD report[/url]; it should be pretty reliable. If you link to the report you can get more detailed information for each country.

[img]http://www.oecd.org/vgn/images/portal/cit_731/15/63/46078860Graph%202.PNG[/img]

For those who care, I would be in the overweight (BMI>25) but not in the obese (BMI>30) group.

John
Message: Posted by: tommy (Aug 8, 2011 11:37AM)
Let us eat and drink and be merry for tomorrow we die.
Message: Posted by: Magnus Eisengrim (Aug 8, 2011 11:38AM)
For your convenience, here is a [url=http://www.nhlbisupport.com/bmi/]BMI Calculator[/url].

Quoting the Isaiah, Tommy? This is an interesting development. ;)

John
Message: Posted by: Marlin1894 (Aug 8, 2011 11:41AM)
Why do you hate fat people so much?
Message: Posted by: critter (Aug 8, 2011 12:04PM)
Thanks to Doc Johnson, I will outlive you all!
[img]http://blogs.edweek.org/edweek/eduwonkette/upload/2009/01/the_skillful_publicist/Snake_Oil-88g4bd-d.jpg[/img]
Message: Posted by: landmark (Aug 8, 2011 01:02PM)
Allan Sherman, Hail to thee Fat Person:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eeoa0-U8-Yw
Message: Posted by: Dannydoyle (Aug 8, 2011 01:07PM)
I am so glad it isn't just me!
Message: Posted by: critter (Aug 8, 2011 01:13PM)
6' 2", 255 lbs. Obese.
[img]http://blog.nj.com/needell/2009/04/large_curry423.jpg[/img]

We can expect Aaron Curry to drop dead from diabetes complications or suffocate in his sleep any day now.
The BMI sucks.
Message: Posted by: Magnus Eisengrim (Aug 8, 2011 01:18PM)
[quote]
On 2011-08-08 14:13, critter wrote:
6' 2", 255 lbs. Obese.
[img]http://blog.nj.com/needell/2009/04/large_curry423.jpg[/img]

We can expect Aaron Curry to drop dead from diabetes complications or suffocate in his sleep any day now.
The BMI sucks.
[/quote]

It is imperfect. That's far from sucking.

John
Message: Posted by: LobowolfXXX (Aug 8, 2011 01:30PM)
The average life expectancy of an NFL player is in the 50s.
Message: Posted by: Dannydoyle (Aug 8, 2011 01:38PM)
The BMI is not a great indication of health. Sure it is a guideline, but definately an imperfect one.
Message: Posted by: kcg5 (Aug 8, 2011 02:03PM)
The BMI is not a great way to define obeseness. To defend myself, as I don't wish to offend-I was just surprised. I guess its a form of culture shock, I had not been back here in a long time. Its not that I have any dislike for people that are overweight, far from it. I just can see why this is happening to our country.

And the main reason is the children. They do not know what is being done to them, and how it will affect them later in life.


At the camp I used to work at, there was a boy who went there. He was a overweight for his age/size. When ever he did "well" at camp, or had a good day-his mom would take him to in n' out (a popular fast food place).
Message: Posted by: critter (Aug 8, 2011 02:31PM)
Ain't no thang dude, I get where you're coming from.

Don't care what the average is for all football players because that includes all of the football players who really are fat or who get fat and (more importantly) sedentary upon retirement, and Curry fits niether category. Yet. I was picking one athlete, not one category of athletes, so the response was to an arguement I wasn't making.
Not that I think fat and unhealthy are synonyms, 'cause I don't.

A bit of fun (and this isn't to provoke a discussion on the source of the story)
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,149807,00.html

I stand by my opinion that the BMI sucks. Maybe in conjuction with other things it doesn't, but too many rely on the BMI alone.
The BMI and the polygraph are, in my opinion, anachronisms that need to be replaced or eliminated altogether.
Message: Posted by: critter (Aug 8, 2011 03:05PM)
I actually like this article a lot better, it includes many of the things I hate about the BMI, plus a few others:
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=106268439
Message: Posted by: Weisszach (Aug 8, 2011 03:15PM)
BMI scale is a rubbish indicator, as I personally don't think I am fat being 6ft and 198lbs, which puts me slightly overweight by the BMI scale. In saying that though I love it when people say yeah BMI is rubbish when they are 5ft 8 and weigh 400lbs.

USA is a fat nation but so is the UK, New Zealand, Canada and many more countries. We are turning in a fat world not just fat countries.
Message: Posted by: balducci (Aug 8, 2011 03:47PM)
[quote]
On 2011-08-08 16:05, critter wrote:

I actually like this article a lot better, it includes many of the things I hate about the BMI, plus a few others:
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=106268439
[/quote]
As the article notes, the BMI is a measure that was designed as a quick and easy way to measure the degree of obesity of the general population. But not for individuals.

As this thread was originally talking about the general level of obesity it seems that the BMI _would_ be an appropriate measure to consider, i.e. as in the OECD statistics Magnus mentioned. Again, if we are talking about the level of obesity in the overall population in different nations.
Message: Posted by: critter (Aug 8, 2011 04:02PM)
[quote]

As this thread was originally talking about the general level of obesity it seems that the BMI _would_ be an appropriate measure to consider, i.e. as in the OECD statistics Magnus mentioned. Again, if we are talking about the level of obesity in the overall population in different nations.
[/quote]

I disagree. The thread was originally talking about FAT. And the BMI is a far less than ideal measure of fat for any sized population. All it measures is a height to weight ratio. That's it. It can not measure fat. It's impossible for the BMI to measure fat at all. Not in one person and not in a million people. It can only give a height to weight ratio which will tell you nothing about what that weight consists of.

It was my own addition to the discussion to say that neither weight nor fat should be the primary measure of health.
Message: Posted by: Dannydoyle (Aug 8, 2011 04:02PM)
It depends on a WHOLE HOST of things if you are healthy. BMI is hardly a factor.
Message: Posted by: Magnus Eisengrim (Aug 8, 2011 06:04PM)
Well critter and Danny, you know how much I hold your medical expertise in esteem. Perhaps you should contact the [url=http://www.cdc.gov/healthyweight/assessing/bmi/childrens_bmi/about_childrens_bmi.html]Centres for Disease Control and Prevention[/url] and the [url=http://www.ama-assn.org/ama1/pub/upload/mm/433/ped_obesity_recs.pdf]American Medical Association[/url] to let them know about the error of their ways.

Granted both links I give are specifically about children and adolescents, but one suspects they are giving this bad advice to adults too.

Look at what the CDC says about BMI:

[quote]Body Mass Index (BMI) is a number calculated from a child's weight and height. BMI is a reliable indicator of body fatness for most children and teens. BMI does not measure body fat directly, but research has shown that BMI correlates to direct measures of body fat, such as underwater weighing and dual energy x-ray absorptiometry (DXA).1 BMI can be considered an alternative for direct measures of body fat. Additionally, BMI is an inexpensive and easy-to-perform method of screening for weight categories that may lead to health problems.[/quote]

Terrible!
Message: Posted by: critter (Aug 8, 2011 06:10PM)
Thanks, the condescending tone really makes me want to listen to every word after it.
How long did you work in the medical field and what did you do?

Enjoy:
http://www.shortnews.com/start.cfm?id=48972

"Advisory Panel Cautions Against Exclusive BMI
A respected medical advisory panel in the US has cautioned doctors against exclusively using the body-mass index as a way of determining whether children are overweight. BMI cannot determine if the weight is fat or lean muscle."

Well I'll be ***ed if that ain't exactly what I ****ing said.
Message: Posted by: critter (Aug 8, 2011 06:16PM)
http://www.asbp.org/siterun_data/news/doc4767498521303397275.html
Message: Posted by: Magnus Eisengrim (Aug 8, 2011 06:56PM)
[quote]
On 2011-08-08 19:10, critter wrote:
Thanks, the condescending tone really makes me want to listen to every word after it.

[/quote]

Sorry I was playing for comedy.
Message: Posted by: critter (Aug 8, 2011 06:57PM)
Another interesting point of view:
Harris, C.V., Bradlyn, A.S., Coffman, J., Gunel, E., Cottrell, L.
BMI-based body size guides for women and men: development and validation of a novel pictorial method to assess weight-related concepts. International Journal of Obesity; Feb2008, Vol. 32 Issue 2, p336-342
DOI:10.1038/sj.ijo.0803704.

It's not about the health aspects, but it's interesting nun the less.

Although, I probably misunderstood it because I'm so stupid that I don't know anything about biology or medicine despite an A average in Anatomy & Physiology and having worked in the field.
Message: Posted by: Magnus Eisengrim (Aug 8, 2011 07:00PM)
[quote]
On 2011-08-08 19:10, critter wrote:
Thanks, the condescending tone really makes me want to listen to every word after it.
How long did you work in the medical field and what did you do?

Enjoy:
http://www.shortnews.com/start.cfm?id=48972

"Advisory Panel Cautions Against Exclusive BMI
A respected medical advisory panel in the US has cautioned doctors against exclusively using the body-mass index as a way of determining whether children are overweight. BMI cannot determine if the weight is fat or lean muscle."

Well I'll be ***ed if that ain't exactly what I ****ing said.
[/quote]

In all seriousness, it isn't what you said. You said "BMI sucks"--twice.

But behind all that we likely agree that BMI is actually pretty good, but it is not the gospel.

John, now in humourless mode.
Message: Posted by: critter (Aug 8, 2011 07:03PM)
[quote]
On 2011-08-08 19:56, Magnus Eisengrim wrote:
[quote]
On 2011-08-08 19:10, critter wrote:
Thanks, the condescending tone really makes me want to listen to every word after it.

[/quote]

Sorry I was playing for comedy.
[/quote]

Missed this post before my last one.

Accepted then.
I'm a little sensitive about being called stupid or anything similar. People in my personal life who don't know me well have always underestimated my intelligence because I'm a little socially awkward so it really ****es me off faster than almost anything. Sorry if I overreact, it's my hot button.
Message: Posted by: critter (Aug 8, 2011 07:09PM)
[quote]
On 2011-08-08 20:00, Magnus Eisengrim wrote:
[quote]
On 2011-08-08 19:10, critter wrote:
Thanks, the condescending tone really makes me want to listen to every word after it.
How long did you work in the medical field and what did you do?

Enjoy:
http://www.shortnews.com/start.cfm?id=48972

"Advisory Panel Cautions Against Exclusive BMI
A respected medical advisory panel in the US has cautioned doctors against exclusively using the body-mass index as a way of determining whether children are overweight. BMI cannot determine if the weight is fat or lean muscle."

Well I'll be ***ed if that ain't exactly what I ****ing said.
[/quote]

In all seriousness, it isn't what you said. You said "BMI sucks"--twice.

[/quote]

Well I also said:
[quote]
And the BMI is a far less than ideal measure of fat for any sized population. All it measures is a height to weight ratio. That's it. It can not measure fat. It's impossible for the BMI to measure fat at all. Not in one person and not in a million people. It can only give a height to weight ratio which will tell you nothing about what that weight consists of.
[/quote]

Which corresponds pretty well with:
[quote]
BMI cannot determine if the weight is fat or lean muscle.
[/quote]

So It seems to me like it is exactly what I said, though I used more words to say it.
Message: Posted by: Destiny (Aug 9, 2011 09:05AM)
I see so many grotesquely obese Americans on television.

It is gross and unhealthy and ugly and it is time you did something about it.

I, of course, am not grotesquely obese.

I am voluptuous, or perhaps rubenesque. Certainly I am not fat. Other people are fat.
Message: Posted by: S2000magician (Aug 9, 2011 09:14AM)
[quote]On 2011-08-09 10:05, Destiny wrote:
I see so many grotesquely obese Americans on television.

It is gross and unhealthy and ugly and it is time you did something about it.[/quote]
Perhaps you should simply stop watching television: problem solved.

[quote]On 2011-08-09 10:05, Destiny wrote:
I am voluptuous, or perhaps rubenesque.[/quote]
How about zaftig?
Message: Posted by: critter (Aug 9, 2011 09:46AM)
[quote]
On 2011-08-09 10:05, Destiny wrote:
I see so many grotesquely obese Americans on television.
[/quote]

I take it you get the "Roseanne" show? :)
Message: Posted by: Destiny (Aug 9, 2011 10:00AM)
[quote]
On 2011-08-09 10:14, S2000magician wrote:
How about zaftig?
[/quote]

I had to google that but, yes, I am zaftig. I am voluptuous, rubenesque, big boned and zaftig.

I am many thing, but thankfully, not fat, obese, or lard-a*sed.
Message: Posted by: Payne (Aug 9, 2011 11:14AM)
[quote]
On 2011-08-08 10:56, kcg5 wrote:

One thing I wish America would catch on to is that YOU ARE MAKING YOUR KIDS FAT AS H#LL, AND THEY WILL NOT LIVE AS LONG BECAUSE OF IT-they will be picked on more than other kids, have poor self esteem, it truly never ends when it involves kids.

[/quote]

And just where is the next generation of magicians to come from then? Without being picked on and\or having poor self esteem there is no reason to get involved in magic.
Message: Posted by: critter (Aug 9, 2011 11:18AM)
Well for the chicks. Obviously.
Message: Posted by: Decomposed (Aug 11, 2011 04:37AM)
[quote]
On 2011-08-08 11:05, Harry Murphy wrote:
Call me Pollyanna but I can see some positive element in most seemingly negative situations. The upside to the obesity issue is that future generations will not live as long and thus Social Security/Medicare will last longer! Of course I could be wrong.
[/quote]

Well said Harry!
Message: Posted by: EsnRedshirt (Aug 11, 2011 09:11AM)
[quote]
On 2011-08-09 10:46, critter wrote:
[quote]
On 2011-08-09 10:05, Destiny wrote:
I see so many grotesquely obese Americans on television.
[/quote]

I take it you get the "Roseanne" show? :)
[/quote]I'm suddenly reminded of one of those medical docu-drama shows they have on Discovery Health- "I Didn't Know I was Pregnant", which is basically about women who go into the hospital with some medical complaint, and come out with a new baby. Or go to the bathroom and have a kid pop out. You'd think there'd maybe be enough material for a one-hour show. Unfortunately, it was a whole series. And the actor selection for the reinactments is kind- when they interview the actual person, you suddenly realize why they didn't know they were pregnant (sometimes with twins.) It's not the camera that's adding 70 pounds...
Message: Posted by: NicholasD (Aug 11, 2011 02:32PM)
Reminds me of the old movies when the wife tells the husband she's pregnant and he's dumbfounded. He had no clue??
Message: Posted by: Marlin1894 (Aug 11, 2011 03:24PM)
Free BBQ at Famous Daves on Sun Aug,14 (up to $15.00) if your name is David, Dave, Davy or some varation thereof. 1/2 price if it's your middle name. Go get some free BBQ Dave, you fat ***.

http://www.famousdaves.com/
Message: Posted by: critter (Aug 11, 2011 04:09PM)
[quote]
On 2011-08-11 16:24, Marlin1894 wrote:
Free BBQ at Famous Daves on Sun Aug,14 (up to $15.00) if your name is David, Dave, Davy or some varation thereof. 1/2 price if it's your middle name. Go get some free BBQ Dave, you fat ***.

http://www.famousdaves.com/
[/quote]

Wow. My Grandpa, at least two of my uncles, and at least one cousin are all named Dave.
Message: Posted by: Magnus Eisengrim (Aug 11, 2011 04:19PM)
[quote]
On 2011-08-11 17:09, critter wrote:
[quote]
On 2011-08-11 16:24, Marlin1894 wrote:
Free BBQ at Famous Daves on Sun Aug,14 (up to $15.00) if your name is David, Dave, Davy or some varation thereof. 1/2 price if it's your middle name. Go get some free BBQ Dave, you fat ***.

http://www.famousdaves.com/
[/quote]

Wow. My Grandpa, at least two of my uncles, and at least one cousin are all named Dave.
[/quote]

[url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LhTqzZpz6RY]These are the Daves I know[/url].
Message: Posted by: diehards2080 (Aug 11, 2011 05:20PM)
I have nothing against heavy people. In the past 2 yrs I have gain about 70lbs due to being lazy. I see nothing wrong with a little bit of weight on a person.

But when I walk down the street and 1 out of 3 people I see; weighs as much as the other 2 combined there is a problem. I have a friend about 5'5 312lbs who you can hear breath across the room.

The lack of inactivity IMO is what really contributes to the problem
Message: Posted by: S2000magician (Aug 11, 2011 05:25PM)
[quote]On 2011-08-11 18:20, diehards2080 wrote:
The lack of inactivity IMO is what really contributes to the problem[/quote]
The [i]surfeit[/i] of inactivity, I'm sure you meant.
Message: Posted by: critter (Aug 11, 2011 06:13PM)
[quote]
On 2011-08-11 17:19, Magnus Eisengrim wrote:
[quote]
On 2011-08-11 17:09, critter wrote:
[quote]
On 2011-08-11 16:24, Marlin1894 wrote:
Free BBQ at Famous Daves on Sun Aug,14 (up to $15.00) if your name is David, Dave, Davy or some varation thereof. 1/2 price if it's your middle name. Go get some free BBQ Dave, you fat ***.

http://www.famousdaves.com/
[/quote]

Wow. My Grandpa, at least two of my uncles, and at least one cousin are all named Dave.
[/quote]

[url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LhTqzZpz6RY]These are the Daves I know[/url].
[/quote]

My Mom printed that poem about Mrs. McCabe and her 23 sons named Dave and gave it to My Grandpa for Father's Day (which was in invented in Spokane, by the way) one year.
Message: Posted by: Decomposed (Aug 11, 2011 08:08PM)
Went to Six Flags today, water park. Oh what a sight! Why do people squeeze marbled layers into a tiny bathing suit? I am glad Im back home, even though it will be 95 deg at 10 pm....
Message: Posted by: EsnRedshirt (Aug 12, 2011 10:03AM)
Decomposed- you need to think of the bright side. All the fat people in bathing suits make the thin ones in bathing suits look even more attractive.
Message: Posted by: critter (Aug 12, 2011 10:08AM)
I'm glad there's still a refuge for those who like to put others down. I was worried for those folks when it became unfashionable to bash the gays, but now they have us fatties to fill the void! Good for them.
Message: Posted by: Destiny (Aug 12, 2011 10:17AM)
I'm just big boned.
Message: Posted by: critter (Aug 12, 2011 10:18AM)
Hehe, you said "boned"
Message: Posted by: EsnRedshirt (Aug 12, 2011 10:32AM)
[quote]
On 2011-08-12 11:08, critter wrote:
I'm glad there's still a refuge for those who like to put others down. I was worried for those folks when it became unfashionable to bash the gays, but now they have us fatties to fill the void! Good for them.
[/quote]I'm not strictly bashing people who are overweight. I'm bashing the ones who have the lack of self-awareness to think they look good in a bikini...
Message: Posted by: Magnus Eisengrim (Aug 12, 2011 10:35AM)
[quote]
On 2011-08-12 11:32, EsnRedshirt wrote:
[quote]
On 2011-08-12 11:08, critter wrote:
I'm glad there's still a refuge for those who like to put others down. I was worried for those folks when it became unfashionable to bash the gays, but now they have us fatties to fill the void! Good for them.
[/quote]I'm not strictly bashing people who are overweight. I'm bashing the ones who have the lack of self-awareness to think they look good in a bikini...
[/quote]

They don't exist for your benefit.
Message: Posted by: RS1963 (Aug 12, 2011 10:50AM)
Not that I buy into this conspiracy theory,or any for that matter. There are some that say that America being fat is just another way for the government to weed out the less desirable section of the population due to the health problems that can come with being obese. In other words selective genocide. My brother how is a firefighter and paramedic holed to that school of thought about what is going on.
Message: Posted by: critter (Aug 12, 2011 10:52AM)
Can't nobody tell me this looks bad:
http://fullfigureplus.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/03/DI-S0825FLX-rep-2.jpg
Message: Posted by: EsnRedshirt (Aug 12, 2011 11:17AM)
Critter- that ain't fat. That's voluptuous.

I'm talking about the morbidly obese who walk around in hot pants and lycra.
Message: Posted by: S2000magician (Aug 12, 2011 11:19AM)
[quote]On 2011-08-12 12:17, EsnRedshirt wrote:
Critter- that ain't fat. That's voluptuous.[/quote]
Wait . . . you mean that that's [i]Destiny[/i] in that photo?
Message: Posted by: critter (Aug 12, 2011 11:21AM)
I get where you're coming from. It can be shocking at times. But if it makes them happy then who am I to judge? I'm not always the most fashionably concious dude myself.
If somebody wants to wear their Wal*Mart best then more power to 'em, says I.
Message: Posted by: EsnRedshirt (Aug 12, 2011 11:25AM)
[quote]
On 2011-08-12 12:21, critter wrote:
I get where you're coming from. It can be shocking at times. But if it makes them happy then who am I to judge? I'm not always the most fashionably concious dude myself.
If somebody wants to wear their Wal*Mart best then more power to 'em, says I.
[/quote]Like I said, it makes the thinner ones look even better :)