Thank you Bill (and Scotty) for the inside scoop. That's pretty much what I've heard regarding the move, which makes Braham's mention of Sawa all the stranger.

Thank you very much Bill and Scott for the interesting information.

I have a Kaps video performing the trick, changing silver into copper into buttons. (name of the effect: ¿?)

I was impressed on the use of Kaps subtlety in the trick and how relaxed he was on performing it, as I consider to be quite bald to use this move so directly.

Antonio

Wow! Bill, Thanks a bunch. I really like hearing stories like that! Much appreciated and so generous of you to share that memory.


Thanks.

~Craig

Craig -

You (and the others) are certainly welcome. Too often lesser known creators like Presto are not always sufficiently credited for their contributions used by better known magicians. Much of this stuff happened so long ago that I am surprised it still generates much interest.

One further thought on your search for explanations of the Palm-to-Palm switch. You might wish to see David Roth's A-1 Multimedia tape called "Live in Sacrameto 1998". I am sure it has probably been converted to DVD but I don't know which one of the new compilations of David's coin work it is now on. I am sure if you contact David, he would be glad to tell you and can probably sell you the appropriate disc. At any rate, in his introduction to the effect "Purse Frame Wild Coin", David discusses one hand switches and his analysis of them. He briefly describes how to do the palm-to-palm switch and what he feels are the pros and cons of the switch. He alludes to it having been developed from a dice cheater's switch. He then teaches his alternative to the palm-to-palm called "The Drop Switch" and why he feels it offers advantages over the palm-to-palm in certain situations. Personally, I find The Drop Switch more difficult to execute than the Palm-to-Palm, but you may find it to be of interest and better suited to your needs. Certainly the tape is of value for anyone researching one hand switches. There are also three other excellent routines on the tape.

Bill

I own that video, I'll look for the move.
Thanks a lot Bill.

I have that tape from Dave Roth and I use the drop switch in one of the copper silver routine I do,i also do it with the coin in Downs palm, I personally believe that the drop switch is much easier than the palm to palm tranfer, but there is a trick to it, that you have to figure out yourself, Dave Roth does not go into too much detail on the Drop Switch and I won't go into detail either because of course it is not my move, but it is way easier than the palm to palm.

Paz,

Mano.

Just an added note on instructions for one hand coin switches:

Volume 3 of the just released New York Coin Magic Seminar DVDs on Copper Silver coin effects contains a segment by David Roth in which he explains various one hand coin switches including the palm to palm change and the drop switch. I might add that he is explaining these switches to a very distinquished trio of coin magicians.

Volume 4 of the same DVD set also includes another David Roth segment in which he discusses his Copper Silver Classic and the palm to palm change in the context of this routine.

Bill

Thanks again Bill for your comments.
I look forward to buy this DVDs, as you say it's a very distinguished group of magicians.
Drop Switch is a great move, very useful to certain routines. I wish Mano could tell me the knack it has, as it's been difficult for me to learn it. But I know how to use the Palm to Palm Change, after a lot of practise I think it's finally going quite well.

Antonio

Hola Antonio,

If I ever get to hook up a webcam, I will send you a clip for the drop and my touches on the palm to palm tranfer.

be well.

Paz,

Mano.

The handling of the Palm Change in CoinMagic is Presto's. The handling in David Roth's Expert Coin Magic is Roth's. At the time I only knew what Roth told me, which was that he thought it was Kaps', hence the incorrect credit.

Im working on the palmtopalmtransfer with pokerchips. A hard move, but by experimenting with the positions, I found a good balance.

There is a video of a Fred Kaps-Routine, changing simultaneously silver and chinese coin in each hand. He clearly shows front and back (as far is I remember the routine at this point)
So far I was impressed, that he did the change with both hands simultaneously, and so smooth. But then as a kicker, he changes them to Buttons, that blew my mind.

Is he using a gimmick, or does he have a technique for a palm to palm change with 3 coins. ?

Froopy. If you have the Derek Dingle memorial issue of Genii Richard Kaufman wrote up Dingle's version of the Kaps effect that you are asking about. I don't have that issue handy but I do know it is in there. I believe that Derek had simplified the handling a bit by adding an extra gaff I think Kaps only used one. Yes there is a gaff involved in the Kaps version.

Ok, thank you!!! knowing theres a gaff explains a lot. Ill check Dingles work.

Froopy, thanks for bumping up this thread. I had forgotten about the valuable discussions on page 1. As to the comments on this page, I can only add that I'm not sure Kaps used a gaff for this effect. At least, it's not clear that he always did, and I'm pretty sure he didn't have to. But without a gaff, the skill required is scary.

As for the history of the move, I'm happy to believe Presto was the source for the New York coin magicians, and through them, Fred Kaps. However, I have been re-reading Bobo's Modern Coin Magic (for a project that will be announced later) and Bobo pretty much describes the palm-to-palm in the context of a Laurie Ireland trick. So the move might predate Presto.

I think it says in Coinmagic that the only difference between the method given in there and the Fred Kaps method is if the coin is allowed to flip over after it is released from the palm or not.

Dan, Coinmagic only mentions "It's similar to the late Fred Kaps' method."

I can't do the move very well as described in either source. I have to clip the palm dropped coin with my pinky finger and then palm the incoming coin. Otherwise my dinky hands make the coins talk. The coin flips one last time to get it near the thumb like the 'coin roll' but on the inside instead of the back of the hand. The search for Kaps' (Presto's) description was to see if that's how I was executing the move and maybe give more insight. P2P change is not easy to do with small hands but I find by clipping with the pinky I can even change coin sizes if needed. A half for a dollar or vice versa.

It's an excellent coin move and if anyone wants to advance their coin technique they should definitely learn one of the methods.

As best I recall Presto said the sleight was based on the two-for-two dice switch/cheat.

Curtis work on the Fred Kaps Purse is magificent and so is Tim Feher's.
During the year I spent in Monaco learning from Fred Kaps, I never heard him mentioning Dr Sawa, but I did hear him mentioning dice switches.
Now Fred had huge hands and the palm to palm switch was easy for him (but not so much for me despite hands almost as large as his).
I'd like to remind that the routine that our friend Bill Wells is referring to was published by Ken Brooks in the late 60s so the rumor of Fred having learned this from Dr Sawa (without any disrespect for our Japanese peer) is fairly unlikely.