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Topic: Impromptu Three Coin Monte
Message: Posted by: Ryan_McSwain (Sep 28, 2012 02:15AM)
Has anyone else played around with the Three Coin Monte from chapter 15 of Bobo? It's a neat little impromptu effect without any special equipment.

The basic idea is that you have three identical coins lined up on a surface. You moisten a small piece of paper in your mouth and stick it to the underside of one of the coins. The rest plays out like a shell game. Another version is described where the coins rest on the tips of the fingers, base of the fingers, and palm.

All the papers on my desk have little pieces ripped off of them, and here's where I'm at:

1) Using cheap newsprint as recommended works well, but I've found that if you can supress your gag reflex, a corner torn from a dollar bill works even better. Aside from perhaps being more available, they stay where you want them a bit easier. They also behave the same after repeated moistenings (that's in the same set--I'm not carrying around soggy dollar tips in my coin case).

2) This seems to work better with soft coins.

3) I've played around with it enough to see potential for a nice little set with a florish at the end; perhaps having all the coins empty, and then flipping them over to reveal they all have paper bits on them.

4) I think an intimate familiarity with three card monte and the shell game (which I lack) would be important for making this something I would actually consider doing in front of anyone.

So anyone else have any ideas or experience with this?

(The most recent thread on this topic is from six years ago, so I thought we could start afresh. Neither of the other threads really got anywhere.)
Message: Posted by: ottphd (Sep 28, 2012 07:50AM)
Thanks Ryan,
This is a nice little routine. How we forget some of the simple things that play so well!
Jim
Message: Posted by: FatHatter (Sep 28, 2012 10:20AM)
Gonna go look this one up! Thanks Ryan.
Message: Posted by: Curtis Kam (Sep 28, 2012 08:32PM)
In spite of the fact that I've always been interested in this routine, this is the first I've heard of anyone actually using it. I never have, partly because it became clear that the coins all have to be identical on one side, and mine always seem to be in varying condition.

Have you got anyone to bet on it? Are you using quarters, halves or dollars?
Message: Posted by: Ryan_McSwain (Sep 28, 2012 10:34PM)
[quote]
On 2012-09-28 21:32, Curtis Kam wrote:
Have you got anyone to bet on it? Are you using quarters, halves or dollars?
[/quote]

I haven't tested it on people yet. I'm still pretty green, and I have plenty of tricks to build up that are more tried and true. I just became interested in this bit becuase of the variety it could add to an all-coin set without adding an extra prop.

I'm using very soft, slightly toned Liberties. I lucked out and they're identical from any distance, but I think you could easily pull this off with matching coins that aren't carbon copies. I tried the move with quarters and dollars, and it worked okay. The Morgan actually provided better cover, but of course you have to reach in a lot further.

I'd love a non-gimicky alternative to the spit paper if anyone has an idea. So far I've tried post-it notes, adhesive dots, colorforms, and a chalk mark. A little square of balloon worked okay, but still had to be moistened. Maybe tomorrow I can hit the store and find something.
Message: Posted by: bobandjim (Oct 3, 2012 11:43AM)
I've had a simlar idea using US state quarters. Get two matching states and one New York coin with the statue of liberty on it. Then you can play a game of "Follow the Lady". The George Washington sides of the coins are all identical. The date is even on the back side now.
Message: Posted by: Merc Man (Oct 6, 2012 07:50AM)
Not used the original method in Bobo, but Joe Riding had a nice version, using this routine as the basis.

Joe used a red spot sticker on the coin, and with a minimum of sleights, switched in additional coins so that at the finale, all 3 coins had stickers on - but 3 different colours.
Message: Posted by: Michael Rubinstein (Oct 6, 2012 08:15AM)
Merc Man, where can I find Joe's version? Was it published? Thanks!
Message: Posted by: funsway (Oct 6, 2012 08:55AM)
Years ago I used to do this with metal washers with a white sticker -- you can look though the hole onto the sheet of paper underneath and not tell which has the sticker, but the idea that you might seems to heighten the effect. I did some additional moves including switching in another washer so that none had a sticker and could turn over any to reveal the sticker with a one-hand switch, sorta like handling a pea and shell.

I'll have to rethink it possibly for Chinese coins. Might even write it up is there is interest.

Washers would not be thought impromptu while Chinese Coins might -- who knows, in a couple of years they may be common change ;-)
Message: Posted by: Merc Man (Oct 6, 2012 02:04PM)
[quote]
On 2012-10-06 09:15, Michael Rubinstein wrote:
Merc Man, where can I find Joe's version? Was it published? Thanks!
[/quote]

Yep, it was published Michael in two places:

- as a stand alone booklet called 3 Coin Monte (1992) and again, within a series of routines called '10 of the best' which was part of Joe's close-up magic course (1996).

Going to be honest here; I'm not in any way claiming Joe's routine, but the 3 different colour spot kicker was actually my addition to it. Joe's routine just ended with 3 red spots. That suggested, to my mind, that you'd just been switching extras into play. By finishing with blue, green and yellow spots, it kind of 'led them up the garden path' so to speak. Joe adopted this finale himself but never put the addition into print.
Message: Posted by: Ryan_McSwain (Oct 6, 2012 03:14PM)
Barry, thanks for the information. Any idea if those sources are still available and, if so, from where? I'm new to this and I don't know which Michael you're talking about.
Message: Posted by: Ryan_McSwain (Oct 6, 2012 03:20PM)
Funsway, that sounds like an awesome routine, especially the white sticker on a white background. That's brilliant. I'd probably have to see which switches you use, as I couldn't quite figure out how to introduce new coins into the process.
Message: Posted by: funsway (Oct 7, 2012 07:09AM)
If you establish a Pattern of Performance by always picking up a coin with one hand and tossing the coin to the other to be placed on the table a Utility Switch will serve. Bobo and other sources have numerous one-hand switches. I like to mix them up and never repeat during a routine. If seated you can also use L**ping of one coin while placing a new one.
Message: Posted by: Mr. Mystoffelees (Oct 7, 2012 08:29AM)
Great idea, funsway! Gotta get Bobo our and look this one up. Thanks to Ryan also...

Jim

p.s. I used to do an effect where you disappear a coin under a glass. The method involved having a piece of contact paper glued to the top of a glass, with the glass resting face down on a board covered with the same pattern paper... your washer idea kind of reminded me of that...
Message: Posted by: Ryan_McSwain (Oct 7, 2012 11:52AM)
[quote]
On 2012-10-07 08:09, funsway wrote:
If you establish a Pattern of Performance by always picking up a coin with one hand and tossing the coin to the other to be placed on the table a Utility Switch will serve. Bobo and other sources have numerous one-hand switches. I like to mix them up and never repeat during a routine. If seated you can also use L**ping of one coin while placing a new one.
[/quote]

Thanks for replying. That makes perfect sense. I was only thinking of monte-type moves, and I knew that there'd be too much heat for an easy switch. I had totally forgotten my fundamentals.

Maybe once I get my close-up table build I'll remember the value of L**ping.
Message: Posted by: Lawrence O (Oct 7, 2012 12:08PM)
I personally don't like the effect (to challenging to be really magical in my mind) but did anyone think of solving the problem by using poker chips which in this case would not offer the same problem of dissimilarity than coins?
Message: Posted by: funsway (Oct 8, 2012 02:49AM)
[quote]
On 2012-10-07 13:08, Lawrence O wrote:
I personally don't like the effect (to challenging to be really magical in my mind) but did anyone think of solving the problem by using poker chips which in this case would not offer the same problem of dissimilarity than coins?
[/quote]

These could certainly be "impromptu" in some settings -- with the "betting theme" already on the table. Many chips are also part metal and allow magnets to come into play.

Yet, I agree that if one is called upon to perform a magic effect impromptu there may be better use of "the moment" than this effect.
Message: Posted by: thatmatt (Oct 8, 2012 07:42AM)
I find the Three Coin Monte to be a little too difficult for me. I tried mastering it for several weeks, but I gave up. I tried it with paper, dollar bills, post-it notes... It just didn't seem to work. I never tried the version with the fingers, though. I wonder if that might work better to rest the coins on the fingers and palm...
Message: Posted by: Steven Conner (Apr 17, 2019 09:34PM)
Any more advancement on this after six years.

Best

Steve
Message: Posted by: Michael Rubinstein (Apr 17, 2019 10:33PM)
Nope.
Message: Posted by: mindmagic (Apr 18, 2019 04:11AM)
A simpler alternative is to use three coins for a "Hummer cups" routine, with a small piece of paper under one of the coins.

Barry
Message: Posted by: Zauberman (Apr 18, 2019 11:02AM)
Use 3" Jumbo coins. Now it's just like the disc monte.
Message: Posted by: funsway (Apr 19, 2019 06:23AM)
A possible advancement, though I was not thinking of this effect specifically during sleight development.
I have been perfecting a new handling of a coin to show both sides in a natural manner or as a handing off to the other hand as a natural take.
In the process a coin can be switched, the same side shown twice or another coin secretly passed on or back.

This method is now i;n the hands of several magician friends to provide feedback and refinement.

For this effect, instead of all coins being blank and the sticker only shown as desired, all three coins could have stickers
and only the desired one shown NOT to be blank on both sides. Coin with hole can work here as noted years ago.
Message: Posted by: Zauberman (Apr 19, 2019 07:26AM)
[quote]On Apr 19, 2019, funsway wrote:
A possible advancement, though I was not thinking of this effect specifically during sleight development.
I have been perfecting a new handling of a coin to show both sides in a natural manner or as a handing off to the other hand as a natural take.
In the process a coin can be switched, the same side shown twice or another coin secretly passed on or back.

This method is now i;n the hands of several magician friends to provide feedback and refinement.

For this effect, instead of all coins being blank and the sticker only shown as desired, all three coins could have stickers
and only the desired one shown NOT to be blank on both sides. Coin with hole can work here as noted years ago. [/quote]

I think something along similar strategic lines has been done, on a somewhat bigger scale.
I've watched the following vid probably 27X and I have come to the conclusion that what you are suggesting is being employed.
Don't want to talk about secrets here and the operator sometimes posts on this forum. But I'm guessing it would be even easier with smaller coins as you are suggesting.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=al9lo4Dq0uc

.
Message: Posted by: funsway (Apr 19, 2019 11:11AM)
Thanks for that. Same idea but different moves. I would say that here two of the disks have spots -
you can catch flash on video never seen in live action.. I will rethink my approach based on two rather than all three
with several different false display moves,

I am influence some by Russian Rings that use multiple ploys to conceal the actual nature of the objects.
Message: Posted by: 4ster (Aug 2, 2019 03:38PM)
How about using three magnetic quarters and discs of paper which are punched from a sheet of paper (so the discs are identical. The paper is made from two pieces of regular paper which sandwich iron filings...or maybe there is a paper to which a magnet is attracted(?)
Message: Posted by: Michael Rubinstein (May 10, 2020 10:52AM)
I confess, I lied in an earlier post. I have a routine that I kept under wraps until release of my new book, Rubinstein Coin Magic, shipping from the printer this week. If you want to see it, go on my YouTube channel Rubinstein Coin Magic and it is there, along with other routines from the book. If you want to get on a list for ordering information, shoot me an e mail at rubinsteindvm@aol.com