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Topic: Top ten card stars... Living today!
Message: Posted by: bishthemagish (May 31, 2004 06:12PM)
Back in the old days of the Spinx Mag they had a list of what the mag said were the top ten or 20 card magicians in the US.

Who would be your Choice of the top ten card stars in the USA? They have to be living magicians...

This is who I would choose not voting for myself as one of them. And it is not in any first to last order.

Jimmy Cards Molinari, Steve Draun, Bill Malone, Darwin Ortiz, Steve Forte, Randy Wakeman, Dan Fleshman, Josh Jay, Michael Ammar, Ron Kaye...

Based on people I have seen work. There are other magicians who are also outstanding card men but these people I have seen work...

What would be your choices?
Message: Posted by: Pete Biro (May 31, 2004 06:22PM)
Tamariz
Steve Freeman
Bruce Cervon
Alex Elmsley
Persi Diaconis
Jon Racherbaumer
Earle Nelson
Daryl
Darwin Ortiz
Michael Close
Message: Posted by: NeoMagic (May 31, 2004 06:27PM)
Pete, are they all from/in the USA?
Message: Posted by: Cameron Roat (May 31, 2004 07:12PM)
From what I've seen and heard...

Allan Ackerman
Bruce Cervon
Daryl
Persi Diaconis
Steve Draun
Alex Elmsley
Steve Forte
Steve Freeman
Jimmy Cards Molinari
Darwin Ortiz
Message: Posted by: Jonathan Townsend (May 31, 2004 07:21PM)
Can we limit this down to those who are WORKING performers?

We could have quite a list if we include those of us who dabble.

This would also take folks like Persi Diaconis, Steve Freeman, Paul Chosse and Ken Krenzel off the hook as top guns.
Message: Posted by: Jordini (May 31, 2004 07:30PM)
Don't forget Aaron Fisher & Lennart Green
Message: Posted by: Review King (May 31, 2004 07:56PM)
Rickey Jay is up there!!!
Message: Posted by: Kevin Ram (May 31, 2004 07:59PM)
Jay, Wimurst, Piacente OK not all American but who cares they need a mention.

England, Wilson... These are the ones off the top of my head who haven't been mentioned
Message: Posted by: sgrossberg (May 31, 2004 08:30PM)
Add Martin Nash and Richard Turner.
Message: Posted by: Reis O'Brien (May 31, 2004 08:46PM)
Racherbaumer!
Message: Posted by: Oz Fan (May 31, 2004 09:11PM)
In no order at all: Michael Ammar, Ricky Jay, Daryl, Darwin Ortiz, Phil Goldstein, Allan Ackerman, Michael Close, Lennart Green, Alex Elmsley, and Bill Malone.
Message: Posted by: Reis O'Brien (May 31, 2004 11:05PM)
I thought for sure you were going to name Oz Pearlman!
Message: Posted by: Mike Powers (May 31, 2004 11:10PM)
What about Bill Kalush and Gary Plants! And, of course, Allan Ackerman.
Message: Posted by: Ctgalex (Jun 1, 2004 02:34AM)
Juan Tamariz, Darwin Ortiz, Daryl, Pit Hartling, Jean Pierre, Andrew Whimhurst, Lennart Green, Barry Goven, Guy Hollingworth, Ricky Jay
Message: Posted by: Pablo Tejero (Jun 1, 2004 02:50AM)
Well, the original post asked for a Top Ten USA, but as long as people preferred to answer with a World Top Ten... here is my choice (in no particular order):

- Juan Tamariz
- Michael Ammar
- Lennart Green
- Martin Nash
- Ricky Jay
- Andrew Wimhurst
- Darwin Ortiz
- Guy Hollingworth
- Roberto Giobbi
- Bill Malone

(I thought a lot of writing Blaine´s name in the top... :rotf: )

All the best magic,

Pablo Tejero :bikes:
Message: Posted by: JasonEngland (Jun 1, 2004 03:06AM)
[quote]
On 2004-05-31 19:12, bishthemagish wrote:
Jimmy Cards Molinari, Steve Draun, Bill Malone, Darwin Ortiz, Steve Forte, Randy Wakeman, Dan Fleshman, Josh Jay, Michael Ammar, Ron Kaye...
[/quote]

Bish,

Please refrain from mentioning Steve Forte and Michael Ammar in the same post from this point on.

Jason
Message: Posted by: Tielie (Jun 1, 2004 03:44AM)
Please explain yourself.

(I can't vote since I haven't seen any magicians)
Message: Posted by: dg (Jun 1, 2004 05:32AM)
Bit unfair, just limiting it to USA.
IMHO I'd say Gerry Sadowitz.
Message: Posted by: bishthemagish (Jun 1, 2004 09:11AM)
By this list I left out a lot of great card stars... Thank you all for adding them.
Message: Posted by: tommy (Jun 1, 2004 09:53AM)
Thank you Bish for this question it is helpful for someone like me who is not familular with all these card men to know who is highly regarded by magi when it comes to buying books and DVDs etc. I do think a world wide choice would be better even though the list would probably be dominated by USA card men. Also would it not be better or easier to name one each and then we could tot up the vote to see who the top ten are in order?

From the few I know I would vote for Ricky Jay.
Message: Posted by: MField2000 (Jun 1, 2004 11:34AM)
I'd add Harvey Rosenthal, Lee Asher, Jack Carpenter, and Ken Krenzel.. And, although he's not from the U.S., Peter Duffie.

Matt Field
Message: Posted by: jcards01 (Jun 1, 2004 11:39AM)
I surprised there is no mention of "Roy Walton", presumably the best cardman on the planet!
Message: Posted by: therntier (Jun 1, 2004 11:41AM)
How about James Swain.
Message: Posted by: Jonathan Townsend (Jun 1, 2004 12:02PM)
How about in terms of $$$ of product sold?

Does Ammar have a top ten spot now?
Message: Posted by: Pete Biro (Jun 1, 2004 12:12PM)
I hear an echo... :)

Posted: Jun 1, 2004 1:14pm

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
In the early days, Vernon, Scarne, etc., a top 10 list was possible cuz there were maybe only 30 or so in the whole world that were any good...

Now a list is impossible as the rest of the world, England, Spain, Australia, Germany, etc. etc., have caught up... and there are maybe a hundred or so guys that are miles better than the original "card stars."
Message: Posted by: bishthemagish (Jun 1, 2004 12:21PM)
Thanks Pete. They were the card stars that put down the foundation in card magic that people like me built and were able to learn from.
Message: Posted by: tommy (Jun 1, 2004 12:24PM)
Pete.

You mean to say you can not do the impossible! Get a grip. What sort of magician are you?
Message: Posted by: RiffClown (Jun 1, 2004 01:43PM)
Joel Givens - If you know or have seen him, you'll agree.
Message: Posted by: briantwig (Jun 1, 2004 01:51PM)
How this thread could get this long without anyone mentioning Steve Beam is beyond me.
Message: Posted by: Justin Hart (Jun 1, 2004 01:53PM)
Hands down, Ray Kosby.
Then David Blaine...hahahah yeah right.

Actually a seat of honor belongs to Simon Aronson for ALL his work, not just the memorized stack work.
Message: Posted by: Kevin Ram (Jun 1, 2004 02:22PM)
Calling it top US stars is way out of date.
There are so many top card men outside of the USA now that it makes sense to say world's top card men.

As said in the above posts there's Sadowitz, also Vincent, Green etc.
Message: Posted by: MField2000 (Jun 1, 2004 04:10PM)
Oops. Left off Bruce Cervon. Also Wesley James and Earnest Earick.

Matt Field
Message: Posted by: jcigam (Jun 1, 2004 04:15PM)
Steve Ehlers! (definately in the top ten) One of the most under-rated card guys of all time. If you know his work, you know what I mean.

Jered
Message: Posted by: roya (Jun 1, 2004 04:43PM)
[quote]
On 2004-06-01 03:50, Pablo Tejero wrote:
Well, the original post asked for a Top Ten USA, but as long as people preferred to answer with a World Top Ten... here is my choice (in no particular order):

- Juan Tamariz
- Michael Ammar
- Lennart Green
- Martin Nash
- Ricky Jay
- Andrew Wimhurst
- Darwin Ortiz
- Guy Hollingworth
- Roberto Giobbi
- Bill Malone

(I thought a lot of writing Blaine´s name in the top... :rotf: )

All the best magic,

Pablo Tejero :bikes:
[/quote]

Michael Ammar? Top 10? Are we talking about the same guy? :)
Message: Posted by: rickmagic1 (Jun 1, 2004 04:59PM)
Here's my take on the list.

- Juan Tamariz
- Rene Levand
- Ricky Jay
- Jamy Ian Swiss
- Johnny Thompson
- Guy Hollingworth
- Roberto Giobbi
- Bill Malone
- Harry Lorayne
- Jon Racherbaumer


I'm definite that there are many more, but I just can't come up with any "masters" right now.

Rick
Message: Posted by: Kevin Ram (Jun 1, 2004 05:47PM)
Mine are ..David Blaine
.... Criss Angel
..... Paul Zenon
..... Paul Daniels

and my uncle who pulled a coin from behind my ear David Copperfield eat your heart out.
Message: Posted by: Mike Walton (Jun 1, 2004 06:30PM)
Based on ability to entertain a crowd with card magic, then I could only add Bill Malone. He really stands out among the crowd in this category IMHO.
Message: Posted by: DrewWiester (Jun 1, 2004 08:55PM)
I would think that Lee Asher might be included in this topic.
Message: Posted by: NJJ (Jun 1, 2004 09:25PM)
What do you base it on?

There is a bit subjective with no real selection criteria!
Message: Posted by: Che (Jun 2, 2004 12:05AM)
I think it's based on your opinion and imagination.
Message: Posted by: TheGreatDane (Jun 2, 2004 01:02AM)
I can't believe no one's mentioned Simon Lovell! Granted, he's originally from England, but he's been working in the States for a long time.
Message: Posted by: Dorian Rhodell (Jun 2, 2004 02:42AM)
As noted already many different times here and in other threads, is the fact that this question is very subjective. The question had no parameters so the answers carry little weight. Every time a question like this is posed, everyone feels compelled to chime in and give an opinion. Eventually threads like these die because the people you were going to mention have already been mentioned by someone who never saw them but heard about them from someone who borrowed the DVD and forgot to give it back to the person they originally borrowed it from ad nauseum.
So why don't we try to ask questions with parameters? The answers you all seek will be more defined. For example instead of asking a vague question such as "who is the best card magician", maybe we should ask "who is the best using the diagonal palm shift or pass or whatever". On top of that, maybe we should write WHY that person is the best at that certain thing. What road did that person travel down to become the "best" at that certain thing? (That would be interesting in itself).
There is no best or top ten. And if there was...do you really care that much? Are you a better magician for it? Did you get any useful info out of it? What can you possibly gain knowing the names of the top ten magicians? (Also keep in mind that this IS the internet and you should consider your sources). If questions can be structured in a way that the person posing the question can really narrow it down to find out the information they need, maybe their answers will be more...shall we say...informative.

Best,

Dorian Rhodell
Message: Posted by: Pablo Tejero (Jun 2, 2004 02:48AM)
[quote]
On 2004-06-01 17:43, roya wrote:
Michael Ammar? Top 10? Are we talking about the same guy? :)
[/quote]

Yes, we are talking about the same guy.

For me a great cardician is not only a great tecnician. He should be a great magician, and in my opinion Michael is a great magician and cardician and sure he is one of the best close-up magicians in the whole history, and a great person also. That´s why I voted him, but if you like I could explain the others votes also.

All the best magic,

Pablo Tejero :bikes:
Message: Posted by: Thomas J. Polis (Jun 6, 2004 05:29PM)
My opinion limits me to only the performers I have seen in person, and that has not been too many.

I like Buddy Farnan - He makes cards fun. Great interaction with the audience!

From what I remember, Frank Yuen was really creative with cards.

And if you think of card productions with gloves on, or have ever seen him do a cold, classic force - it's Billy Bishop!
(Yes. I know he passed away, but he lives eternally in my heart!)

And there was this other guy a very long time ago who taught me a handful of "Aces" routines. His technical skills were awesome and had quite a lot of patience in showing a lanky, clumbsy guy how to do some awesome card routines.
The guy was a pudgey little kid who use to manage a magic shop in Oak Park, Illinois and he had a bit of a wandering eye. He moved away from the Chicago area and I think he went on to do great work with a hyno show.

What is his name? .... I am trying really hard to recall! Sure wish I could remember his name! Ummmmmm....


Oh, yeah. His name is Glenn Bishop.
(...and it is spelled with 2 "N"s!)
Message: Posted by: zombieboy (Jun 6, 2004 05:43PM)
As stated before, Alan Ackerman and Jamy Ian Swiss undecidedly make the list. The best of the best.
Message: Posted by: hnegash (Jun 7, 2004 12:05AM)
A couple of nights ago I had the oppurtunity to witness the magic of "Jack the Ripper". The card trick he did was more stunning than his name. He had me shuffle and cut the pack. He then asked me to cut a portion into his hand. After receiving the packet he looked me in the eyes and said 15 cards. He then proceeded to count the cards, and there were in fact 15 cards, but as an extra bonus the last card counted was an Ace. He did this three more times, each time it was a different number of cards and the last card counted was always an Ace. A stunning piece of magic. I'm still losing sleep over it.

Henok
Message: Posted by: camador (Jun 7, 2004 04:01AM)
What comes to mind right now,

Juan Tamariz
Darwin Ortiz
Allen Ackerman
Steve Forte
Andrew Wimhurst
Bill Malone
Martin Nash
Jerry Sadowitz
Michael Vincent
Guy Holliworth

saludos
Message: Posted by: Pablo Tejero (Jun 7, 2004 04:31AM)
Gracias Camador for the remember!

How could I forget Andrew Wimhurst? What a great cardician he is!

All the best magic,

Pablo Tejero :bikes:
Message: Posted by: michaelvincent (Jun 7, 2004 04:54AM)
Ditto for Andrew Wimhusrt. The devil from down under rocks. I love Andrew's Awesome Foursome routine and his Ultimate Topsy Turvy Aces.

We have never met but look forward to the day when we do.

Mike Vincent
London
Message: Posted by: Pablo Tejero (Jun 7, 2004 05:44AM)
Michael, if you want meet him you only have to come to Spain in less than a month to the Spanish National Convention of Magic, take a look here for more info http://www.themagiccafe.com/forums/viewtopic.php?topic=71626&forum=31&0

All the best magic,

Pablo Tejero :bikes:
Message: Posted by: flourish dude (Jun 7, 2004 11:50AM)
There is not a thing wrong with Ammar. I am sure you have learned something from him. So get off it
Message: Posted by: Phil Pearce (Jun 7, 2004 06:06PM)
My take on top ten living, performing card men.
Juan Tamariz
Alan Ackerman
Johnny Thompson
Andrew Wimhurst
Bill Malone
Daryl
Jerry Sadowitz
Eric Anderson
Guy Hollingsworth
Darwin Ortiz

Of course, limiting to ten, there will always be disagreements. But hey, that's what a forum is for. Good topic.
Message: Posted by: Dennis Loomis (Jun 7, 2004 07:54PM)
No way can this be limited to ten. So many great names have already been mentioned. Just to be different and come up with a couple new ones:
Bob Stencil
Ron Bauer
Nick Trost
Message: Posted by: bishthemagish (Jun 8, 2004 11:47AM)
[quote]
On 2004-06-02 03:42, Dorian Rhodell wrote:

What can you possibly gain knowing the names of the top ten magicians?

Best,

Dorian Rhodell


[/quote]

Top ten CARD MAGICIANS IN THE USA...

The reason I started this thread was to find out who and what people like in card magic. I already started a thread on on card magic as to who are the best card magic entertainers.

The information was that the two top card entertainers were Ricky Jay and Bill Malone.

There are other great card entertainers out there but they were the most often mentoned in that thread.

So I started a thread on skill not entertainment. And because card magic is an art form when done well. And art is a personal point of view and is subjective...

I wrote the post in the manor above.

What this tells me is several things. Because the information comes from many different points of view. People like different kinds of skill with card magic. They like the teaching and routines of Michael Ammar...

And they like the skill of the card sharp methods of Steve Forte...

Two different sides of the same yard stick.

The interesting thing is that back in Dai Vernon's day there were no video's or DVD's when the Spix gave us a list of the top ten card stars.

So when Vernon went to New York the only way you could see him was Live - and you would have to go to New York to do so.

Now we have video's and DVD's and if you get the video or the DVD you can see a great card magicians work in your own living room.

This has not only let us see them but also learn from them...

The video/DVD has pushed card magic forward and I find it most interesting to read who likes who in card magic.

Thank you all for posting...
Message: Posted by: Mike Powers (Jun 8, 2004 03:16PM)
Awhile back Jon Racherbaumer had a top 10 list. It may have been in MAGIC Magazine. Two names from Jon's list that I haven't seen on other lists in this post are Bill Kalush and Paul Chosse.

Mike
Message: Posted by: Chris Larson (Jun 8, 2004 03:41PM)
Earl Nelson is the best that I have had the pleasure to watch
Message: Posted by: bishthemagish (Jun 8, 2004 03:45PM)
And I consider Mike Powers a great many with a deck of cards. Also Jon Racherbaumer of course. And two less known magicians that I used to hang out with Al Bach and Jim Gleason.
Message: Posted by: Logan Five (Jun 9, 2004 01:58AM)
Ok.. here's mine: Ricky Jay
Andrew Wimhurst
Darwin Ortiz
Martin Nash
Jack Carpenter
Allan Ackerman
Lennert Green
Greg Wilson
Jon Racherbaumer
& more recently Simon Lovell
Message: Posted by: NJJ (Jun 9, 2004 02:15AM)
Might I just say that Andrew Wimhurst is a close personal friend of mine and that actually he is a very poor magician who kicks puppies for kicks.

(just kidding andrew)

I've known Andrew for many years and he has taught me a great deal. His attention to detail and dedication to his style and presentation has set the bar very high for me. If it wasn't for him and Phil Bevan I wouldn't be full time pro today.

In fact, for many years I wouldn't accept a booking for someone asking for a card sharp or card magician unless I knew that Andrew had turned it down first because I didn't think it was fair to sell myself as a card magician when someone like him was in town.

But since I learnt about the puppy kicking....
Message: Posted by: ASW (Jun 9, 2004 12:52PM)
I'm speechless.

It was me or the puppy. I swear.
Message: Posted by: TheAmbitiousCard (Jun 9, 2004 01:41PM)
Nobody ever picks me :(
Message: Posted by: Paul Chosse (Jun 9, 2004 06:41PM)
[quote]
On 2004-06-08 16:16, Mike Powers wrote:
Awhile back Jon Racherbaumer had a top 10 list. It may have been in MAGIC Magazine. Two names from Jon's list that I haven't seen on other lists in this post are Bill Kalush and Paul Chosse.

Mike
[/quote]

Hi Mike!

That was an interesting list Jon did. He later amended it and did several other lists. The criteria for each was different, and I think there was a good reason for that. There are dozens of great cardmen alive, and how you draw a top ten list is a very subjective thing. So, Jon did the next best thing: he defined the qualifications for the list, and made them different for each list. He ended up with three "Top Ten" lists!

He had the "Theatrical", "Pure Skill", and "Old Guard" categories, and then the "Those Who Do Not Easily Fit Into Any Category" (which suits them just fine!) Category! That was the one I wound up in!

Hell, I'm glad I'm on any list at all, even a hit list! Come to think of it, maybe Rockie was doing just that, setting us all up for the young guns... I notice he didn't put himself on any of those lists - and that ain't cuz he's modest!

Best,

PSC
Message: Posted by: Pete Biro (Jun 9, 2004 08:20PM)
Franks Starsini heads my feces roster :kermit:
Message: Posted by: Michael238 (Jun 9, 2004 09:36PM)
Bill Malone and Daryl .

Hey Pete, when are coming out with a DVD?
Message: Posted by: Dorian Rhodell (Jun 10, 2004 12:20AM)
[quote]
On 2004-06-08 12:47, bishthemagish wrote:
[quote]
On 2004-06-02 03:42, Dorian Rhodell wrote:

What can you possibly gain knowing the names of the top ten magicians?

Best,

Dorian Rhodell


[/quote]

Top ten CARD MAGICIANS IN THE USA...

The reason I started this thread was to find out who and what people like in card magic. I already started a thread on on card magic as to who are the best card magic entertainers.

The information was that the two top card entertainers were Ricky Jay and Bill Malone.

There are other great card entertainers out there but they were the most often mentoned in that thread.

So I started a thread on skill not entertainment. And because card magic is an art form when done well. And art is a personal point of view and is subjective...

I wrote the post in the manor above.

What this tells me is several things. Because the information comes from many different points of view. People like different kinds of skill with card magic. They like the teaching and routines of Michael Ammar...

And they like the skill of the card sharp methods of Steve Forte...

Two different sides of the same yard stick.

The interesting thing is that back in Dai Vernon's day there were no video's or DVD's when the Spix gave us a list of the top ten card stars.

So when Vernon went to New York the only way you could see him was Live - and you would have to go to New York to do so.

Now we have video's and DVD's and if you get the video or the DVD you can see a great card magicians work in your own living room.

This has not only let us see them but also learn from them...

The video/DVD has pushed card magic forward and I find it most interesting to read who likes who in card magic.

Thank you all for posting...
[/quote]

Hi Bish,

I agree with you. But I feel the readers would strongly benefit as to WHY they believe that person should make the list. What good does it do if I tell you that Mr. So and so should be on the top ten because he "rocks"? You gained nothing from it but an opinion that bears no weight. I could name off ten people that many others on this forum have never heard of mainly because they are not very visible in the magic community. But if I did that you wouldn't find out what I like in card magic. Instead you would just get a list of ten names. That's not helping anyone. So all I'm saying once again is, let's put a little WHY in there.

Best,

Dorian Rhodell
Message: Posted by: TheAmbitiousCard (Jun 11, 2004 12:53PM)
[quote]
On 2004-06-09 21:20, Pete Biro wrote:
Franks Starsini heads my feces roster :kermit:
[/quote]

Finally, I'm on someone's list.
Does this mean I'm almost famous?
Message: Posted by: eggshell (Jul 24, 2004 09:46AM)
Hmmm, he may not be a performing magician unless you visit him at his store in Glasgow. I don't see how you could mention Jerry Sadowitz (who is a pretty brilliant card man) and not mention Roy Walton who Jerry thinks is the best.

You only have to look at some of the effects from some of the great card guys today which invariably include phrases like " based on an idea by Roy Walton" to know what a contribution he has made over the years.

Type "Roy Walton cards" into Google, and you'll see what I mean.
Message: Posted by: mattisdx (Jul 24, 2004 09:54AM)
Lennart Green, Bill Malone, and for a tie, Allan Ackerman and Daryl. :D
Message: Posted by: Ryan 101 (Jul 24, 2004 01:27PM)
I couldn't get 10 but I got these:

* Daryl
* Bill Malone
* Michael Ammar
Message: Posted by: slakk (Jul 24, 2004 02:15PM)
Darwin Ortiz
Steve Forte
Andrew Wimhurst
Eric McMillian
Lou Lancaster
Bill Malone
Jeff McBride
Paul Chosse
Bruce Cervon
Martin Nash
Message: Posted by: diamondjack (Jul 24, 2004 11:28PM)
Andrew Wimhurst
Steve Forte
Darwin Ortiz
Martin Nash
Ray kosby
Lennart Green
Jerry Andrus
Allan Ackerman
Earnest Earick
Jack Carpenter
Pit Hartling

I know, that's 11. I can't get rid of any one of those guys before the others.
Message: Posted by: lchemist (Jul 25, 2004 12:28AM)
I can't believe nobody has mentioned Bill Goodwin yet.
Message: Posted by: houdini33 (Jul 25, 2004 05:43AM)
Everybody forgot Bebel the French magician.
One of the best for sure!
Message: Posted by: Tophie (Jul 25, 2004 08:05AM)
Speaking of leaving off names, I can't believe no one has mentioned Steve Beam. He has devoted years to the art of card magic and is truly an outstanding entertainer with cards. He published The Trap Door and has five volumes of Semi-Automatic Card Tricks.

Steve can truly made card magic entertaining and not just a demonstration of skill.
Message: Posted by: DonDriver (Jul 25, 2004 04:20PM)
Frank Garcia was spotted at a Burger King in Little Rock, Arkansas last week, so let's add his name.

Anybody heard of Howard Schwartzman? One of the best out there.

Don
Message: Posted by: Kevin Ram (Jul 25, 2004 04:51PM)
I'm sure it was a mistake guys, but you forgot KUKRAM. It's OK, though. The name is kind of funny.

Just remember Kukram. :)

OK, Also Sadowitz, Vincent, Kukram, Ortiz, Wimhurst, Kukram, Forte, Walton, Kukram, England, Chosse and---what's that guy's name? Oh, yeah...KUKRAM. :rotf:

(I hope this subliminal messaging works.)
Message: Posted by: marcus2 (Jul 25, 2004 05:03PM)
Jay Ose
Howard Schwartzman
Bill Malone
Stephen Minch
Richard Kaufman
Ortiz
Elmsley
Lorayne
Zarrow
Ackerman
Message: Posted by: M. Perk (Jul 25, 2004 08:01PM)
Would I get in trouble if I said John Bannon?
Message: Posted by: Kjellstrom (May 14, 2005 01:27PM)
Fred Kaps, a true master.
He did an amazing card trick for over 73 million people 1964:

- He was the guy who had the unenviable job of following the Beatles when they made their debut appearance on "The Ed Sullivan Show":

Ed Sullivan's February 9, 1964 installment truly was "a really big show. Some 73 million viewers tuned in to watch Fred Kaps' card (Homing Card) and salt-shakers trick and Wells & the Four Fays doing their unique brand of "acrobatic physical comedy."
Oh yeah, there was also a little outfit from Liverpool called the Beatles making their U.S. television debut. "
Message: Posted by: Alewishus (May 14, 2005 03:24PM)
Francois Dupont.



A.
Message: Posted by: evolve629 (May 14, 2005 03:43PM)
What about Jay Sankey and Oz Pearlman?
Message: Posted by: eryanic (May 15, 2005 04:04AM)
Joint top cardician --> Guy Hollingworth & Darwin Ortiz

IMHO
Message: Posted by: andre combrinck (May 15, 2005 04:53AM)
The issue of Michael Ammar is very interesting.If you are judging his performance from what you saw in ETMCM,think again.In ETMCM,granted he uses mainly Double Cuts ect.(not the most difficult sleights).But that's exactly why the DVDs were called EASY to Master Card Magic.Michael is very proficient in all sleights.If you have a look at his Early Ammar tapes and Dai Vernon's Revelations you will see this.Even the Pass which he shuns,he could very well(see his book).
To me Ammar should be in the top 10,because of his knowledge,teaching and ability.
Jaun Tamariz,Bill Mallone,Guy Hollingworth,Darwin Ortiz are up there.And although their technical ability is up there with Ortiz,Paul Harris and John Bannon for their creations.
Andre
Message: Posted by: Steve Friedberg (May 15, 2005 09:08AM)
One name that's missing here, and should be given some consideration, is Kostya Kimlat. He's easily in the vanguard of younger magicians. His thinking and his work are top-notch.

Also, I do believe that Andrew Wimhurst should be mentioned again. He has become, without even trying, the best card magician in the entire Middle East.

And what about Jason England? He's contributed to this thread, but should not be overlooked.

On another board, Paul Rooney wrote, "Don't trust any magi over the age of 30 and you will miss out on most of the best magic ever created, in my opinion. These creative types, many of whom are on this board, are eager to share their knowledge." I have seen and experienced this generosity first-hand.

I'm more than twice the age of some of these guys, and I realize (more than somewhat ruefully) that I will never possess even one-fourth of their talent.
Message: Posted by: green (May 15, 2005 12:29PM)
Juan Tamariz and lennart green
Message: Posted by: DrSammy (May 16, 2005 10:42AM)
[quote]
On 2005-05-15 05:53, andre combrinck wrote:
To me Ammar should be in the top 10,because of his knowledge,teaching and ability.
Jaun Tamariz,Bill Mallone,Guy Hollingworth,Darwin Ortiz are up there.And although their technical ability is up there with Ortiz,Paul Harris and John Bannon for their creations.
Andre
[/quote]

As far as I can tell, this is the first mention of Paul Harris in this thread. I've been deprived in that I've never seen him perform, but based on the creativity of his published material and the ubiquitous praise for his effects I find his absence surprising. I'm not trying to put down the other choices made here - I can find fault with very few (*ducks the incoming bricks from the "Blaine/Oz/Copperfield is the greatest" club*), but would have expected to see him mentioned sooner.

DrSammy
Message: Posted by: Mike aka Duffy (May 16, 2005 06:18PM)
[quote]
On 2005-05-15 10:08, Steve Friedberg wrote:
One name that's missing here, and should be given some consideration, is Kostya Kimlat. He's easily in the vanguard of younger magicians. His thinking and his work are top-notch.

This Past weekend, I had the pleasure of seeing Kostya perform and lecture at Magical May Day in Carlisle, Pennsylvania. If you get a chance to see him work, DO IT! He has phenomenal technique, entertaining and creative presentations, and on top of all that, he's a genuinely nice guy.
- Mike
Message: Posted by: mike gallo (May 16, 2005 11:48PM)
Is it just me...or am I the only one who thinks Harry Lorrayne should be on this list?

Mike
Message: Posted by: MysticK (May 17, 2005 12:46AM)
No one opted for Oliver Macia?

In no particular order -

Alan Ackerman
Lee Asher
Larwin Ortiz
Lennart Green
Ray Kosby
Jeff McBride
Bill Malone
Richard Kaufman
Oliver Macia
Message: Posted by: RC4MAG (May 17, 2005 09:11AM)
Two other really great cardmen who have not been seen much on video but were proficent in written media are Doug Edwards and Gene Maze.
Message: Posted by: Trois (May 17, 2005 09:27AM)
Jimmy "Cards" Molini
Message: Posted by: Paul Chosse (May 17, 2005 10:15AM)
I'm only listing people I know personally and have seen work, talked to, and who are - "Living Today":

1.) Ron Bauer
2.) Bruce Cervon
3.) Gary Plants
4.) Bill Kalush
5.) Steve Freeman
6.) Ricky Jay
7.) Bob Stencil
8.) Jon Racherbaumer
9.) Bill Goodwin
10.)Darwin Ortiz

Best, PSC

P.S. Another list - all gone - Vernon, Miller, McMillen, Marlo, Kort, Skinner, Hamman, Jud Brown, Vic Kirk, Jim Cooper - ten who I saw who are no longer with us, but would have made the list...
Message: Posted by: Lukenp (Jun 17, 2005 10:34PM)
THis is only my opinion. I don't think oz pearlman jay sankey or piacente are on the list. They are fare from being on the top 75 list. Just my opinion though.
Message: Posted by: Tom G (Jun 18, 2005 06:53AM)
I'd have to add Simon Lovell... Only saw one mention

Best,
Tom
Message: Posted by: daffy (Jun 18, 2005 11:57AM)
With no order, my favorites:

- Daniel Rhod
- Bébel
- Steve Forte
- Richard Turner
Message: Posted by: Wizard291 (Jun 18, 2005 02:54PM)
Does anyone have top favourite card workers in NY? Spending 2 weeks there in August - would appreciate links/contacts to hook up with.

Thanks peeps.

(Might forget about this post - if anyone knows of NY workers *or sharks* I'd be hugely appreciative - a simple list of names over PM would be super kind.)
Message: Posted by: Canvey Card Sharp (Jun 19, 2005 02:05AM)
1. Al Smith (England)
2. Paul Gordon (England)
3. Roy Walton (England/Scotland)
4. Peter Duffie (Scotland)
5. Jerry Sadowitz (Scotland)
6. Juan Tamariz (Spain)
7. Roger Kelly (Flitwick England)
8. Me ! (England)
9 & 10. ????
Please note we currently have 2 vacancies - not being biased but you have to be from Europe (and preferably the UK)!!!
Message: Posted by: eryanic (Jun 19, 2005 03:44PM)
1. Chad Sanborn
2. David Roth
3. Michael Ammar
4. Richard Osterlind
5. Tabary
6. Curtis Kam
7. Dean Dill
8. Criss Angel
9. david Blaine
10.Oz Pearlman
Message: Posted by: Pete Biro (Jun 19, 2005 06:17PM)
Lists are a joke, sorry...
Message: Posted by: Canvey Card Sharp (Jun 21, 2005 03:29AM)
Pete - don't agree with you on this one.

Why? Well lists can throw up a name for other magi (especially those new to the game) that they haven't heard of and subsequently generate further study.

For example, a guy on my list is Al Smith. I doubt if many guys across the pond have heard much about Al Smith other than his book Cards On Demand (1980 reprinted 1982) yet the guy has produced a wealth of card material and brilliant ideas in other booklets that range from self working to complex over the past 20+ years.

If simply a name generates further investigation/study, then in my view lists do indeed serve a purpose.
Message: Posted by: RiffClown (Jun 21, 2005 07:20AM)
Joel Givens <-- This begins and ends my list.
Message: Posted by: Greg Arce (Jun 21, 2005 07:37AM)
I really can't add much to the extensive list... and I agree with most... but DAVID BLAINE! That's joke, right?
Anyway, I'd like to add a friend who is known mostly for coins, but he never ceases to amaze me when he pulls out a deck of cards... Shoot Ogawa.

Greg
Message: Posted by: Glenn Godsey (Jun 21, 2005 11:00AM)
[quote]
On 2004-05-31 20:21, Jonathan Townsend wrote:
Can we limit this down to those who are WORKING performers?

We could have quite a list if we include those of us who dabble.

This would also take folks like Persi Diaconis, Steve Freeman, Paul Chosse and Ken Krenzel off the hook as top guns.
[/quote]

In the past, your criteria would have eliminated Dai Vernon and Ed Marlo. Of course you could replace them with working performers like Mark Wilson and Kreskin :)

Best regards,
Glenn Godsey
Message: Posted by: Jonathan Townsend (Jun 21, 2005 11:15AM)
[quote]
On 2005-06-21 12:00, Glenn Godsey wrote:... Of course you could replace them with working performers like Mark Wilson and Kreskin :)[/quote]

More likely Jimmy Grippo, Del Ray, John Scarne, Larry Jennings...
Message: Posted by: bishthemagish (Jun 21, 2005 12:56PM)
I started this thread Posted: May 31, 2004 7:12pm it is funny how it still is going on!
Message: Posted by: Jonathan Townsend (Jun 21, 2005 01:04PM)
Yup, stuff like this keeps folks distracted and also from becoming candidates for the list too.
Message: Posted by: bishthemagish (Jun 21, 2005 01:08PM)
I guess that is why I never made it on my own list and I started the thread.
Message: Posted by: Pete Biro (Jun 21, 2005 02:26PM)
Let me explain. I used to travel all over the country and to Europe and Japan. I saw performers everywhere and used to book them. Once I had the FUN of picking the TOP 20 acts from wherever I wanted, to do a TV Special in Japan.

Now, I don't travel anymore so I wouldn't be able to do anything like that.

So, regarding "Top X Lists" -- impossible as no one has seen everyone.

You can list people you have seen and think are excellent, just OK or overrated, but to call them the "Top X" is impossible, hence, to me, a joke.

And many List Makers really have no clue as to what constitutes excellence.

Even many of the judges, say at FISM, don't know jack either... believe me.
Message: Posted by: jrandcc (Jun 21, 2005 04:51PM)
DMC- I am not sure when your planning to visit NY but some good card workers are:

NYC(near Tannens)
Doug Edwards
Wesley James
Sol Stone(coins)
Gerry Deutsch

Upstate

Bob Elliott(I think)
Jonathan Townsend(coins)

There are others both those people are there more frequently.
Message: Posted by: RS1963 (Jun 21, 2005 04:54PM)
I tend to agree with Pete Biro on the opinon that lists do not mean anything. To borrow from a phrase One mans top ten list is anothers garbage list. You really can't put together a true top list of anything really. It just does not work.
Message: Posted by: Gary Plants (Jun 21, 2005 05:49PM)
I once asked Dai Vernon who he considered the top 5 cardmen today. He told be that it was impossible to answer this question because there are too many ways someone can be a great cardman. Some are entertainers, some technicians, inventors,etc. But, if he had given me a list of names, it would have meant more to me that one from Bozo the Clown. Some peoples lists I respect and others are SO silly.
Message: Posted by: MattWayne (Jun 21, 2005 06:58PM)
I suppose I'll cast my vote out there. There are so many to choose from. But I'll play along:)

No particular order:

Whit Haydn
Aaron Fisher
Darwin Ortiz
Kostya Kimlat
Daryl
Sterenko
Lennart Green
Simon Aronson
Simon Lovell
Message: Posted by: TheAmbitiousCard (Jun 21, 2005 08:24PM)
I wonder what it means to be a "top card man".
What are your criteria?
Message: Posted by: God-glorified (Jun 21, 2005 08:33PM)
Greg wilson
Message: Posted by: Pete Biro (Jun 21, 2005 08:44PM)
To me a "top card man" is one that fools the crap out of you.

There are FEW, believe me, FEW, that you watch that do not have tells. You catch moves, see breaks, etc. yet many rate them highly.

I guess the real test would be to bring all contenders to one place and have a shootout.

However, there is another area... INVENTION.

Some can't invent, but have great chops.

Who ranks over the other?

Then there are a very few, like Juan Tamariz, who will fry you and have you wet your pants with laughter.

There are some that I have seen that work indetectibly, no moves caught, no methods figured, like Diaconis in his prime. Have not seen him lately, but I would still put him against ANYONE.

Especially if the stakes are high. And this includes Forte.

OOOPS gotta go watch the basketball game. :kermit:
Message: Posted by: slydini62 (Jun 21, 2005 08:51PM)
It is a SIN to watch Basketball in June!! Geez...It seems like the basketball season just gets extended every year!! Pretty soon the season will compete with the World Series ratings soon!
Message: Posted by: bishthemagish (Jun 21, 2005 08:58PM)
Just for fun here is a new list...

Tony Picasso
Rich Cowly
Jim Gleason
Al Bach
Mike Powers
Jimmy Cards Molinari
Bill Malone
Steve Taylor
Ricky Jay
Vinny the godfather
And the FL hustler who I never met but sent me some card shark method video that was some of the best card work I have ever seen!

All of these people I have seen do cards that was both entertaining and with great skill.
Message: Posted by: Wizard291 (Jun 22, 2005 12:28AM)
Jrandcc you're a star. Thank you.
Message: Posted by: squando (Jun 24, 2005 03:32PM)
The top I have witnessed are:

Lennart Green
Rene Lavand
Juan Tamariz
Guy Hollingsworth

I'll See Darwin Ortiz next week.
Message: Posted by: smartie_28 (Jun 24, 2005 06:46PM)
I have to say that I probably enjoy Lennart Green's style the best.
Message: Posted by: Alewishus (Jun 24, 2005 10:13PM)
All these guys suck when put up against a Francois Dupont.
Forget the list, just check this guy out.


A.
Message: Posted by: RiffClown (Jun 24, 2005 10:41PM)
How many of those on the list have you actually seen perform?
Message: Posted by: TheAmbitiousCard (Jun 25, 2005 12:06AM)
That's a very good question Rob. I meant to ask the same one.
Message: Posted by: ImpromptuBoy (Jun 25, 2005 12:12AM)
Darwin Ortiz
Guy Hollingworth
Juan Tamariz
Steve Forte
Bill Mallone
J.C. Wagner
Daryl
Sal Piacente
Martin Nash
Richard Turner
Pete Biro (as a bonus)
Message: Posted by: Jeremy L. (Jun 26, 2005 10:03PM)
I personally like Don England but that's probably because I've seen him live.
Message: Posted by: HogK (Jun 28, 2005 12:32PM)
Hi,
My vote goes to Lennarth Green. He is a wonderful performer and creator (and has a great personality). If you guys haven't seen him "Live" I suggest that you join the convention in Lund (Sweden), as he always (often) drops by. He shows his latest moves (I suppose) in the bar (great and relaxed atmosphere there, especially in the late hours/early morning) and gladly helps you with difficult moves (almost like a "workshop" when he helped me perfect the top shot etc.)
Per
Message: Posted by: thecardman (Jun 28, 2005 04:06PM)
OK, so here is my top 10 of those that I have seen performing personally - i.e. not on the TV (so that rules out Steve Forte - for now). So, in alphabetical order, they are:-

Gordon Bruce
Peter Duffie
Alex Elmsley
Bill Goodwin
Lennart Green
Guy Hollingworth
George McBride
Chris Power
Roy Walton
Paul Wilson

There will be names there that are familiar to most. Some names that are familiar to a few and a couple that are very unfamilliar. It was not designed like that, it's just how it happened.

It is a pity that it is only living ones, as I have to miss out one of the best - Steven Hamilton from Glasgow. A brilliant magician who worked for real people on a day in, day out basis, but could still do and still studied all the technical stuff that we only do for ourselves and fellow magicians. A great magician who is very sadly missed by us all.
Message: Posted by: Sam Tabar (Jun 28, 2005 05:58PM)
George McBride? Or are you referring to Jeff McBride?
Message: Posted by: iamslow (Jun 28, 2005 06:31PM)
There is a magician named george McBride..
Message: Posted by: Christopher Williams (Jun 28, 2005 07:27PM)
George McBride created an ebook called Best of Osmosis and I'm sure he has other stuff out there. My votes go to:

Guy Hollingworth
Lennart Green
Shoot Ogowa
Peter Duffie
Pit Hartling- He's awesome live!!!
and Roberto Giobbi- Another great live performer
Message: Posted by: Glenn Godsey (Jun 29, 2005 09:07AM)
Top ten living card stars:
Annika Sorenstam
Tiger Woods
Vijay Singh
Ernie Els
Phil Mickelson
Retief Goosen
Sergio Garcia
Adam Scott
Padraig Harrington
David Toms

Take a look at their cards!

Best regards,
Glenn Godsey
Message: Posted by: Pete Biro (Jun 29, 2005 11:39AM)
As long as they sign them... :kermit:
Message: Posted by: Chad Sanborn (Aug 10, 2005 11:33AM)
[quote]
On 2005-06-19 16:44, eryanic wrote:
1. Chad Sanborn
2. David Roth
3. Michael Ammar
4. Richard Osterlind
5. Tabary
6. Curtis Kam
7. Dean Dill
8. Criss Angel
9. david Blaine
10.Oz Pearlman
[/quote]
Thanks for putting me at the top of your list. But I must humbly say, that I don't think I belong there. I am not a card technician by any means. What did I do that made you add me to your list?

Chad
Message: Posted by: spencerpeterson (Oct 29, 2008 10:09PM)
Ben Earl
The Buck Twins
Ricky Smith
Guy Hollingworth
Chris Kenner
Akira Fuji
Bebel
Kostya Kimlat
David Williamson
Pit Hartling
Message: Posted by: studentoflife (Jul 1, 2009 01:25PM)
Don't forget Michael Vincent! :)
Message: Posted by: critter (Jul 1, 2009 06:56PM)
R. Paul Wilson
Kostya Kimlat
Message: Posted by: magicmatt (Aug 13, 2009 12:19PM)
Card Stars? Didn't Okito and Owen magic make a pretty card star!
Message: Posted by: hbwolkov (Aug 21, 2009 05:33PM)
Sadly, Martin Nash (1933-2009) must be retired from the list.