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rannie Inner circle 4375 Posts |
Got me there brother...Now...if I am to speak only for myself...YES! Hand Size Does Not Matter! LOL!
A perfect example would be the edge... I can do it but not as effectively as the DP. For the EG you would need long fingers to really get the most out of it. I still do EG on some stuff such as my "Threeple Treat". The problem is for moving sleights.... if there is such a term.... I loose freedom of movement from my other fingers as opposed to the DP. Perhaps it is a case of being better with another thing because of neccessity. The next generation of Raymundo's will have longer fingers... Evolution man!LOL! Take carte fellas! HSDM Rannie
"If you can't teach an old dog new tricks, trick the old dog to learn."
-Rannie Raymundo- aka The Boss aka The Manila Enforcer www.rannieraymundo.com www.tapm.proboards80.net |
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Pete McEwen Special user Durham, N.C. 576 Posts |
Keep in mind I am a very serious student of Kainoas stuff. A couple of you on this forum have seen me perform it either in person or video and can attest to it. But to me, I think it's superior to Roth's and Down's palm (or L'Homme Masque) because it can be put into edge grip with one hand. Not only that but the fingers don't have to pull all the way in to a fist to put it there as is normally the case in DP. So to me if you take the time to master it it's the best of both worlds, because it can be put there one handed repeatedly and it can be produced from there repeatedly with little finger movement.
Pete
The magician formerly known as SPEEDcuber
"no one will believe the things we do if we don't believe them ourselves." - Slydini PeteMcEwen@mac.com |
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Chad Barnard Special user Mt. Airy, NC 763 Posts |
You can get into Roth's edge grip with one hand as well. I'm pretty sure it's on his beginner video. Vol. II maybe? I'll check when I get home.
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Mano Inner circle 1028 Posts |
Pete,
I do not agree with that whatsoever, with Kainoa edge grip the hands will never and I mean never look more relaxed the holding out in DP and I even used Morgans, when I use halves in DP it feels as if I had nothing in my hand seriouly. I can move coins from DP,yes I still gonna call it dp after reading that link above. to any position I want, I can bring them to kainoa,dave's egde grip and curb palm,mutobe palm in fact anywhere I want and back to dp and spread and move my fingers at will, you can not do that with dave or kainoa edge grip,you can have that freedom. I can also produce 7 morgans one underneath the others either with sound or without it. Downs Palm is the way to go, I'm not pushing though,:) And of course all with one hand and very minimum finger movement. |
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rutabaga Inner circle Toronto, Canada 1283 Posts |
This is a great thread - not only for the valuable information, but especially the obvious passion for the art and camaraderie evident. A refreshing change!
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Chad Barnard Special user Mt. Airy, NC 763 Posts |
Mano, I think all of us are still going to call it DP. It's been irrevocably linked to Downs for so long, I don't think there's any going back.
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Pete McEwen Special user Durham, N.C. 576 Posts |
Well good, I'm glad it works for you, But I don't just use EG,I use it when I'm holding coins at chest height, if my hand are holding anything I drop it to FP. Use what ever you want. I use it because I use a lot of the retention pass to edge grip. Is that what is taught on his DVD? I like it beccause it can get you there with little finger movement, whereas I think with DP you have to curl all the way into a fist. It's the way I like to work, you work the way you want to work. I'd be happier if people didn't do Kainoa's stuff honestly. It'd make me look better.
Pete
The magician formerly known as SPEEDcuber
"no one will believe the things we do if we don't believe them ourselves." - Slydini PeteMcEwen@mac.com |
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Mano Inner circle 1028 Posts |
Pete,
I forgot to mention that I have seen your videos, and I honestly like them all, It shows the good work you have done with your coin magic, they are all very well performed along with the presentation. Rutabaga, I'm glad you like the topic,which we have somehow change it a little bit,:). Peace my friends. Mano. |
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Pete McEwen Special user Durham, N.C. 576 Posts |
Thanks Mano
The magician formerly known as SPEEDcuber
"no one will believe the things we do if we don't believe them ourselves." - Slydini PeteMcEwen@mac.com |
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Mano Inner circle 1028 Posts |
Pete,
You are welcome my friend. I'd be happier if people didn't do Kainoa's stuff honestly. It'd make me look better. I know what you mean Pete, there is no doubt that Kainoa's work is top notch and require lots work that some people are not too willing to go through unless they are really serious about doing good coin magic. It is the same thing with my coin work, it is certainly not a piece of cake,:) Peace my friends. Mano. |
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Fingers Inner circle Pennsylvania, USA 1330 Posts |
Its probably me, but I like anything to do with edge grip. Any type, any way, any how. I think they all can have advantages depending on the performers ability, on the type of routine and where you are performing. The only disadvantage I see is the hard work involved to use edge grip techniques and to use them effectively. Personally, I am much better in their uses now than when I started, but I have a long way to go.
I can't wait to see the inside scoop on your works Mano. Judging by the videos I have seen of you, your DP or whatever you want to call it, is impressive. I can't wait to see how its done by the master! I am sure it will be another fine tool to add to my repertoire along with my Kainoa and Bertini works.....
Where I go, so do my coins.....
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Sealegs Inner circle The UK, Portsmouth 2596 Posts |
I feel like I'm butting into an interesting private conversation...
As someone who certainly doesn't profess to be a coin worker but used to do some nifty coin stuff I fpr one was never able to get a comfortable feel with the DP and so could never use it. There were several effects though that I performed that used EG. I always put this down to being a factor of my very short stubby fingers one of which recieved a break when I was 18. Then again it might just not be thatI'm not that good at coin magic. Neal.
Neal Austin
"The golden rule is that there are no golden rules." G.B. Shaw |
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Gary Yin Elite user Sabah, Malaysia 449 Posts |
I got a book called "Edge Grip with Gary" it is 1 page long with 50 words and in notebook format. I sell it for half dollar. Only selling 4. Buy now before it's too late. Here's a preview..
"Deep Edge Grip(Kainoa) is much more safer than the Roth Edge Grip, for that you can shift it to low Downs Palm by just extending the middle finger. And if trouble arise, it can be drop to fingerpalm anytime or catched by third finger to do your evil deeds." |
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rutabaga Inner circle Toronto, Canada 1283 Posts |
Gary, do you take Paypal?
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John T Cox Veteran user 385 Posts |
I have tried using the EG but feel much more in control with DP. Perhaps it is really about hand shape rather than size. My fingers are thick and my thumb is not comfortable moving down much lower than between my first and second fingers. So I cannot get the coin to stay well between thumb and second(middle) finger. It wants to nestle a bit higher up. I do miss the ability to drop coins into FP or drop them one at a time to other places with this position though.
The real magic is family!
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mystre71 Inner circle martinsburg west virginia 1693 Posts |
Hypnodream, I also have think fingers. And, like Pete, I'm a big fan of Kainoa's work. At first it took me awhile to get use to EG, and if you can find the old thread on Coins on Edge, you'll might find where I posted about DP-vs-EG, but after working with it awhile, it's almost all I use now days. I'm sure if you keep working on it, you'll get it in no time.
Best, Joe
Walk around coin box work check it out here https://www.magicalmystries.com/products
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Jonathan Townsend Eternal Order Ossining, NY 27297 Posts |
Slim fingers here. Slim guy in general. So I had to learn EG stuff. It kind of came naturally as going all the way down to FP took some cover and with wet hands... CP was pretty much out too. Necessity and all that.
...to all the coins I've dropped here
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