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Topic: Ellusionist to give credit!!!
Message: Posted by: Brian Proctor (Jun 16, 2002 04:03PM)
I just found out through some email that Ellusionist is actually listening to people and they are going to start crediting magicians. Here is the actual excerpt from the Ellusionist Newsletter.
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---3---- Credits on Ellusionist Videos
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All future Ellusionist products, including the Street Package and
Ninja 1 will now come with a FULL listing of credits to the
magicians whose material is seen and taught in these videos. You may
also view this list right now by going to
http://www.ellusionist.com/credits.htm.

Ninja 2 is credited during teaching segments of the video
itself.

Note that this will happen when the current stock is depleted and future
duplication runs commence. Master tapes have been re-edited to
accomodate this.

Our apologies for the time it has taken to get this completed!
=============================================
Its about time! Now how about those prices? Geez.

Brian
Message: Posted by: Andy Leviss (Jun 16, 2002 10:58PM)
Crediting is one thing, but did he ever obtain the permission of those creators to use their material? If he doesn't have permission, then all the crediting in the world doesn't make his use of their material okay. It might make him an honest thief (in the eyes of ethics, if not the law), but a thief nonetheless.
Message: Posted by: Tony Chapparo (Jun 22, 2002 06:31PM)
[quote]
On 2002-06-16 23:58, Andy Leviss wrote:
Crediting is one thing, but did he ever obtain the permission of those creators to use their material? If he doesn't have permission, than all the crediting in the world doesn't make his use of their material okay. It might make him an honest thief (in the eyes of ethics, if not the law), but a thief nonetheless.
[/quote]

I agree, I would never buy anything from this site. :angry:
Message: Posted by: Andy Leviss (Jun 23, 2002 03:54AM)
Just to make it clear, I'm asking the question, not making the accusation. I would presume that, since he didn't originally credit, he also didn't ask for permission, but I don't know that for a fact and don't want anybody to interpret my post as suggesting that this is the case. I just posed the question.

If the answer is that he didn't have permission, than I'm right there with Tony (actually, I have no interest in the product, anyway, but that's beside the point).
Message: Posted by: TheAmbitiousCard (Aug 2, 2002 08:09PM)
What I don't like is that the promo clips lead you to believe things that are not true:

In one clip he's implying that he is doing The Pass but really he is not. The card is already on top so the move looks invisible because he didn't do it.

That is misleading.

If not, I want to learn the one-handed pass where you just flick your wrist and the card in the middle comes to the top.
Message: Posted by: Brian Proctor (Aug 4, 2002 01:31AM)
okay okay! I just thought I'd point out that it looked like they might be turning around their crooked ways. I guess it doesn't make up for the other stuff they do. I dont recommend their videos anyway.
Message: Posted by: mattneufeld (Aug 5, 2002 04:41PM)
Guys! Let's all do some research on the company, their videos, their practices, their presentation, their management, their reputation, their anything else, before we start assuming and guessing about this and that!

We're all magicians, so let's assume that Ellusionist is a good company dedicated to good magic and all of their people have nothing but the best interests in magic and magicians at their heart. That should be the starting point--on a positive, collective, communal level.
Message: Posted by: Kent Messmer (Aug 7, 2002 04:26PM)
Hey mattneufeld, I see by your profile that you are a journalist. What can you tell us about copyrights? Are they automatic or does one need to apply for them? Thanks.
Message: Posted by: Andy Leviss (Aug 7, 2002 11:01PM)
I'm not Matt, nor a lawyer, but as both a writer, performer, and theatrical designer with a vested interest in understanding copyright law, I figured I might as well answer.

First off, copyrights don't apply to magic tricks, only to the specific set of written instructions or a specific performance of them. Patents might apply in certain circumstances, but not always, and they're very expensive.

That aside:
A creation is automatically copywritten at the moment of creation. BUT...you have no legal ability to enforce it through an infringement suit unless you fill out the form and pay the fee to register it. So yes, and no.