(Close Window)
Topic: HELP / ADVICE WANTED
Message: Posted by: kinesis (May 8, 2014 04:54PM)
Hi Guys, I don't often ask for help but I could do with some just now. I have a gig for an extremely large global company. They are looking for a very specific performance theme...

"...In your demonstration we hope you can focus on – a demonstration of thought processes, conscious overload, distraction and mental blind spots..."

Sadly I'm having a bit of a mental blind spot with this concept. They are looking for a 30 min performance repeated 4 times but that may change to 2 different thirty minute performances repeated twice.

Ideas and suggestions for appropriate routines would be most gratefully received.

Derek
Message: Posted by: IAIN (May 8, 2014 05:22PM)
Http://psych-your-mind.blogspot.co.uk/2011/08/friday-fun-psychological-blind-spots.html
positive/negative |l&d tests based on strong/weak reactions to certain words

http://conversational-hypnosis.com/articles/a39c.html
any hypnotic display/demo

http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/245710.php
reading difficult text from a book whilst a long sharp needle is threaded through their arm
Message: Posted by: IAIN (May 8, 2014 06:22PM)
Also, in loose terms, those four areas could apply to an artist's creative process, scientific hypothesis and similar...so its an entire narratve in a way...
Message: Posted by: robwar0100 (May 8, 2014 09:26PM)
Thought Process = Magic Square
Conscious Overload = Osterlind Card Calling
Distraction = Aldo Colombini PreDeck Ability
Mental Blind Spots = Prevaricator
Message: Posted by: Magical Dimensions (May 8, 2014 10:03PM)
What about 'Memory Mashup' by Knenton Knepper? In it he talks about 'Blowout'. People in a 'Blowout' stop thinking temporarily. They are just in the moment. This sounds like it might fit 'Conscious overload' and maybe blind spots.


Ray
Message: Posted by: C.J. (May 9, 2014 01:00AM)
Luke Jermay's [I]RGM[/I] and/or Patrick Redford's [I]Glemme[/I] are what I use for "Conscious overload" sort of demonstrations. Replace Redford's pseudo-hypnosis with a bombardment of facts, and show how the overload can force other information out so thoroughly that they'd swear it never happened.
Message: Posted by: C.J. (May 9, 2014 01:14AM)
In terms of mental blind spots and what you could do there, the phrase "Choose the Confetti" comes to mind! A lot of Joshua Quinn's work would be adaptable to this theme, too. I'll PM you with another concept I've used that could be applicable to "thought patterns".
Message: Posted by: mindpunisher (May 9, 2014 05:13AM)
I would craft a few simple messages about how these things affect performance and what the delegates can do to improve their performance. I honestly think that's what they are looking for. The effects will be secondary. Once you have these three or four messages and tips on how deal with them you will find effects. When you focus on helping the delegates rather than focusing on the effects.

I would start by googling each of these items to find good articles that offer wisdom and advice. I would then use this as the meat the structure of your talk. Effects would support this. Without the solid structure your gig will fall flat.

Personally I would deliver two effects at the most. And probably only one the rest of the time would be about dealing with those issues. I get the impression they think you are an expert in motivational training. You have to become better in these areas if you are going to pull it off.
Message: Posted by: Limitless (May 9, 2014 05:19AM)
[quote]On May 8, 2014, kinesis wrote:
"...In your demonstration we hope you can focus on – a demonstration of thought processes, conscious overload, distraction and mental blind spots..."
[/quote]

Personally I would approach it from the other way round. Rather than trying to find techniques to fit what they want - do what works best for you and then explain to them how it aligns with what they want. After all you are the expert - not them!

Thought processes - can be demonstrated after any technique to "reveal" what you actually did rather than what they thought you did.
Conscious overload - can be any explanation of the language, instructions that you use.
mental blind spots - the prestige - although perhaps when explaining how you incorporated the other two into your routine you actually set them up for a mental blind spot demonstration "let me show you exactly what I did"......... "by the way, how many of you noticed X?"

Good luck - not that you need it.
Message: Posted by: kinesis (May 9, 2014 06:11AM)
[quote]On May 9, 2014, mindpunisher wrote:
I would craft a few simple messages about how these things affect performance and what the delegates can do to improve their performance. I honestly think that's what they are looking for. The effects will be secondary. Once you have these three or four messages and tips on how deal with them you will find effects. When you focus on helping the delegates rather than focusing on the effects.

I would start by googling each of these items to find good articles that offer wisdom and advice. I would then use this as the meat the structure of your talk. Effects would support this. Without the solid structure your gig will fall flat.

Personally I would deliver two effects at the most. And probably only one the rest of the time would be about dealing with those issues. I get the impression they think you are an expert in motivational training. You have to become better in these areas if you are going to pull it off. [/quote]

They have a guest speaker that will be doing a talk on 'MindSafety' I'm there to provide entertaining examples of the above phenomenon.
Message: Posted by: mindpunisher (May 9, 2014 06:23AM)
Actually I could do all those above with no need for fake effects. there much better ways to demonstrate these things for real I wouldn't use Mentalism at all. I don't think they are looking for a mentalist either.

I think doing effects is bad advice.
Message: Posted by: kinesis (May 9, 2014 06:26AM)
From the introductory email....

"...We would like an act very similar to Derren Brown with mind reading/ manipulation as opposed to magic tricks. The purpose of the event is to demonstrate the way the mind works/ how conscious overload can leave people blind to everything else. Full details can be given. Preferably with some humour, again like Derren Brown..."
Message: Posted by: mindpunisher (May 9, 2014 06:40AM)
Ok give them a few mentalism effects. The last poster was right just explain it anyway you want.

Here is an idea you might be able to work in. Get them all to stand up look around the room. Tell them to remember everything they can see that's is the colour brown. Give them a few mins to do so. Tell them you are going to test them. Then get them all to close their eyes and tell you everything they can remember that green. They will struggle to give you a good list. When they open their eyes they will be amazed at how much green is in the room. You might have to choose different colours depending upon the room.

This is a genuine demonstration of blind spots and distraction and that when you focus on the crap you miss opportunities that are all around you everyday.You could use it as precursor to a bigger effect.

I would include at least one real demonstration with a strong message.

You can try it out practice it a few times with individuals to see if you feel comfortable with it. Its an old Tony Robbin's thing. He probably got it somewhere else.

But no matter what you decide to do you are the expert here I'm sure it go down well.
Message: Posted by: IAIN (May 9, 2014 06:45AM)
[quote]On May 9, 2014, mindpunisher wrote:
Get them all to stand up look around the room. Tell them to remember everything they can see that's is the colour brown. Give them a few mins to do so. Tell them you are going to test them. Then get them all to close their eyes and tell you everything they can remember that green. [/quote]

WARNING - do not perform this in a forest...
Message: Posted by: mindpunisher (May 9, 2014 06:51AM)
Change the colours to suit the environment T :-) Actually that one thing demonstrates all of the requirements in one go. It might be a good place to start then move on to bigger effects. The fact that ita a Macro effect/demonstration gets everyone involved gives them a real experience a strong message sets up the rest of the effects nicely.

So long as the environment is suitable and its so easy to do.
Message: Posted by: kinesis (May 9, 2014 06:58AM)
Thanks Mindpunisher, I like that, a lot. :-)
Message: Posted by: mindpunisher (May 9, 2014 07:01AM)
I would link it to everyday distractions like facebook forums email texts smart phones etc and the need to shut them off and focus on getting tasks and goals done etc.. These are all everday examples of overload and distraction! And mostly crap!


A few tips like that you can find if you google on productivity thrown in with patter will really impress a company and will bring more value to the effects.
Message: Posted by: mindpunisher (May 9, 2014 07:13AM)
Its got me thinking now. I would then go on to use effects that show that when you are distracted you make the wrong decision. For example a bank night where you distract them? Leading up to a real jaw dropper effect just for the sake of a good effect. Anything strong and big

Good luck whatever you decide to do.
Message: Posted by: Rolyan (May 9, 2014 09:03AM)
[quote]On May 9, 2014, kinesis wrote:
From the introductory email....

"...We would like an act very similar to Derren Brown with mind reading/ manipulation as opposed to magic tricks. The purpose of the event is to demonstrate the way the mind works/ how conscious overload can leave people blind to everything else. Full details can be given. Preferably with some humour, again like Derren Brown..." [/quote]
Are we in danger of over thinking this. They want a mentalist not a magician (in their minds). They know Derren Brown, and they believe what he tells them re how it's done.

Can't you just do your normal effects but use patter to explain that they are what the organisors want. I could explain any effect I do as being due to sensory overload etc.

I really don't think this is all that difficult; do your effects and explain them a la Derren Brown. I'm not being dismissive, I've been in this situation myself and the above worked for me.
Message: Posted by: kinesis (May 9, 2014 09:28AM)
Sorry Rolyan, I think you are over simplifying it.
Message: Posted by: tpratt38 (May 9, 2014 01:53PM)
For Mental Blind spots. I like Devin Knights Color= Stoop test effect Blindsight Outdone
Message: Posted by: Rolyan (May 9, 2014 03:00PM)
[quote]On May 9, 2014, kinesis wrote:
Sorry Rolyan, I think you are over simplifying it. [/quote]
I tried not to as it's worked (and works) for me. However, I may be missing something.

But to be honest......

"...We would like an act very similar to Derren Brown with mind reading/ manipulation as opposed to magic tricks. The purpose of the event is to demonstrate the way the mind works/ how conscious overload can leave people blind to everything else. Full details can be given. Preferably with some humour, again like Derren Brown..."

.......doesn't sound too difficult. But again, I accept that I may be missing something.
Message: Posted by: Heka Siosiri (May 9, 2014 06:41PM)
I don't know your audience but I would go with:
a Dead or Alive test, of course not dealing with death but choosing the two categories depending of what the company deals with (are they sellers?)
a Lie detector test (with a coin ploy a' la Turner) or, more for stage, like Derren did with the white/black ball in Something wicked... or Waters' Ode to Ekman, and fill whatever you chose with loads of explanations.
Some PWA principles probably is also what they are looking for, so as simple as PS or KK stuff, no need to complicate it.
Peter's "A gift from me to you" if you want to get them involved
If it's not too metaphysical a pulse stop routine to show the power of mind over the body.
If you can, some positive hypnotic inductions, or fake ones if yo think it suits the venue (Fraser)

Lots of possibilities
Message: Posted by: kinesis (May 10, 2014 01:51PM)
Thank you guys. I have been ispired by informative web links, routines, suggestions and so much more. I've been contacted by PM and have shared some great ideas. I am in awe of the generosity shown by so many. Thank you, so very much.
Message: Posted by: konjurer (May 12, 2014 12:57PM)
I think it might help to learn a bit more about the speaker and the actual material and concepts he is teaching. Sounds like it may be around the concept of multitasking. The human mind is can only process one concept at a time. When people get overloaded with too many tasks, the overhead associated with switching tasks becomes overwhelming. At this point the brain starts to lose track of tasks and the efficiency and productivity of the human brain starts to deteriorate.

Perhaps you could do a memory demonstration (ie, like Osterlind or from Corinda). Seems like you are multitasking and keeping of many bits of information. It seems impossible. In fact, you are processing each bit of information separately before moving on to the next piece of information.

Then for a fun exercise, look up the "multitasking test" and do that. This is not mentalism but it is an eye-opener.

Then explain that anyone can do extraordinary mental tasks if they focus on a single task at a time. Explain that people need slack in their schedule in order to adapt to changing business environment. Then finish with a Magic Square.
Message: Posted by: kinesis (May 12, 2014 03:31PM)
Konjurer, you are correct

From email "...In your demonstration we hope you can focus on – a demonstration of thought processes, conscious overload, distraction and mental blind spots.
Your demonstration will link to a presentation on ******** by the founder **** *****. I have requested a summary of his presentation for your information and will forward that in advance of the event..."

I like your ideas, thank you.

Derek
Message: Posted by: kinesis (May 14, 2014 04:14PM)
The plot thickens; one of the focal points of the day will be mental impairment due to drug or alcohol abuse. My client would like me to incorporate this theme into the act some how. So I'm going to get blind drunk the night before and forget to turn up for the gig. Seriously though, they keep altering the requirements and time is going on. This is a very bespoke show.
Message: Posted by: Heka Siosiri (May 14, 2014 05:32PM)
Well, if you're into hypnosis a couple of things could be done, make the subject drunk or make him forget something.
If you're not may I suggest to look into Jermay's work. Then you can alter the patter and stories behind how it suits you.
Anyway, awful client.
Message: Posted by: kinesis (May 15, 2014 06:51AM)
Thanks Heka, The client is paying a lot of money so.... :-)
Message: Posted by: Medifro (May 15, 2014 08:14AM)
These concepts have been a life long fascination and indeed a topic of a Tedx talk I did (24 mins speech with just one trick performed, unfortunately video isn't available ). I'm educated in these areas as they happen to be close to my professional life. I understand they need demonstrations, you run the risk of being viewed as a hack if there're people who are knowledgeable about the concepts who would wonder about how what you're doing is related to the topics. Ideally I'd start by getting educated about them though it will take time which I doubt you have. Fortunately Their exposure to these topics is pretty laymen since they didn't use any of the actual scientific terms.

Good points above. I'll point out addtional guidelines.

I'd make a point of knowing if they're requesting a speech or a performance. A speech would contain more information along with performance pieces to demonstrate the concepts ( demonstrations that preferably are legitimate ). A performance obviously is the other way around.

Another way to look at it is this: You can design the show with the aim of increasing their level of awareness about themselves ( my favorite in all of performance arts, and what our field is most capable of doing ). Are there other speakers talking about similar topics ( life coaches .. etc )? I'd be great to have a general idea about them so you'd tailor the show accordingly.

For tricks, the presentation and narrative is obviously up to you, though you can consider this:

Distractions: demos that shows off how our attention works or rather the lack of it.
Thought Process: Readings, predictions.
Mental Blindspots: Predictions. Also applies for distractions.
Alcohol or drug abuse: Dual reality based effects as hallucinations. Max Krause had an effect in his penguin lectures where 2 specs see apparently things differently using Out to Lunch.

You don't need to tackle each one as long as the atmosphere of the show fits the theme as a whole.

Incidentally I do think mentalists should educate themselves on different disciplines studying the Mind. Faking psychic powersspirit contact used to be the hype in the early days. Today its NLP and body language though New Age mentalism is making a return. Currently though we live in age where science and philosophy of mind are flourishing. Seeing fresh perspectives on themes of magic & mentalism will be very refreshing.

Hope this helps,
- Feras
Message: Posted by: mindpunisher (May 18, 2014 06:31PM)
[quote]On May 14, 2014, kinesis wrote:
The plot thickens; one of the focal points of the day will be mental impairment due to drug or alcohol abuse. My client would like me to incorporate this theme into the act some how. So I'm going to get blind drunk the night before and forget to turn up for the gig. Seriously though, they keep altering the requirements and time is going on. This is a very bespoke show. [/quote]

These are not good clients Derek. you need to put up boundaries. your an entertainer not a counselor. You can't do the above. you should call them speak to them find out the purpose of our spot etc etc....

They sound really confused. Its your job to guide them onto something that will work. Entertainment your not an alcohol or drug counselor. You need to make that clear.
Message: Posted by: kinesis (May 19, 2014 02:22AM)
Thanks MindPunisher, I have a telecom arranged with the team leader at 10.30am this morning. I actually have a nice 30 min prepared but we'll see what the outcome of the conversation is. Don't worry I had similar concerns as you have raised and will be discussing them.
Message: Posted by: kinesis (May 19, 2014 07:12AM)
I had a 35min telecom with the client. Had a very good briefing and it's all good. Thanks to many of you here on The Café I have an exciting 30 minute spot which covers cognitive blindness, mental impairment through alcohol abuse and overcoming subconscious FAPs (Fixed Action Patterns). Just got a wee bit of work on the scripting to do but I should be good.

Thanks to everyone who posted, PM'd and called me.

Derek
Message: Posted by: mindpunisher (May 19, 2014 04:38PM)
They sound like they know how to party.....are you just going to get ****ed with them? Till you can't stand or see?
Message: Posted by: kinesis (May 19, 2014 05:16PM)
[quote]On May 19, 2014, mindpunisher wrote:
They sound like they know how to party.....are you just going to get ****ed with them? Till you can't stand or see? [/quote]

LMAO - sounds like the better option
Message: Posted by: kinesis (May 20, 2014 12:06PM)
Now the boss is questioning my fee. WTF!!! :angry:
Message: Posted by: kinesis (May 23, 2014 02:36PM)
So they had my fee right from the start. We discussed the topics for the effects. Not easy. During a very long telecom we discussed the individual routines and how they met the topic criteria. We discussed lighting, stage set, audience layout. We agreed I'd write my show intro. I was to email the client the routine outline, intro and fee. Within 24hrs the project manager was challenging my fee for 2 x 30 minute spots. I explained that I understand that on paper it does appear a lot. However it's not just 2 x 30 minutes. There's a 5 hour round trip to Aberdeen and back. I will be at the event potentially from 12 noon til 4pm. This adds up to a 9 hour day. There has been a substantial number of hours taken to create what are essentially bespoke routines specific to this event. I still need many hours to script and rehearse the full routine in time for the event. Three days later and still no decision has been made. This is a global company within the oil industry worth around $180 000 Million. Now it's the weekend, still waiting - I'm just a tad pi$$ed off.
Message: Posted by: mindpunisher (May 23, 2014 02:42PM)
Its not worth it just dump them. They will never be happy and you will struggle to get paid.

Its not about an hourly rate. you are an Entertainer not one of their employees.

They are the clients from hell.

I would have dumped them by now.
Message: Posted by: C.J. (May 23, 2014 05:11PM)
Call me old-fashioned, but I wouldn't think the "dump and run" is going to be particularly good for your reputation if they are as big as you say. No news is good news, as they say. Maybe they will come through. If they don't, let them dump you, not the other way around. It's Dale Carnegie 101.
Message: Posted by: kinesis (May 23, 2014 06:18PM)
I'm holding tight. I have been assured they will get back to me as soon a possible. They sure won't find anyone else to take this one on.
Message: Posted by: Heka Siosiri (May 23, 2014 06:56PM)
[quote]On May 23, 2014, kinesis wrote:
I'm holding tight. I have been assured they will get back to me as soon a possible. They sure won't find anyone else to take this one on. [/quote]

Right. Stick with it, they'll call you. If needed reduce the fee max of 5% after a review of the package you're giving them. Which is what they want
Message: Posted by: mindpunisher (May 24, 2014 01:35AM)
[quote]On May 23, 2014, C.J. wrote:
Call me old-fashioned, but I wouldn't think the "dump and run" is going to be particularly good for your reputation if they are as big as you say. No news is good news, as they say. Maybe they will come through. If they don't, let them dump you, not the other way around. It's Dale Carnegie 101. [/quote]

Its not dump and run it called terms and conditions. Or in simple terms BOUNDARIES. If you don't have them you will get all walked over and treated as a doormat. Plus you will get a reputation for that so will attract more of it. And when they have a good budget they will go to someone who has set those boundaries up because you will be perceived as someone who works cheap and can be messed about. Someone to go to when you don't have a decent budget.

Just because a company is big doesn't mean they are good clients or good payers. Often the opposite is true.

Always have boundaries and a walk away point. As Kenisis said they won't get anyone else. Do you really want to be the guy that will take anything? that's not a good reputation to have.
Message: Posted by: C.J. (May 24, 2014 01:39AM)
Yes, but there's a difference in HOW you walk away. The earlier suggestions of dropping the client sounded very aggressive. We get the benefit of choosing our customers, but that doesn't mean we "stick it to them" if they are difficult or not aware of how hard our job is. We can decline an offer, or say, "I'm afraid we're unable to agree on terms", but that attitude is different to "They are the clients from hell. I would have dumped them by now".
Message: Posted by: mindpunisher (May 24, 2014 02:33AM)
Clients from hell is not an attitude its a category of client. You get good clients bad clients and clients from hell very bad clients who just drain you and are bad payers.

It doesn't matter how you dump them "I'm afraid we're unable to agree on terms" or better still give then your terms and conditions up front so they don't waste your time which is probably the best.

Its still dumping them no matter how you phrase it.

Clients from hell are a reality not an attitude.
Message: Posted by: mastermindreader (May 24, 2014 04:47AM)
I don't go over each routine I do with clients and let them tell me how to present anything. Nor do I dicker over fees. This sounds like a situation where you're going to end up on the short end of the stick no matter how things turn out.

Since your fee was apparently made clear right up front, the fact that they're now questioning it should tell you something about them.

I'd tell them to find someone else whose show they'd like to write for them.

I mean, do you tell them how to dig oil wells?
Message: Posted by: kinesis (May 24, 2014 09:32AM)
Thanks Bob.

The client wanted to present very specific safety rules in an entertaining way. The show is to be entertaining, educational and informative. During a telecom I was asked to describe each effect as it would appear to the audience. This allowed the client to see that each safety aspect had been covered appropriately. At no point did they attempt to tell me my job. They were more than happy with the outline I proposed.
Message: Posted by: mastermindreader (May 24, 2014 11:32AM)
That mitigates it a bit, I guess. But I was under the impression that you told them what your fee would be BEFORE doing the telecoms with them going over the effects. In other words, you already began working on the contract. And NOW they want to reduce the fee.

IMO that would be a breach of contract on their part because you've already partially performed your end of the deal by participating in the telecoms and preparing a customized show.

I'm just looking out for you, Derek. I don't like to see fellow performers getting screwed.
Message: Posted by: kinesis (May 24, 2014 04:36PM)
Yes, you are totally right, Bob. And thank you.
I've suspended all work on this until I know it's going ahead. It's a pain in the rear though as some of the script I need to learn has some very precise wording that has to be delivered word for word. Time is ticking away.
Message: Posted by: mindpunisher (May 24, 2014 05:49PM)
You are an Entertainer not a safety officer. If they want to present safety then they should do that before you go on to entertain. They aren't entertainers. Your show and what effects you perform is up to you. You can't win here.

Listen to Bob I would dump them.

They keep changing the goal posts. The minute someone questions my fee I always dump them. No exceptions. And I have done it a few times. I don't argue I just walk away. I don't want them as clients by that point neither should you!
Message: Posted by: kinesis (May 24, 2014 06:16PM)
The Keynote speaker IS on before me. I believe they also have some kind of drama/theatrical type presentation too. I hear what you're saying MP, it's the weekend, am gonna see what Monday/Tuesday brings (bank holiday Monday I think).
Message: Posted by: mastermindreader (May 24, 2014 08:21PM)
I wonder if they're directing the theater group and writing the speech for the Keynote speaker. If so, your biggest problem might be staying awake until it's time for you to go on. And then waking the audience up when you get out there. :eek:
Message: Posted by: saysold1 (May 24, 2014 09:37PM)
[quote]On May 23, 2014, kinesis wrote:
So they had my fee right from the start. We discussed the topics for the effects. Not easy. During a very long telecom we discussed the individual routines and how they met the topic criteria. We discussed lighting, stage set, audience layout. We agreed I'd write my show intro. I was to email the client the routine outline, intro and fee. Within 24hrs the project manager was challenging my fee for 2 x 30 minute spots. I explained that I understand that on paper it does appear a lot. However it's not just 2 x 30 minutes. There's a 5 hour round trip to Aberdeen and back. I will be at the event potentially from 12 noon til 4pm. This adds up to a 9 hour day. There has been a substantial number of hours taken to create what are essentially bespoke routines specific to this event. I still need many hours to script and rehearse the full routine in time for the event. Three days later and still no decision has been made. This is a global company within the oil industry worth around $180 000 Million. Now it's the weekend, still waiting - I'm just a tad pi$$ed off. [/quote]

I don't like the way this sounds.

Boundaries are important in sales - and in relationships. So far they keep asking you to do this or that.. add this or that - then to question the fee?

The only way to show your in control is to tell them that the deal is off and to locate another entertainer.

In sales one of the most powerful things you can do is cut a problematic client.

So far they have seen what they perhaps perceive as pliability on your part - hence the attempt to renege on the fee or see if there is softness. As others have said - bad omen.
Message: Posted by: saysold1 (May 24, 2014 09:44PM)
[quote]On May 24, 2014, mastermindreader wrote:
I wonder if they're directing the theater group and writing the speech for the Keynote speaker. If so, your biggest problem might be staying awake until it's time for you to go on. And then waking the audience up when you get out there. :eek: [/quote]

Bob brings up another good pint here too - maybe you should have a greater say in when you come on in terms of the order.

I made that mistake recently and allowed the organizers to schedule me at a stated 9:45PM time, after dinner, and after dessert... after the 300+ attendees had just competed in 12+ hours of a Karate competition!

They ended starting me at 10:45PM.

Needless to say, this was not a high energy audience.

It was my fault 100% - before the event I should have strongly recommended that they put me on before dinner, or immediately after. ON show night once we went past 10:30PM for start time, I should have then said that the show would run 30 min rather than an hour.

Live and learn. But as performers in many cases we know better than the client as to when we should be scheduled and what makes sense.
Message: Posted by: mastermindreader (May 24, 2014 10:22PM)
And, in most cases, they KNOW that we know better and would probably have listened if we explained things clearly right up front.

When a show is great, you'll get the credit for sure. But if it's less than optimal, it going to be seen as your failure, not theirs.
Message: Posted by: Scott Soloff (May 24, 2014 10:39PM)
You already have plenty of good advice here from working pros. With that said, I'm going to add my two cents, for what's worth.

1/ I never justify my fee. My fee is my fee; you can get it done well or get it done cheap but you can't have it both ways.

2/ I always get a deposit (non-refundable) and make it clear that I get the balance when I show up. Not After The Show! If they bother to ask why (some do, some don't), I politely tell them that I don't like to chase money.

3/ My dear departed father taught me that one of the most valuable lessons in business is knowing when to cut your losses. This situation, from what you have shared here sounds untenable to me.

Obviously, this is something that you have to decide for yourself.

Whatever you decide, I genuinely hope that it works out well and wish you the best.

Scott
Message: Posted by: kinesis (May 25, 2014 04:12AM)
I will decide on Tuesday what my course of action is going to be. Thank you all for the advice, I'll let you know.
Message: Posted by: Rolyan (May 26, 2014 01:40PM)
It will be interesting to hear the outcome.

For what it's worth, I've never justified my fee and I've never reduced it. I've only ever lost one show, to a booker who said "I can get a group (music) for that". So I told him to book the group.

If it was me I would simply state that they have my fee and I would need an answer by (enter date). Good luck and I hope you get the outcome you want.
Message: Posted by: MrThomas (May 27, 2014 04:23AM)
[quote]On May 15, 2014, Medifro wrote:
For tricks, the presentation and narrative is obviously up to you, though you can consider this:
[...]
Mental Blindspots: Predictions. Also applies for distractions.
Alcohol or drug abuse: Dual reality based effects as hallucinations.
[/quote]

Referring to mental blindspots and distortion of perception (hallucination), 'The 100th Monkey' might be an interesting idea/concept to use on this subject. You can find a link to a performance in another thread here in Penny. http://www.themagiccafe.com/forums/viewtopic.php?topic=553902&forum=15)
Message: Posted by: kinesis (May 27, 2014 09:25AM)
Well, I sent them an ultimatum. Make a decision today or I'm out. Despite the manager being 'Out of Office' the team leader has replied that we should go with the original plan. So far so good, but don't hold your breath...watch this space.
Message: Posted by: kinesis (May 29, 2014 05:25PM)
Just a wee update
It's all good and it's all go. It's all signed and sealed. I have a mad frantic weekend ahead scripting and rehearsing. I put this on hold while it was sorted out. Fortunately I have a completely free weekend, so the phone's off the hook, the door's getting locked and no TV or internet - FOCUS!!! Also a wee thanks to Dusty here on The Café who shared some excellent advice over the phone just the other day - thanks mate.

Happy days :bg:
Message: Posted by: saysold1 (May 29, 2014 05:33PM)
Good luck!

This should prove to be interesting. Keep us posted post show.
Message: Posted by: saysold1 (Jun 4, 2014 06:56PM)
So what happened?
Message: Posted by: kinesis (Jun 8, 2014 07:08AM)
So what happened...

The gig was a 2 1/2 Hour drive away. Arrived in plenty of time. Was immediately met by one of the organisers and other people presenting at the event. There were 4 different topics within the safety event. The delegates were split into two groups. So each topic was covered twice in a four station rotation (difficult to explain). So basically I had 2 x 30 min spots with a 30 min break inbetween. The day was exceptionally well organised. In my part I demonstrated;

cognitive blindness
The power of the subconsciuos
Subconsciuous Fixed Action Patterns (FAPs)
Mental Impairment due to alcohol and drugs - specifically Judgement, Agility (mental & physical) and Perception

The routine was very well received. I was at the venue for 4 hrs in total. At the end of the day delegates were asked to fill out feedback forms.

The day after the gig I got an email thanking me for my performance and that the feedcack was extremely positive and that they were delighted....blah blah blah!!!

I was paid 2 days after the gig.
Message: Posted by: mindpunisher (Jun 8, 2014 10:10AM)
Glad to hear it worked out Derek.
Message: Posted by: Scott Soloff (Jun 8, 2014 11:53AM)
Pleased it worked out. Thank you for bringing us up to date.

Best wishes,

Scott