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Topic: Have Okito boxes...Looking for Something Else.
Message: Posted by: chucklerich (Jan 12, 2019 12:44PM)
I'm at the point with okito boxes where I cannot see myself performing them too often anymore. I am looking for another showpiece that I can use with half dollars to make a number of them dissapear, switch for something else, etc. I know props don't make the magician but my I like having an attention getter I can use for multiple effects. Any constructive help would be appreciated. :spinningcoin:
Message: Posted by: magicalaurie (Jan 12, 2019 06:37PM)
How about a nice cup or chalice?
Message: Posted by: Poof-Daddy (Jan 13, 2019 01:52AM)
Chazpro? I think, made a set called Shamrock Cups. I had and sold a set years ago, not sure if they are still made but there must be some “out there”. Sort of a large shot glass size “Okito” family set. Al Cohen makes (or made) a pretty cool “Miracle Cup” (think chop cup for coins with a special coin gaff included). I just read about this one today while reading “Unexpected Visitor” by Doug Brewer.
Message: Posted by: funsway (Jan 13, 2019 04:33AM)
A Spiral Purse (Rose Purse) can support all of those magic results and more - including effects in the spectator's hand.
I have developed dozens of moves, sleights and handling just waiting good photos to publish.

a natural item for carrying coins and other objects whose design allows for secret loading and steals during normal handling. (no gaff) cheap too!



Write me ken@eversway.com if interested
Message: Posted by: chucklerich (Jan 22, 2019 11:27PM)
[quote]On Jan 12, 2019, magicalaurie wrote:
How about a nice cup or chalice? [/quote]

Are there any specially made for coin magic?
Message: Posted by: magicalaurie (Jan 22, 2019 11:45PM)
Yes, as mentioned by Poof-Daddy, above, but you can also use any cup you fancy that suits your coins and presentation style, too. I'd consider it a treasure hunt, but that might just be me. :)
Message: Posted by: funsway (Jan 23, 2019 03:47AM)
A collapsible metal cup called a "bike cup" has an interior base the size of a Kennedy Half/English Penny. The removable lid can also be used in effects. Can hang on your belt

The lower portion is mildly magnetically attractive, so an exterior magnet can be placed their easily to gaff the cup to retain a shimmed coin,
or a Chop type routine. In collapsed form it can allow for some Okito handlings as well.

It is silver so I prefer Pennies or a CSB set for contrast, but have also used gold dollars and brass tokens
Message: Posted by: Kanawati (Jan 23, 2019 05:19PM)
Some cards or a transparent silk maybe? I guess the items themselves wouldn't be considered showpieces but I've seen them used to create nice showpieces:) Cards for a matrix routine. I've also really enjoyed watching coins through a transparent silk, specifically the versions performed by Al Schneider and Chris Power. From more of a comedy angle, those saltshakers that squeak can be attention getters. I'm thinking of something along the lines of Silver and Salt by Giovanni Livera.
Message: Posted by: Jerry (Jan 23, 2019 07:18PM)
There is the Xray or transparent Okito box.
Message: Posted by: chucklerich (Jan 23, 2019 10:18PM)
[quote]On Jan 23, 2019, funsway wrote:
A collapsible metal cup called a "bike cup" has an interior base the size of a Kennedy Half/English Penny. The removable lid can also be used in effects. Can hang on your belt

The lower portion is mildly magnetically attractive, so an exterior magnet can be placed their easily to gaff the cup to retain a shimmed coin,
or a Chop type routine. In collapsed form it can allow for some Okito handlings as well.

It is silver so I prefer Pennies or a CSB set for contrast, but have also used gold dollars and brass tokens [/quote]


I did a google search for this and all I saw were bicycle cup holders....can you provide a link or brand name please?
Message: Posted by: funsway (Jan 24, 2019 02:48AM)
Perhaps that term is outmoded. I got a dozen in 2009

search on Amazon:

Great Rocky Stainless Steel Portable Outdoor Travel Camping Folding Collapsible Cup Metal Telescopic Keychain 75ml
Message: Posted by: magojose| (Jan 26, 2019 03:24PM)
Having issues with an Okito box’s look is the same that having trouble performing stage magic due the fact that it never looks like normal props. Just embrace the fact that coin boxes are weird as hell nowdays as it sure was at Okito’s time
Message: Posted by: David Neighbors (Jan 26, 2019 04:54PM)
The box came from th real world ! It was a pill box! But it was made from cardboard ! :)
Message: Posted by: magojose| (Jan 26, 2019 07:03PM)
[quote]On Jan 26, 2019, David Neighbors wrote:
The box came from th real world ! It was a pill box! But it was made from cardboard ! :) [/quote]


I know the whole story about how Okito “discover” this property of a pill box, but for sure it was crazy to use it to hold coins instead of pills, but I think is part of the presentation give any solution or justification or not given any at all
Message: Posted by: funsway (Jan 27, 2019 12:36AM)
I have always given a reason for the brass rather than the box - and it seems to get the proper nods of understanding.

example:

"Different metals align magic energy in unusual ways. Brass is a good insulator while the silver in that coin may seem warm to you."
Message: Posted by: David Neighbors (Jan 27, 2019 01:20PM)
[quote]On Jan 26, 2019, magojose |wrote:
[quote]On Jan 26, 2019, David Neighbors wrote:
The box came from th real world ! It was a pill box! But it was made from cardboard ! :) [/quote]


I know the whole story about how Okito “discover” this property of a pill box, but for sure it was crazy to use it to hold coins instead of pills, but I think is part of the presentation give any solution or justification or not given any at all [/quote]

Crazy ----- Yea where Magicians !!! :)
Message: Posted by: chucklerich (Jan 29, 2019 11:33AM)
I think we're getting off point here....is there another prop for vanishing, transposition and production of coins that has some well established routines to it etc. I found the cup that funsway mentioned. But are there routines for its use? And I don't want any one trick ponies if you get my meaning. :spinningcoin:
Message: Posted by: Julie (Jan 29, 2019 11:53AM)
You can find small wooden boxes at Pier I Imports, Hobby Lobby etc. that are a little crudely made, but attractive nonetheless.

An unintended benefit to the crude construction is that often there is a gap on the inside between a wall of the box and the floor.

This gap enables the box to be used as a "slot box" with thin oriental coins. A good place to carry your coins, too.

Julie
Message: Posted by: Bill Hegbli (Jan 29, 2019 12:24PM)
[quote]On Jan 29, 2019, chucklerich wrote:
I think we're getting off point here....is there another prop for vanishing, transposition and production of coins that has some well established routines to it etc. I found the cup that funsway mentioned. But are there routines for its use? And I don't want any one trick ponies if you get my meaning. :spinningcoin: [/quote]


No there is not any other prop that is as versatile as the Okito Box. Do you have the booklet on the box as well, you could find more effects with it in that booklet.

Other props are a one routine effect.

To bad Johnson Products has disappeared, they use to make additional boxes that one could expand on with the box, ending in a sold brass box that was a hunk of brass.
Message: Posted by: David Neighbors (Jan 29, 2019 02:38PM)
Yea The Boston Box ( without A coin stuck in the bottom ) Is great !!! I have a book on it! :)
Message: Posted by: chucklerich (Jan 29, 2019 03:06PM)
[quote]On Jan 29, 2019, Bill Hegbli wrote:
[quote]On Jan 29, 2019, chucklerich wrote:
I think we're getting off point here....is there another prop for vanishing, transposition and production of coins that has some well established routines to it etc. I found the cup that funsway mentioned. But are there routines for its use? And I don't want any one trick ponies if you get my meaning. :spinningcoin: [/quote]


No there is not any other prop that is as versatile as the Okito Box. Do you have the booklet on the box as well, you could find more effects with it in that booklet.

Other props are a one routine effect.

To bad Johnson Products has disappeared, they use to make additional boxes that one could expand on with the box, ending in a sold brass box that was a hunk of brass. [/quote]



So your saying in the over 400 years of magic there is no other prop that does what the okito box allows you to?
Message: Posted by: tom_stamm (Jan 29, 2019 06:07PM)
I’ve used okito boxes for over thirty years. not once have I ever been asked about or challenge to what it was. it was just the box my coins were kept it. (albeit weird stuff happened with the coins and the box at the beginning and end of my coin routine, but I always just treated like a box and never explain it).

this last year I started using a quiver+ wallet and treat it the same way. it is just something I keep the coins in. (albeit weird stuff along the way....)
Message: Posted by: Jerry (Jan 30, 2019 02:55PM)
This?:
https://www.copelandcoins.com/products/traveler-coin-artists-wallet?variant=29097539019

Or this?:
https://www.copelandcoins.com/

Or this?:
https://www.mymagic.com/p/walk-around-magic/quiver-kelvin-chow

Or this?:
https://www.vikingmagic.com/product/wizard-coin-cups/

chucklerich - in your research, what have you found?
Message: Posted by: Julie (Jan 30, 2019 09:04PM)
Plan "B" is to obtain Bobo's (or any other "updated" book, if that's your pleasure) and learn real sleight of hand.

Then you can use any container that strikes your fancy.

Julie
Message: Posted by: Jerry (Jan 30, 2019 09:22PM)
"To bad Johnson Products has disappeared, they use to make additional boxes that one could expand on with the box, ending in a sold brass box that was a hunk of brass".

Johnson Magic is still around and they still make the plug box. Never did like the "sucker" plug box bit.

Go here:
https://www.johnsonmagicproducts.com/shop/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=94&zenid=cc855ac3de60b44483436db0fa339809
Message: Posted by: Dougini (Jan 31, 2019 01:03AM)
I got the O-Korto box set. Then, later I got all the Chazpro boxes. And, like the OP, I got bored. Then, somehow, I learned about Dave Neighbors book:

https://coinjurer.com/?product=the-professional-coin-box-magic-of-dave-neighbors

I have a RENEWED enthusiasm for these! The very first trick in the book, is what I'm working on now. Dave's boxes are the Chazpro Buddha line:

https://cdn6.bigcommerce.com/s-rzbcrah0/products/392/images/592/BuddhaBX__33086.1414611663.356.300.jpg?c=2

But I like the Johnson O-Korto Box set! I don't use the "small" box. I also see no point in the "plug" box. It signifies an OBVIOUS switch. Not a fan of the mag boxes. I've lost too many mag and shimmed halves to mess with them. Keeping it simple. Ungaffed halves and an ungaffed Okito box or Boston Box. And now, I've been alerted that Chazpro has a DOLLAR size box in Buddha!

http://www.chazpro.com/buddha-okito-box-dollar-size-brass/

My hands are pretty small, but I bet I could run the thing! I'm a sucker for these Buddha boxes! Bill's right. In 400 years, I do NOT believe there is ANYTHING like the Okito Box!

My .02...

Doug
Message: Posted by: Dougini (Jan 31, 2019 01:08AM)
Ya know...thinking about it...there are these:

https://www.vikingmagic.com/product/wizard-coin-cups/

But these ARE a sort of "one trick pony". there are DOZENS of routines with the Okito Box.

Jes' saying...
Message: Posted by: David Neighbors (Jan 31, 2019 09:03AM)
Hi Doug,
Thanks So much Man ! :) But there is Shell stuff With A box in there too! :)
Message: Posted by: Jerry (Jan 31, 2019 12:04PM)
The original post require the use of a prop.

In coin magic there is very little available that is on the same level of versatility as the Okito coin box.

So until someone comes up with another item like Okito box, then the answer is "Yes, - over 400 years of magic there is NO other prop that does what the okito box allows you to".

Please prove me wrong.
Message: Posted by: chucklerich (Jan 31, 2019 02:15PM)
[quote]On Jan 29, 2019, Bill Hegbli wrote:
[quote]On Jan 29, 2019, chucklerich wrote:
I think we're getting off point here....is there another prop for vanishing, transposition and production of coins that has some well established routines to it etc. I found the cup that funsway mentioned. But are there routines for its use? And I don't want any one trick ponies if you get my meaning. :spinningcoin: [/quote]


No there is not any other prop that is as versatile as the Okito Box. Do you have the booklet on the box as well, you could find more effects with it in that booklet.

Other props are a one routine effect.

To bad Johnson Products has disappeared, they use to make additional boxes that one could expand on with the box, ending in a sold brass box that was a hunk of brass. [/quote]


they stiil exist ive the same problem with their okito addons.
Message: Posted by: funsway (Feb 1, 2019 07:28AM)
[quote]On Jan 29, 2019, chucklerich wrote:
I think we're getting off point here....is there another prop for vanishing, transposition and production of coins that has some well established routines to it etc. I found the cup that funsway mentioned. But are there routines for its use? And I don't want any one trick ponies if you get my meaning. :spinningcoin: [/quote]

I suggested that Bike Cup because you originally asked for "an attention getter I can use for multiple effects." Now this has changed to "well established routines" that you can copy/emulate.

-- a big difference for me. I assumed that you were looking for something that allowed your own creativity to come into play. "Other than Okito" could mean "other than boring."

No problem -- I would have noted earlier that an eBook "Co-Lapse" has dozens of effects using such a cup. Plus, many Okito effects can be performed when it is collapsed.
Since this cup can be gaffed/ungaffed "on the fly" most ChopCup effects/routines can be performed as well. Even coins to glass effects.

Are you limited to coins? Many well established routines with small object (even C&B) can be performed using such a cup.

I also have dozens of effects and routines using a Spiral Coin Purse. It can work alone or be paired with a box or cup. The problem is that the sleights and moves are new and not well established. They only use principles older than an Okito Box. I do not create new effects/routines just to be different, but find in every object a potential fir orchestrating magic in the spectator's mind.
There is value in "traditional" and value in "new and different." Not sure where "well established" fits in.

I guess I am suggesting that you might look at the end result desired with your intended audience -- then work backwards to the ideal prop or technique to get it done. No prop or method should ever drive the creation/selection of a routine. It is great that you are looking 'outside the box" but now have no idea what you are really looking for.
Message: Posted by: The Gold Coin (Feb 3, 2019 08:13PM)
If you like Okito boxes and their friends, I'd suggest a coin cup. Al Cohen's Miracle coin cup is probably the best one to start out with, but it's extremely difficult to find (try searching for local magic shops that have a website you can order from). Ronjo also makes a great cup that's readily available. If you're curious about the differences, PM me.

Doug Brewer has a small book out for the coin cup, and some of those routines appear on NYCMS (volume 15). IMO that's plenty of material for the prop. To be fair, the coin cup can't compete with the Okito box for sheer volume of material, but the effects it can generate are great.
Message: Posted by: chucklerich (Feb 11, 2019 10:17AM)
[quote]On Jan 29, 2019, Bill Hegbli wrote:
[quote]On Jan 29, 2019, chucklerich wrote:
I think we're getting off point here....is there another prop for vanishing, transposition and production of coins that has some well established routines to it etc. I found the cup that funsway mentioned. But are there routines for its use? And I don't want any one trick ponies if you get my meaning. :spinningcoin: [/quote]


No there is not any other prop that is as versatile as the Okito Box. Do you have the booklet on the box as well, you could find more effects with it in that booklet.


Other props are a one routine effect.

To bad Johnson Products has disappeared, they use to make additional boxes that one could expand on with the box, ending in a sold brass box that was a hunk of brass. [/quote]

Yes I have the Mohammed Bey Book. The Section I got he most from is the last few pages where different ways of turning and loading the box are discussed. If I could find a book full of moves like that I'd be one happy camper.
Message: Posted by: chucklerich (Apr 20, 2019 08:13PM)
[quote]No there is not any other prop that is as versatile as the Okito Box. Do you have the booklet on the box as well, you could find more effects with it in that booklet.

Other props are a one routine effect.

To bad Johnson Products has disappeared, they use to make additional boxes that one could expand on with the box, ending in a sold brass box that was a hunk of brass. [/quote]

My hands aren't of a size that I could switch boxes.

Yes, I have the Mohammed Bey book, for me the last pages, where McLaughlin shares hus favorite moves is the most helpful part for me. If I could find a book(let) with just different moves to do different things with the Okito box (like what Bobo did for coin work) I would be so happy to get my hands on that. At one point I was going to do a "transporter" effect with 2 Okito Boxes(both in full view) but because the material I have on the boxes is limited I gave up on the idea.
Message: Posted by: Jerry (Apr 20, 2019 09:16PM)
To change everything about the Okito Coin Box, go here:

https://gumroad.com/l/ThsI
Message: Posted by: dpe666 (May 7, 2019 06:36PM)
Https://www.amgmagic.com/product/the-boston-tea-party-by-david-devlin-and-amg-magic-video-download/
Message: Posted by: st3v13 (May 8, 2019 01:28AM)
Mobius wallet?
Message: Posted by: Dynamike (May 21, 2019 10:23PM)
[quote]On Jan 12, 2019, chucklerich wrote:
I'm at the point with okito boxes where I cannot see myself performing them too often anymore. I am looking for another showpiece that I can use with half dollars to make a number of them dissapear, switch for something else, etc. I know props don't make the magician but my I like having an attention getter I can use for multiple effects. Any constructive help would be appreciated. :spinningcoin: [/quote]
I think the learning material you have is not interesting you. Check this out:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=alUh14_MJKk&feature=youtu.be
Message: Posted by: Michael Rubinstein (May 22, 2019 07:20AM)
Curtis Kam reveals his work on the Okito box in his Penguin show, available June 2.
Message: Posted by: algebraic (Jun 9, 2019 08:53AM)
I'm not sure if this will interest you, but Midus Cups At Viking Mfg. may be worth a look.
Message: Posted by: Jonathan Townsend (Jun 9, 2019 02:05PM)
The coin box is kinda like having a third hand.

Look in Greater Magic. What do you think of the coin easle?
Message: Posted by: Jeff O (Aug 25, 2019 04:08AM)
Shameless plug: I have the Chazpro set of coin cups for sale over in the for sale section. https://www.themagiccafe.com/forums/viewtopic.php?topic=698890&forum=76
Message: Posted by: Bill Hegbli (Sep 23, 2019 11:43AM)
Here is the Johnson Products list of boxes and the Plug, they have sold for years. Great props and great magic.

https://www.johnsonmagicproducts.com/shop/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=94&zenid=71cc2b03f0d9ff7f4edea26de9a00eb8


:spinningcoin:
Message: Posted by: J Burke Whittaker (Sep 28, 2019 11:57AM)
I wanted to toss in my two cents on the justification for the box some have mentioned earlier on hope no one minds too much:

I have used my Okito box stuff for as long as I can remember and I do not think I will ever drop it. There are so many things that can be done with it. I have found that if you never bring up the subject of what the box is no one else will either. One subtlety I use when I perform is to hand the box to a spectator to hold while you show them the coins which were inside. I drop the lid into their hand, then dump the coins into my hand, then drop the bottom along with the lid.

The reason for this is to allow the person to feel the parts separately and to see what they are. They will inevitably fool around with the pieces and at the very least put them back together.

This queues the rest that if it were "tricky" that I would never just drop into a persons hand and never it give it a thought. This registers on a subconscious level for the audience. This is solely based on how the brain perceives the world and determines if something is suspicious. If a burglar walks up to an empty house and walks in no one ever thinks "hey is he supposed to be there..." but if he walks up and messes around with the door and looks to see if anyone is looking it draws suspicion.

Same exact thing just with less larceny; by dropping it and looking away no thinks it is odd; paw at it, toss it around, and make it the center of attention and now they want to know more about it. If you have too many people asking what it is it might be you are making them suspicious about it from the off.


.