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Topic: The Safety Coffin Bell.
Message: Posted by: Senor Fabuloso (Nov 24, 2018 05:57AM)
Suffocation, is one of the most brutal deaths one can experience.
Even the idea can make some queasy and uncomfortable. So how would
it be if you were buried prematurely before having really died?

Today we think the inadvertent possibility of premature burial inconceivable
but back in the 18th centenary, it happened more often than you might think.
This lead to the development of the "Safety Coffin Bell". A bell hung above
the coffin on a pulley system with a cord attached to a finger of the thought
deceased. If after burial the person was still alive, the bell would ring and
the person unearthed.

This is what has lead to the expression "Saved by the bell".

I have one of these bell here. Taken from the grave of one Mary Ann Bellwood.
Ironic how bell is in Her name don't you think? Many Ann did actually die and
was never uninterned however, they say, that this bell is strangely connected to
Miss Mary. And under the right circumstances if we believe and listen carefully,
She will make herself know to us by ringing the bell.

Out of respect for the dead let us stay very quiet while we try contacting
Mary Ann Bellwood. Mary are you here?


This is a spirit bell presentation I thought of after seeing an episode of "Lore"
Feel free to use it in any way you see fit.

Comments, additions, constructive criticism, all are welcome.
Message: Posted by: ManxBull (Nov 24, 2018 09:15AM)
There's a very good, and rather sinister, cemetery bell routine in Roger Curzon's book 'Dark Matters', available from Lebanon Circle.
Message: Posted by: Philemon Vanderbeck (Nov 24, 2018 10:31AM)
Https://www.phrases.org.uk/meanings/saved-by-the-bell.html
Message: Posted by: Senor Fabuloso (Nov 24, 2018 11:58AM)
[quote]On Nov 24, 2018, ManxBull wrote:
There's a very good, and rather sinister, cemetery bell routine in Roger Curzon's book 'Dark Matters', available from Lebanon Circle. [/quote]

I'm sorry, are you saying that my exact post comes from the work, your citing? If it does, I'm totally unaware of it and would never try passing off someone else's work, as my own.
Message: Posted by: Lo Pan (Nov 24, 2018 12:35PM)
In response to the above post: I am enjoying this thread and read through all the posts and I donít believe that Manx was accusing you of anything just adding to the thread - adding another resource to help
Message: Posted by: ManxBull (Nov 24, 2018 01:29PM)
[quote]On Nov 24, 2018, Senor Fabuloso wrote:
[quote]On Nov 24, 2018, ManxBull wrote:
There's a very good, and rather sinister, cemetery bell routine in Roger Curzon's book 'Dark Matters', available from Lebanon Circle. [/quote]

I'm sorry, are you saying that my exact post comes from the work, your citing? If it does, I'm totally unaware of it and would never try passing off someone else's work, as my own. [/quote]

No no, not at all. Roger's piece is quite different. I was just pointing to another approach to the story, keeping the theme going. :)
Message: Posted by: Senor Fabuloso (Nov 24, 2018 01:59PM)
Manx thank you. I didn't know of the work in Dark Matters but thought it might be possibility that I had actually, thought of something already in existence. It has happen to me before. Not accusing you of anything and appreciate the contribution :) Just looking for clarification was all. Thank you.
Message: Posted by: the Sponge (Nov 24, 2018 02:16PM)
Mark Strivings put out a booklet with an act revolving around the coffin bell:
https://www.magicbookshop.com/p/sale/the-death-act

Nick created a box and props with this theme:
https://dark-artifacts.com/product/deathwatch/

People on here talked about using the Wenger bell with this theme.
Message: Posted by: Senor Fabuloso (Nov 24, 2018 02:19PM)
So there we have it. Once again what I thought was an original idea, turns out to have existed for quite some time. Live and learn I guess.
Message: Posted by: the Sponge (Nov 24, 2018 02:21PM)
But it's a good idea though.
Message: Posted by: Mind Guerrilla (Nov 26, 2018 05:52PM)
[quote]On Nov 24, 2018, ManxBull wrote:
There's a very good, and rather sinister, cemetery bell routine in Roger Curzon's book 'Dark Matters', available from Lebanon Circle. [/quote]

Do you have a link for this? Thanks.
Message: Posted by: kcalB (Nov 26, 2018 06:37PM)
Marks book is called The Death Act
Message: Posted by: the Sponge (Nov 26, 2018 06:52PM)
[quote]On Nov 26, 2018, Mind Guerrilla wrote:
[quote]On Nov 24, 2018, ManxBull wrote:
There's a very good, and rather sinister, cemetery bell routine in Roger Curzon's book 'Dark Matters', available from Lebanon Circle. [/quote]

Do you have a link for this? Thanks. [/quote]

just Google it; a couple places show up.
Message: Posted by: ManxBull (Nov 27, 2018 08:10AM)
[quote]Do you have a link for this? Thanks. [/quote]

I got mine through Lebanon Circle, but Dan must have sold out as it's not listed there any more.
Message: Posted by: Intrepid (Nov 27, 2018 08:59PM)
[quote]On Nov 26, 2018, Mind Guerrilla wrote:
[quote]On Nov 24, 2018, ManxBull wrote:
There's a very good, and rather sinister, cemetery bell routine in Roger Curzon's book 'Dark Matters', available from Lebanon Circle. [/quote]

Do you have a link for this? Thanks. [/quote]
http://www.lulu.com/us/en/shop/roger-curzon/dark-matters-the-arcane-thaumaturgy-of-dr-jacob-tordoff/hardcover/product-23353915.html
Message: Posted by: Slim King (Nov 28, 2018 03:07PM)
It also lead to the phrase DEAD RINGER.....
Message: Posted by: Winks (Nov 28, 2018 03:29PM)
And the phrase, graveyard shift
Message: Posted by: Nick Birch (Nov 28, 2018 03:44PM)
As well as the phrase Ďsaved by the bellí
Message: Posted by: Intrepid (Nov 28, 2018 04:12PM)
Maybe and maybe not...

"There's no evidence to show that anyone was ever saved by these coffins or even that they were ever put to use, and there's a similar lack of evidence of the phrase 'saved by the bell' ever being used in that sense prior to it having been used in other contexts.
In fact, the expression is boxing slang and it came into being in the latter half of the 19th century. A boxer who is in danger of losing a bout can be 'saved' from defeat by the respite signalled by bell that marks the end of a round. The earliest reference to this that I can find is in the Massachusetts newspaper The Fitchburg Daily Sentinel, February 1893:
"Martin Flaherty defeated Bobby Burns in 32 rounds by a complete knockout. Half a dozen times Flaherty was saved by the bell in the earlier rounds."

There are other popular etymological fallacies related to death - notably dead ringer and graveyard shift."
https://www.phrases.org.uk/meanings/saved-by-the-bell.html

"Dead ringer" originated from horse racing
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dead_ringer_(idiom)

"We have debunked the saved by the bell and dead ringer myths previously, so now let's take a look at 'graveyard shift'. Given that the derivation of the phrases 'saved by the bell' and 'dead ringer' had nothing whatever to do with burials or graveyards, it might be thought that 'graveyard shift' could be dismissed without further investigation. That may be a little hasty. Those phrases may have had nothing to do with bells being attached to coffins to guard against premature burial, but such devices did exist and were occasionally used. Given that some people had sufficient fear of being buried alive to invest in such coffins, it is at least plausible that they would also have made arrangements for someone to monitor the grave so that their coffin's bell could be heard in the event of them ringing it. Nevertheless, and as usual with phrase etymology, plausibility and truth are only distant relatives.
The Graveyard Shift, or Graveyard Watch, was the name coined for the work shift of the early morning, typically midnight until 8am. The name originated in the USA at the latter end of the 1800s. There's no evidence at all that it had anything directly to do with watching over graveyards, merely that the shifts took place in the middle of the night, when the ambience was quiet and lonely.
The earliest example of the phrase in print that I have found is in the US newspaper The Salt Lake Tribune, June 1897:
The police changed shifts for the month yesterday. This month Sergeant Ware takes the morning relief. Sergeant Matt Rhodes the middle and Sergeant John Burbidge the graveyard shift.
The 'graveyard watch' version of the phrase was normally used by sailors on watch - hardly a group in a position to supervise buried coffins. The graveyard link was made explicit in this definition, offered by the American mariner Gershom Bradford, in A Glossary of Sea Terms, 1927:
"Graveyard watch, the middle watch or 12 to 4 a.m., because of the number of disasters that occur at this time."
One more nail in the coffin of folk etymology, let's hope, or can I still hear a faint bell clanking in the Internet graveyard?
https://www.phrases.org.uk/meanings/graveyard-shift.html
Message: Posted by: Wizard of Oz (Nov 28, 2018 06:25PM)
Awesome stuff Intrepid! Thank you.

As fun as false history is to tell, the vague truth like the real origin of "Graveyard Watch," can be just as grimly intriguing.

Like the late Ricky Jay showed us performance after performance, tell the right story and the magic becomes miracle.
Message: Posted by: Christopher Taylor (Nov 28, 2018 07:12PM)
"Saved by the bell" originating from the graveyard makes an AWESOME story. It is however, not true. As many people who have fought in the ring know, it is a boxing term (coined in the 30s). Cheers.

Christopher
Message: Posted by: Slim King (Nov 29, 2018 12:42AM)
I don't trust wiki ... You'll need a better source.... :dancing: :dancing: :dancing: Evidence for Dead Ringer basically defines Ringer, which is common knowledge and then attaches the writers idea of dead....
Message: Posted by: Senor Fabuloso (Nov 29, 2018 04:27AM)
So while authenticity matters to us, I'm not sure it matters to our audiences? Depending on our persona, I'm not sure it should matter to us either? Are we entertainers or professors lecturing? I ask myself these questions over and over again with the answer being, it depends. Because of the plethora of dependencies, I won't even begin to try covering all the bases but in general, I think it more important to be entertaining, than accurate in my presentations. That's just me :)
Message: Posted by: Delimbeau (Nov 29, 2018 04:49AM)
About being burried alive. This is a great novel: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Golden_Egg

Donít watch the related American movie, though. It has a happy end... (eh, and the book hasnít)

Cheers, Luc
Message: Posted by: Philemon Vanderbeck (Nov 29, 2018 07:40AM)
[quote]On Nov 29, 2018, Slim King wrote:
Evidence for Dead Ringer basically defines Ringer, which is common knowledge and then attaches the writers idea of dead.... [/quote]

https://www.phrases.org.uk/meanings/dead-ringer.html
Message: Posted by: Intrepid (Nov 29, 2018 06:29PM)
[quote]On Nov 29, 2018, Senor Fabuloso wrote:
So while authenticity matters to us, I'm not sure it matters to our audiences? Depending on our persona, I'm not sure it should matter to us either? Are we entertainers or professors lecturing? I ask myself these questions over and over again with the answer being, it depends. Because of the plethora of dependencies, I won't even begin to try covering all the bases but in general, I think it more important to be entertaining, than accurate in my presentations. That's just me :) [/quote]
Agreed 100%. The debate on the origin of a few saying is solely for our own nerdy forum bantering and nothing more.
Message: Posted by: Slim King (Nov 29, 2018 11:15PM)
[quote]On Nov 29, 2018, Philemon Vanderbeck wrote:
[quote]On Nov 29, 2018, Slim King wrote:
Evidence for Dead Ringer basically defines Ringer, which is common knowledge and then attaches the writers idea of dead.... [/quote]

https://www.phrases.org.uk/meanings/dead-ringer.html [/quote]
Dead, in the sense of lifeless, is so commonly used that we tend to ignore its other meanings. ..... So THIS is proof???? reminds me of the old mentalism trick .. Common knowledge ...LOL