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Topic: Triple T.U.C questions
Message: Posted by: Necroface (Jun 8, 2017 12:17PM)
Hi I was wondering if anyone here has purchased the Triple T.U.C could give me some reviews on what they thought about it? Thank you
Message: Posted by: Joshua Barrett (Jun 8, 2017 12:28PM)
It's just a TUC with a shim sh***. TUC are not expanded so you can add one to any. it's not something different
Message: Posted by: coinme (Jun 8, 2017 05:09PM)
Cool
Message: Posted by: funsway (Jun 8, 2017 05:26PM)
[quote]On Jun 8, 2017, Joshua Barrett wrote:
It's just a TUC with a shim sh***. TUC are not expanded so you can add one to any. it's not something different [/quote]


Not quite complete. The provided Shim Sh*** is balanced to the TUC so that it adheres loosely to one side and "locks' on the other.
thus, the Sh** can be Ditched on the TUC itself or Idled and a Chest Mag or other Place.

There are some interesting effects that can be done with this combination, but unless you use the TUC a lot it may not justify the expense.

If you have a TUC and are thinking of getting this, consider getting the C/S TUC version for many additional effects.

I have not seen many published effects for the Triple - so you must use your imagination.

The point is that just adding an Exp [ to a TUC will not get the same results.
Message: Posted by: Necroface (Jun 9, 2017 01:44AM)
Thank you very much that is very helpful, I do have a TUC but its not something I often, but I was interested in a C/S TUC so I think I will go with that, thank you!
Message: Posted by: funsway (Jun 9, 2017 08:46PM)
I have some unpublished C/S TUC effects - drop me a line when you are comfortable with it
Message: Posted by: hektormagic (Jun 15, 2017 05:55AM)
I have it. I really do not understand why the expanded shell is not more deep to cover the TUC (the same problem is with probably all expanded shells too)... Really why the "manufactures" do not fix this, is it so difficult?
And there is not included effects for this "new" TUC. The received link is the same as for other TUC and nothing more. Can I find somewhere?
Message: Posted by: inigmntoya (Jun 16, 2017 10:36AM)
[quote]On Jun 15, 2017, hektormagic wrote:
I have it. I really do not understand why the expanded shell is not more deep to cover the TUC (the same problem is with probably all expanded shells too)... Really why the "manufactures" do not fix this, is it so difficult?
And there is not included effects for this "new" TUC. The received link is the same as for other TUC and nothing more. Can I find somewhere? [/quote]

Expanded shells are made from actual coins that have been slightly flattened ("expanded") and then hollowed out.
To start with, at best the rim of an expanded shell can be no "taller" than the original coin. It will be slightly thinner, "less tall" from being expanded, and then of course some of the thickness of the shell needs to remain. Add that all up and you can't get full coverage with the basic process.

That said, Mark Mason / Bob Swadling's "Deep Dish" shell sold as "Shell Shocked" does provide full coverage. They must be doing something to process the rim.
Coverage is great, but (1) the milling doesn't look quite the same as original coins - especially older ones that will have worn milling, and (2) the extended rim is now *taller*, making the shell appear *thicker* than all the other coins. Also, due to the "full coverage" / "taller rim", some moves may need to be adjusted to get the shell to fully clear a coin. It's a perfectly good shell and some may prefer it, but it's not the be-all end-all.
Message: Posted by: tonsofquestions (Jun 16, 2017 11:11AM)
[quote]On Jun 16, 2017, inigmntoya wrote:
Expanded shells are made from actual coins that have been slightly flattened ("expanded") and then hollowed out.
To start with, at best the rim of an expanded shell can be no "taller" than the original coin. It will be slightly thinner, "less tall" from being expanded, and then of course some of the thickness of the shell needs to remain. Add that all up and you can't get full coverage with the basic process.[/quote]

As a small point of clarification, that's just *one* (usually the most common) way of making X-Shells. There are other ways that still use real coins (often more than one), that either don't involve as much stretching and/or more coverage. I suspect the deep dish shell uses some of these techniques.

That said, I definitely agree with your observations that more coverage makes the coin look thicker than the rest, and that moves can be affected.
Message: Posted by: hektormagic (Jun 17, 2017 11:01PM)
Oh, Inigmntoya, the shell on the photo looks great!, thank you! Can you make also photo of the backside when the coin is covered?
Message: Posted by: inigmntoya (Jun 18, 2017 12:26AM)
[quote]On Jun 18, 2017, hektormagic wrote:
Oh, Inigmntoya, the shell on the photo looks great!, thank you! Can you make also photo of the backside when the coin is covered? [/quote]

I no longer have the set, but you're in luck - I still have the pictures I took when I put it up for sale here a while back.
Probably another drawback of the deep-dish "full coverage"... the rim comes all the way up to the edge of the coin which seems to taper inwards, so there's a more visible gap.
Compare (pics to follow) to how the shell from Bob Kohler's "Vegas Coins" sits back. Caveats -- the coin has a beveled edge which helps, and it's dollar sized which generally helps make things less noticeable as the rim, while the same thickness, is a smaller percentage of the overall coin.
Message: Posted by: inigmntoya (Jun 18, 2017 12:27AM)
Coverage of the Vegas Coins shell....
Message: Posted by: inigmntoya (Jun 18, 2017 12:29AM)
Nested Vegas coin - mouth-up. I really like this set.
Message: Posted by: inigmntoya (Jun 18, 2017 12:41AM)
And just for completeness, and to bring things back to the TUC.... My WL TUC "mouth up". The rim comes right up to the edge, but because the insert is cut down, it has a bit less of a rim of its own.
Message: Posted by: hektormagic (Jun 18, 2017 03:37AM)
Thank you very much Inigmntoya!
Message: Posted by: funsway (Jun 18, 2017 05:39AM)
When Marcello (Mr. Tango) began experimenting with the addition of an extra EXP [ to compliment the TUC the focus was on a Slipper Shell (ShimSlip)
different from the original concept in that it would be shimmed to marry with the TUC under certain conditions.

In anticipation of this I composed several 'articles' for him exploring possible effects and supporting logic. Eventually he decided on a complete Exp [
in preference to the ShimSlip -- I am not sure of all of the reasons. I also explored several other effects using the 'concept' in draft form,
but lacking nay tools to work with never completed them.

When he announced the release of the 'Super" I was part of the beta test group and compiled ideas for its use -- many adapted from the original material.
I have never seen any compilation of materials from the various 'testers' and do not know of any planned publication.

Therefore, I will make available to interested parties such material as I have that might give ideas for use and application of this new tool -- with restrictions:

NewMiracleS-S (You will have to adapt the terms and sleights to a full shell rather than a ShimSlip)

SuperTUC (Written as an evaluation of the new approach, but does include a couple of possible effects)

Taking Sides (a mini-routine)

1) a request is made to Ken@eversway.com with info about yourself, current TUC related devices in your possession, and reason why you desire the material.
2) the usual commitment to feedback on the material (not comments on grammar or style) - but certainly any experience of using nay of these ideas in a performance.
3) acknowledgment that these are DRAFT copies and not field tested effects or applications.
4) recognition that these are not designed to sell anyone on acquiring a Super TUC - instead may talk many out of getting one in favor of just using the TUC more completely.
5) the material assumes the reader has read "TUC Appreciation" as to terminology and format. In short, if you are not expert in using the TUC my material may be of little use.
Message: Posted by: hektormagic (Jul 12, 2017 07:10AM)
Thanks Ken. You have an email
Message: Posted by: PhilJake (Jan 21, 2018 07:32PM)
If anyone is still looking for an explanation of how the Triple TUC works or looking for a routine, Meir Yedid has made his Triple TUC routines video available as a download at a very reasonable price on his mymagic site. It Includes a nice coins across routine.
Message: Posted by: donny (Jan 23, 2018 10:29AM)
What you all miss: Triple TUC is a hair smaller than the standard TUC. Therefor, it won't play with your other shells and the parts aren't interchangeable between TUC types, when type of coin is considered. The Triple TUC is a mistake for this reason. My solution: Get TUCs if that's what you want and just add a properly shimmed shell to it, and thus DIY!
This and a Wong 3-in-1 are best coin gaffs. Next is Double Deception, then the rest of Oxf, then just a shell.
Who would argue?
Message: Posted by: Signet (Jan 23, 2018 12:03PM)
Donny, is exactly what I have been trying to come up with. Do you happen to know where I can buy the wafer to put into my exp (? I found one company that sells them for $2.50 each, but minimum quantity of 200. I think a TUC coin like this would be superior to the triple TUC.
Message: Posted by: donny (Jan 23, 2018 12:44PM)
Forget the Triple. Just buy a shimmed expanded shell (read no magnet[or you will have a problem]. yes to steel shim) and use with your regular TUC. Buy a boatload of TUCs and your parts WILL be interchangeable. Funsway is right, I think, get a few sun/moon types to maximize the effect. Anyone understand? I hope this will save you all some money and improve your magic. I'm out $120 for the Triple TUC :(
Message: Posted by: Stephon Johnson (Jan 23, 2018 01:27PM)
I’m happy with the Triple TUC. My only issue is a simple, smooth reset after “locking” the shimmed shell onto the front face of TUC. Having to “hiding away” to dislodge the shell from the TUC itself for reset is a NO GO for me! I will experiment with a magnet in my pocket that will attract the shiim shell and “repel” the TUC to separate them. I only do stroll & table magic that has quick/easy or auto reset.
Steph
Message: Posted by: tonsofquestions (Jan 24, 2018 01:14AM)
[quote]On Jan 23, 2018, donny wrote:
What you all miss: Triple TUC is a hair smaller than the standard TUC. Therefor, it won't play with your other shells and the parts aren't interchangeable between TUC types, when type of coin is considered. The Triple TUC is a mistake for this reason. My solution: Get TUCs if that's what you want and just add a properly shimmed shell to it, and thus DIY!
This and a Wong 3-in-1 are best coin gaffs. Next is Double Deception, then the rest of Oxf, then just a shell.
Who would argue? [/quote]

Different TUCs are slightly different - over the several I've tried, some were interchangeable, and others weren't. I don't think that's particular to the Triple TUC. Both TUCs (not the third part) are also standard-sized half dollars - there would have been no reason to reduce it. But there is some variance in half dollar sizes, so perhaps that's what you're experiencing. It's also worth noting that "being a hair smaller" doesn't prevent use of shells - only being "a hair too large" would. Sure, the fit might not be perfect, but you typically won't get that unless you're buying a specific matched set of coins + shell.

All that said, it's possible to buy a shimmed shell separately, but you'll have to make sure the balance is right - it's why there's a difference between a hand-constructed triple threat and one that's been made so the connections aren't too strong or loose. Another option is to go for the shimmed slippery shell instead, which gives different kinds of possibilities. I know that was suggested long before the Triple TUC came out.

As far as favorite gaffs go, the ones you list are nice, but I'm not sure I'd agree with your claim. "Best is all relative", and subject to opinion. Maybe I'm a big fan of color changes, so I like C/S and Sun/Moon coins, instead. I'm no less wrong.
Message: Posted by: funsway (Jan 24, 2018 03:55AM)
Some history and mystery (for me)
When the TUC first came out and I got involved, there were many queries to Marcello about other options such as ShimSlip.
At the same time other combo coins were being manufactured and hyped.
Communication has never been great, mostly language. I have never been sure about the accuracy of information from around the world,
i.e. a lot of magicians might say "wouldn't it be kool if ..." when they are not buyers or earnest performers.

Marcello has a passion for wanting to make things simple at a price most can afford. Methinks he tries placate everyone, confusing "Internet excitement" excitement over market research.

At his request I began exploring applications for a Shimmed Slippery Shell (ShimSlip) as an "Add On" to a TUC. It would fit on any TUC and also be shiftable to other coins.
I created several new effect base don using the TUC as a "resting place" for the ShimSlip until needed. I found little additional value for the triple split function.
Perhaps I am biased by not grasping the value added for an audience in such effects that cannot be gained by simple sleights.

To any persons discussing effects/techniques in "T.U.C. Appreciation" I also recommended they become proficient in dozens of TUC effects before adding and extra gaff.

I do not know where the ShimSlip morphed into the full shell sold as a Triple Unit rather than an Add On. Never got a good answer beyond "customer requests."
I willing beta tested the new product and submitted several effect to Marcello - no real feedback

So, despite my personal misgivings as to value (not just money), I will accept that the design and functionality is based on requests and feedback from many users and wannabe's around the world.
It is not for everyone. I suggest that a buyer have a specific need for the feature rather than some hope it will open new worlds of possibilities.
For those who just want anew toy I suggest getting the C/S version so that additional possibilities do exist.

Getting one is not "a mistake" if based on realistic expectations of how you plan on using it - but probably a mistake if based on someone else's imagined like/hate.
It is a tool. Don't buy a new set of metric wrenches if you do not own a car. Don't buy a rice maker and complain if it doesn't bake a cake.

........

as an additional thought. In all of the feedback I have received from "T.U.C. Appreciation" with more than 60 effects and some special techniques,
no one has ever listed more than six(6) effects that they do regularly. So, what are people looking for in and extra shell?
What want or expectation from their audience drives this need for a new gimmick? What effect were they performing before that did not get the response they desired?

With better info I might create some new effects of this device, or publish some of what is already developed.
Message: Posted by: donny (Jan 24, 2018 12:03PM)
Two gets attention, Three is WOW! Coins vanish, then change to different coin! - my favorite TUC effect.
@tonsofquestions: My outer [ on the TRIPLE will not fit over a normal size coin. A standard [ will not fit over the outer Triple [. Thus, maybe my Triple set is just smaller (un-intentionally) than my other TUCs.
Thanks for info.
Message: Posted by: Stephon Johnson (Jan 24, 2018 12:20PM)
Donny, you are right. Triple TUC shell is “partially expanded” and the TUC is “slightly milled down”. I’m not sure WHY Mr Tango chose to do that; rather than a Regular TUC + Expanded Shell! This makes it unable to combine with other gaffs. When I first got it, I thought “I will replace his shell with my Expanded shell” then I found the TUC was smaller than a regular coin.
Steph
Message: Posted by: tonsofquestions (Jan 25, 2018 12:03AM)
In an amusing coincidence, I was seeing a friend from my local magic circle tonight, who got the triple TUC a while back.
I asked to take a look, citing this thread, and this was not our experience. Regular coins fit in the expanded shell, as did my TUC.
I wonder if there's something different about newer ones (I recall Mr. Tango said he'd changed something), or the older TUCs.

Perhaps he'll chime in here with more detail.

If I can ask - when did you get your Triple TUC? Was it one of the early ones, or a more recent acquisition?
Message: Posted by: donny (Jan 25, 2018 09:25AM)
Okay, I was under a false assumption based on the TUC coins I have (8 and one Triple). I had concluded that the Triple was a hair smaller than the regular TUCs. But given your reports, tonsofquestions, I have to conclude that this is not always the case and in fact, variance of both smaller/larger can occur.
Thanks much and sorry for the prior mis-information.
I purchased my Triple recently from H*cus P*cus, should that be meaningful to you.
Message: Posted by: debaser (Aug 16, 2018 10:31AM)
[quote]On Jun 9, 2017, funsway wrote:
I have some unpublished C/S TUC effects - drop me a line when you are comfortable with it [/quote]

Can you do a visually identical version of Klause's soleil et lune with the s/m tuc?

thanks
Message: Posted by: funsway (Aug 17, 2018 02:52AM)
[quote]On Aug 16, 2018, debaser wrote:
[quote]On Jun 9, 2017, funsway wrote:
I have some unpublished C/S TUC effects - drop me a line when you are comfortable with it [/quote]

Can you do a visually identical version of Klause's soleil et lune with the s/m tuc?

thanks [/quote]

not familiar with that effect so can't give an opinion.