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Topic: The Egg Bag
Message: Posted by: Peo Olsson (May 4, 2004 12:25AM)
Ok, so let's talk about the egg bag.
What egg bag do you use? What kind of egg?
And what routine are you using?

I have a Malini egg bag myself, with a plastic egg... and learning the Ken Brooke's routine.

Pete, I understand this this is one of your favourite routines. Do you have any words of wisdom?


Peo
Message: Posted by: Harry Murphy (May 4, 2004 07:21AM)
This has been discussed a couple of times before here at the Café. A search will turn up some of those discussions.


The routine I most often use is the Roy Benson (of Benson Bowl fame) and is straight from Bruce Elliott’s “Classic Secrets of Magic”. It is unlike traditional egg bag routines in that it is a production of six eggs from a small bag. It is very clever and seemingly impossible.

The bag I use is homemade to the dimensions of my hand. I use wooden eggs (six are used in the routine).

I also have and use the Mardo bag (made by Martin Lewis’ mother) from time to time. I pretty much use a Bertran routine that ends with a bottle production.

And I have and use the Malini bag made by Danny Tong’s wife. I use Ken Brooke’s routine (and when I can get away with it I will use the Mullica ending to that routine).

All that said, 98% of the time I am using my homemade bag with Roy Benson’s clever, visual, surprising, and magical routine. It is the second egg-bag routine I learned (the first being a modified Tarbell routine) when I was a teenager and the one that seems to get the greatest response for me.
Message: Posted by: PaulGreen (May 4, 2004 10:20AM)
Hi Peo,

The Malini bag and the routine of Ken Brooke's are good things. If you can, watch Charlie Miller (tapes), Jeff Hobson, or Johnny Thompson. Masters--everyone!

Regards,

Paul Green
Message: Posted by: rickmagic1 (May 4, 2004 12:04PM)
I'm a bit different. I use Martin Lewis' handling of the Senor Mardo bag, only I end with a production of a goldfish in a short stemmed wineglass.

This is from my period act, "Victorian Secrets: A Performance of Classical Conjuring" in which I portray Professor Richard Alan Barclay.

Rick
Message: Posted by: Pete Biro (May 4, 2004 06:23PM)
Personally I think the Malini (Charlie Miller) bag is the most baffling and entertaining, not to mention easy to do egg bag out there.

Ken's instructions are easy to follow.

Close with the lady reaching into the bag to find the egg after you have done the "hold my wrists" segment.
Message: Posted by: rickmagic1 (May 5, 2004 12:01AM)
I have to admit, Pete. I saw Johnny do that routine in Vegas back in 2001...one of the finest performances of magic I've ever seen, but then the least I've seen Johnny Thompson do was great!
Message: Posted by: Alan Munro (May 7, 2004 09:05AM)
I use a Tarbell Egg Bag made by Pauline Tong, with a practice golfball instead of an egg. I use the Martin Lewis routine, with slight modifications, from the Stevens tape on the egg bag. The routine won a magic competition for me last summer. The look of surprise on the face of the spectator is priceless, as they pull the golfball from the bag.

The routine is excellent for both standup and close-up applications.
Message: Posted by: SethHoward (May 9, 2004 12:06AM)
I just purchased the "Encyclopedia of Egg Magic" by Donato Colucci (Hermetic Press) and I highly recommend it. It covers almost every type of egg bag and different routines.
Seth
Message: Posted by: Bill Hegbli (May 9, 2004 12:49AM)
I must disagree that the Encyclopedia of Egg Magic is any good. Please do not waste your money on this worthless book. It has no value what so ever.

You would do better to purchase the Egg Bag tape from Stevens Magic.

If interested to purchase my copy of the above book for $50 plus $10 postage PM me.
Message: Posted by: SethHoward (May 9, 2004 02:01AM)
Care to elaborate why you think it's a "worthless" book?
I know it doesn't contain any new material but it is a great compliation of classic routines and handlings.
Seth
Message: Posted by: ed rhodes (May 10, 2004 11:44AM)
I don't know [what] bag I have. I picked it up at Tannen's. It's far and away better than the old red flannel Adam's bag I used to use.

A gripe here. When I ordered the bag, the ad in the catalog said; "You also need the Devil's Handkerchief and an extra egg to perform this routine." When I got the bag and the handkerchief and the extra egg, I discovered that nothing in the instructions said anything about a second egg or the Devil's handkerchief! When I went to Tannen's later and asked, they didn't know anything about it!

(Mind you, it's also an excellent Devil's handkerchief and I'm not sorry I bought it! I just wish either the ad had been more accurate or the instructions had the information the ad said they would!)
Message: Posted by: Pete Biro (May 10, 2004 08:41PM)
Charlie Miller, with the Malini Bag, at one time, used the Devil's Hank to vanish an egg and the egg would be found in the bag.

It may have been an early ad, or earlier version.
Message: Posted by: Bill Hegbli (May 10, 2004 11:31PM)
The Encyclopedia of Egg Magic is missing detail routines. It only give suggestions. Have read it from cover to cover. It repeats much of the same material and does not give anything useful.

Yes, the material is old, but it is not an encyclopedia. I would an encyclopedia would contain detailed construction of every egg bag that has been on the market. The lost tricks and routines on egg magic. Gags, usable material. Multiplication routines.

The book is really stuck in a rut on Stodare Egg. I could not make out what this egg was suppose to be, as it is referred to so much, "It was clear as mud".

I did not find one usable idea or item in this book.
Message: Posted by: SethHoward (May 10, 2004 11:49PM)
Umm...It's pretty clear what the Stodare Egg is. It's classic gimmicked egg used to vanish a silk and produce an egg.

As far as construction of egg bags, we must remember a lot of egg bags are still on the market to purchase and to reveal the workings would not be good.

Maybe it should be titled "Egg Magic Reference Book". Maybe you should go through it again and you just might find something of use. I know I have.
Seth
Message: Posted by: Dan LeFay (May 11, 2004 05:35AM)
Studied the Ken Brooke routine. Now I just read Ron Bauer's Siamese Goose Bag. Very well written routine (as most of his booklets)and crystal clear effect.
Both sources recommended.
Message: Posted by: Jeff Dial (May 11, 2004 05:42PM)
Wmhegbli,

We would disagree on what makes a good magic book. I agree that the Encyclopedia of Egg Magic does not "contain detailed construction of every egg bag that has been on the market". Neither does John Novak's Egg Bag Book, which lists many, but categorizes them in the same four basic types.

The material in the book contains the routines as they first appeared in print. The "bits of business" are missing because they were never there to begin with. The Benson routine is as it appeared in Classic Secrets of Magic. I know Harry Murphy said he was able to learn the routine from that manuscript.

You are right if you are saying that there are not a lot of fully scripted routines in the book (I haven't checked there may not be any), but I think it is a bit much to say there are no useable items there. (I know you said YOU found no useable items, which is not exactly the same thing but I took a little liberty) :)

For me the value is in the historical content, the breadth of ideas that can be applied to other things besides eggs. We are all different kinds of learners and performers. Some like all the details and patter worked out (from an an admitted Ken Brooke routine egg bagger) and some like the bones of a routine that they can add the flesh themselves. We should have all heard by now about magicians that throw away the routine that comes with a trick so they can work out their own routine. I see the EEM as falling into this latter category.

If nothing else the EEM is a good reference tool.

If all you want are egg bags the two best sources are the Steven's Video and the Novak book although the book is also short on routines. The literature on egg bags is huge. The EEM notes that Jack Potter's Master Index to Magic in Print (c. 1970) listed nearly 300 listings. I think Mr. Colucci did a good job bringing as many as he did into one place.
Message: Posted by: JamesinLA (May 12, 2004 02:00AM)
Mandrake,
The devil's hank is used in the Tarbell egg bag routine, which is in Tarbell #2.

Jim
Message: Posted by: Bill Hegbli (May 12, 2004 03:39AM)
Having owned most egg tricks and bags on the market over the 50 years I been doing magic. I stand to any unsuspecting purchaser to pass on this book.

It is just an overpriced waste of good paper. It has nothing of usable value.

It is not an encyclopedia.
Message: Posted by: ed rhodes (May 12, 2004 05:17AM)
[quote]
On 2004-05-12 03:00, JamesinLA wrote:
Mandrake,
The devil's hank is used in the Tarbell egg bag routine, which is in Tarbell #2.

Jim
[/quote]

Thank you... I'm going to make an effort to get Tarbell's 1 & 2. (I'd like to get them in order.) Be nice if the guys at Tannens had known that.
Message: Posted by: Bill Hegbli (May 12, 2004 07:07AM)
Trevor Lewis has a nice routine on his DVD out by L&L Pub. I do not have this video.

Also he has a Devil's Hank addition in the Ken Brooke instructions that I have.

Trevor is a tremendous children’s entertainer.
Message: Posted by: ed rhodes (May 12, 2004 07:41AM)
How can you determine what kind of bag you have? Mine is a black bag with a "woven" pattern printed on it to look like multiple colored threads.
Message: Posted by: L Trunk (Oct 9, 2008 02:33AM)
Resurrecting an old one here, but lately I'm interested in the egg bag (trying to lose the table here). I know a talented seamstress, and the general principle of the egg bag. Will the Novak book give me enough detail to have her make up a quality working bag?

Lyndon
Message: Posted by: Hansel (Oct 9, 2008 02:38AM)
What egg bag do you use? Silk Legacy Malini Egg Bag by Fabric Manipulation
What kind of egg? A blown egg
And what routine are you using? A routine inspired by Wayne Dobson with a lady seated with me at the edge of the theater stage or in my stool.
Message: Posted by: Dave V (Oct 9, 2008 02:39AM)
I don't have the Novak book, but I do know that egg bags aren't as simple as they look. In order to work smoothly without puckering, it requires a very fine touch and extreme attention to detail. Looking at the bags that I have, it looks like it's more hand work than machine work. It might be cheaper in the long run to buy a bag than to pay someone to experiment until you get somewhere close.

Check the auction sites. If there's not one listed now there may be one soon.
Message: Posted by: L Trunk (Oct 9, 2008 03:22AM)
Thanks Dave, I had thought that it might work out cheaper to just buy one, but I feel so much better with a unique made to measure job. Also, I definitely would not be using an egg in the routine. I want to use a door-knob. Any tips on which bag would suit better?

Still, I would like to know if the Novak book does describe the manufacture, otherwise I will buy the Steven's dvd in preference. Can someone shed some light?
Message: Posted by: pepka (Oct 9, 2008 03:23AM)
[quote]
On 2008-10-09 03:38, Hansel wrote:
with a lady seated with me at the edge of the theater stage or in my stool.
[/quote]
I think I'd much rather sit ON your stool rather than IN it. Call me crazy.
Message: Posted by: Hansel (Oct 9, 2008 03:32AM)
[quote]
On 2008-10-09 04:23, pepka wrote:
[quote]
On 2008-10-09 03:38, Hansel wrote:
with a lady seated with me at the edge of the theater stage or in my stool.
[/quote]
I think I'd much rather sit ON your stool rather than IN it. Call me crazy.
[/quote]


Hey Pepka...i will take it personal!You don't get your hand out of my face!
Message: Posted by: pepka (Oct 9, 2008 04:47AM)
I don't know which is funnier, my line, the fact that it ticked off Hansel, or the fact that he seems to not get it.

Relax dude, I was not ripping on you, rather your choice of phrasing.
Message: Posted by: L Trunk (Oct 9, 2008 05:00AM)
Well it's a fairly obscure word.
Message: Posted by: Hansel (Oct 9, 2008 07:16AM)
Well, let's think that the English is not my first language ... and yes,i get it!
Hansel!
Message: Posted by: Alan Munro (Oct 9, 2008 11:42AM)
[quote]
On 2008-10-09 04:22, L Trunk wrote:
Thanks Dave, I had thought that it might work out cheaper to just buy one, but I feel so much better with a unique made to measure job. Also, I definitely would not be using an egg in the routine. I want to use a door-knob. Any tips on which bag would suit better?

Still, I would like to know if the Novak book does describe the manufacture, otherwise I will buy the Steven's dvd in preference. Can someone shed some light?
[/quote]

I have the Novak book in my library. It has rudimentary illustrations of how the bags are constructed. But, it's apparent that Mr. Novak knew little about sewing - most details about the types of seams and hems are missing.

I'd recommend contacting Fabric Manipulations and have one made to fit. It should be easy enough to size one over the phone, especially when you're talking to someone who makes a lot of egg bags.
Message: Posted by: jakeg (Oct 9, 2008 12:49PM)
From what I've been given to understand, Fabric Manipulation will make your bag to order. Give them a yell.
Message: Posted by: relayer66 (Oct 9, 2008 02:11PM)
I use Fabric Manipulations black Malini bag and a wooden egg. My routine is based on the Ken Brooke routine with a shotglass production ending.

I have the Encyclopedia of Egg Magic and I consider only "ok". Nothing too special.
Message: Posted by: Ony Carcamo (Oct 9, 2008 07:28PM)
I second the Fabric Manipulation egg bag. It's well made, the silk is the best for the egg bag... fabulous!

Although I also use Hobson's egg bag from time to time.

Can't go wrong with these two.
Message: Posted by: deadcatbounce (Oct 10, 2008 07:26AM)
Anyone have an opinion on the Jeff Hobson egg bag? And the eggs supplied?

Tks.

DCB
Message: Posted by: L Trunk (Oct 10, 2008 07:38AM)
DCB,

In my searches on the Café, people have raved about the Hobson bagg. In fact, I can't remember seeing a negative review. A couple of people said they preferred other bags, and that mainly because they were accustomed to using them.

The Hobson bag comes with two eggs.


--
Lyndon
Message: Posted by: deadcatbounce (Oct 10, 2008 11:27AM)
I bought the bag from Jeff at the recent convention in Eastbourne. It was expensive, but he sold it very well. He spent a long time on the whys and wherefores - and I had considered, up to that point, of getting hold of the one from Dan Tong, who I'm a big fan of.

However - I had a pocketful of cash, and had visited the convention mainly to swot up on kids stuff, and scout round the dealers.

I don't have the time to put into the egg bag right now (concentrating on the cups and balls..), but perhaps I'll get round to it in the New Year.
I was just a bit surprised that it hadn't come up in this thread.

Regards,

DCB
Message: Posted by: L Trunk (Oct 11, 2008 04:43AM)
Ahh. I misread that as "are the eggs supplied"... I guess it hasn't come up on this thread because there are so many other threads dedicated to it.
Message: Posted by: Harry Murphy (Oct 11, 2008 05:15AM)
The Hobson egg bag has been reviewed, discussed, and argued about in a number of places here on the Café. One review and discussion thread (including input from Mr. Hobson) is at:

http://www.themagiccafe.com/forums/viewtopic.php?topic=242392&forum=109

There is even a bit of discussion on the eggs supplied with the bags.
Message: Posted by: jakeg (Oct 11, 2008 09:19AM)
I recently bought an egg bag from the Ambitious Card. I used it over the summer and like it a lot. I bought it mainly because it was considerably less money that the other quality bags, and came recommended from a source I respect.
Message: Posted by: Magnus Eisengrim (Oct 11, 2008 10:25AM)
I showed my Ambitious Card egg bag to some old-timers at the club. They were convinced that I had a Fabric Manipulations bag. It's nice!

John
Message: Posted by: Lynetta (Oct 11, 2008 12:16PM)
"Imitation is the sincerest of flattery." Charles Caleb Colton

I guess I should feel very flattered, considering two of the above mentioned manufacturers had one my egg bags prior to releasing their "own" designs. This is why you will notice some uncanny similarities when comparing their egg bags to mine. I know that I do not own the exclusive rights to the egg bag, however, I do have the exclusive rights to manufacture Johnny Thompson's egg bag. (Sorry, I had to finally publicly get that off my chest.)

That being said...I personally hand-make each of my Legacy Egg Bags according to Johnny Thompson's exact specifications. However, if someone prefers a customized egg bag, utilizing their own size, color, design, or fabric, I am happy to accommodate. Just contact me for a quote.

Lynetta
Message: Posted by: Pete Biro (Oct 11, 2008 12:47PM)
What Johnny Thompson has done to the subtle difference make A HUGE DIFFERENCE in the handling... Can't get any better bag PERIOD.
Message: Posted by: Father Photius (Oct 11, 2008 03:40PM)
I agree with Pete, and you can't find it any better than those made by Lynetta.
Message: Posted by: Josh the Superfluous (Oct 11, 2008 04:11PM)
Malini bag with 6 golf balls and a paper bag. Think outside the bag. :)
Message: Posted by: Harry Murphy (Oct 11, 2008 04:14PM)
I wonder what has Johnny Thompson done that was not done with the egg-bag that was not available and/or in print before.

I have one of Lynetta's wonderful bags (via Denny & Lee’s brick and mortar shop). I have said elsewhere that Lynetta’s bag is amongst the best made. It is a professional prop for the serious worker.

However, other than actual size, proportion (length to width) and maybe selection of material used, what makes it a Johnny Thompson version of the Miller/Malini bag?

It can’t be the nature of the opening to the “necessary” working of the bag. Tarbell clearly shows the inside quarter circle opening to the “necessary” in his instructions on making the Malini egg bag. Heck, this little tidbit was published by Tarbell in 1924 (well before Miller reinvented the Malini bag!). See page 112 of volume 5.

My understanding of the double wall on both sides of the bag was a development of Charley Miller and Harry Riser’s wife (along with input from Harry and Persi Diaconis). But even that concept was being used in the construction of other types of egg bags available. One “Standard” in my collection dates to 1957 and is doubled walled both side. It comes from a shop in Panama City, Panama.

I know that Mr. Thompson takes credit for the rounded outside corners of the Miller/Malini egg bag, On the Stevens Great Magic Video #29, he says to Charlie Miller that his “contribution” to the egg bag is the “rounded” outside corners.

Mr. Thompson may have well contributed the rounded outside corners to the Malini/Miller egg bag but it is not his invention. An egg bag was sold in the late 1800’s (Standard type) that had beautifully rounded corners. Further, within Mr. Thompson’s lifetime, Jack Miller (no relation to Charlie) made and sold an egg bag through Tannen’s that had rounded corners. Jack Miller’s bag was also a version of the Standard egg bag not a Malini.

So what makes an egg bag a Johnny Thompson egg bag? Mr. Thompson brings years of experience to egg bag use and knows what works in making the bag easy to perform with. Thus he configured a bag based on that experience. That unique configuration of elements (size, shape, nature of “necessary, and type and weight of material, etc) that makes it a Thompson bag. I believe that Lynetta makes the bag according to these specifications.