I know the title sounds a bit weird; however, I've noticed a tremendous downward dive as far as the quality of magic apparatus. Such items as ring boxes, dove pans, change bags, etc. no longer are items worth the pricing they are connected to. In your own opinion, what would you (the magic community) like to see manufactured with more attention to detail and quality?

I'm interested to hear the results!

-Bryan Gilles

Magic apparatus is always a case of you get what you pay for. Unusable props have always been around, it's just that they're being made outside of the country, now. If you want the stuff that works, you'll have to get it from a manufacturer who knows their stuff. Unfortunately, few dealers seem to realize that guys who do shows need to know who manufactured the prop, before they place an order.

I wasn't too impressed with the rabbit wringers that I saw, online, so I ordered one from a manufacturer who knows how to build quality stuff. This one will hold my rabbit, who is bigger than than what most "rabbit" boxes will hold.

Hi Bryan:

I think you may be thinking of all the Indian imported stuff, which is generally average-to-poor quality. The good stuff is still around - you just have to search for it.

You can still get beautifully made dove pans and change bags, although the majority are junk.

Ron

I also think a lot of "dealers" will stock lower quality items so they can sell more. It's just supply and demand.

Given that quality props are expensive and will only be bought by a few who will actually use them (working pro's for example), they will not be able to sell very many.

On the other hand, if they stock the lower quality stuff, with a price that matches, they have a chance to sell a lot more, given those who will buy it have seen the more expensive items, think they are getting the same thing (in a sense they are, but only the effect, not the quality) and will readily purchase it to add to their collection.

Just my 2 cents! Mark.

I think it is simply a case of different markets. Pros do want and can afford the upper end of the magic props. However, how many pros shop in magic shops? Often their props are custom made. Even more often, their props are what others call supplies (Cards, silks, ropes, coins, newspapers, etc.).

Running a magic shop is a very competitive business. They no longer compete with other magic shops in the area. Now they have to deal with online stores, true magic auctions and general resell markets like eBay. To beginners, price is the only difference they can see between sources. Unfortunately, price sells. Magic shops can get you the "good" stuff. Just ask.

Remember too that many pieces of magic are sold for trick exposure rather than use. Quality is not a factor there. I don't like it, but someone somewhere will always make it available.

An advantage of classical magic is that it is more what you do with the props than the props themselves. But much of the market is more like the TV dinner part of the grocery store: that is magic-show-in-a-box. Since the majority of magicians don't really have a show, quality props are not what they seek. Therefore, it's not what vendors provide. (You do know that Avon and Tiffany's is the same company?) You can't blame the vendor for meeting the demands of the customer. (Either way!) A good vendor knows his market. That is not to say that those consumers in that market know themselves.

Bob Sanders
Magic By Sander

I've never managed to find a lota bowl that doesn't leak when it is upside down, after the water is supposed to be emptied.
Also, those plastic break-away wands break for real! Doesn't there exist a good quality version of these, maybe made from wood?
The metal shell of the die from the die box inevitably cracks on its seam.

A dealer friend of mine once said that "magicians are cheapskates." If a business depends on broad sales to a wide variety of hobbyists -- then often they may have to limit their stock of "quality" stuff to use their capitol to sustain their bread and butter lines of things that are more fragile or less than perfectly detailed.

I have seen Fabrege' eggs that were made with the thousands of hours of craft the Czar demanded -- and the knock-off in the Dollar Stores. Do I want either badly enough to come up with thepurchase price?

The same in magic -- while Wiz Kote was selling for a lot less at Chalet in the stock set -- I contacted George and has a special set made to my specs (I can handle size 12 EEE shoes) and was willing to wait and pay for that and got a quality piece. Can it be compared with the smaller stock version -- of course as the unknowing public does not know the subtle differences in springing, size variation etc.

I have several Thayer pieces I got to replace stuff I had when I was first starting in magic when $35 was a LOT of money. My one man nest of boxes costs about $1000 today -- and I remain sorry I sold my first $35 set years ago.

I have (and am about to offer for sale in the appropriate forum below) a Teufell Zig-Zag Coin which I consider to be one of the Farberge's Eggs of Magic. It is excrutiatingly well detailed and easy to operate and I was willing to pay dearly for this trick's craftsmanship and spare coins for a date matching proof routine-- and hope a buyer who knows quality will get it --- but I am not holding my breath because "magicians are cheapskates." After all -- goes their rationale -- if Tenyo ever makes a version it will only be $35 -- not $350.

My silks -- and well worth the wait and price -- are P&A or ORIGINAL Silk King. My recently sold head chopper was a Wellington See Thru. But price alone does not determine QUALITY -- as I have found the mobility and simplicity of one man illusions made by Jim Sommers to be a mobile simple act performers dream. They are durable and easily fixed -- even though the carpentry might not be Owen or Smith.

I have always felt (and own some) Shepphard. He made top quality stuff when it came to appearance and collectability in their finish. Some was great for continuing performance (stuff I still have) but others had klunky hardware for operation.....but still looked beautiful. Which was quality? It deponded upon your use.

I have not minded spending $1200 and $1400 for my boutania and garden of flowers rigs -- both quality to last and performability and no flying checken feathers. But if I was doing kids comedy -- flying feathers out of the bouquets and rigs might be more appropriate for their "lack of quality."

Collectors have a different need. I still use my P&L stuff. I find my Losander tables -- exceptional quality - and fragile at the same time. They will never end up in a display case. However I have some Milson Worth on display in my home as I have also had Nielsen-Okito Pieces. These display quality pieces have brought me joy as a collector and having to sell them is not pleasant......Although they are performable I worry too much about messing them up (or more than likely stage hands and assistants messing them up) and not letting these exceptional quality examples of magic craftsmanship retain collectors' value that I will need in further hard times.

So I realize that "quality" for one -- may not be "quality" for all. I guess that is whay there are so many car brinds, prices and models out there too.....