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Topic: One Card Poker by Chris Rawlins†
Message: Posted by: Magic KL (Mar 27, 2018 06:35PM)
Http://www.penguinmagic.com/p/9736

Spectators find four aces from a shuffled deck. Hope it's really that good. Any reviews?
Message: Posted by: Mercury52 (Mar 27, 2018 07:54PM)
Chris lectured here in NC recently and fooled the room with this. I bought his notes on it for 2x the price of the Penguin download and am very happy with it. Easy to do, and some great thinking in the routine.
Message: Posted by: Tom Cutts (Mar 27, 2018 09:51PM)
It really is that good. There is so much room to venture presentationally. I donít get excited over card tricks, but this one is something Iím really excited about.
Message: Posted by: pegasus (Mar 28, 2018 02:11AM)
Does this require multiple specs to perform??
Message: Posted by: rowdymagi5 (Mar 28, 2018 03:30AM)
[quote]On Mar 28, 2018, pegasus wrote:
Does this require multiple specs to perform?? [/quote]

Good question. Can it be adapted to a one on one performance?
Message: Posted by: EZrhythm (Mar 28, 2018 03:59AM)
Could you deal three poker hands to one person? 'Ever play Blackjack and split your hand? It's merely an Ace assembly not a 'tossed out' assembly.

Here is another assembly by the Late Great Eugene Burger. Do you think one spec could be the helper through the whole effect as if it were a one on one demo?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sGaJ90rXoAU
Message: Posted by: JamieD (Mar 28, 2018 06:06AM)
This really is a wonderfully choreographed piece of magic! Perfect for dinner situations! Highly recommend!

Jamie Daws
Message: Posted by: pegasus (Mar 28, 2018 08:15AM)
Ok, apart from the usual recommendations, can anybody answer the question, can this be performed on a SIngle spec?
Message: Posted by: Mercury52 (Mar 28, 2018 08:17AM)
Yes, can absolutely be done one-on-one
Message: Posted by: DeeChristopherMagic (Mar 28, 2018 08:48AM)
As Kevin said, it's perfect for just one person - We had a lot of groups and couples that evening, but there is also a performance (it's in the trailer) where he shows just one guy as his friend wasn't too keen about being on camera!

When working with groups; Chris gets everyone involved in the shuffling, but when it's just one person; they do the shuffling all by themselves. Doesn't affect the effect in any way at all! :)
Message: Posted by: pegasus (Mar 28, 2018 10:43AM)
Excellent. Thank you both.
Message: Posted by: John Long (Mar 28, 2018 11:33AM)
Can this be done with a spectator's deck?
Message: Posted by: DeeChristopherMagic (Mar 28, 2018 11:56AM)
[quote]On Mar 28, 2018, John Long wrote:
Can this be done with a spectator's deck? [/quote]

It requires a minimal set up; so with a little creativity and thought, I guess you could - but Chris teaches doing it with your own deck, not a borrowed one, so you're always ready to go as long as your cards are in your pocket! :)
Message: Posted by: Dave the Knave (Mar 28, 2018 11:56AM)
[quote]On Mar 28, 2018, John Long wrote:
Can this be done with a spectator's deck? [/quote]
No. If you saw the complete performance you would easily see through it.
Message: Posted by: pegasus (Mar 28, 2018 12:24PM)
[quote]On Mar 28, 2018, Dave the Knave wrote:
[quote]On Mar 28, 2018, John Long wrote:
Can this be done with a spectator's deck? [/quote]
No. If you saw the complete performance you would easily see through it. [/quote]

But this is a magician fooler, no?
Message: Posted by: Magic KL (Mar 28, 2018 01:36PM)
[quote]On Mar 28, 2018, DeeChristopherMagic wrote:
[quote]On Mar 28, 2018, John Long wrote:
Can this be done with a spectator's deck? [/quote]

It requires a minimal set up; so with a little creativity and thought, I guess you could - but Chris teaches doing it with your own deck, not a borrowed one, so you're always ready to go as long as your cards are in your pocket! :) [/quote]

How long does it take to set up the deck?
Message: Posted by: Joe Roberts (Mar 28, 2018 01:48PM)
[quote]On Mar 28, 2018, Magic KL wrote:
[quote]On Mar 28, 2018, DeeChristopherMagic wrote:
[quote]On Mar 28, 2018, John Long wrote:
Can this be done with a spectator's deck? [/quote]

It requires a minimal set up; so with a little creativity and thought, I guess you could - but Chris teaches doing it with your own deck, not a borrowed one, so you're always ready to go as long as your cards are in your pocket! :) [/quote]

How long does it take to set up the deck? [/quote]

Probably overnight.

You're finding four cards. How long do you think a "minimal set up" with four cards might take?
Message: Posted by: cho7 (Mar 28, 2018 01:53PM)
Well, it's in the end a very easy effect mostly based on a technique than many of us already know. So easy that I actually wonder why the video is sooooo looong. Seriously, 1 hour, which could have been reduce to 10 minutes. I never felt so bored by playing a video before.

TBH an uncut performance will have lead me to the trick, so I wouldn't have buy it.

My other concern is that I read a review which was saying that you can do this with a borrowed deck. No you can't, unless you somehow "alter" the deck of your friend, but according to my personal definition of "borrowed-deck-friendly-trick" this trick is not one of them.

My 2 cents
Message: Posted by: MitchC (Mar 28, 2018 02:19PM)
[quote]On Mar 28, 2018, cho7 wrote:
So easy that I actually wonder why the video is sooooo looong. Seriously, 1 hour, which could have been reduce to 10 minutes. I never felt so bored by playing a video before.
[/quote]

Totally agree ! I got extreme anxiety watching this tutorial. Could have been 10-15 minutes tops....but he HAD to do about 76 ribbon spreads for no apparent reason. OK... I LIKE the effect, so I'll not gripe too much about having too much explanation.
Message: Posted by: Tom Cutts (Mar 28, 2018 02:50PM)
[quote]On Mar 28, 2018, cho7 wrote:
My other concern is that I read a review which was saying that you can do this with a borrowed deck. No you can't, unless you somehow "alter" the deck of your friend, but according to my personal definition of "borrowed-deck-friendly-trick" this trick is not one of them.
[/quote]
This ABSOLUTELY can be done with a borrowed deck. It is entirely possible you missed the tip as to how that is possible.
Message: Posted by: cho7 (Mar 28, 2018 03:02PM)
[quote]On Mar 28, 2018, Tom Cutts wrote:
[quote]On Mar 28, 2018, cho7 wrote:
My other concern is that I read a review which was saying that you can do this with a borrowed deck. No you can't, unless you somehow "alter" the deck of your friend, but according to my personal definition of "borrowed-deck-friendly-trick" this trick is not one of them.
[/quote]
This ABSOLUTELY can be done with a borrowed deck. It is entirely possible you missed the tip as to how that is possible. [/quote]

It was so long and boring that I play it fast forward, so I may have missed the tip, yes :-)
Message: Posted by: BMWGuy (Mar 28, 2018 03:17PM)
Hey guys,

Full review coming shortly.

Thanks

Alex Alejandro
Message: Posted by: Christopher_Rawlins (Mar 28, 2018 03:58PM)
Hey Everyone,

I'm truly excited to share this with you all.

Yes - this is a Magician fooler but more importantly, it's a fun, easy routine that real people love.


If you see me lecture on my US lecture tour that I'm currently on you will see this live, I know you'll love it.

Thanks all.

C
Message: Posted by: BMWGuy (Mar 28, 2018 07:03PM)
Hey guys,

So I don't know Chris personally, but have Skyped with him a few times, back when he was going to release IDD.

Chris is a smart cookie, who has some great material out there.

I must admit the only routine of Chris's that I have used in the past is IDD, but this One Card Poker will be my second.

Basically, what you see in the demo is what you get.

You can use your own deck, or with a little imagination if you want to fool your fellow magicians, you can borrow a deck and do this.

This is something that will totally fry laymen and magicians because of the structuring of the routine and all the shuffling that is done.

The method is 2 parts, and I like the way that it is layered, very beautifully pieced together.

This is something that you will use and be ready to rock and roll anytime anywhere.

You can do everything hands off, and you don't even have to touch the deck.

For $9.95 this is a no brainer. highly recommended, and worthy of study.

Chris credits all the right people for this sort of effect, from Chad Long, to Ben Earl, and more.

Great download, and well worth the price.

Love these types of effects that seem so fair.

This is the type of magic you would probably see buried in a Steve Beam Semi Automatic book.

Alex Alejandro
Message: Posted by: cho7 (Mar 29, 2018 02:58AM)
[quote]On Mar 28, 2018, Tom Cutts wrote:
[quote]On Mar 28, 2018, cho7 wrote:
My other concern is that I read a review which was saying that you can do this with a borrowed deck. No you can't, unless you somehow "alter" the deck of your friend, but according to my personal definition of "borrowed-deck-friendly-trick" this trick is not one of them.
[/quote]
This ABSOLUTELY can be done with a borrowed deck. It is entirely possible you missed the tip as to how that is possible. [/quote]

I replayed the video, sorry I'm still missing the part where he says something about this. To be honest, I'm still playing it with a lot of fast forwards because I can't possibly watch a 1-hour long video for such a simple trick.

I think this trick is not for me anyway. BTW I don't think it' a magician fooler too, while there are several card tricks on P3 which wow-ed me, this one is not one of them. But I guess it will depend of magic history and habits of each of us.
Message: Posted by: Tom Cutts (Mar 29, 2018 03:06AM)
Best it remains a secret from you, then. Some things you should have to at least put the work of watching a one hour video in. If you canít do that well, I just donít know...
Message: Posted by: dooblehorn (Mar 29, 2018 03:30AM)
I just bought this and love it...I especially like the fact that it includes several live performances, so you can get a better understanding of the flow of the routine.
Maybe not for everyone, but I'm happy I bought this, and will def use it.
Message: Posted by: IAIN (Mar 29, 2018 03:35AM)
It's hard to take people seriously that can't be arsed watching an hour vid and giving it a go...

I liked it, very minor set up...you can do it impromptu, but a) what normal person owns a deck? B) bring your own tools to the table, you've been hired

I have an idea for a subtle wordy version of this using flash cards...
Message: Posted by: pegasus (Mar 29, 2018 04:01AM)
Is there a requirement to p@@m the aces whilst the remainder of the deck is shuffled?
Message: Posted by: IAIN (Mar 29, 2018 08:14AM)
[quote]On Mar 29, 2018, pegasus wrote:
Is there a requirement to p@@m the aces whilst the remainder of the deck is shuffled? [/quote]

Nope. And nothing has to go back into the case either.
Message: Posted by: RNK (Mar 29, 2018 09:29AM)
So is there a full uncut demo of this? I am only asking because some here are saying that this is a magicians fooler. If that is the case then I would think there would not be a problem showing a full uncut performance vid? Fair?

RNK
Message: Posted by: pegasus (Mar 29, 2018 09:35AM)
Very good point Bob. Thank you Iain.
Message: Posted by: MitchC (Mar 29, 2018 09:45AM)
A full uncut demo would not reveal any useful info to you. This is GOOD. Best $ spent on a single effect.
Message: Posted by: Christopher_Rawlins (Mar 29, 2018 10:22AM)
Hey Everyone,

So I have a day off from my USA Lecture tour, and wanted to check in again.

Cho7 - I've spent many years thinking about my Magic. The things I really perform like this, and everything else, I could talk about for much longer than an hour. I'm glad that you like the effect, and by no means do you have to watch the whole thing however...I've read, watched, re watched, re read, thought about and re examined every piece of Magic & Mentalism I've seriously wanted to perform, spending much longer than an hour doing those things above. I always try to over deliver, as I wuld rather give you a full download with every detail covered than not.

Also remember that this download is aimed at multiple skill levels and multiple levels of understanding.

I hope some of you make it out to one of my lectures and see this live.

What I LOVE about this routine is the playful presentation I've created, that ends with a VERY surprising conclusion.

In buying this or watching the trailer you already know the end result, but spectators see the production of four aces as a total surprise, and that's why this get's such great reactions.

I'm so happy to hear that so many are already using this.

I appreciate the support.

Christopher
Message: Posted by: aheller5 (Mar 29, 2018 10:28AM)
I hope christopher you can make it to Long island NY
Message: Posted by: pegasus (Mar 29, 2018 11:13AM)
Well itís very reasonably priced, and unlike most Penguin products thereís no useless (to us anyway) items sent in the post.
Message: Posted by: RNK (Mar 29, 2018 11:46AM)
[quote]On Mar 29, 2018, MitchC wrote:
A full uncut demo would not reveal any useful info to you. This is GOOD. Best $ spent on a single effect. [/quote]


Lol. Really? If you think I am looking to suss the method out you are greatly mistaken MitchC. If it's really that good and a magician's fooler there should be no reason and uncut demo video cannot be posted. When the Creator makes the statement that this is a magician's fooler then my thoughts are let's see a full demo video.

As a matter of fact you just stated that an uncut video will not reveal anything so apparently you must agree that and uncut demo video can be posted?
Message: Posted by: videoman (Mar 29, 2018 12:06PM)
[quote]On Mar 29, 2018, RNK wrote:
[quote]On Mar 29, 2018, MitchC wrote:
A full uncut demo would not reveal any useful info to you. This is GOOD. Best $ spent on a single effect. [/quote]


Lol. Really? If you think I am looking to suss the method out you are greatly mistaken MitchC. If it's really that good and a magician's fooler there should be no reason and uncut demo video cannot be posted. When the Creator makes the statement that this is a magician's fooler then my thoughts are let's see a full demo video.

As a matter of fact you just stated that an uncut video will not reveal anything so apparently you must agree that and uncut demo video can be posted? [/quote]

But it's important to remember that what very well may be a magician fooler after the first viewing may not continue to be after repeated viewings so I can understand why a full demo is often not provided in these instances.
Message: Posted by: rosariorose9 (Mar 29, 2018 12:16PM)
[quote]On Mar 29, 2018, videoman wrote:

But it's important to remember that what very well may be a magician fooler after the first viewing may not continue to be after repeated viewings so I can understand why a full demo is often not provided in these instances. [/quote]

That's a GREAT point, videoman!
Message: Posted by: Christopher_Rawlins (Mar 29, 2018 02:07PM)
[quote]On Mar 29, 2018, videoman wrote:
[quote]On Mar 29, 2018, RNK wrote:
[quote]On Mar 29, 2018, MitchC wrote:
A full uncut demo would not reveal any useful info to you. This is GOOD. Best $ spent on a single effect. [/quote]


Lol. Really? If you think I am looking to suss the method out you are greatly mistaken MitchC. If it's really that good and a magician's fooler there should be no reason and uncut demo video cannot be posted. When the Creator makes the statement that this is a magician's fooler then my thoughts are let's see a full demo video.

As a matter of fact you just stated that an uncut video will not reveal anything so apparently you must agree that and uncut demo video can be posted? [/quote]

But it's important to remember that what very well may be a magician fooler after the first viewing may not continue to be after repeated viewings so I can understand why a full demo is often not provided in these instances. [/quote]

I could not have said this better myself. Trailers are not here to give out free Magic. The OCP trailer is very fair, the effect is as shown and described.

And RNK - it's less than $10... I would understand your viewpoint if we were asking $100 or $1000.

I hope that helps.

Chris
Message: Posted by: DeeChristopherMagic (Mar 29, 2018 02:14PM)
Not to turn this into a thread about magic trailers, as that's another topic for another day; but to close the book on the 'full performance' comments, in this instance, I can tell you that nothing important is missed out of the demo, they'll always shuffle the entirety of the deck and they'll always find the aces without you having do to much of anything at all, aside from weave your script and take your applause.

Videoman's point is a really valid one, and totally true a lot of the time - We need to protect the secret so that you have to learn it the right way.

As editors; it's our job [in the trailer] to give you an accurate representation of the effect, a full pitch on what it is and what can do for you, the reasons that it is a good investment for you and of course some demonstrations of the way it can affect an audience when it is performed for real people in real situations... We also like throwing in some fancy titles here and there to re-iterate important points as it's fun, looks cool and helps to build excitement.

If magic companies were to sell their wares based purely on full performance videos, a vast amount of customers would switch off most of the time. People want (and in this quick moving online culture, need) the important information FAST. Most people don't have the time to sit through full performance after full performance when looking for the next trick or routine they want to put into their act.

What's the effect? why is it good? What kind of situations can it be performed in? If those three questions are answered when I watch a demo, I believe it to be a solid sales video and will demonstrate to the viewer whether it is a purchase that he or she should consider. We try to cram all that info into just a couple of minutes so that you have more time to check out other stuff on Penguin, or get back to your easter egg shopping.

Car commercials don't contain a full demonstration of every feature; they show clips of it looking killer against an awesome backdrop and food commercials certainly don't show you the process that went into making that cake; they show you caramel sauce being slowly drizzled over the item followed by smiling faces. This is simply because you can't experience driving the car or eating the cake through a screen, the same way that you can't experience the magic without being in the moment.

It's always helpful to remember how magic used to be sold, you saw a hand drawn image with a couple of lines detailing the effect in a catalogue. These days we are lucky enough to be able to give you so much more than that, but we also have to contend with the fact that the average person spends less than 20 seconds on a webpage, so if we can't tell the story in the first 10-20 seconds, most prospective buyers will move onto the next thing and could miss out on an amazing product.

Anyway, to move the discussion back to Chris' routine, the real value in this is not only the method, but the many additions, subtleties and the deep thinking that has gone into this routine to take it from a quick trick to a great performance piece.

I must also mention, that while the basic method is discussed early on as a foundation for the rest of the download, the video also contains further ideas from Chris, if you fast-fowarded, chances are you will have missed out a massive amount of really great information. There is also several full live performances in the tutorial and a full studio performance, that way you can see how Chris plays it to different people and how the effect looks in different situations - I felt that the addition of many performances was quite important for this particular project. The minutes add up extremely quickly!
Message: Posted by: muse (Mar 29, 2018 03:38PM)
Pros and cons, or strictly speaking, cons and pros:

Cons: Penguin Magic emailed me saying "This new mind-blowing card trick using an ORDINARY DECK has pros raving." I take issue with 'ordinary deck', particularly in capital letters. The thrust of the explanation does not justify this. Secondly, as noted above, the video is bloated - the basic teaching is good, but padded out to an at times excruciating degree. A good editor would have been useful to either cut down or re-structure the explanation.

Pros: I like it very much. The trick is simple, but ticks lots of boxes in terms of spectator actions - they genuinely shuffle, cut, choose and can change their minds. And it is, to my mind, a nicely unexpected combination of a 'game' and an ace production. And although overexplaining can be a pain in the neck, it's better than underexplaining. Chris Rawlins comes over well too, with a nicely laid back presentation.

Overall: Worth the money for me, but I'm thankful for 'fast forward'.
Message: Posted by: ejohn (Mar 29, 2018 06:25PM)
I ditto muse. Entertaining, fun and easy to set up and do. Popular gambling theme. A keeper.
Message: Posted by: EZrhythm (Mar 29, 2018 07:15PM)
[quote]On Mar 29, 2018, Christopher_Rawlins wrote:

And RNK - it's less than $10... I would understand your viewpoint if we were asking $100 or $1000.

[/quote]

That is interesting. Why would it matter how much the effect costs? Either the effect's secrets could be given away with a full performance viewing or it couldn't.
Message: Posted by: Rizzo (Mar 29, 2018 07:26PM)
Yea itís a strange one. On one hand I can agree that after many viewings, perhaps it could be reversed engineered. On the other there are many full performance clips that have never been figured out so I would assume ( could be wrong) that the trailer is what it is for a reason. Other than the write up of the effect, Iím not a fan of the trailer but quite honestly, I see many trailers lately that I can do without. As per write up I like it though.
Message: Posted by: RNK (Mar 29, 2018 07:32PM)
[quote]On Mar 29, 2018, EZrhythm wrote:
[quote]On Mar 29, 2018, Christopher_Rawlins wrote:

And RNK - it's less than $10... I would understand your viewpoint if we were asking $100 or $1000.

[/quote]

That is interesting. Why would it matter how much the effect costs? Either the effect's secrets could be given away with a full performance viewing or it couldn't. [/quote]

[quote]On Mar 29, 2018, EZrhythm wrote:
[quote]On Mar 29, 2018, Christopher_Rawlins wrote:

And RNK - it's less than $10... I would understand your viewpoint if we were asking $100 or $1000.

[/quote]

Yes. And if its that good and a fooler an unedited demo should be posted. Other creators have no problem showing unedited video when its a fooler. Heck, some will even show an unedited video when it's not a magician's fooler. And in this instance when the effect is good I will not hesitate to support the creator and buy the effect and reward them for their openness and creativity.


Yes Chris, only $10.00. If I had the money back from all of the "ONLY $10" that turned out to be useless and not what the demo showed I would have a lot of money in my paypal. No disrespect, you seem like a very likable chap. I just have a problem with creators that say this is a magician fooler but cannot show a whole demo video.


Either it's a magician's fooler and that good or it isn't.

RNK
Message: Posted by: Mb217 (Mar 29, 2018 07:35PM)
[quote]On Mar 29, 2018, muse wrote:
Pros and cons, or strictly speaking, cons and pros:

Cons: Penguin Magic emailed me saying "This new mind-blowing card trick using an ORDINARY DECK has pros raving." I take issue with 'ordinary deck', particularly in capital letters. The thrust of the explanation does not justify this. Secondly, as noted above, the video is bloated - the basic teaching is good, but padded out to an at times excruciating degree. A good editor would have been useful to either cut down or re-structure the explanation.

Pros: I like it very much. The trick is simple, but ticks lots of boxes in terms of spectator actions - they genuinely shuffle, cut, choose and can change their minds. And it is, to my mind, a nicely unexpected combination of a 'game' and an ace production. And although overexplaining can be a pain in the neck, it's better than underexplaining. Chris Rawlins comes over well too, with a nicely laid back presentation.

Overall: Worth the money for me, but I'm thankful for 'fast forward'. [/quote]

Good, fair post here...:)

I too, above all else, really like the trick. It's pretty simple and easy to pull off with minimal effort. I can see how this is a real fooler and would amaze people to know end. It's a good piece of thinking and makes for a fine presentation. Really, what's not to like? :)

As to all the talk about the explanation, I would simply suggest to Chris to offer as coin craftsman, John Jurney does with his Casino Chip Coin Coalition...he offers a "Cliff Notes" version to just show the moves with brief explanation, before also offering a longer more involved how & why. Easy enough to do, and gives everyone what they want as to the telling of the effect. Problem solved, and with that the real beauty and power of this fine effect can maybe be better realized as it deserves because really, that's what's most important here. :)

Very good job, Chris! :)
Message: Posted by: MitchC (Mar 29, 2018 07:45PM)
As I am getting older, I really appreciate maximum impact with minimal effort. This is in that category. NO sleights. Great reactions from the dozen performances so far. If there were a 'download of the year' award I'd easily vote for this ! Easily the best $9.95 I've ever spent. Kudos Chris !
Message: Posted by: Christopher_Rawlins (Mar 29, 2018 07:49PM)
Thank you everybody for the positive words, messages and comments about OCP.

RNK - like I said the trailer is very fair, they really do shuffle everything, they realy do make every single choice and they really are truly surprised at the conclusion of the routine and entertained throughout.

I'm not in the business of giving out free Magic, secrets have to be earned. With friends that's with trust and friendship, with fellow Magicians I am yet to meet, that's a monitary exchange.

Either - you like the sound of the OCP, and the ffect is something you would enjoy performing, or not. Besides that I can't help you.

You of course don't have to buy my downloads, or books, or DVD's in any form.

What I would say is to judge the overall tone of the thread from people that are customers that have made the small purchase.

Apparently my explanation is long, but everyone seem's to very much enjoy the routine and secret.

I do feel that demanding a full performance is unecessary. This is a fooler, but it's also not a freebie.

No disrespect taken and thanks, I am a very nice guy. I appreciate your interest in OCP, and I hope that if you do choose to purchase it that you'll enjoy it.

Either way, best wishes to you.

Christopher
Message: Posted by: EZrhythm (Mar 29, 2018 08:24PM)
[quote]On Mar 29, 2018, DeeChristopherMagic wrote:
Not to turn this into a thread about magic trailers, as that's another topic for another day; but to close the book on the 'full performance' comments, in this instance, I can tell you that nothing important is missed out of the demo, they'll always shuffle the entirety of the deck and they'll always find the aces without you having do to much of anything at all, aside from weave your script and take your applause.[/quote]

What you feel is not missing is in fact important to others- By seeing that there is nothing to see if that is the case and making their own decision about the full performance. I can say right now that there is a part of the performance that is missing in the trailer that I would like to see whether or not someone claims it is important or not.

[quote]Videoman's point is a really valid one, and totally true a lot of the time - We need to protect the secret so that you have to learn it the right way.[/quote]

Quite understandable.

[quote]As editors; it's our job [in the trailer] to give you an accurate representation of the effect, a full pitch on what it is and what can do for you, the reasons that it is a good investment for you and of course some demonstrations of the way it can affect an audience when it is performed for real people in real situations... We also like throwing in some fancy titles here and there to re-iterate important points as it's fun, looks cool and helps to build excitement.[/quote]

Only accurate to a certain point because as like you said you need to protect the secret. A "full pitch" is subject to what one's opinion is of the fullness of it. It is designed to promote sales because after all a producer of an effect who isn't interested in maximizing the full potential of sales and just allows the effect speak for itself doesn't have flashy videos filmed and without a full performance. -Axel Hecklau's, Just a Cup for example.

[quote]If magic companies were to sell their wares based purely on full performance videos, a vast amount of customers would switch off most of the time. People want (and in this quick moving online culture, need) the important information FAST. Most people don't have the time to sit through full performance after full performance when looking for the next trick or routine they want to put into their act.[/quote]

They certainly would NOT switch off most of the time. Remember OZ's demo vids on Penguin? Those are what started it all for Penguin and helped them to grow to be what they are today.

[quote]What's the effect? why is it good? What kind of situations can it be performed in? If those three questions are answered when I watch a demo, I believe it to be a solid sales video and will demonstrate to the viewer whether it is a purchase that he or she should consider. We try to cram all that info into just a couple of minutes so that you have more time to check out other stuff on Penguin, or get back to your easter egg shopping.[/quote]

Correct on all points there AND for the purpose to maximize sales. Nothing wrong with that but lets look at these points for what they are.

[quote]Car commercials don't contain a full demonstration of every feature; they show clips of it looking killer against an awesome backdrop and food commercials certainly don't show you the process that went into making that cake; they show you caramel sauce being slowly drizzled over the item followed by smiling faces. This is simply because you can't experience driving the car or eating the cake through a screen, the same way that you can't experience the magic without being in the moment.[/quote]

Car commercials represent a product that can may be physically experienced, test driven with no cost.
So you are saying that magic can't be experienced by a product trailer? If so, I and multitudes of others would disagree.If you are not saying that then- "Without being in the moment"? This statement is presented in a convoluted way. If another member feels differently, please post your thoughts.

[quote]It's always helpful to remember how magic used to be sold, you saw a hand drawn image with a couple of lines detailing the effect in a catalogue. These days we are lucky enough to be able to give you so much more than that, but we also have to contend with the fact that the average person spends less than 20 seconds on a webpage, so if we can't tell the story in the first 10-20 seconds, most prospective buyers will move onto the next thing and could miss out on an amazing product.[/quote]

That is looking at it from a standpoint of "Let's create an experience to MAXIMIZE SALES QUICKER". If it is truly an amazing product then word-of-mouth is your best marketing tool. This is why free samples are given away to reviewers. Those prospective buyers who do move on to the next thing within 20 seconds are quite rare and if the product is, as mentioned before, truly amazing, then they will be back.

[quote] Anyway, to move the discussion back to Chris' routine, the real value in this is not only the method, but the many additions, subtleties and the deep thinking that has gone into this routine to take it from a quick trick to a great performance piece.[/quote]

I absolutely agree.

[quote]I must also mention, that while the basic method is discussed early on as a foundation for the rest of the download, the video also contains further ideas from Chris, if you fast-fowarded, chances are you will have missed out a massive amount of really great information. There is also several full live performances in the tutorial and a full studio performance, that way you can see how Chris plays it to different people and how the effect looks in different situations - I felt that the addition of many performances was quite important for this particular project. The minutes add up extremely quickly! [/quote]

Because some are expressing that the video was long and draw out or repetitive, it would have been beneficial to provide it in parts.
Message: Posted by: EZrhythm (Mar 29, 2018 08:39PM)
[quote]On Mar 29, 2018, RNK wrote:

Yes. And if its that good and a fooler an unedited demo should be posted. Other creators have no problem showing unedited video when its a fooler. Heck, some will even show an unedited video when it's not a magician's fooler. And in this instance when the effect is good I will not hesitate to support the creator and buy the effect and reward them for their openness and creativity.

Either it's a magician's fooler and that good or it isn't.

RNK [/quote]

AND some creators even show the gimmick, if there is one involved AND let you download the full explanation tut.
Message: Posted by: EZrhythm (Mar 29, 2018 08:45PM)
I am curious in seeing how the specs obtain their individual cards. This was interestingly cut out of the video. I'm not interested for secrets sake but for routine design.
Message: Posted by: Davdo (Mar 29, 2018 11:08PM)
I went ahead and bit on this because I liked the premise a lot. Upon first full viewing, however, I caught what was going on. I wouldn't discount this as a magician fooler, though, because I had the advantage of knowing what outcome to expect and the way the demo was shot, there's a flash of something important early on. The reason why I have shared that I got it quickly is to illustrate the simplicity of it all. It's not difficult to wrap your head around, and for those of us that enjoy banter and improvisation, it will be a fun effect to perform. Considering the simplicity, I'd say this is another one of those purchases where I consider the $$ to be a penalty on my own lack of ingenuity. There isn't anything I've never heard of here, but it's the notion to put a few different ideas together that makes this work so well.

Is this a magician fooler? If they knew that the goal was to force them to find the four aces, no way. But if you approach them as normal spectators, I dare say most would be fooled. That said, who the heck is collecting effects for the purpose of fooling magicians?? That line of copy is usually a big turnoff for me.

All in all, this is a nice idea that I will definitely be using and adapting. One critique I will share, though, is that the incredible volume of ribbon spreading in the video made me anxious :P I get it... It's a tick...

Thanks, Chris.

Dave
Message: Posted by: videoman (Mar 30, 2018 12:03AM)
[quote]On Mar 29, 2018, RNK wrote:
I understand your points Chris and hope you understand that I'm not trying to disrespect you as I do not think you were trying to disrespect me. But I also stand by my statement that if an effect is claimed by the creator to be a true magician fooler a full uncut demo should not be an issue. If its an issue in any way, then my perspective is that it must not be a magician fooler. [/quote]

So you see no difference in being able to view something once and viewing it a dozen times?
Message: Posted by: Mb217 (Mar 30, 2018 09:07AM)
Y'know, thank God, that for most of us that our greater audiences are not magicians. :D I know for myself that most times I do magic for people, they are typically laymen, and that's a good thing IMHO. :) With that said, all the little things that may peek a magician's alertness, they most likely will not see, not if you present the effect correctly, casually, and confidently, as I think Chris most certainly does here. That he mentioned that the effect would fool magicians, well, that's mostly because it probably would...just why wouldn't it? I remember feeling so confident with my coin magic that I knew no one, including the absolutely brilliant including Presidents, School Chancellors and astute business men would be none the wiser. And yknow why...Because most like anyone else, despite their fine intelligences, they are mostly like anyone else when it comes to perceiving something off the fly, their thinking mechanisms work mostly the same as anyone else. And sure, magicians know of certain things, but that doesn't mean they can't be fooled, and as a half-decent-at-best coin man, I certainly can be fooled, and darn happy for it. :D

Anyway, Chris' method here is darn clever, and the presentation delivered quite matter-of-factly off the cuff. And I guess all of us may be of varying levels of ability and competence as to card magic, but I doubt any level would call this effect junk magic, as it really is quality thinking and neat application...Just a darn good card trick that costs nearly nothing to learn.

And perhaps you might not learn anything new here, but most will find it new-enough in various ways that'll make you smile and go "Hmmmmm." :D Might not be all-the-way something new like the automobile was to the horse & carriage, but it brings together enough cleverness to make it totally worthwhile IMHO. :) That Chris thought of this and no one else did, well, that's what creativity is all about, little and big. That he thought enough even a bit further to share his creation with others, well, that's sorta what "Magicians Helping Magicians" is all about too, ain't it? :)

Again, good job Chris and I believe this wonderful work will speak for itself, given even half a chance...It's honestly that good. :)
Message: Posted by: IAIN (Mar 30, 2018 09:39AM)
And there's the huge difference between being a watcher and being involved in the presentation...your attention is elsewhere...
Message: Posted by: Rizzo (Mar 30, 2018 12:32PM)
After trying this out in work today - WOW! Well done Chris. . Itís one of those effects that regardless of how you see the video or notó-including the tutorial, it plays huge on the audience - Recommended.
Message: Posted by: Dave the Knave (Mar 30, 2018 01:37PM)
In 55 years of being involved with magic, this is the worst card trick I've seen. Bar none. No exaggeration.
Message: Posted by: IAIN (Mar 30, 2018 01:40PM)
Well, after 117 years in magic, I say it's not...
Message: Posted by: Dave the Knave (Mar 30, 2018 03:37PM)
You're a liar and I'm not.
Message: Posted by: IAIN (Mar 30, 2018 03:43PM)
[quote]On Mar 30, 2018, Dave the Knave wrote:
You're a liar and I'm not. [/quote]
You mean I'm not really over 117 years old...wow...

Look, I can grab many a book and find card tricks far, far worse than this...if you've really been into magic for 55 years, then you can too...

Why not help out and explain fairly why you don't like this one? Would be useful to some I'm sure...
Message: Posted by: Caveman (Mar 30, 2018 04:18PM)
Iain, isn't he just being sarcastic?
Message: Posted by: Steven Conner (Mar 30, 2018 04:25PM)
[quote]On Mar 30, 2018, Dave the Knave wrote:
In 55 years of being involved with magic, this is the worst card trick I've seen. Bar none. No exaggeration. [/quote]

You are certainly entitled to your opinion, but you must live in a cave. I've seen far worse card tricks. This is actually pretty good. There's a lot of things I don't like, but if I'm going to take a strong stance on it, you ought to at least state your position why so a more intelligent conversation can be posted.

Best

Steve
Message: Posted by: pegasus (Mar 30, 2018 06:43PM)
[quote]On Mar 30, 2018, Dave the Knave wrote:
In 55 years of being involved with magic, this is the worst card trick I've seen. Bar none. No exaggeration. [/quote]

Iíve told you a million times not to exaggerate.
Message: Posted by: Mb217 (Mar 30, 2018 07:32PM)
[quote]On Mar 30, 2018, Caveman wrote:
Iain, isn't he just being sarcastic? [/quote]

That, or yet another troll aimed at mischief, setting fires and watching it burn happily with a bowl of popcorn.

[b]*DONT FEED THE TROLLS![/b]
Message: Posted by: rosariorose9 (Mar 30, 2018 10:21PM)
[quote]On Mar 30, 2018, Mb217 wrote:
[quote]On Mar 30, 2018, Caveman wrote:
Iain, isn't he just being sarcastic? [/quote]

That, or yet another troll aimed at mischief, setting fires and watching it burn happily with a bowl of popcorn.

[b]*DONT FEED THE TROLLS![/b] [/quote]

And this troll is one who has enough posts to access the 'Secret sessions' portion of this forum....

By the way, imho, this is a pretty good trick, and I don't regret having purchased it.
Message: Posted by: davidpaul$ (Mar 30, 2018 11:15PM)
Wasn't going to purchase this. Goodness, I have more resources for card and other effects to last 3 lifetimes or more.
I bit the bullet anyway as many can relate to. My verdict: I'm not disappointed. Since I perform mostly in restaurants,
I probably won't perform this routine that often. Table space and time. Interruptions from waitstaff.
It is an entertaining routine and am glad I have it in my arsenal. .( You just can't borrow a deck.)
Teaching is thorough with live performances as was mentioned.
Message: Posted by: mike donoghue (Mar 31, 2018 07:13AM)
It's a great routine with a lot of audience participation & a great ending.

However, it didn't fool me but who cares as business dictates that I fool and entertain a lay audience.

Got to agree though that the explanation is FAR too long & frustrating to watch ( as even though I knew what was happening, I still had to watch it to see if there wa anything in it which added to the effect.

A great routine though that I can see me using at the right moment.

Mike Donoghue
Message: Posted by: 1KJ (Apr 1, 2018 04:05AM)
I'm not really into Ace productions, but this is one that I like!

KJ
Message: Posted by: mtstic44 (Apr 1, 2018 10:11AM)
I'm downloading it now. Can't wait until it's done.

Allen
Message: Posted by: matsam (Apr 1, 2018 08:27PM)
Hard to tell how long the whole thing takes, given the trailer cut; and if there are awkward bouts of equivoque. intrigued, though! Looking forward to hearing more thoughts.
Message: Posted by: John Long (Apr 1, 2018 08:41PM)
[quote]On Mar 30, 2018, Mb217 wrote:

[b]*DONT FEED THE TROLLS![/b] [/quote]

Good attitude.
Better to walk away from a fight, than walk into one.
Message: Posted by: MadisonH (Apr 1, 2018 09:29PM)
[quote]On Apr 1, 2018, matsam wrote:
Hard to tell how long the whole thing takes, given the trailer cut; and if there are awkward bouts of equivoque. intrigued, though! Looking forward to hearing more thoughts. [/quote]

It's very quick, no equivoque. It is very clever. I can guarantee if Chris had performed this on me, I would have been fooled. It's got some really killer subtleties which really make it seem impossible.

Madison
Message: Posted by: DougRoy (Apr 3, 2018 02:08PM)
Quick question:
I gather from comments that 'table space' is required with this, for the spread. Would a fanning of the cards, in the hand, not be a possibility? I mostly do strolling magic, so just
curious if this can be done in that format... with minimal space.
Looking for some input on this.
Thanks in advance! :)
Doug
Message: Posted by: Davdo (Apr 3, 2018 02:30PM)
With some obedient specs, in theory they could hold the tabled cards. And the spread at the end is just a fancy reveal. The last reveal could be done in the hands. I don't think it would be that difficult to adapt to strolling.

Dave
Message: Posted by: Paul Rathbun (Apr 3, 2018 04:07PM)
I don't care for the procedure that is left out of the demo. This has a much quicker reset than Big Four Poker, but I don't think it is as entertaining. If I had to choose between this and big four poker I would definitely go with Big Four Poker. Although the reset for BFP is a hassle. Just my 2 cents.
Message: Posted by: Craigers (Apr 8, 2018 07:12AM)
Took a punt at this. Not sure I like it. The "burning" seems a bit contrived as the magician makes the burn choices, so need to find a workaround. Also the explanation video could have been done in 5 mins.
Message: Posted by: Mb217 (Apr 8, 2018 02:00PM)
[quote]On Apr 3, 2018, Paul Rathbun wrote:
I don't care for the procedure that is left out of the demo. This has a much quicker reset than Big Four Poker, but I don't think it is as entertaining. If I had to choose between this and big four poker I would definitely go with Big Four Poker. Although the reset for BFP is a hassle. Just my 2 cents. [/quote]

While I also like Tom's take on his Big Four Poker, I actually like a lot more about One Card Poker. I think for what it is, it does not dissapoint.

1 - It's quite a bit shorter but does not suffer for spectator interaction and participation for this kind of effect.

2 - It's a lot cheaper.

3- It's easier to assemble (and reset as noted).

4 - I like that the specs are just as involved and believe just as much as to their shuffling & choices of the cards, and overall play & fairness of the effect...Very believable and the amazement is honest.

And I already know that it plays rather well, and I love that it's fairly easy to do with little to worry about in presenting it..No "hassle" at all.

Now, I'm just a decent-at-best coin guy, but I do understand "to each his own," but just wanted to give a baseline comparison, IMHO. :) And as to getting what you pay for, in this one, I think you get a good bit more, for a lot less. Just my thoughts and truly appreciate all the other views, either-which-way. :)
Message: Posted by: Christopher_Rawlins (Apr 9, 2018 09:18AM)
Can I also say that, I met Tom in Chicago, he's a super nice guy.

He actually cane to both my lecture there, and we talked about OCP, Big Four Poker and many other things.

We really got on, and hope to keep in touch.

I don't feel that OCP should be compared to BFP, they are very different.

The responce to this has been superb.

I have 6 lectures left on my USA lecture tour, come along and you'll see it live amongst many other creations of mine.

Christopher
Message: Posted by: Tom Dobrowolski (Apr 9, 2018 11:21AM)
First off Chris I appreciate the very kind comments. Great meeting you! I really enjoyed our conversation(s) and also look forward to keeping in touch. I agree B4P and OCP very different. Both really good in my opinion:-) Buy either or both and you won't be disappointed.

Also if you get a chance to see Chris lecture do it! He's a great guy and I really enjoyed it (twice!). It's full of terrific information and effects you'll use.

Thanks Paul Rathburn and others for the kind comments about B4P. Truly appreciated. Glad folks like and use it!

I also want to let those who have asked/mentioned it there is a quick reset for B4P. Pick up the 4 piles do 2 quick in the hands reverse faros (used in many self working tricks) and the stack is reset! Takes less than a minute. I wish I would have mentioned it in the B4P DVD.

Go see Chris lecture! You'll be glad you did!!
Message: Posted by: Ross W (Apr 11, 2018 08:36AM)
Gotta laugh at all these people demanding "full performance demonstrations" before parting with their cash. We oldies remember the printed catalogues, The number of times I was burned as a youth by a description that made it sound like I was buying REAL MAGIC!
Message: Posted by: Ross W (Apr 11, 2018 08:37AM)
One question about this: how practical is this to put either before or after other tricks, without a deck switch?
Message: Posted by: IAIN (Apr 11, 2018 09:03AM)
Very easy... incredibly easy set up..
Message: Posted by: Jared (Apr 16, 2018 09:33AM)
I watched this last night and my gosh talk about OVERKILL! While the trick itself is pretty good I was practically screaming at my computer monitor for having to watch 1 hour and 7 minutes of Chris's explanation. This was already mentioned before but honestly 15-minutes would have been a generous amount of time for the performance, credits, and explanation. If nothing else, why couldn't they have divided this into two segments: (1) quick explanation, and (2) detailed explanation? Honestly, this was borderline torture.
Message: Posted by: castype (Apr 16, 2018 09:29PM)
I felt the same way. I must have said 'OK we get it!!!' out loud 20 times. Pretty decent trick regardless.
Message: Posted by: Christopher_Rawlins (Apr 24, 2018 09:12AM)
I'd rather be thorough than not. ;)
Message: Posted by: rosariorose9 (Apr 24, 2018 08:36PM)
[quote]On Apr 11, 2018, Ross W wrote:
...We oldies remember the printed catalogues, The number of times I was burned as a youth by a description that made it sound like I was buying REAL MAGIC! [/quote]

I guess you're right, Ross, I AM getting old. I remember the old 'Abbott's' catalog. Easily an inch (2.54cm for my European friends) thick. The overwhelming majority of the effects were pretty bad (sorry, Percy), but God did I love when that catalog arrived at my doorstep.
Message: Posted by: RNK (May 1, 2018 10:30AM)
I finally got around to checking this out and I have to say that I do like this. Nothing knuckle busting that allows you to concentrate on your performance. I do apologize to Chris for giving him a hard time. Though, I do think a full demo could have been released without most not being able to backtrack and figure this out. I do think this is practical and the deck can be used for other effects.

Overall a very nice release Chris!


RNK
Message: Posted by: Dr. J Maggio (May 1, 2018 01:03PM)
[quote]On Apr 11, 2018, Ross W wrote:
One question about this: how practical is this to put either before or after other tricks, without a deck switch? [/quote]

no deck switch needed. 30 second set-up.

J
Message: Posted by: Dr. J Maggio (May 1, 2018 01:06PM)
Good trick, especially for 10 bucks. I do wish there would be a less suspicious way of burning the cards. (Any ideas?) I do love the "card you could have picked" reveal though. I did the trick on some friends... it was not a "hard" audience, but they really enjoyed it. (I am a hobbyist.)