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Topic: I want to manipulate
Message: Posted by: wikiro (Jul 23, 2002 02:29PM)
I heard of coins, cards, canes, balls, and thimbles being manipulated, but what else is there to manipulate that is a little more risky and more of a challenge? Oh and don't say the spectators cuz that isn't funny :bg:

Wikiro :dance:
Message: Posted by: Kardenni (Jul 24, 2002 12:56AM)
Message: Posted by: wikiro (Jul 24, 2002 07:50AM)
Hmmm... sounds good I'll add that to the list. What else is you there?
Message: Posted by: Kardenni (Jul 24, 2002 11:57PM)
Look it up in books you will be surprised what you find! The Tarbell set is great for things like this.
Message: Posted by: wikiro (Jul 25, 2002 06:31AM)
Tarbell? :confused:
Message: Posted by: ***Kev*** (Jul 25, 2002 06:40AM)
Bottle tops (substituted for thimbles),
Top Hat manipulation (spinning)
Business cards,

All you need to do is use your imagination.
Message: Posted by: Harry Murphy (Jul 25, 2002 08:00AM)
Items that I have seen manipulated (or have actually manipulated myself) include:
Soap Bubbles
Pipes (corncob, clay, meerschaum, etc)
Cigars Cigarettes
Burning Candles
Bic Lighters (any cigarette lighter)
Silk Handkerchiefs
Rings (finger, moderate and large size)
Shot glasses (full of drink)
Regular size (12 to 16 oz) glasses full of a beverage
Bottles (full)
Poker chips
Jumbo safety pins
Hand Bells
Clown Nose
Sponge rabbits

This is not an exhaustive list but I have seen examples of each in performance. You want risk or difficulty? Try to make any (ANY) manipulation act interesting! Now THAT is difficult!
Message: Posted by: wikiro (Jul 25, 2002 10:04AM)
Bic Lighters

these sound interesting where can learn on these Items?

silks maybe
hat maybe

Wikiro :yippee:
Message: Posted by: Harry Murphy (Jul 25, 2002 04:03PM)
For Cigar manipulation try Karrol Fox’s “Foxy Cigars”. It is routine using two dummy cigars that keep appearing and vanishing and ends with a pipe appearing in the performers mouth. It uses a couple of very simple thimble moves. Many thimble moves can be done with these props.

A couple of “Fickle Fire” gimmicks and some flash paper and an appearing torch will give you the basics of an act manipulating fire (hand to hand, etc).

Knives? I watched an old hand do an entire cigarette act using pocketknives! His cigarette manipulation act no longer played because most of his venues were non-smoking so rather than give up on years of practice he bought a dozen pocket knives and did his routine using the knives. It played well. He went from the color changing knives into the manipulation routine.

The smaller BIC style lighter is easily manipulated using cigarette moves. They are also easy to gimmick (plastic is an easy medium to glue to). Fantasio even makes blue, yellow, and red BIC shells (color change, silk to BIC, BIC to match, etc!).

Wands, the people who supply you with the manipulating canes usually supply the manipulating wands. My set is from the now defunct Magic Hands in Germany.

My multiplying lighters are custom-made stainless steel rectangles and are hinged and finger bracketed in the same manner as the standard multiplying candles. And they work exactly the same as the multiplying candles. You take out a silver lighter, light it and it multiplies, jumps from hand to hand, and finally eight are found between the fingers of both hands.

Mine have holders that secure them under my jacket and drop them into the proper position in my hand. They were custom made in the mid 70’s. The guy who made them may have made as many as 50 sets and sold them. He made multiplying candles and I told him I wanted a multiplying cigarette lighter. He produced one. If you are interested I will email you photos of them. I doubt if you will ever see these again. While not one of a kind, I don’t know of anyone that has a set! They are for sale but they are not cheap!

Children’s crayons can be manipulated using the standard cigarette manipulation moves. Take a fairly standard cigarette routine and simply replace the cigarettes with crayons, candies (Tootsie Rolls), Golf tee’s, Sharpie marking pens, and on and on. The slights and routines are all the same! It is only the object being manipulated that is different!

Heck, Slydini’s broken and restored cigarette routine can be adapted to using crayons!

These ideas ought to get you thinking and thinking out of the box!

Go for it!
Message: Posted by: wikiro (Jul 25, 2002 04:37PM)
I want to learn cigar manipulations because I know a way to rig a cigar to shoot retractable confetti.

I want to learn Lighter manipulation because I think lighters are interesting objects, and I would love to see your manipulatable lighters, Mumblepeas.

I like knives also better than cigarettes because I don't smoke.

Crayons are also a nice little touch for the young people.

I want wand manipulation because no magician should be without his wand (not a Harry Potter thing, hehe)

I think that fire also gives magic a great flare.

Wikiro :dance:
Message: Posted by: Harry Murphy (Jul 25, 2002 07:49PM)
Wands! I agree with you about wands. I love them, use them and am not embarrassed to say so!

The wand could be magically produced. They can be produced say, from midair (an appearing wand) or from a small purse (any one of a dozen methods-I like Cellini’s method and also Gene Anderson’s version, and use them both).

Learn a good wand spin. It is a flourish and a utility move for vanishing a ball (cups and ball) or a coin (Flying Eagles) or whatever.

Learn the strike vanish. It is a utility move for vanishing anything small.

Learn a “Flip-Stick” routine. There are at least three on tape or in books. Basically the wand vanishes and reappears.

Maybe learn a good “splitting” the wand into two bit. There are actual commercial versions of this available. But you should be able to pull it off with a little timing and misdirection!

Build a routine from those bits and you have all the wand magic you will need!

A good book on cigarette manipulation will give you all the slights you need for the manipulation of any of the crayons, knives, or BIC style lighters you want. Go learn the basics and start building a routine.

As soon as I can I will photograph my lighters. I won’t expose the gimmick, but you will get the idea! It will be a while before I get to it be patient.

So work on your wand routine first. Then build. It won’t cost you much. Mainly practice!

Go for it!
Message: Posted by: wikiro (Jul 26, 2002 06:15AM)
Where can I get a wand that has a lot of gimmicks added to it? Because I will only, and I mean only, use one wand...well...unless it breaks of course :bg:

Wikiro :donut6: :coffee:
Message: Posted by: Harry Murphy (Jul 26, 2002 11:37AM)
I don’t understand what gimmicks you want on a wand. Some wands are built to vanish a silk, others to produce a coin (and then vanish it again), and some have a magnet or two built into them for obvious reasons. Most wands are just sticks! They are used as a prop while your hands do whatever. For example, the wand is used in the strike vanish. The vanish is slight of hand the wand is the misdirection.

Do you even know what you want your wand to do or how you plan to use it? It sounds like you haven’t given this a lot of thought yet. There is no one-wand-fits-all wand out there that I am aware of. There may be a few multiple gimmick wands out there but I am unaware of where you might find them.

You will probably have to design and build (or have built for you) your own wand. I think that you ought to figure out what your act is before you buy a prop!

One wand? What’s that about? I am sitting here typing this and looking at my bookshelf. I have a large mug that holds 14 different wands of varying sizes, shapes, made of various materials and some even “do something”. I will use a specific wand for a specific character and/or specific act.
Message: Posted by: paulapaul (Jul 26, 2002 01:21PM)

If you take your one wand, and go to a mirror, many of the things that Mumblepeas mentioned can be done:

a good wand spin
strike vanish
“Flip-Stick” routine

These are all killer basics that you'll use many times, many ways. You can add even more to these ... but the moves mentioned above will be plenty to chew on.

Later, by adding cigarette and/or thimble manip lessons to your agenda, you are also getting the absolute "must" basics for the other routines and props, as Mumblepeas pointed out.

I sense a need for focus in your posts. The things above will give you a solid place to work from. You can't go wrong by selecting one and jumping in.

I have mentioned Mumblepeas name a few times in this post, because he has offered generous advice as to where you might start.
From where I sit - it looks like he's a guy to defer to regarding manips.

You came to the right place to ask! As soon as you put the props in your hands and start getting familier with these moves, you'll get some instant gratification. It will be exciting to hear that your act is coming along! Good luck!

Message: Posted by: morpheus (Jul 26, 2002 03:35PM)
I manipulate CD's it is a good effect
Message: Posted by: wikiro (Jul 28, 2002 03:16AM)
I would use one wand and one wand only because I have a nice little story line that goes with the wand and if I switch the wands the story doesn't hold true.

I think the wand should do many things and those things are:
-produce sparks or some kind of fire effect
-go through items (like the pen or cig through coin)
-and works as a two way radio no just kidding
I know that this is probably impossible to add all these together, and it sound like a kid magicians dream but I like the Idea and Ill try but first I need money so I'm going to work see ya all for a week.

Message: Posted by: Harry Murphy (Jul 28, 2002 09:05AM)
Wikiro, I don’t think that it’s a kids dream. From our dreams come our inventions. In fact, that’s not a horribly long list of things for a wand to do. Many of your “wants” can be performed with an ungimmicked wand.

“Flip-Stick” is a vanish of the wand (ungimmicked) at your fingertips and have it appear elsewhere (vanish and teleportation).

The penetration effect is rather standard. Penetration through a handkerchief can be done with an ungimmicked wand. The penetration through a coin, block, and body can be done with a very easily made gimmick (good only on straight sided wands) that creates the illusion of penetration.

The shrinking wand will use the same gimmick and create the illusion that the wand shrinking against the palm of your hand rather than penetrating it. You will need a second wand (the shrunk or smaller version) if you are going to hand it out or lay it on a table. So a switch out is needed. I know that you are thinking of some kind of telescoping wand (like an antenna) but trust me they don’t look very good and cannot be used close-up.

Reverse the shrinking wand and you have a growing wand.

The fire effects can be had with a “double-bang” wand (or even a “single bang” version). However, think that having to buy flash paper and/or flash cotton and the hassle of properly storing it is a bit of a bother. There is a nice electronic double flash wand on the market that creates a rather startling flash of light. There is also a “Delight” wand out there that lights up. Both should be considered. If you really want fire, then gimmick the prop that is going to burn not the wand, use the wand to trigger the flames. No big deal and keeps the wand “clean”

OK, so here it is! In one wand using only two gimmicks (a home made shrinking/penetrating/stretching gimmick and a flash gimmick) you can perform everything that you want and more!

I think that once you learn some basics of misdirection and manipulation you will find that your wand will do many more miracles than you listed.

For example finger rings placed on the body of your magic wand will become linked as they slide off into your hand, objects will vanish just by taping them, ropes wrapped around the wand and then around a volunteers body will penetrate the body just by removing the wand, cards will float out of the deck with the help of the wand, and…oh I could go on and on for pages, but you get the idea.
Message: Posted by: Brian Proctor (Aug 1, 2002 09:41PM)
Where would I turn for a good resource in sleight of hand with Cig Lighters?
Just wondering, I have been playing with my lighter for a while.
Message: Posted by: primoshock (Aug 2, 2002 12:40AM)
Lighters would be cool, and I saw a CD manipulation on a Lance Burton special.

What I am researching is the manipulation of billiard balls. I can see the whole act in my head, making the pool stick appear, the balls, the triangle thing - then in the end an entire pool table!

I never thought of manipulating crayons - hmmmmmm . . .

Message: Posted by: Harry Murphy (Aug 2, 2002 06:27AM)
Brian, I don’t know what kind or size of cigarette lighter you use, but I found that the smaller BIC disposable lighter (and similar brands) could be manipulated with the same slights as a cigarette. I have small hands and can do most standard vanishes and productions with a BIC lighter. I have played with a standard Zippo but never actually put one into performance, YET! I have just bought a used Ring-to-Zippo prop to include in a bar routine and am thinking that I might have to start playing with Zippo’s again! Hummmm.

This summer, I watched a young magician do the Slydini cigarette routine, move for move, using a BIC lighter. We were sitting in the hall of a convention talking about impromptu magic (and showing off for each other) when this “kid” takes my lighter and does the whole routine. He was flawless! I actually saw Slydini perform that little sequence and have it on videotape and I believe that the old man would have been proud!

My multiplying lighter set is just that, a multiplying lighter set. It is a one trick pony. It is performed exactly the same as the multiplying candles. For some reason, years ago, almost every stand-up magician was doing the candles so I had the lighters made. I included the sequence in a cigarette manipulation routine (Misers Dream with cigarettes). When I went to light my cigarette the lighter acted up, jumped from hand to hand, and multiplied from one to 8! By the way, did I mention that I don’t smoke (never have!)?
Message: Posted by: ***Kev*** (Aug 2, 2002 06:35AM)
You could also manipulate matches,
What do you think?
Message: Posted by: Brian Proctor (Aug 3, 2002 05:35AM)
Thanks for the ideas Mumblepeas. I do have a small bic Lighter. I have been playing around with basic cigeratte sleights. Most from bill tarrs "Now you see it" book. I dont have any other reference right now. I wish I could see a video of Slydini's manipulations.

Kev, I do think that it would be cool manipulate matches.
Message: Posted by: ***Kev*** (Aug 3, 2002 02:29PM)
a nice routine would be manipulating lit matches, then proceed to light a cigarette or cigar then manipulate that.....
Message: Posted by: Brian Proctor (Aug 3, 2002 02:40PM)
I'd end up burning something down with lit matches. Best for me to just use a lighter. :rotf:
Message: Posted by: ***Kev*** (Aug 4, 2002 05:48AM)
Good point,
Matches are considerably more dangerous than lighters mainly because a lighter is under your control, if dropped, the flame will automatically go out as you aren't pressing the gas button down,
'Everybody Dance now' :dancing:

<< :babyface: >>
Message: Posted by: wikiro (Aug 5, 2002 01:13PM)
Im back can you tell me where i can learn cigertte and wand manipultaion?

wikiro :dance:
Message: Posted by: Harry Murphy (Aug 5, 2002 01:55PM)
Tom Mullica has a three videotape series on cigarette magic. There is just about everything you want to know about cigarette manipulation covered. The Keith Clark “Encyclopedia of Cigarette Magic” is still in print and can be hound through most major magic dealers (maybe Hank Lee). Plus, there are literally hundreds of videos of various close-up magicians that include a cigarette manipulation or trick or two on them.

I still don’t know what you mean by wand manipulation. Starting with a one wand and magically splitting them into two (or more) then causing one to dance or float or balance at your fingertip? Nesting wands do the job fine for the splitting effect.

Several magicians have included their handling of the “Flip” stick (named after Flip the magician). Cellini’ street magic lecture video (not the new one the older British tape) has a nice routine. John George has a very nice flip stick routine on his “Close-up Magic volume I” video.

A search of what is available on the major magic sites should result in dozens of good leads for you.

Good luck.
Message: Posted by: wikiro (Aug 7, 2002 08:06AM)
Where can I learn about the wand?

Wikiro :dance:
Message: Posted by: Harry Murphy (Aug 7, 2002 03:38PM)

I have given you several references for magic wand “manipulation” in my posts above. There is no one reference that is just a book or tape encyclopedia of magic wand magic that I know of. The stuff is spread through literally hundreds of references. I gave you a start. In fact I gave you more than you will ever need to build a good, strong, wand manipulation routine.

Now find the references, read/watch them, write your routine, practice it, rehearse it, and perform it!

Perhaps, you will be the person that collects all the wand tricks available and put out an encyclopedia of wand magic! Go for it!
Message: Posted by: ***Kev*** (Aug 8, 2002 05:52AM)

Why don't we ask Kevin James to bring out an Encyclopedia of Wand spinning,
He has done about everything else!
:rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :dance: :dance: :dancing:
Message: Posted by: wikiro (Aug 9, 2002 03:04AM)
Hehe thats kind of funny the magicians trade mark doesn't even have its own book. That makes me sad. :smiletear:

Wikiro :dance:
Message: Posted by: Stephen Barney (Aug 11, 2002 05:33PM)
Mumblepeas is right, the search through all that litterature makes the journey worthwhile you will appreciate the magic you create more if you have to work to get it there in the first place.

I like the challeng go on go out there research and write the encyclopedia of wand magic :bg: :bg: :bg: :bg:
Message: Posted by: wikiro (Aug 12, 2002 10:39PM)
Do you have any tips on origami or small objects other than coins or cigerettes?

Wikiro :yawn:
Message: Posted by: Harry Murphy (Aug 13, 2002 01:31PM)
Wiriko, I honestly don’t know what you are looking for! This thread is full of resources about manipulating various objects! None of it is easy or automatic. Friend, there are about a dozen (or less) sleights and moves that are fairly universal to all objects. It simply does not matter what the object is, if you know some basic sleights you will be able to develop a manipulation routine with almost any object.

Most card manipulation slights can be used for bills, credit cards, origami, bits of paper, to some extent coins, CD’s and so on. Most cigarette sleights can be used for crayons, pencils, pens, candy, BIC lighters, sunglases, Q-tips, and to some extent coins. Most Ball slights can be used for, coins, thimbles, pipes, and on and on and on…

Do you get the idea?

At some point you have to commit yourself to study and practice. Go buy Henry Hay’s “The Magician’s Handbook”. It has almost everything you will ever want to know about this kind of magic. It is your starting point, but you have to start somewhere.

Go for it!
Message: Posted by: wikiro (Aug 14, 2002 12:45PM)
I am trying to start, but my money is SOOOOO limited. I can't buy anything unless I'm so sure it is worth the buy.

So far, I got Bobo's coin book, lots of Jean Hugard and Fredrick Braue books, Mark Wilson's Magic cyclopedia: A Complete Course (small version, not a good buy I might add), and Jeff McBride's "The Art of Card Manipulation" series.

I need to get out of cards and coins. I'm making a wand because I have all I need at home (but I need some ideas on the wood I should use, like if cherry is good or something like that) so I want some good wand books.

Also I am ok at origami and I love the art, so I want to put magic into it. I would also like to just take any item and do with it whatever I want, but right now I like wands and origami. This is what I'm searching for.

Sorry also for getting annoying on this thread I tend to do that. :pout:

Wikiro :dance:
Message: Posted by: Steven Steele (Aug 14, 2002 09:27PM)
I have seen some wonderful resources on manipulation, but it seems the best artists aren't even amongst us magicians. Looks like nobody can manipulate books better than CEOs!! :giggles:
Message: Posted by: DavidEscapes (Aug 23, 2002 08:03PM)
Hi all

I started my performing career as a juggler and therefore manipulate a lot of different things. Those that apply to magic most closely though are...

Crystal balls (As in the film Labyrinth)
Other items of furniture

It is only since joining this board that I realised how much this kind of stuff relates to magic. I had only thought of it it terms of circus, physical/silent comedy, and juggling.

BTW. Jugglers refer to object manipulation as 'contact juggling'. Just thought that might interest you.. and if it doesn't...well...it's too late now!

Have fun

Message: Posted by: wikiro (Aug 26, 2002 01:19AM)
I just went on vacation and I got $52 to spend. For wand manipulation what would be best Kidbiz by David Ginn or Fantasio - My Canes and Candles, but I also heard these are on gimmicked wands so I might not get either of them. I also heard I should get Worldclass Manipulations by Jeff McBride but I heard it has faults. Expert Coin
Magic Made Easy by David Roth sounds good also, but I cant get them all in a day which stinks. I was also thinking about Dai Vernon books or tapes, but I was wondering was he a manipulator or a sleight of hand magician? Personally either way I wouldnt care I think his stuff sound interesting.
I would be thankful for all of your opinions on what to buy.

Wikiro :dance:
Message: Posted by: Dan Farmer (Aug 26, 2002 03:33PM)
I think Nike says it best "Just do it!"

It seems to me from reading your posts that you have a hard time focusing. I guess everyone has to dabble before they find something that they love (and mind you most magicians can do a little bit of everything). The items you mentioned there are all different. World Class manipulation by McB is manipulation of coins, balls and thimbles. David Roth's Expert Coin Magic is more like "tricks" he is an excellent teacher and his set of videos is widely (though I'm sure not universally) regarded as the best start for coin magic. Another interesting video that I am looking at getting is Micheal Ammars intro to coin magic as it is one video/DVD that covers a lot of stuff.

Anyway. Dai Vernon was definitely not a manipulator, his thing was to create the most effect with the simplest techniques. Again, he is a highly regarded magician. Personally I am not much for Vernon's stuff but like I said earlier everyone has their own loves. I don't know what book or video you were considering but this would probably be card magic.

Finally, everything has it's faults. I've heard criticism for everything you mentioned and I doubt that there is anything (except maybe royal road to card magic :goof: ) that doesn't have people for and against it. Just pick one and check it out, they are all good picks.

Ok I lied, you mentioned being strapped for cash. I thought I'd point out that you have more magic material than I do! ;)

Message: Posted by: wikiro (Aug 27, 2002 02:12PM)
Fantasio - My Canes and Candles
Is this book only on how to opperate the vanishing wand or does it talk about how to make one? or does it talk about how to vanish a wand with out gimmicks?

Message: Posted by: Chessmann (Aug 28, 2002 10:07PM)
As I was reading through this thread, I thought to myself, "Maybe CD's?" Lo and behold, I soon came across someone who did just that.

How about an expanded cd shell? A folding cd? Interesting possibilities....
Message: Posted by: wikiro (Aug 29, 2002 08:55AM)
Also I've seen some one fling a cd like a frizbie and it came back to there hand but instead of catching it he let it cut off his fingers. I thought it was cool.

Wikiro :swordbasket:
Message: Posted by: JePi (Sep 18, 2002 08:33AM)
Why you don't want to use yo-yo's? I have found some yo-yo's in a toy shop. They where designed and sized like a billard ball. So it was possible to show all common ball manips and multiplying with these items.
Message: Posted by: Tolga Ozuygur (Sep 20, 2002 06:12AM)
Try multiplying candles with two hand. It's a really good effect.
Message: Posted by: wikiro (Oct 27, 2002 04:58PM)
I got a list of Ball, Wand, Fire, and Silk magic. Maybe cds and Im sorry I don't like yo-yos. :pout:
Message: Posted by: Kendrix (Oct 28, 2002 10:35AM)
Murray Sawchuk already has a signature act of manipulation with CD's, Laser disc etc. He was won several contests with it.
Message: Posted by: magicboy1234567 (Nov 4, 2002 02:51PM)
How do you manipulate CD's?
Message: Posted by: zombieboy (May 11, 2003 09:08AM)
I have a whole act with balloons, which has a playful look, and it lightens up the show. Good resources for this are Charlie Frye's "Eccentrics" and "The Magic of Jeff McBride."
Message: Posted by: wikiro (May 23, 2003 04:11PM)
I have an idea of my own with silks.
Message: Posted by: djvirtualreality (May 23, 2003 04:23PM)
Mask manipulation is my favorite kind. :thumbsup: